2018 Free Agency Database - (Signed: WILLIAMS - McPhee - Scandrick - P-Rich) - (Lauvao, Bergstrom, Nsehke, Taylor, Z. Brown and Quick re-signed)

[Est.1974]

The point really is that you make Browns contract effective from day 1 of the new league year. Not sure what he's asking for, or expecting, but id hope for a decent deal in the 7mil per year range.

[skinny21]

7 would be a good deal.  I have a hunch he’d like a bit more given 1) his impact for our D, 2) back-to-back pro bowl selection (albeit as an alternate for us), 3) his tackle totals the past 2 seasons and 4) the salaries of the top ILBs.  

[markmills67]

In my opinion I would only sign ZB if cousin's is here, if no cousin's I would go with McCoy as QB and sign younger players to 1 year deals. It's just not worth spending big on 2 or 3 big name FA if they're not going to be here 2 or 3 years down the line, when our new young QB is starting in 19. I would also go NT , MLB and DB with our 1st 3 picks. Plus I would also trade Norman and Reed, all this is if we don't re-sign Cousin's to a LTD and I only give us 25% tops that we sign him.

 

HTTR 

 

 

[Paul Cumberland]

The top paid ILB in the league is Luke Kuechly who averages ~12.35m per year.  ZB made 2.3m last season.  He'll be getting a raise probably in the 7-8m range if on a LTD which would place him in the top 10.  Hope we get him locked up and either bring Foster back or perhaps get Preston Brown from the Bills who I believe would be an upgrade over Foster, though I still like what Foster brings.  Seems like Vigil could be a decent backup and Compton, though his leadership is nice, doesn't provide what the others do on the field..  A lot of people are clamoring for Roquan Smith in the draft too, which wouldn't be bad, but he has yet to declare (though expected to - Monday the 15th is the last day for eligible Juniors to declare), but if we somehow can afford to bring back ZB and pair him with Preston and then go with a run stuffing lineman like Vea or Payne, man...  our D could take a big leap in our worst area..

[thebeermonkey]

7 hours ago, markmills67 said:

In my opinion I would only sign ZB if cousin's is here, if no cousin's I would go with McCoy as QB and sign younger players to 1 year deals. It's just not worth spending big on 2 or 3 big name FA if they're not going to be here 2 or 3 years down the line, when our new young QB is starting in 19. I would also go NT , MLB and DB with our 1st 3 picks. Plus I would also trade Norman and Reed, all this is if we don't re-sign Cousin's to a LTD and I only give us 25% tops that we sign him.

 

HTTR 

 

 

The eagles are showing a really strong defence can win with a crappy/middle of the road qb 

[Voice_of_Reason]

3 hours ago, thebeermonkey said:

The eagles are showing a really strong defence can win with a crappy/middle of the road qb 

They were able to beat a team that has a suspect defense an an offense that has been out of synch all year.

 

They’re likely going to get drilled in the next round.

[OVCChairman]

On 1/13/2018 at 12:06 PM, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

The point really is that you make Browns contract effective from day 1 of the new league year. Not sure what he's asking for, or expecting, but id hope for a decent deal in the 7mil per year range.

but i believe the signing bonus is paid at the time of signing, regardless of when the contract becomes 'effective.'   At that point it can be split over the life of the contract, but I dont know what the parameters are for how much per year is applied.  I have to imagine if that was an option, and it was possible we would do it.  

[Peregrine]

On 1/10/2018 at 11:18 AM, skinny21 said:

@Peregrine

 

I don't even know that we need a speedster, just someone that can create separation.  In fact, I'd prefer a guy that can run all the routes well and has the burst to gain a step to a guy that is mostly just a deep threat.  

 

I guess what I'm saying is I'd prefer more well rounded players to more one trick ponies.  Our TEs are a good example - we have to good pass catchers in Davis and Reed, and one decent blocker in Sprinkle.  Thing is, you don't have to worry about the first two in the run game and you don't have to worry about Sprinkle in the pass game.  So teams can add a man to the box if Sprinkle is in and leave an extra guy in coverage if Reed is in.  With a TE that can do both, teams have to choose - do we put an extra man in the box and risk that TE getting over the backers, or leave both safeties playing off and risk that TE opening a hole for the back?

