The Bruce Allen/GM Thread

[Skinsinparadise]

7 minutes ago, SkinsFTW said:

 

Are their 2 idiots worse than ours though?

 

At least theirs sign their players when it's time to.

 

Nope IMO.  Will McClay who runs their personnel department is considered by some the best in the league.   Jerry is a mess but not as bad as Dan IMO.  He's won a lot more than Dan.  And at least the dude doesn't hide from the public regardless of how hot the heat gets.   

2 minutes ago, Andre The Giant said:

Dallas wouldn’t definitely offer him control of front office. No guarantee they’d want him over, say, Riley or that they’ll definitely make a change. 
 

Skins offering all control now = bird in hand.  I could see Urban pulling the trigger. 

 

I agree with this part.  No way Dallas gives him control.  Dan is always willing to pretend he will at least. 

[pcbothwel]

1 minute ago, SkinsFTW said:

 

Are their 2 idiots worse than ours though?

 

At least theirs sign their players when it's time to.

 

I would argue that Dan is a bigger idiot, but he has said and shown a willingness to step back and let professionals make decisions... Jerry Jones has done the exact opposite.

 

I would also argue that the Cowboys might be in a worse overall position for a new HC. They are a non-playoff team that will have will have 60M per year invested in a RB, WR, and above average QB... Thats a recipe for mediocrity if i have ever heard one.

 

Our front 7 players (With Chase Young) will be flush with elite young talent and we have Guice & Terry on offense. Assuming you like Haskins, there is a TON of opportunity to add to the team.

 

Last Part: Expectation. Any Cowboys coach will be expected to win 10 games and one playoff game off the bat. The Skins coach could garner tons of praise by simply winning 7-8 games if other factors (Stability, culture, etc.) also appear to improve 

[bh32]

Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Nope IMO.  Will McClay who runs their personnel department is considered by some the best in the league.   Jerry is a mess but not as bad as Dan IMO.  He's won a lot more than Dan.  And at least the dude doesn't hide from the public regardless of how hot the heat gets.   

Dallas's talent is so over rated..They have a couple good OL and a bunch of meh everywhere else.

[RWJ]

51 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

Mark Gray, apparently is a 980 guy, haven't heard of him, he's the source.  He just jumped on the station. 

 

Dan had a summit meeting recently in the Bahamas.  Among the conclusions:  Meyer is HC.  Alex Smith in the FO with some position.  He's not sure about what happens with Bruce.  Meyer would have some hand in personnel, too.

 

Dan is uncomfortable with the perception people have around the league that it isn't a franchise destination spot anymore.  He wants to make a splash.  Meyer is the dude.  He heard they are doing stuff including getting the Ohio State fight song ready for the announcement.  

 

Listening to the dude, I wouldn't treat it obviously as gospel. Just more gossip.   You'd figure Schefter or someone who nail a story like this first but I guess you never know.  But I'll give him credit on one front, unlike the other guys covering all this, this dude is sticking his neck out and saying Meyer would be announced as the guy.  He's not hedging on the story. 

So SIP is this fella from 980 saying the Bruce is replaced/fired?  Another words not affiliated with the Skins anymore?

[SkinsFTW]

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Nope IMO.  Will McClay who runs their personnel department is considered by some the best in the league.   Jerry is a mess but not as bad as Dan IMO.  He's won a lot more than Dan.  And at least the dude doesn't hide from the public regardless of how hot the heat gets.   

 

And he doesn't pretend to offer full control and then use his committee of himself and the team president to get exactly what he wants behind the scenes.

[Skinsinparadise]

1 minute ago, bh32 said:

Dallas's talent is so over rated..They have a couple good OL and a bunch of meh everywhere else.

 

Disagree and I mean that sadly since I hate the Cowboys.  Check out the PFF ratings among other things versus our players its not even close.   But their FO has dysfunction albeit no where as bad as ours.  And their HC is a joke.  They do have a problem though with Cooper, Dak and Bryon Jones all looking to get paid at the same time right on the heels of big contracts for Elliot and Lawrence. 

1 minute ago, RWJ said:

So SIP is this fella from 980 saying the Bruce is replaced/fired?  Another words not affiliated with the Skins anymore?

 

He said he didn't hear anything relating to Bruce. 

[Wildbunny]

25 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

I'm not convinced that hiring a coach to "be in charge" is a terrible approach. Look at Buffalo. McDermott was hired before Beane. McD wanted Beane because they know each other, trust each other and are good at collaborating. Beane knows what McDermott needs for his systems to work. It can be done correctly doing it that way as long as the GM and HC have clearly defined roles and they work together rather than opposed to each other.

We tried that approach with Shanahan.

 

We ended up with the guy whose names is in the title of this very thread...

[SkinsFTW]

1 minute ago, RWJ said:

So SIP is this fella from 980 saying the Bruce is replaced/fired?  Another words not affiliated with the Skins anymore?

 

He doesn't know because Dan doesn't want to give up his puppet.

