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The Bruce Allen/GM Thread


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9 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

What I'm curious to see is what happens in all of this come the end of the season. People easily want Bruce fired and that's nothing new. But if that's the case, is it Doug or Smith or Schaffer? And of those three who do we consider the most valuable piece? There have been rumors of Smith being considered for a GM job. I'm not buying in until I see him interviewing because a lot gets thrown out there that adds up to nothing. 

 

But Schaffer has been here longer and has worked wonders with the cap management. Did we luck into Smith because of Bruce's relationship with AJ Smith, or does Bruce/DW/somebody else have a connection or a way of evaluating scouts that makes them confident that they can find another college scout that can do that role well? 

 

Unfortunately, I fear that if we lose Smith we're going to just play a game of musical chairs and simply give the job to somebody else already in our front office. I think that Schaffer's role has kinda become lessened because of our FA philosophy. Maybe its still relevant because of re-signings though. 

 

And ultimately I wonder how the front office feels about working with each other and the current structure. Part of me wonders if Doug is being sly when he goes on these Doc Walker shows because (a) he knows that Bruce doesn't like the media and media appearances from the FO, and (b) most, if not all of the stories that Doug lets out put Bruce in either a neutral light or a negative light, almost never a positive light. 

 - the Smith trade (negative for Bruce)

 - the AP story (negative for Bruce)

 - behind the scenes of the draft (neutral for Bruce because he's not really involved)

 

Now the regular person here says that that's just Bruce being Bruce and Doug is telling the stories as they happened. But I got a positive Bruce vibe when Eric Schaffer went on 1067 with Grant and Danny and talked about the cap management technique that I want to say he learned from Bruce, or at least that Bruce emphasized, and Eric spoke positively of Bruce in that regard. 

 

So I really wonder what the next installment of this FO will be. 

 

I think you make Schaffer President and Smith GM, and keep them both. As for Williams, I don't know. He's likeable and I think relates well with players. I might have him in a role doing that. But not overseeing the franchise or player personnel.

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7 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

I think you make Schaffer President and Smith GM, and keep them both. As for Williams, I don't know. He's likeable and I think relates well with players. I might have him in a role doing that. But not overseeing the franchise or player personnel.

I’m in 100% agreement on Schaffer as Prez with Smith the GM.  The issue with Williams is that they’ve promoted him so high, there are no other roles for him that won’t be an obvious demotion.

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Just now, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I’m in 100% agreement on Schaffer as Prez with Smith the GM.  The issue with Williams is that they’ve promoted him so high, there are no other roles for him that won’t be an obvious demotion.

 

Maybe some sort of crisis management-spokesman -- take the heat for the team.  Trying to think how to give that a title. 

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If you're going to make a change, you need to blow it all up.

 

Meaning Snyder would need to go to an outside search agency and then get out of the way.

 

Promoting from within ain't gonna do it.

 

The culture is toxic. 

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Louis Reddick who has been one of this organizations biggest defenders in recent years looks to be off that train

 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/sports/2018/12/03/louis-riddick-redskins-claiming-reuben-foster-asinine-playoff-chances-over/?utm_term=.e703abc19c26

 

Riddick: Given how much there is for them to do before you can ever get back on the football field, claiming him was unnecessary, number one. Number two, not having made any calls — which is my understanding — to the authorities to try and figure out exactly what happened prior to claiming him is just asinine. I don’t understand that at all, in any way, shape or form.

 

 

...They’re compounding the problem more and more and more every time they open their mouth. At the most basic level, there are many, many teams that wouldn’t touch Reuben regardless of what has been rumored to go on with this young man . . . because obviously his decision-making does not seem to be able to get a good grasp as far as what is right and what is wrong. . . . All of these things are adding up to the Redskins once again getting that reputation of being that team that doesn’t quite get it. I know that they have tried to dispel that opinion . . . over the past couple of years by the way they’ve built that football team. I don’t want to say it’s all come crashing down, but they have done some serious damage to themselves with the way they’ve handled this. It’s all self-inflicted in terms of their ability to make sound decisions. It’s just so unnecessary and asinine on so many levels. I’m shocked.

