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    • By JimmiJo in ES Coverage
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      ES Coverage: Giants vs Redskins 
       
      12/9/18
       
      DEFEAT!!!
       
      Giants 40 - Redskins 16
       
      Greetings friends, JimmiJo here, and I am joined by my shivering partner, Spaceman Spiff. Together we will bring you this all important NFC East divisional matchup between the Washington Redskins and New York Giants.
       
      When I was last with you the Redskins had command of the division and there was optimism to spare. Since, devastating injuries to quarterbacks, linemen, and cornerbacks has left this team losers in 4-of-5 contests.
       
      But there is still everything to play for, and if they can manage a victory today and the Eagles to the same Washington will once again have a share of the lead.
       
      I can dream can't I?
       
      On paper, the future looks grim. A continued collapse will start the questions about the future of personnel and perhaps leadership. Yes, we can certainly point to injuries as the primary reason the team is struggling. But the record earlier in the year was masking some issues with the squad. No real arial threat. An inconsistent running game. And a defense that has been anything but consistent.
       
      But these are questions for another time. Today, it is just two teams looking for a win.
       
      See you at the half.
       
      Follow along on Twitter @Skinscast 
       
      Inactives
       
      The Redskins declared the following players as inactive:
      o   No. 12 QB Colt McCoy
      o   No. 32 RB Samaje Perine
      o   No. 46 RB Kapri Bibbs
      o   No. 52 LB Ryan Anderson
      o   No. 63 C Demetrius Rhaney
      o   No. 66 G Tony Bergstrom
      o   No. 99 DL Caleb Brantley
       
      JimmiJo
       
      I was happy to see players like Josh Johnson and Byron Marshall in the game. The marquee guys did not earn the right to play following the disastrous first half. It was historically bad.
       
      Never before had the Washington Redskins trailed by as much as the 34-0 deficit they entertained today at the half.
       
      I remarked to one of the writers that in 13-seasons I had never seen this team so outplayed as today. The offense led by Mark Sanchez was throw-up in mouth bad. At no point did you feel like they would or could score.
       
      I tweeted before the game that it is time for Daniel Snyder to replaced head coach Jay Gruden. Yes injuries are the headline. But the offense was poor before the injuries.
       
      No aerial threat and an inconsistent rushing. They only seemed to score 20-points per game.
       
      What they did do well was hold on to the ball. And the defense was a takeover machine the first half of the year.
      But turnovers tend to even out.
       
      So I was more than glad to see those ‘backups’ play. All they did was show they should have been playing in the first half.
       
      Especially Johnson. Take a look at your Redskins’ starter the rest of the way. From his first snap the offense looked different. There was energy. There was life.
       
      And there was threat.
       
      Johnson played with more command, accuracy and imagination than Mark Sanchez. He looked much more the accomplished quarterback.
       
      A word on Josh Doctson. You are an idiot. Without the stupid penalty you are not letting the safety out-position you to make the pick with 5-minutes left.
       
      Following this game, staring at the standings and considering possible scenarios for getting in the playoffs is fools’ gold. It is all about assessing who it worth keeping for next year.
       
      I don’t believe head coach Jay Gruden is going to make the list. Nor should he. He has had nore than enough time to do something here. He had Kirk Cousins’ starting over 3-full seasons.
       
      He had his chance.
       
      I tweeted before the game team owner Daniel Snyder should let Gruden go and bring in Mike McCarthy. Washington Post writer (and friend) Rick Snider made a great counterpoint to that idea:
       
      “Why would McCarthy want to come here? He has better options,” he said.
       
      That sure feels like the truth. And if so, it may explain why Gruden is fast becoming one of the most tenured coaches in the league.
       
      This was my last game for this season. I would like to thank Extremeskins and the team for the opportunity this year. I will see you guys next year.
       
      Let me go on the record now and say I do not think Jay Gruden's position here is secure. Not with the likes of Mike McCarthy available.
zskins

NFL.com: Kirk Cousins tops biggest contracts (Special rule---you can refer to the Redskins in this thread---M.E.T.)

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People expect results no matter what.  

 

Impartial folks without a horse in the race can typically affirm who is at fault for not getting positive results in a team sport though.

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48 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

I'd be shocked if the Vikings make it to the playoffs. 

 

They are .500 right now facing a stretch of Cardinals, Jets, Saints, Lions.  Three of those teams are bad.  You pay a QB like Kirk to beat bad teams even when your run game and defense aren't showing up.

 

They could easily be 5-3-1 going into the bye.

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Casserly on Sheehan's podcast the other day, criticized our current QB, then goes Kirk has been lights out/great in Minny even without a good O line or running game.  Only reason why I found that interesting is he's chummy know with ownership (even though he was canned by Dan years back) even Bruce or so it seems based on other segments.

