Redskins receiving corp is beginning to shape up

[zoony]

12 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

And 4-8 TD's?

 

Whatever he did in 2017 +/- 2

[Morneblade]

3 minutes ago, zoony said:

 

Whatever he did in 2017 +/- 2

so, 4-8.

[Sandy Monk]

2 hours ago, zoony said:

My bold prediction is that Josh Doctson will do Josh Doctson things.  He will have between 30 and 40 catches and between 400 to 700 yards in 2018.

 

Our savior at WR is not currently on the team.

 

I'm not sure there will be a savior WR for this system. People are focused too much on individual stats, instead of staring the bigger picture right in the eye. Winning is all that matters. If Doctson or Richardson get 2 or 3 catches per game, but are opening up opportunities for others? I applaud their contributions toward the success, if it leads to winning. I don't see any single WR getting the bulk of targets, rather, the ball being spread around to all. 

[mistertim]

5 hours ago, Sandy Monk said:

 

I'm not sure there will be a savior WR for this system. People are focused too much on individual stats, instead of staring the bigger picture right in the eye. Winning is all that matters. If Doctson or Richardson get 2 or 3 catches per game, but are opening up opportunities for others? I applaud their contributions toward the success, if it leads to winning. I don't see any single WR getting the bulk of targets, rather, the ball being spread around to all. 

 

Agreed and honestly it's much more common for a good team to have a well rounded stable of receivers who compliment each other than it is to have an absolute superstar #1. There really just aren't that many guys like Megatron, Julio, Antonio, OBJ, or Fitz (in his prime) out there...guys who are pretty much impossible to cover 1 on 1, who almost force you to keep a safety up high to help out, who can make ludicrous catches look easy on the regular, who are still super productive no matter how focused the defense is on them. You can hope that you get lucky and find that guy, but you certainly can't depend on building a team around finding him.

 

From what I've read it sounds like Smith is already trusting Doctson more thank Kirk ever did and is getting more and more comfortable with him so I think that will help out as well, as long as Doctson does his part. He had over 500 yards and 6 TDs in what was essentially his rookie year and that's not bad. He showed some issues that most first year WRs showed...concentration lapses, understanding the offense and the route tree, rounding out his routes, etc. But that stuff is all fixable and he flashed some big time potential, especially on contested/difficult catches. If he improves on that stuff (and stays healthy) and Smith trust him this year I could see him getting closer to 1000 yards and ~10 TDs, which would be just fine with me.

[abdcskins]

The title of this thread has always bothered me. It is receiving corps, not corp. Can the mods change it?

 

I'm glad Crowder is going back to being a #3/slot receiver. He's much better over the middle. He also is more than likely gonna see the other team's third best CB. 

Edited July 31, 2018 by abdcskins

[Burgold]

A different Doctson narrative.

 

https://redskinswire.usatoday.com/2018/07/30/josh-doctson-big-plays-redskins-training-camp-after-mri/

 

Doctson has put any concerns to rest.

Not only is Doctson making huge contested catches down the field, he’s saying the right things too:

Doctson is also getting praise from someone like Josh Norman: “With Josh Doctson, he’s deceptively quick,” Norman said, according to the Washington Times’ Matthew Paras. “Fast in the way his timing on the ball was almost impeccable. He jumps at the top of every throw.”

[Jericho]

On 7/30/2018 at 5:44 PM, Sandy Monk said:

 

I'm not sure there will be a savior WR for this system. People are focused too much on individual stats, instead of staring the bigger picture right in the eye. Winning is all that matters. If Doctson or Richardson get 2 or 3 catches per game, but are opening up opportunities for others? I applaud their contributions toward the success, if it leads to winning. I don't see any single WR getting the bulk of targets, rather, the ball being spread around to all. 

 

Yes, but someone has to be putting up yards. It's 2018, not 1950 and there should be at least 4000 receiving yards out there for someone on the team to grab. And sure, the TEs will get some (pray for Reed's health) and the RBs will get some (pray for Thompson's health). But you have to think there's around 2500 yards for some to grab from the WR position. And neither Doctson or Reed will put much dent in that 2500 yards getting only 2-3 balls a game. And the Redskins don't exact have depth either. So I hope someone takes a big step forward.