 

With that said, we are lacking speed from the receivers (and backs).  Crowder is fine, but Doctson, Harris and Grant aren't going to run away from defenders on crossers and posts very often.  Maybe Davis helps there, but we've seen nothing from him yet.  So I do agree we need to add more speed, but it doesn't have to be someone like Jackson.  

 

 

Rereading my post, I'm being a little unfair - it's not like you're saying we need a guy that is a speedster and nothing more.  

 

@SemperFi Skins After the season he had, I bet he is, lol.  Might be a smart time to try from the 'Skins perspective though, too - extend him while his value is slightly lower.  

Sure, a well rounded player is the best, someone who has speed, size, runs great routes and has good hands.  But those cost a fortune.  Part of building a great team under a salary cap is realizing where you can save some money, make the most use of players and get similar results with far less invested.  This allows you to build other positions.  You can either pay for 3 Antonio Browns and hamstring your team, or get 1, and then get 2 guys who arent nearly as well rounded, but good at different aspects.  

 

At that point a GOOD coach knows how and when to use those players to maximize their strength(in this case speed) and minimize their weaknesses)lets say route running).  By getting a guy who is a speedster but not great at other areas, you save $6 million a year, but you still get the ability, if used well, to take the top off of defenses in key situations, and also open up the field for your other players.  You find that separation ends up being a lot easier for your other receivers when the safeties have to worry about someone getting behind them.  Speed is one of those rare attributes that cannot be adjusted for by anything other than comparable speed, or starting back to cover the deep ball quicker.  As a coach, now  that you can dictate what the defense has to react to, it gives you more ability to draw up effective plays.

[Est.1974]

5 hours ago, OVCChairman said:

but i believe the signing bonus is paid at the time of signing, regardless of when the contract becomes 'effective.'   At that point it can be split over the life of the contract, but I dont know what the parameters are for how much per year is applied.  I have to imagine if that was an option, and it was possible we would do it.  

 

Maybe that's the delay with Kirk then 

[OVCChairman]

2 hours ago, UK SKINS FAN '74 said:

 

Maybe that's the delay with Kirk then 

You bring up a VERY valid point, and it's odd that this would be a hold up with Brown but not with Kirk?  Or maybe this is the delay but nobody is reporting it?  I dont know... the legal stuff is so deep it's hard to know whats speculation and what's fact anymore. 

[Paul Cumberland]

18 minutes ago, OVCChairman said:

You bring up a VERY valid point, and it's odd that this would be a hold up with Brown but not with Kirk?  Or maybe this is the delay but nobody is reporting it?  I dont know... the legal stuff is so deep it's hard to know whats speculation and what's fact anymore. 

 

Just per speculation on my part but if the reason for not getting an announcement on a LTD for Kirk is consistent with the reason why ZB hasn't been extended yet (which I believe to be true) then keep your eye on March 14 which is the start of the new league year and also coincides with the start of FA.  Assuming we place no tag on Kirk (March 6th being that deadline), if we're going to have Kirk back, it will be announced very early once the new league year and FA begins.

[markmills67]

1 hour ago, Paul Cumberland said:

 

Just per speculation on my part but if the reason for not getting an announcement on a LTD for Kirk is consistent with the reason why ZB hasn't been extended yet (which I believe to be true) then keep your eye on March 14 which is the start of the new league year and also coincides with the start of FA.  Assuming we place no tag on Kirk (March 6th being that deadline), if we're going to have Kirk back, it will be announced very early once the new league year and FA begins.

And what odds would you give on cousin's signing a LTD with the Redskins on March 14th?.

 

HTTR 

[Paul Cumberland]

4 minutes ago, markmills67 said:

And what odds would you give on cousin's signing a LTD with the Redskins on March 14th?.

 

HTTR 

 

As much as anyone, I guess...  But here's the thing, Kirk wants to win and he's concerned with his legacy.  He also says he knows that you can't hamstring a team with a high percentage of the cap in order to do that.  Some people say that he's just saying BS with that but I personally have no reason not to believe him as I've never caught him in a lie.  So assuming he's not bull****ting, if somehow Bruce & Co can persuade him to believe they can build a winner here, I believe we have as good a shot as any to sign him....

