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The Bruce Allen/GM Thread

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The whole idea that Bruce is needed for a stadium is ****ing insane and asinine. Guy should have been fired half a decade ago. The fact that Snyder even thinks Allen is the key to a new stadium only cements his own stupidity.

 

1. A winning culture cures all. If this team was a Superbowl contender and a perennial playoff team, the fans would ****ing pack the hell out of ugly FedEx Field and the DMV governments would be falling over themselves trying to secure a new stadium deal.

 

2. There is no way in HELL, Bruce Allen is better at getting a Stadium deal done then say...Brian Lafemina who did this for the NFL as a whole.

 

Yet as it stands, Lafemina was fired and Snyder continues to employ this imbecile year after year with no legitimate rationale.

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1 hour ago, ggarriso said:

while sloth Haskins continues his "development" after a below average preseason where he clearly looked overweight and overmatched in the NFL while his daddy setup his brand.

 

Everything else you said is absolutely spot on this but this came out of nowhere...wtf? 

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2 hours ago, ggarriso said:

Just taking stock a few items

 

-Kyle is now undefeated in SF

-McVay is undefeated in LA

-Several rookie QB's are looking like studs while sloth Haskins continues his "development" after a below average preseason where he clearly looked overweight and overmatched in the NFL while his daddy setup his brand.  

--KC using tools from the trade with us for Smith to go undefeated while Alex Smith recovers from a busto leg

--Basement of the NFC East

--Mystery and lingering injuries continue unchecked

--Reed probably never to play again after collecting a fat check to do nothing for two years (to include this one)

--Team "captain" never wants to be associated w/ this organization ever again

--Hall of Fame RB making fun of FO publicly after being unceremoniously benched

--Guice

--Fan apathy at an all time high

 

Bruce you SUCK - I truly hate what this org has become

 

 

If Bruce goes, the first question we should be asking ourselves is "who's the next Bruce Allen or Vinny Cerrato going to be?" 

 

You could rewind it 10 years before he even got here and see the issues. That tells me Bruce isn't the main problem

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4 hours ago, ggarriso said:

 

-Several rookie QB's are looking like studs while sloth Haskins continues his "development" after a below average preseason where where he clearly looked overweight and overmatched in the NFL while his daddy setup his brand

 

Those studs you are referring too would be duds in Jay Gruden's system

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9 hours ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

If Bruce goes, the first question we should be asking ourselves is "who's the next Bruce Allen or Vinny Cerrato going to be?" 

 

You could rewind it 10 years before he even got here and see the issues. That tells me Bruce isn't the main problem

 

I don't think anyone thinks he's the main problem but he IMO helps double down on the lack of class-incompetence.  Be nice if Dan (though granted not sure its possible) found a BFF who imbues class and competence.  Bruce was called by a reporter in Tampa the Prince of Darkness before he got here.   That might be harsh.  But Bruce at least from what some say doubles down on the element of office politics at Redskins Park.

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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1 hour ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I don't think anyone thinks he's the main problem but he IMO helps double down on the lack of class-incompetence.  Be nice if Dan (though granted not sure its possible) found a BFF who imbues class and competence.  Bruce was called by a reporter in Tampa the Prince of Darkness before he got here.   That might be harsh.  But Bruce at least from what some say doubles down on the element of office politics at Redskins Park.

 

I am willing to be friends with Dan Snyder. I don't know that I'm competent, though. So there's that :ols:

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6 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

I am willing to be friends with Dan Snyder. I don't know that I'm competent, though. So there's that :ols:

 

Sounds like you also have to be willing to have drinks with him most nights, and tell him how smart he is and how the evil media misrepresents him, and on occasion go on vacation with him.  😀  Sadly, this is some of the stuff said about him, so not joking.  :(

Edited by Skinsinparadise

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8 hours ago, Boss_Hogg said:

 

Those studs you are referring too would be duds in Jay Gruden's system

 

very possibly, or within this organization

 

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Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Sounds like you also have to be willing to have drinks with him most nights, and tell him how smart he is and how the evil media misrepresents him, and on occasion go on vacation with him.  😀  Sadly, this is some of the stuff said about him, so not joking.  :(

 

Let me run the show and I'll tell him whatever he needs to hear while I sprinkle truth bombs in between...