[Malapropismic Depository]

2018 Super Bowl Champs did not have a single player at any position with over 1000 receiving yards

[Koolblue13]

100% of our WRs would make fine 3 or 4s on several teams around the league. 

[Sandy Monk]

8 hours ago, Jericho said:

 

Yes, but someone has to be putting up yards. It's 2018, not 1950 and there should be at least 4000 receiving yards out there for someone on the team to grab. And sure, the TEs will get some (pray for Reed's health) and the RBs will get some (pray for Thompson's health). But you have to think there's around 2500 yards for some to grab from the WR position. And neither Doctson or Reed will put much dent in that 2500 yards getting only 2-3 balls a game. And the Redskins don't exact have depth either. So I hope someone takes a big step forward.

 

Just for curiosity, I broke this down like this. 

 

Reed = 67 - (750 yds)

Crowder = 60 - (700 yds)

Doctson = 55 - (770 yds)

Richardson = 40 (600 yds)

V.D. = 40 (600 yds)

C.T. = 25  (320 yds)

Guice = 25 (260 yds)

 

This is a total of 312 completions. We could add in another 25 total on miscellaneous targets like Sprinkle, Quinn, Perine, Marshall, MO Harris etc. So 337 total completions. 

 

If Smith throws the ball 520 times this season.. that's a 64.8 completion percentage. Conservative, but about fair, for year 1. 

 

Rough estimate. 

 

So, just between the primary 7 targets, that is exactly 4,000 yds. Do these numbers look reasonable for expectations? 

 

 

53 minutes ago, Koolblue13 said:

100% of our WRs would make fine 3 or 4s on several teams around the league. 

 

I think even at low expectations, there are 3 that are respectable 2s and a couple more likely to be solid 3s.

 

If the TEs and run game are viable, it could be enough to make for a top 12 offense. 

[Morneblade]

44 minutes ago, Sandy Monk said:

 

Just for curiosity, I broke this down like this. 

 

Reed = 67 - (750 yds)

Crowder = 60 - (700 yds)

Doctson = 55 - (770 yds)

Richardson = 40 (600 yds)

V.D. = 40 (600 yds)

C.T. = 25  (320 yds)

Guice = 25 (260 yds)

 

This is a total of 312 completions. We could add in another 25 total on miscellaneous targets like Sprinkle, Quinn, Perine, Marshall, MO Harris etc. So 337 total completions. 

 

If Smith throws the ball 520 times this season.. that's a 64.8 completion percentage. Conservative, but about fair, for year 1. 

 

Rough estimate. 

 

So, just between the primary 7 targets, that is exactly 4,000 yds. Do these numbers look reasonable for expectations? 

 

 

 

I think even at low expectations, there are 3 that are respectable 2s and a couple more likely to be solid 3s.

 

If the TEs and run game are viable, it could be enough to make for a top 12 offense. 

 

You're expecting Reed to stay healthy AND Davis to catch 40 balls?

Richardson might be high.

Doctson might be high as well, unless you're forcing him the ball.

 

I would love to hear who you think are respectable #2's

[Sandy Monk]

1 hour ago, Morneblade said:

 

You're expecting Reed to stay healthy AND Davis to catch 40 balls?

Richardson might be high.

Doctson might be high as well, unless you're forcing him the ball.

 

I would love to hear who you think are respectable #2's

 

I think Reed's due, and from the early indications, I am optimistic that he can put together 12-13 games. More, if to include potential playoffs.

 

The exact numbers are free to shift, but my point was that I see a lot of 600-800 yard individual production versus 1 guy getting 1,000+ yds. 

 

 

While it does imply some faith in their further improvement, I think the top 3 will be respectable #2s. ( Doctson-Crowder-Richardson )

 

Said it before, I don't think this team must have a true #1 WR to make it work. Would be nice to have, but spreading it around seems more likely. 