 

The Post: Having worked for Daniel Snyder and this organization, do you have insight into how a decision like this gets made?

 

Riddick: According to what they said — and when you’re talking about something this explosive where you knew he was arrested and accused of domestic violence — it’s at the highest levels of the organization. Ownership, team president, coach and the top levels of personnel. And ultimately it has to be an ownership call — or should be an ownership call. What [Snyder] is doing — the owner is charting the course of the franchise and he wants everyone else to carry out his vision of what he wants his team to be, how he wants his organization to be thought of, and ultimately that decision should rest with that person.

 

...The Post: Do you sense any frustration around the league with Washington, that this signing [along with Kansas Chiefs running back Kareem Hunt] gives the league a black eye? That the NFL has struggled to handle and adjudicate issues of domestic violence with its players and this signing thrusts the league back into a place they’ve been before?

Riddick: I don’t know if it’s frustration. I think it’s a feeling of, “Which team claimed him? Which team is in the news for doing something stupid? Oh, it’s Washington.” That’s what I think is being is said. It’s not frustration, it’s “Oh, it’s Washington. Same old Washington.” I don’t know if everyone else feels like it’s a black eye on them because it’s this team. It’s Washington.

 

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53 minutes ago, Peregrine said:

Very true, if you are ever going to reboot and give the new guys a real chance, now is the time to do it.  Obviously you have one big roadblock to that, the Smith contract, but maybe he retires?  Regardless, you have, while not a great talent pool, a decent one that a GM can build off of.  You have a lot of draft picks in the next draft.  You have a number of young players on the defensive front that look very promising for the future.  You arent going anywhere with the current staff and theyve been given enough years no one would be unhappy with you firing them.  From a team standpoint, future resources standpoint, and PR standpoint it makes it the easiest time to re-boot without facing 1-15.  You fire everyone, bring in a new GM, who hires a new HC, who then gets to revamp the roster but keep the talent.  

 

But Dan aint gonna do that.

 

 

If you make the decision to go that route... that roadblock is greatly mitigated.  With the cap increase, a capable GM can look at this roster and find the money to offset Alex.  If you go GM, HC, QB, then you're future is on a rookie contract which won't be a concern until after Smith falls off the books.... The estimates I've seen show the cap going from $177.2 mil to approx $190 mil next season.  That almost covers Alex.  The year after it could go up an additional $10 mil, which helps absorb that following year.  A good GM can make that work if your QB is on his rookie deal.  We're actually lucky right now with the amount of young talent we have, so if we want to try a transition instead of a completely team rebuild... now is the time.  In 2 years when Smith comes off the books, we won't have the luxuries we have now with our entire starting D-line on rookie contracts.  

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12 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Maybe some sort of crisis management-spokesman -- take the heat for the team.  Trying to think how to give that a title. 

Probably won’t need that with Schaffer and Smith at the helm.  Maybe Doug can simply be the buffer between Schaffer/Smith & Dan.  In fact, they could still call it ‘crisis management spokesman’.

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3 hours ago, Hooper said:

If they fire Gruden and keep Bruce, the league should step in. It's really that bad.

 

Then again, maybe Gruden tanks the rest of the year so he can take the Bengals job. 

 

Boy, I hope not. I don't particularly care what happens to the Bengals, but Marvin Lewis and his "entourage" are just dinosaurs in today's NFL. It is just as painful to watch a Bengals game as it is a Redskins game (and they have A LOT of talent on the offensive side). I hope Gruden does not get another head coaching job because it is bad for the league and the fans of those teams.

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47 minutes ago, playoffsplz said:

 

Boy, I hope not. I don't particularly care what happens to the Bengals, but Marvin Lewis and his "entourage" are just dinosaurs in today's NFL. It is just as painful to watch a Bengals game as it is a Redskins game (and they have A LOT of talent on the offensive side). I hope Gruden does not get another head coaching job because it is bad for the league and the fans of those teams.