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ESPN:  Kirk Cousins is at his best when pressure is cranked up

 

Quote

EAGAN, Minn. -- Sustained quarterback success in the NFL is often derived from making plays while under pressure and/or in a less-than-desirable pocket. Whether it’s a weakened offensive line, facing a plethora of elite pass-rushers or seeing pressure frequency rise in correlation with blitzes, a handful of circumstances determine why some quarterbacks are forced to throw under duress more than others.

 

http://www.espn.com/blog/minnesota-vikings/post/_/id/27351/kirk-cousins-is-at-his-best-when-pressure-is-cranked-up

 

Kirk played with a bus station OL the Skins had to cobble together last season, maybe that helped him prepare for the situation in Minnesota.  Obviously having Diggs and Theilen help a lot also.

Edited by Veryoldschool
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On 10/10/2018 at 5:24 PM, Skinsinparadise said:

Just more on Kirk as to charity since it was brought up here before

 

 

 

I can't hate on this, as someone who has beaten the disease 2 times since 2015 we need more help with R&D and not just for breast cancer, I think everyone is quite aware of breast cancer at this point and I'm glad to see that graphic at the end of the video where he's helping with many other types.

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We need to play the Vikings for closure, watch him hug Jay after the game regardless of the result and move on with our lives.  What's done is done, there's really no point in nit picking the guy anymore.  I do not like how he held our franchise hostage, but the further we get away from that, the easier it will be to get over it.  It really is impossible to hate the guy outside of that.

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Kirk had two hilariously awful first half turnovers yesterday.  But his D and running game bailed him out and he dropped a couple nice dimes to Theilen in the 2nd half.

 

C+, I guess.

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On 10/11/2018 at 12:50 PM, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Casserly also said Smith was an upgrade over Cousins after the trade was made.  It was on a local show though, I’ve noticed he’s nicer when on local tv.

 

Yeah it looks like Polian/Reddick have gone into a hole.  They were leading the upgrade mantra on TV.  Polian is close with Bruce ironically.   

 

Alex right now ranked 21st in QBR.  Kirk #7.  And no i am not hoping Alex keeps playing like this moving forward.  Hopefully it improves.  But yeah #21st in the NFL feels about right based on what we've seen IMO.  

 

I am not buying the move on about what Kirk does - it doesn't matter stuff when every beat guy who covers the team is saying the opposite based on their sources.  And even if they weren't saying that -- its intuitive to me.  Of course it should matter.  I get the cognitive dissonance of the Bruce-Kirk dynamic.  If you don't like Kirk or have the typical hey he's not here anymore lets root against him dynamic -- the idea that Bruce's job is a big variable in all of this just gets in that way of that thought.  But it is what it is. 

 

For me a case in point with me it would be Scot-Bruce.  I like Scot.  I don't like Bruce.  But I couldn't just pretend that I didn't hear the stories about Scot being an issue behind the scenes even though it didn't fit with how I would have liked the narratives to fit together in my mind.  But my preconceived narratives didn't fit on this point so I took it for what it is.  

 

The narrative that Kirk's performance and Bruce's job security aren't hand in hand interlinked stories -- IMO is just cognitive dissonance kicking to make the narrative easier to swallow and more linear to those who don't like Bruce and don't want the two narratives clashing.   Where you want to be both anti-Kirk and anti-Bruce and make it all fit together.  But I am convinced Kirk-Alex are running narratives as to the future of the FO -- versus just a run of the mill dynamic of a player leaves and lets root against the dude because he's not here anymore.  But will see. ?

 

That's my long winded way of saying as long as Bruce remains in the FO, i am rooting for a big season from Kirk. 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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5 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

I am not buying the move on about what Kirk does - it doesn't matter stuff when every beat guy who covers the team is saying the opposite based on their sources. 

 

Even if the owner didn't care what Kirk does on the Vikings, the fans would care.  We're human, and that's only human nature.

 

Frankly, the people who want to pretend Kirk no longer matters are the people who lost the Kirk vs RG3 and Kirk vs Bruce and Kirk vs Alex arguments.  They want the argument to go away because they don't want to admit they were 100% wrong at every stage.

 

12 hours ago, Renegade7 said:

We need to play the Vikings for closure, watch him hug Jay after the game regardless of the result and move on with our lives.

 

We're playing the Vikings next season for sure.  There's a chance we meet them in the playoffs this year, actually a pretty decent chance because of how bad the NFC East is.

 

Are you telling me that if Kirk spanks us 38-9, the fanbase will just shrug and move on to discussing which backup safety should make the team next year?

 

5 hours ago, TryTheBeal! said:

Kirk had two hilariously awful first half turnovers yesterday.  But his D and running game bailed him out and he dropped a couple nice dimes to Theilen in the 2nd half.

 

C+, I guess.