[markmills67]

11 minutes ago, Paul Cumberland said:

 

As much as anyone, I guess...  But here's the thing, Kirk wants to win and he's concerned with his legacy.  He also says he knows that you can't hamstring a team with a high percentage of the cap in order to do that.  Some people say that he's just saying BS with that but I personally have no reason not to believe him as I've never caught him in a lie.  So assuming he's not bull****ting, if somehow Bruce & Co can persuade him to believe they can build a winner here, I believe we have as good a shot as any to sign him....

But isn't waiting until the middle of March stopping the FO from planning for the draft and FA, we need to be ready for March the 14th with a plan in place not waiting for cousin's to make his mind up. At this moment in time I would just like both parties to come out and say they will get the LTD done or just let cousin's go and move on. 

 

HTTR 

[skinny21]

22 minutes ago, markmills67 said:

But isn't waiting until the middle of March stopping the FO from planning for the draft and FA, we need to be ready for March the 14th with a plan in place not waiting for cousin's to make his mind up. At this moment in time I would just like both parties to come out and say they will get the LTD done or just let cousin's go and move on. 

 

HTTR 

Well, it makes the planning a bit tougher maybe, but the scouts should be looking at all of the prospects (draft and FA) regardless, so it's just a matter of "if this, than that" and such.  

[Paul Cumberland]

48 minutes ago, markmills67 said:

But isn't waiting until the middle of March stopping the FO from planning for the draft and FA, we need to be ready for March the 14th with a plan in place not waiting for cousin's to make his mind up. At this moment in time I would just like both parties to come out and say they will get the LTD done or just let cousin's go and move on. 

 

HTTR 

 

I think most, if not all, fans would want to know what's going to happen with Kirk ahead of time but it really doesn't work like that.  FA comes before the draft.  The team will have a plan in place for both.  If it comes to pass that Kirk is signed prior to FA, they'll announce it.  If they don't have him signed by the tag deadline (March 6), then they'll probably announce they're letting him test free agency but they'll still have 1 week left before then to lock him up. If he does make it to FA, the only thing that could throw a wrench into FA plans is if Kirk says he wants to accept a LTD deal with us after taking his whirlwind tour..  But I have to assume there's a plan in place for that as well..

[carex]

Part of me worries about crossing the league because of the consequences, another part of  me figures you can only violate the spirit of something and get punished so many times before you've got a lawsuit.

 

Okay, the official punishment for going over the cap is you get fined one dollar for every dollar you;re over it for the entire time you're over it, right?

 

Give me a cap extension on the last day of he league year that slams a bunch of money onto the old dying cap.  You pa a fine.  And then your guy gets a big bonus to sign but a good chunk of the money vanishes after one say

[fordranger76]

So after looking at the upcoming FA class for ILB I'm in the camp to let Brown go. Call me crazy but the guy just didn't do it for me. He is a sure tackler and is quick but he can't cover anyone. I think Vigil called a capable defense in his absence in hindsight and there are a lot of young ILB to be had. I know we need help at this position I am not daft but I just think we can do better. All about keeping as clean of a cap as possible and both Cousins and Brown to me, are not worth the contracts they are about to receive.

[Bonez3]

A lot of Guards, WR's in FA this year... I think that's where to go for depth and proven commodity. 

 

Use draft for LB (re-sign Brown), S, RB

[Reaper Skins]

Brown looked good until we were forced to pair him up with practice squad level guys.  He's part of the solution, not part of the problem.

[Skinsinparadise]

Cooley going off this morning doubling down on his criticism at the time of the McGee-McClain signings last off season.  He was saying McClain wasn't good.  McGee wasn't hot though got better towards the end of the season.  He doesn't like the approach of overpaying for average type of players in FA.  His point is go bigger money, bigger players versus quantity -- talking up Calais Campbell should have been who they pursued last time.  In his defense, he said the same thing then, too.  I was on board with his point as well.

 

Forget that specific example.  By in large, I'd rather have one or two marquees guys versus 4-5 medium level guys -- the Andre Roberts, Paea types often don't work out.  On occasion, you strike gold that way.  Swearinger is borderline in this category.  But Swearinger was a 2nd round pick who bounced around the league some but had a really good year for the Cards before we signed him.  

 

My point go get someone like Allen Robinson versus signing Bryce Buter and Kendall Wright.  Maybe Calais is an extreme example based on what he got paid but I get Cooley's point.  I agree with it.

[BatteredFanSyndrome]

I agree completely on 1 elite vs. 2 mediums.