[NoCalMike]

Ertz was the leading receiver on the Eagles last season,  Jefferey & Aguilar had 750ish yards receiving each.   You don't need that one super star to anchor the unit, if the unit performs as a....unit.

 

For example, Doctson may never be a Top 5 WR, but his specific skill set is always going to make him an asset (as long as he can stay healthy)  His ability to go upstairs and make catches over defenders, allowing the QB to take more chances and push the ball downfield.  You want that on your team. 

 

Sometimes a player's value is measured by what he offers as his piece to the bigger puzzle. 

[Sandy Monk]

1 hour ago, NoCalMike said:

Ertz was the leading receiver on the Eagles last season,  Jefferey & Aguilar had 750ish yards receiving each.   You don't need that one super star to anchor the unit, if the unit performs as a....unit.

 

For example, Doctson may never be a Top 5 WR, but his specific skill set is always going to make him an asset (as long as he can stay healthy)  His ability to go upstairs and make catches over defenders, allowing the QB to take more chances and push the ball downfield.  You want that on your team. 

 

Sometimes a player's value is measured by what he offers as his piece to the bigger puzzle. 

 

Agree. I think fantasy football has infected too much of the sport, tbh. The individual stat glorification has gradually muddled the real importance. 

[kingdaddy]

On 7/30/2018 at 11:45 PM, mistertim said:

 

Agreed and honestly it's much more common for a good team to have a well rounded stable of receivers who compliment each other than it is to have an absolute superstar #1. There really just aren't that many guys like Megatron, Julio, Antonio, OBJ, or Fitz (in his prime) out there...guys who are pretty much impossible to cover 1 on 1, who almost force you to keep a safety up high to help out, who can make ludicrous catches look easy on the regular, who are still super productive no matter how focused the defense is on them. You can hope that you get lucky and find that guy, but you certainly can't depend on building a team around finding him.

 

From what I've read it sounds like Smith is already trusting Doctson more thank Kirk ever did and is getting more and more comfortable with him so I think that will help out as well, as long as Doctson does his part. He had over 500 yards and 6 TDs in what was essentially his rookie year and that's not bad. He showed some issues that most first year WRs showed...concentration lapses, understanding the offense and the route tree, rounding out his routes, etc. But that stuff is all fixable and he flashed some big time potential, especially on contested/difficult catches. If he improves on that stuff (and stays healthy) and Smith trust him this year I could see him getting closer to 1000 yards and ~10 TDs, which would be just fine with me.

Yep, name the Eagles receivers after Alshon Jeffery? Wentz and Foles throw it to anyone and everyone...Reed is the key to our receiving corp in my opinion. 

[Morneblade]

45 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

Yep, name the Eagles receivers after Alshon Jeffery? Wentz and Foles throw it to anyone and everyone...Reed is the key to our receiving corp in my opinion. 

 

He is, but he is never healthy for a season. And that's a big problem.

[Jericho]

And Doctson goes down, hopefully he's not too hurt. Depth is a huge problem at WR

[Jericho]

53 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

Yep, name the Eagles receivers after Alshon Jeffery? Wentz and Foles throw it to anyone and everyone...Reed is the key to our receiving corp in my opinion. 

 

They're not exactly nobodies. Nelson Agholor is a former first round pick (only 3 years ago) and Torrey Smith had had numerous good seasons (and a career high  of 1,128 yards and he was only 28 last year). Not to mention Brent Celek (similar career to Vernon Davis). And Zach Ertz and Alshon Jeffrey are former Pro Bowlers.

[Malapropismic Depository]

On 7/31/2018 at 12:21 AM, abdcskins said:

The title of this thread has always bothered me. It is receiving corps, not corp. Can the mods change it?

 

 

 

Then, you'll have to go after the people spelling it "core"

[kingdaddy]

On 8/1/2018 at 1:36 PM, Jericho said:

 

They're not exactly nobodies. Nelson Agholor is a former first round pick (only 3 years ago) and Torrey Smith had had numerous good seasons (and a career high  of 1,128 yards and he was only 28 last year). Not to mention Brent Celek (similar career to Vernon Davis). And Zach Ertz and Alshon Jeffrey are former Pro Bowlers.