 

Seems fair, and don't forget the batted down passes.  At some point that's the QB's fault.  I'm sure Kirk would say he had a bad game.

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18 minutes ago, Tsailand said:

 

Even if the owner didn't care what Kirk does on the Vikings, the fans would care.  We're human, and that's only human nature.

 

Frankly, the people who want to pretend Kirk no longer matters are the people who lost the Kirk vs RG3 and Kirk vs Bruce and Kirk vs Alex arguments.  They want the argument to go away because they don't want to admit they were 100% wrong at every stage.

 

 

We're playing the Vikings next season for sure.  There's a chance we meet them in the playoffs this year, actually a pretty decent chance because of how bad the NFC East is.

 

Are you telling me that if Kirk spanks us 38-9, the fanbase will just shrug and move on to discussing which backup safety should make the team next year?

 

 

Seems fair, and don't forget the batted down passes.  At some point that's the QB's fault.  I'm sure Kirk would say he had a bad game.

 

When a DL bats down a pass it is the OLs fault, they are responsible for staying engaged with DL and not letting them jump of succeed in raising their arms.

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41 minutes ago, Tsailand said:

 

We're playing the Vikings next season for sure.  There's a chance we meet them in the playoffs this year, actually a pretty decent chance because of how bad the NFC East is.

 

Are you telling me that if Kirk spanks us 38-9, the fanbase will just shrug and move on to discussing which backup safety should make the team next year?

 

 

No, I'm saying we should stop being mad at Kirk and let go of any left over personal animosity towards him.  I have my feelings, but the negative ones are only a part of how I feel towards him overall, they cancel out.

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1 hour ago, Tsailand said:

Frankly, the people who want to pretend Kirk no longer matters are the people who lost the Kirk vs RG3 and Kirk vs Bruce and Kirk vs Alex arguments.  They want the argument to go away because they don't want to admit they were 100% wrong at every stage.

This.  Doesn’t cover everyone but you can paint that with a large brush.  I’ve been saying for a while that most of them don’t even believe what they are typing, kind of like Skip Bayless, they just have to stick with their guns.

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4 hours ago, Tsailand said:

 

Frankly, the people who want to pretend Kirk no longer matters are the people who lost the Kirk vs RG3 and Kirk vs Bruce and Kirk vs Alex arguments.  They want the argument to go away because they don't want to admit they were 100% wrong at every stage.

 

 

That's a pretty broad generalization.  At what point doesn't he matter?  Is he always gonna be the that got away, the new Brad Johnson or Trent Green?  Define "pretend Kirk no longer matters anyway", please.

 

Question for all: does Kirk get booed or cheered his first game back in DC?

Edited by Renegade7

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1 hour ago, Renegade7 said:

 

That's a pretty broad generalization.  At what point doesn't he matter?  Is he always gonna be the that got away, the new Brad Johnson or Trent Green?  Define "pretend Kirk no longer matters anyway", please.

 

Question for all: does Kirk get booed or cheered his first game back in DC?

He SHOULD get a standing ovation but the idiots in our fan base will boo him.

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16 minutes ago, Warhead36 said:

He SHOULD get a standing ovation but the idiots in our fan base will boo him.

Yep.  It won't be loud, but it will be audible.

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Interesting article from the New York Post (the Vikings play the Jets this week) entitled:

 

"How Sweet it Will be for the Jets to Shut Up Classless Kirk Cousins".

 

https://nypost.com/2018/10/16/how-sweet-it-will-be-for-jets-to-shut-up-classless-kirk-cousins/amp/

 

I forgot the Jets were in the running for Cousins' QB services.

 

According to this article, not really. :)

Edited by SkinsGuy

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Has Kirk ever had a really good game in the Meadowlands?

 

Edit:  Yes he has.  290 and 2 tds in a win, week 3 2016.

Edited by TryTheBeal!

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14 minutes ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

Since when does the NYPost actually stick up for it’s teams?

 

 

 

The article is probably a lot of sour grapes. Though not too sour as the Jets have saved $90 million from not having to pay Cousins, and Darnold is not doing too bad on a rookie contract.

 

Of course, they might be trying to stir the team and the fans of New York with extra motivation or something.

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Just now, SkinsGuy said:

 

The article is probably a lot of sour grapes. Though not too sour as the Jets have saved $90 million from not having to pay Cousins, and Darnold is not doing too bad on a rookie contract.

 

Of course, they might be trying to stir the team and the fans of New York with extra motivation or something.

All that is probably true, I’ve just never know them to have the teams back.  Normally they are trying to stir the pot against them home team.

 

6 minutes ago, TryTheBeal! said:

Has Kirk ever had a really good game in the Meadowlands?

I believe he played well when we beat the Giants in 2016.  I know he played bad the last time they played the Jets there but I think that was 2015.

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