[NeverSurrender]

While Alex Smith has clearly never held any type of front office position, I think he is the type of person you want around.  He has intangibles through the roof.  I think he would work great with Meyer in helping to identify the right type of talent for the team.  I also think that he could provide exceptional leadership and professional development for players.  This is the type of guy that you move mountains to keep around.  If we dont, I know there are teams that would have him in their FO in a heartbeat. 

[KDawg]

2 minutes ago, Wildbunny said:

We tried that approach with Shanahan.

 

We ended up with the guy whose names is in the title of this very thread...

 

So because we did something one time and it didn't work it means its always wrong?

 

And we didn't really try the approach I'm outlining. Shanahan was in charge of personnel. The problem was that Snyder meddled from day one and drafted RG3. We know Shanahan wasn't on board with that move as he drafted Cousins in the 4th. 

 

The system I'm describing doesn't have a de facto GM. It has a real GM tied to the HC. A guy who knows the HC and understands the things he looks for in players. McDermott is NOT in charge of player personnel. Beane is. Beane just knows McDermott.

[Skinsinparadise]

7 minutes ago, SkinsFTW said:

 

And he doesn't pretend to offer full control and then use his committee of himself and the team president to get exactly what he wants behind the scenes.

 

Yeah I hate to say it because he's a Cowboy but Jerry Jones IMO is a mile better than Dan.   I far from like everything he does but he doesn't play games.  He's transparent.  He's accountable to the public.   He doesn't hide.  Heck he's even likable.  Would I want him ideally as the owner of my team -- nope.  Would I take him over Dan?  Yeah by miles. 

[justice98]

27 minutes ago, spjunkies said:

I'm buying the Urban story. I'm good as long as Allen is done. 

 

Playing along for the purposes of this discussion, let's say it's true.  It still seems like a dysfunctional way of doing it.  Why cant we just hire a regular GM and let the GM conduct the coaching search?  Or hire a team president, let him hire a GM and so on. 

 

This franchise always has to overthink it and have some non-traditional setup where you're not really sure who does what, what power they have, and who reports to who.  

[Andre The Giant]

2 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

Playing along for the purposes of this discussion, let's say it's true.  It still seems like a dysfunctional way of doing it.  Why cant we just hire a regular GM and let the GM conduct the coaching search?  Or hire a team president, let him hire a GM and so on. 

 

This franchise always has to overthink it and have some non-traditional setup where you're not really sure who does what, what power they have, and who reports to who.  

That’s what I’ve wanted too. But coaching is really important in the NFL, and if they can get Meyer, and he has full control, I’m good.
 

They have drafted very well under Kyle Smith.  If true, and his role is also increased, this setup has potential. 

[86 Snyder]

9 minutes ago, NeverSurrender said:

While Alex Smith has clearly never held any type of front office position, I think he is the type of person you want around.  He has intangibles through the roof.  I think he would work great with Meyer in helping to identify the right type of talent for the team.  I also think that he could provide exceptional leadership and professional development for players.  This is the type of guy that you move mountains to keep around.  If we dont, I know there are teams that would have him in their FO in a heartbeat. 

 

There are worse people to give first chances to, for sure.  I'm warming to the idea of getting his feet wet with a vague FO-whisperer type role and seeing how he develops.  At least, in theory.  The problem is we all know Dan doesn't think that way.  It's more like:

 

 

[SoCalSkins]

Urban Meyer is by far the best possible result of how this coaching search could go. I'm super pumped.

[Andre The Giant]

7 minutes ago, 86 Snyder said:

 

There are worse people to give first chances to, for sure.  I'm warming to the idea of getting his feet wet with a vague FO-whisperer type role and seeing how he develops.  At least, in theory.  The problem is we all know Dan doesn't think that way.

My guess is Alex’s job would be to take Bruce’s role of primary liaison w/ Dan. Urban likely trusts him, and so it seems does Dan.  Could be why it was he who stayed late w/ Dan, and not Bruce, after the Eagles game. 
 

Alex has an excellent reputation around the league. Knowing how the Skins actually operate, I’d be cool with this setup as well. 

[NewCliche21]

19 minutes ago, KDawg said:

The system I'm describing doesn't have a de facto GM. It has a real GM tied to the HC. A guy who knows the HC and understands the things he looks for in players. McDermott is NOT in charge of player personnel. Beane is. Beane just knows McDermott.

 

This is what I'm imagining.

 

Coach:  All right, I'm trying to make chicken pot pie.  Let's pick up everything from Wal-Mart this afternoon.

 

GM:  Okay, so you want to make chicken pot pie, got it.  Instead of Wal-Mart, I know that there's a really good crust at Store A, some great chicken next year at Store B which you've never heard of, some bad quarter-carrots that we want to avoid from Store (US)C, and I've got a bunch of guys looking to see if any of our neighbors have some other under-utilized ingredients.

 

Coach:  Okay, as long as it fits to make the best chicken pot pie ever, you bring them to me and we'll talk about it.  If I'm not sure, I'll defer to your gut.