 

"Dan, you are so villified, man. It's not cool. You're a good dude. You just want to win and you have a way of doing things. Didn't you tell me the other day that the most important part of building a team is having a solid base?"

 

Dan nods

 

"Right! So a focus on the lines is a great plan. You're a god damn genius. Weren't you also explaining how a coach has to be able to manage his roster? I think that's great. The coach knows what he needs and needs to work closely with a GM who understands the dynamics and can work with the coach and not force guys on him, but at the same time help him see different perspectives so they can work together and find the best players. You're a lot smarter than anyone says you are. You're coming up with all of this stuff, straight from your mind. The media has no idea how smart you are."

 

Dan nods and takes a sip of his ****tail.

 

"And, correct me if I'm wrong here, but you believe that the best ability of a player is availability, right? You were saying how guys who aren't here don't help us? I think that's a great thought. You have such a great mind. If the team isn't going to re-sign people, we need to try to get assets for them. And injury prone players can't be relied upon, but rather be supplements. This is good stuff. You should write a book, man. I can see if I can find a publisher to help you!"

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6 minutes ago, KDawg said:

 

 

"And, correct me if I'm wrong here, but you believe that the best ability of a player is availability, right? You were saying how guys who aren't here don't help us? I think that's a great thought. You have such a great mind. If the team isn't going to re-sign people, we need to try to get assets for them. And injury prone players can't be relied upon, but rather be supplements. This is good stuff. You should write a book, man. I can see if I can find a publisher to help you!"

 

Yeah I get the vibe that he needs to be played like that.  Some said he loved Gibbs in part because he made Dan feel included in most decisions where it felt like he was part of them even if Gibbs was mostly doing his own thing and in his own way.

 

Cooley has said the next GM whomever that is has to be able to work well and closely with Dan.  So to be successful, that dude has to be not only a good personnel guy but also be masterful at managing Dan.  Vinny and Bruce could do the later part.  If only we can find a personnel guy who is also good and could manage Dan. 

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Not sure if this has been posted or discussed but Bruce Allen recently sold his home (for a loss) in McLean, VA. Apparently he's been trying to sell it for years so I guess it means nothing. 

 

But then Snyder is trying to sell his mansion for 49 million. 

 

What does this all mean? Probably nothing but still interesting. 

 

https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2019-09-16/redskins-president-bruce-allen-takes-a-loss-on-mclean-mansion

https://robbreport.com/shelter/homes-for-sale/nfl-owner-lists-his-opulent-washington-d-c-estate-for-49-million-2857161/

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6 minutes ago, Boss_Hogg said:

Not sure if this has been posted or discussed but Bruce Allen recently sold his home (for a loss) in McLean, VA. Apparently he's been trying to sell it for years so I guess it means nothing. 

 

But then Snyder is trying to sell his mansion for 49 million. 

 

What does this all mean? Probably nothing but still interesting. 

 

https://www.latimes.com/business/story/2019-09-16/redskins-president-bruce-allen-takes-a-loss-on-mclean-mansion

https://robbreport.com/shelter/homes-for-sale/nfl-owner-lists-his-opulent-washington-d-c-estate-for-49-million-2857161/

They know they can no longer live in the same area of the franchise they ruined?

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2 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Yeah I get the vibe that he needs to be played like that.  Some said he loved Gibbs in part because he made Dan feel included in most decisions where it felt like he was part of them even if Gibbs was mostly doing his own thing and in his own way.

 

Cooley has said the next GM whomever that is has to be able to work well and closely with Dan.  So to be successful, that dude has to be not only a good personnel guy but also be masterful at managing Dan.  Vinny and Bruce could do the later part.  If only we can find a personnel guy who is also good and could manage Dan

 

I can't think of a single person in the NFL with that skillset. The amount of effort it takes to placate Snyder is less time spent evaluating talent or signing players. There's only so much time in the day. This is why nobody will take the job, because any competent personnel guy knows he will waste half his day catering to Snyder's ego, only to get ultimately tossed out the door with his reputation damaged by his association with the Skins.