 

A lot of talk last season about how Baker wasn't all that good and many fans were stupid for not being happy about letting him go.  When the entire time it wasn't so much about how good Baker is vs. what we got to replace him.  Baker ended up going on to stink up the joint in Tampa, but the guys we picked up did very little here as well and cost twice the money because we paid 2 players.

 

In fairness, Campbell was the price of 3 Mc's.  We already have one 15M player on defense in Norman.  Not sure how we would have been able to pull that off.  Although, I'd rather pay a monster contract to a Dlineman than I would a corner.

 

[Paul Cumberland]

I kinda equate the quantity or quality thing like having a leaky bucket to fill.  If you can plug one hole, the other 2 are still going to pour water out, but if you can semi plug 3 holes, you'll still lose water but just not at as fast of a rate...  To me, we have/had so many holes to fill in our bucket, just going with 1 stud or 3 mehs i kinda get the point of.  JAX had no such holes like we did.  And though perhaps they really didn't have any holes at all, they perceived that a stronger stopper (no pun intended) could be the final piece.  Additionally, you have to look at fit with who else you have.  Teamwork and being on the same page as they guy next to you has a lot to do with pieces working together well.  Perhaps that's where we failed in our evaluation or perhaps it's coaching or maybe a combination...

[carex]

1 hour ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I agree completely on 1 elite vs. 2 mediums.

 

A lot of talk last season about how Baker wasn't all that good and many fans were stupid for not being happy about letting him go.  When the entire time it wasn't so much about how good Baker is vs. what we got to replace him.  Baker ended up going on to stink up the joint in Tampa, but the guys we picked up did very little here as well and cost twice the money because we paid 2 players.

 

In fairness, Campbell was the price of 3 Mc's.  We already have one 15M player on defense in Norman.  Not sure how we would have been able to pull that off.  Although, I'd rather pay a monster contract to a Dlineman than I would a corner.

 

 

39 minutes ago, Paul Cumberland said:

I kinda equate the quantity or quality thing like having a leaky bucket to fill.  If you can plug one hole, the other 2 are still going to pour water out, but if you can semi plug 3 holes, you'll still lose water but just not at as fast of a rate...  To me, we have/had so many holes to fill in our bucket, just going with 1 stud or 3 mehs i kinda get the point of.  JAX had no such holes like we did.  And though perhaps they really didn't have any holes at all, they perceived that a stronger stopper (no pun intended) could be the final piece.  Additionally, you have to look at fit with who else you have.  Teamwork and being on the same page as they guy next to you has a lot to do with pieces working together well.  Perhaps that's where we failed in our evaluation or perhaps it's coaching or maybe a combination...

 

if the draft had happened first and we'd known we were going to get Allen I can see going for Campbell.  But if you go for one guy when you have two holes all that happens is your opponent runs away from the guy you brought in

[Rufus T Firefly]

1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Cooley going off this morning doubling down on his criticism at the time of the McGee-McClain signings last off season.  He was saying McClain wasn't good.  McGee wasn't hot though got better towards the end of the season.  He doesn't like the approach of overpaying for average type of players in FA.  His point is go bigger money, bigger players versus quantity -- talking up Calais Campbell should have been who they pursued last time.  In his defense, he said the same thing then, too.  I was on board with his point as well.

 

Forget that specific example.  By in large, I'd rather have one or two marquees guys versus 4-5 medium level guys -- the Andre Roberts, Paea types often don't work out.  On occasion, you strike gold that way.  Swearinger is borderline in this category.  But Swearinger was a 2nd round pick who bounced around the league some but had a really good year for the Cards before we signed him.  

 

My point go get someone like Allen Robinson versus signing Bryce Buter and Kendall Wright.  Maybe Calais is an extreme example based on what he got paid but I get Cooley's point.  I agree with it.

I don't think I totally agree about the general theme of that. You can sign stars, you can sign solid starters, you can sign depth. The important thing is to hit on the guys you do sign. McClain and McGee just didn't have any impact.

 

You could have signed Jonathan Hankins or Dontari Poe for their combined price, that would have been better.

You could have spread the money out to 4 or 5 players, that would have been better.

You could have signed nobody and saved the space for this year, that would have been better.

 

Again, it's not a matter of philosophy, it's a matter of execution and competence, imo.