_____

 

Something like that?

[86 Snyder]

2 minutes ago, Andre The Giant said:

My guess is Alex’s job would be to take Bruce’s role of primary liaison w/ Dan. Urban likely trusts him, and so it seems does Dan.  Could be why it was he who stayed late w/ Dan, and not Bruce, after the Eagles game. 
 

Alex has an excellent reputation around the league. Knowing how the Skins actually operate, I’d be cool with this setup as well. 

 

Agree with what you've outlined, but who would be picking the players, Meyer?  That's an awful lot of control to give a guy who hasn't coached in the nfl.  

 

I could live with that setup if they promoted Kyle, or brought in a respected personnel guy that wouldn't necessarily require being the final word and was willing to take a collaborative approach (lol like both parts of this description fits anyone).  

 

Otherwise, I fear it's just Meyer, Alex, and Doug Williams on the mast head, with Kyle and Schaffer doing their best to bail everyone out all day long.

 

Or, and I dont even want to say the words, ****ing Voldemort hangs around pulling strings in some capacity.

[Cooleyfan1993]

Had a dream last night that i saw A tweet the day after Christmas that said the redskins have fired Bruce Allen. 

 

Woke up today, and no tweet about any firing. Sad 🙁

[Voice_of_Reason]

1 hour ago, NewCliche21 said:

But to keep it relevant, can someone explain to me the allure of Smith in the FO?

1. He’s not Bruce.

2. He would “retire” which would be helpful to the Skins cap situation.

3. He seems like a likable guy, which is the opposite of Bruce and Dan.

 

 

1 hour ago, Mr. Sinister said:

I can just imagine D Hall strutting through the building making all the women in heels that are taller than him walk around barefoot.

 

Good times.

I had completely forgotten he made Kelli Johnson take off her shoes.  Kelli was REALLY tall and wore high heals.  

 

The whole thing went to hell when Kelli told the story and they panned down to show her bare feet.  

 

Good times.  Good times. 

 

43 minutes ago, bh32 said:

I don't know why any coach would want to coach for the Cowboys with the two idiots that are running that team..

Because the Cowboys are the #1 brand in football.  And big egos crave attention.  And you’ll get that in spades.  

 

 

42 minutes ago, 86 Snyder said:

 

Why?  Casserly is utterly clueless these days.  Maybe he caught some infectious CTE.

The dirty little secret is Casserly was never a good GM.  Bethard built the Skins teams.  Casserly had plenty of flops as GM of the Skins then wasn’t good in Houston.

 

 

37 minutes ago, SkinsFTW said:

 

Are their 2 idiots worse than ours though?

 

At least theirs sign their players when it's time to.

Jerry is likable, transparent and accountable. So, yes. 

[Andre The Giant]

8 minutes ago, 86 Snyder said:

 

Agree with what you've outlined, but who would be picking the players, Meyer?  That's an awful lot of control to give a guy who hasn't coached in the nfl.  

 

I could live with that setup if they promoted Kyle, or brought in a respected personnel guy that wouldn't necessarily require being the final word and was willing to take a collaborative approach (lol like both parts of this description fits anyone).  

 

Otherwise, I fear it's just Meyer, Alex, and Doug Williams on the mast head, with Kyle and Schaffer doing their best to bail everyone out all day long.

 

Or, and I dont even want to say the words, ****ing Voldemort hangs around pulling strings in some capacity.

According to the report, somebody will be promoted to Director of Player Personnel.  You’d think it’d be either Kyle Smith or Alex Santos. My guess would be Kyle.  He’d then own college and pro personnel.
 

Question is what happens with Doug. He may be odd man out. 

[justice98]

22 minutes ago, Andre The Giant said:

That’s what I’ve wanted too. But coaching is really important in the NFL, and if they can get Meyer, and he has full control, I’m good.
 

They have drafted very well under Kyle Smith.  If true, and his role is also increased, this setup has potential. 

 

I just kinda wonder what his influence really was on who got picked.  All we ever heard was "this was a Bruce/Dan pick or this was a Gruden pick".  

[Panninho]

 

[profusion]

Forgive me if I don't jump on this latest "sources say" rumor. A few weeks ago, the breathless reports were of Bruce being fired...a few weeks ago.

 

That said, it wouldn't surprise me if Dan backed up a large enough brinks truck to nab Meyer. Jerry Jones isn't going to hire anyone who would redirect the spotlight away from himself.

[Voice_of_Reason]

16 minutes ago, justice98 said:

 

I just kinda wonder what his influence really was on who got picked.  All we ever heard was "this was a Bruce/Dan pick or this was a Gruden pick".  

Bruce/Dan only care about 1st rounders.  Jay took credit for a few guys.  His shining pick was Ionnidis.  

 

But from reports Kyle/Doug chose who was picked when. There is a story from 2 years ago where Jay fell in love with Trey Quinn (typical under talented, try hard Jay Gruden type of guy) and wanted to pick him in the 5th and Doug got him with the last pick in the draft.