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2 hours ago, Skintime said:

They know they can no longer live in the same area of the franchise they ruined?

 

Maybe Dan is planning on moving the team? All that slimy midget cares about right now is a tax payer funded stadium. I know the NFL wants a team in London. 

 

With declining attendance and a rapidly eroding fanbase we are entering into those waters

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12 hours ago, Boss_Hogg said:

 

Those studs you are referring too would be duds in Jay Gruden's system

 

I'm not so sure...I think we need to de-couple the organization from Gruden's ability to develop a passing game. He has a career journeyman QB putting up very good numbers even though he's leaving multiple plays on the field due to his limitations. 

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31 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

I'm not so sure...I think we need to de-couple the organization from Gruden's ability to develop a passing game. He has a career journeyman QB putting up very good numbers even though he's leaving multiple plays on the field due to his limitations. 

 

Yup. I don’t buy that Gruden is bad at everything. He’s mediocre at best at situational play calling and setting plays up for later. That’s generous. But he’s phenomenal at finding talent, getting receivers open, etc.

 

hes poor at roster management but of all the things I just named we have no idea which are actually his issues versus the franchise. 

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31 minutes ago, TD_washingtonredskins said:

 

I'm not so sure...I think we need to de-couple the organization from Gruden's ability to develop a passing game. He has a career journeyman QB putting up very good numbers even though he's leaving multiple plays on the field due to his limitations. 

 

Yup. I don’t buy that Gruden is bad at everything. He’s mediocre at best at situational play calling and setting plays up for later. That’s generous. But he’s phenomenal at finding talent, getting receivers open, etc.

 

hes poor at roster management but of all the things I just named we have no idea which are actually his issues versus the franchise. 

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3 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Yeah I get the vibe that he needs to be played like that.  Some said he loved Gibbs in part because he made Dan feel included in most decisions where it felt like he was part of them even if Gibbs was mostly doing his own thing and in his own way.

 

Cooley has said the next GM whomever that is has to be able to work well and closely with Dan.  So to be successful, that dude has to be not only a good personnel guy but also be masterful at managing Dan.  Vinny and Bruce could do the later part.  If only we can find a personnel guy who is also good and could manage Dan. 

 

This is the thing that sparked me initially about Kyle Smith. I knew nothing about him as a personnel guy initially. It was that he was the son of a former GM - AJ Smith, who is also Bruce's best friend. Now, given that AJ was an arrogant dude in his own right, but I kinda hope that Kyle is being trained and brought up by a mixture of AJ and Bruce on how to lead a team. And as much as we want to knock Bruce for various reasons one thing he has done is turned Dan around in terms of how he's building a team. So he may be the perfect guy to help mentor Kyle on how to talk to Dan. AJ, who is Kyle's father could then pull him aside and say "ignore points 1, 2, and 3 that Bruce just told you but that point about the raquetball - take it to the bank". 

 

The thing about this league is that its a temporary league. All jobs are temporary. And in such a temporary league, we've had Vinny and Bruce here for 9 years each. So that gives the position some value in terms of stability. Dan will give you an opportunity to shine. But you've got to do your proper amount of snoozing. I wonder how much it is compared to other jobs - both inside and outside of football. I know at my current job, I found my introverted self having to go to a bunch of office parties and events to show I could be "one of the boys". Maybe I didn't "need" to do this, but there was a certain guilt I felt when I'd get a company email saying there was event so and so going to at place blah blah blah and there'd be a series of replies of excuses saying why people couldn't go. But when i did go, and when I got out of my shell, I got first hand experiences to talk to some of the VPs and leadership. And not just that but people who were somewhat parallel to me, when they got promoted they remembered my name. 

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15 hours ago, Burgundy Yoda said:

If Bruce goes, the first question we should be asking ourselves is "who's the next Bruce Allen or Vinny Cerrato going to be?" 

 

You could rewind it 10 years before he even got here and see the issues. That tells me Bruce isn't the main problem

We still have the options that Dan's stumble on someone's good at everything. Not probable, but possible.

 

13 hours ago, Boss_Hogg said:

 

Those studs you are referring too would be duds in Jay Gruden's system

There's a long list of QB that were seen as studs to end up duds a few games later.