Didn't say they were "nobody's" but my point is that the Eagles system is so good that all of them produce. One of their best weapons was Trey Burton, backup tight end who's now in Chicago I believe. They also used rookie RB Clement to take over for Sproles after he went down and he did very well too. Doug Peterson is a master at getting guys open and that's what we need from Gruden; creative play calling that doesn't rely on one guy to dominate. We have as much talent at WR as the Eagles do along with Reed, Davis, Thompson and now Guice. No reason we can't have an explosive offense like the Rams and Eagles have, especially given Smith's ability to buy time with his legs like Carson Wentz can do.

[Morneblade]

40 minutes ago, kingdaddy said:

Didn't say they were "nobody's" but my point is that the Eagles system is so good that all of them produce. One of their best weapons was Trey Burton, backup tight end who's now in Chicago I believe. They also used rookie RB Clement to take over for Sproles after he went down and he did very well too. Doug Peterson is a master at getting guys open and that's what we need from Gruden; creative play calling that doesn't rely on one guy to dominate. We have as much talent at WR as the Eagles do along with Reed, Davis, Thompson and now Guice. No reason we can't have an explosive offense like the Rams and Eagles have, especially given Smith's ability to buy time with his legs like Carson Wentz can do.

 

The Eagles still have a better Receiving corps than we do. They have a proven #1 and a good #2. We don't Also, the Eagles don't focus as much on the pass as we do, so it's even more important that we have good receivers. The Eagles only had 3700 yards passing last year, but over 2100 yards rushing and 4.5 ypc. In fact, most of hte passing stats were very much in the middle of the NFL, except for TD's. They are a run oriented team with a really nasty defense.

[HardcoreZorn]

26 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

The Eagles still have a better Receiving corps than we do. They have a proven #1 and a good #2. We don't Also, the Eagles don't focus as much on the pass as we do, so it's even more important that we have good receivers. The Eagles only had 3700 yards passing last year, but over 2100 yards rushing and 4.5 ypc. In fact, most of hte passing stats were very much in the middle of the NFL, except for TD's. They are a run oriented team with a really nasty defense.

Real talk, do you think anybody was talking about Agholor as a good WR last year? Players develop and especially receivers can take big steps forward from years 2 to 3. So why dismiss Doc so easily?

 

Or are you talking about Mike Wallace? Because I would argue Richardson will be for us what Wallace will be for the Eagles this year.

 

Our group is nothing to scoff at when you add Reed and Thompson. I'd be shocked if we don't get more out of Reed this year than last.

 

And we are trending more toward a run oriented team I would think with Guice and Alex running some RPO. I know you are high on Guice. We also have a really good front 7 it would appear. So I think it's fine that we don't have some game changing player at the WR position and collectively I think they will be a serviceable group.

[JSSkinz]

This Quinn kid is hilarious, definitely no lack of confidence.

 

Check out his interview with Grant and Danny yesterday, start at 43:46

 

https://thefandc.radio.com/media/audio-channel/8118-full-show-busy-day-guests

[Warhead36]

Its funny people talk about Alghalor, but before last year he basically was the Eagles version of Doctson with his drops and general inconsistency. But he figured it out in year 3.

 

I don't know if Doc will ever be a gamebreaking stud but I think he can be a solid 1100-1200 yard #1 WR who is money in the red area.

[HardcoreZorn]

1 minute ago, Warhead36 said:

Its funny people talk about Alghalor, but before last year he basically was the Eagles version of Doctson with his drops and general inconsistency. But he figured it out in year 3.

 

I don't know if Doc will ever be a gamebreaking stud but I think he can be a solid 1100-1200 yard #1 WR who is money in the red area.

Yeah I was quite encouraged by Doc, being that it was his first season being out there really. Needs to take another step this year though.