Your misery as a Skins fan is coloring your objectivity. I get it. But around the league, Gruden is seen at the very least as a solid offensive mind. He gets guys open. His scheme is loved by many people -- guys like Andy Benoit think no one has better passing concepts than Jay as crazy as that may sound. Dalton did quite well under him too. Also, to be fair to Marvin and his current staff, it's not like they're running some "dinosaur" scheme. 

 

And again, Jay has arguably done better than any other coach under Snyder and two of them were hall of famers. I think folks will be surprised how quickly he gets a job once he is out of DC. I just hope Bruce Allen has nothing to do with picking his replacement. On that, I'm sure we can all agree.

 

Hail.

 

 

Edited by Hooper
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25 minutes ago, Hooper said:

Your misery as a Skins fan is coloring your objectivity. I get it. But around the league, Gruden is seen at the very least as a solid offensive mind. He gets guys open. His scheme is loved by many people -- guys like Andy Benoit think no one has better passing concepts than Jay as crazy as that may sound. Dalton did quite well under him too. 

 

And again, he has arguably done better than any other coach under Snyder and two of them were hall of famers. I think folks will be surprised how quickly he gets a job once he is out of DC. I just hope Bruce Allen has nothing to do with picking his replacement. 

 

 

 

This is a fair and very overlooked reality. Only in Washington is Jay Gruden so hated and talked about in such angry and quite honestly sometimes petty terms. Most of the professionals in the league that know Jay have a very high respect for him. 

 

He may have to be an OC for a few years again to make sure this franchise did not break him. After that, he will get another HCing chance. I hope he does and I hope he is very successful. He is a much better coach than people give him credit for. I wish him all the success in the world. I doubt it will be here - but more despite him, not because of him. 

 

And before the unnecessary deluge of - but he sucks at......  Just save it. No one said he is perfect. I have chronicled myself the places that he is weakest. He has some things he can definitely improve on. But I stand by my statement that he is a better coach than he gets credit for by many Redskins fans.  

 

The majority of the teams problems are not due to Jay. They are due to Dan and Bruce. If Dan really cared about the Redskins as much he says he does, he would sell the team - now!  But he is way too arrogant to do that. 

 

 

 

Edited by goskins10
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2 hours ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I’m in 100% agreement on Schaffer as Prez with Smith the GM.  The issue with Williams is that they’ve promoted him so high, there are no other roles for him that won’t be an obvious demotion.

 

The problem is, what does Doug actually do? He's not a scout, he's not a cap guy, he's not a organizational guy, so what exactly is his role in the organization?

 

I'm not sure he really does much, outside of being a link to a very long and forgotten past. So, outside of that, what does he actually DO here?

 

Honestly, it seems like he's been promoted to made up positions that don't do all that much. So, make up another one that sounds good and call it a day. "President of Player Development and Public Relations" or something. Let him do some stuff with the players, and cut ribbons with the Press.

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9 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

The problem is, what does Doug actually do? He's not a scout, he's not a cap guy, he's not a organizational guy, so what exactly is his role in the organization?

 

I'm not sure he really does much, outside of being a link to a very long and forgotten past. So, outside of that, what does he actually DO here?

 

Honestly, it seems like he's been promoted to made up positions that don't do all that much. So, make up another one that sounds good and call it a day. "President of Player Development and Public Relations" or something. Let him do some stuff with the players, and cut ribbons with the Press.

 

Doug brings in players against Bruce's wishes (like Adrian Peterson).

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33 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

The problem is, what does Doug actually do? He's not a scout, he's not a cap guy, he's not a organizational guy, so what exactly is his role in the organization?

 

I'm not sure he really does much, outside of being a link to a very long and forgotten past. So, outside of that, what does he actually DO here?

 

Honestly, it seems like he's been promoted to made up positions that don't do all that much. So, make up another one that sounds good and call it a day. "President of Player Development and Public Relations" or something. Let him do some stuff with the players, and cut ribbons with the Press.

He's a Redskin legend and not much else. Was not in demand around the league. Love Doug, but he got the job because he fits Synder's two most important pieces of criteria: beholden to Dan -- who else would give him a such a big job? -- and part of the Redskins family, which makes him go down easier with some fans.

 

After 20 years, we are still waiting for Snyder to do thing the way most good organizations do. Hire a real GM. Let him pick the coach. Employ a traditional power structure. With Snyder, it's always been done differently. He either thinks he knows better than the rest of the league or wants to make sure he is involved in personnel decisions. Or both. The only thing we know for sure is that it has never worked.

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39 minutes ago, Morneblade said:

 

The problem is, what does Doug actually do? He's not a scout, he's not a cap guy, he's not a organizational guy, so what exactly is his role in the organization? 

 

The personnel department reports to him. He may not make major calls, but he's a supervisor and spokesperson.

 

The structure of Eric/Kyle/Doug can work.

 

Many people speak highly of Green Bay's personnel department. They have the following roles:

 

Director of Football Operations (Eric)

General Manager (Kyle Smith)

Senior Advisor of Football Opps (???)

Co-Directors of Player Personnel (2) (Doug)

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1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Actually it was Schaffer but Doug took the heat for it.   

Doug also took heat for the Reuben Foster signing.

 

So, I believe we could elevate him to the title of "Public Relations Heat Sink".

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1 minute ago, RandyHolt said:

Damage control. 

 

They should have pressed for his sources.  What's to hide, if its all on the up and up.

It seemed silly to be talking about it on air and telling us what Allen was saying without having recorded it so we could see for ourselves. Wasn't impressed with that at all.

 

But after days of hearing that they didn't call Tampa police and then their story of tasing to all his Bama teammates fell apart, and all the bad PR that came with it, to all of a sudden have them claiming they did a ton of research, and hadn't bothered to mention it earlier seems extremely suspicious. At best.

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9 minutes ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

On ESPN, saying Allen was talking about how much research they did on the Foster situation and how they knew there was more to the story than is being reported.

 

Color me skeptical.

 

 

The sad thing is that he likely hasnt even done as much research as collectively the people of this board have, and he is connecting dots to justify it.  Telling himself that she lied before so shes lying again amd thats what he thinks is "more to the story" like the rest of us dont already know that

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20 minutes ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

On ESPN, saying Allen was talking about how much research they did on the Foster situation and how they knew there was more to the story than is being reported.

 

Color me skeptical.

It's nonsense. Bruce is entitled and from a time where the sports media would swallow whatever nonsense you told them. Different age now. Dude just does not get it. 

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6 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

For me Kyle by a mile (he fits the profile that I want in a GM), then Schaffer by a mile over Doug.  I don't mind Doug as a facilitator but I don't like the idea of him heading personnel.

 

 

To an extent I kinda agree with you, but he is more of a wild card in all of this than the others to me. Lets not forget that our team is OVERLY stacked with Alabama guys and to a lesser extent VA Tech guys. Do we recruit other places? I know we've got some players from HBCUs which I attribute more to Williams than anybody else due to his connection to Grambling and the SWAC. 

 

But even if Smith is this great personnel guy, I wonder how he will do on trades. I think that Stephen Jones is a much better GM than Jerry Jones, but I don't think he should have traded a 1st for Cooper, especially when he could have gotten Josh Gordon for a 4th or a 5th. Will Smith get fleeced like that? (and I'm not saying that Bruce doesn't get fleeced on trades - both McNabb and Smith come to mind, and RG3 may not be on the same level but its bad). Also what's his attitude/temperament like? We know his father has a reputation for being hot headed. Is he similar? if we keep Schaffer could those two work together on their own, and do they have a good working relationship? How does his father feel about Snyder now? I know there was a riff back when Smith thought RG3 wasn't an NFL QB, but has that changed since then? In particular when Kyle asks his dad "what do you think about how I've done as GM", will his dad say something to the extent of "you'd be doing great if not for that bozo you have of an owner?" And then just for clarity, how much of a bozo is he? Will he embarrass us like Allen and Vinny have? Is he so caught up in the tape that he can't explain stuff to the layperson? Can he tote the company line while not looking like a vile individual? And at the same time, will players think he's always trying to squeeze every penny out of them or trying to do them wrong when we put them on IR? 

 

I hope that these are just stupid questions that we can laugh at, but if we're going to get better in this area I thought I should list my concerns. 

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