I'm pretty sure Blake Bortles is in this list.

Even ColtMcCoy would be if you just take his win against the cowboys out of a vacuum.

 

4 hours ago, KDawg said:

 

I am willing to be friends with Dan Snyder. I don't know that I'm competent, though. So there's that :ols:

You should get your resume ready for both GM and HC. Changes will come soon.

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20 minutes ago, Thinking Skins said:

Now, given that AJ was an arrogant dude in his own right, but I kinda hope that Kyle is being trained and brought up by a mixture of AJ and Bruce on how to lead a team. And as much as we want to knock Bruce for various reasons one thing he has done is turned Dan around in terms of how he's building a team.

I strongly disagree.  The last thing we want is Kyle to see Bruce as a mentor in being a GM.  Outside of the conventional philosophy of building through the draft vs. FA, what does Bruce bring to the table?  Smug arrogance that turns people off.  Add AJ to the mix and just yeah, no.

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1 minute ago, BatteredFanSyndrome said:

I strongly disagree.  The last thing we want is Kyle to see Bruce as a mentor in being a GM.  Outside of the conventional philosophy of building through the draft vs. FA, what does Bruce bring to the table?  Smug arrogance that turns people off.  Add AJ to the mix and just yeah, no.

 

His mentor in being a GM is his dad - who was a great GM in terms of personnel. His model for dealing with Snyder is Bruce, who may be second only to Vinny in that respect. Whether you think so or not, Kyle has interpreted his dad's ability to evaluate talent. The question is will we see that to fruition or will we find an excuse to let him go? Heck even jay may be a good mentor for him in terms of dealing with Dan. But we can't have this guy leave like Marty or Schneider because they couldn't play team ball. If all Dan needs is to feel included, then Kyle needs to learn to play the game. 

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Backing up a bit, I wonder how much of this is based on the newness of Danny. He was a 34 year old Bilioniare when he purchased the team and was doing something entirely new to him and he did it incredibly wrong. But alongside that is that he didnt know anybody or many people in the business. So to counter that he met Vinny and part of Vinny's job was to help introduce Danny to the league. Vinny fails as a GM / personnel guy but is helping Dan learn the ropes and meet people. But Vinny's network is limited as he's never really had success and Snyder learns quickly that his "network" is really "people who know people" but really they don't know any people. And he also learns that his BFF owner Jerrah Jones was a backstabbing liar who he can't trust, but at the same time the one he most wants to be like. SO he says he'll go after someone who worked for another backstabbing liar in Al Davis with (we'll ignore that this connection was made my Shanny) Brce Allen. Unlike Vinny, Allen does have a network and Dan is learning the names and faces in that network as well as having these conversations with people like AJ Smith or Scot or Doug or maybe Martin Mayhew and other former Skins who are now in league front office positions, even former Skins who are in coaching positions. 

So maybe Snyder's league knowledge is improving and further maybe if we force Snyder to leave town, we'll have to go through this again with a new owner as they have to learn the ropes again. 

The key question I have now is can he build a winning environment. Something has to be good here as far as recognizing talent because we have guys on our staff who are valued (McVay, K. Shanahan, LeFleur, Smith, Schaffer, our coordinators found positions elsewhere. It seems to be more the culture than anything and I think part of that comes with the ingredients (the players) and part of that comes with winning. Like they say, winning produces winning. But there are other things like has been raised - the putting players back on the field after getting hurt, the field conditions, the suing the fans, the stadium experience, the war with the media, etc. the stories go on and on. And I really hope that he is learning as an owner because that's the quickest road to victory for us. 

And the great part about that is that we've seen a lot of owners make a key hire like a FO position and suddenly they turn it around. Look no furhter than Dallas. They hired Parcells and suddenly their FO was looking good. Then they promoted JJ's son and he's managed to make a number of sound decisions. Hopefully Dan can do a similar thing. 

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18 hours ago, Thinking Skins said:

 

This is the thing that sparked me initially about Kyle Smith. I knew nothing about him as a personnel guy initially. It was that he was the son of a former GM - AJ Smith, who is also Bruce's best friend. Now, given that AJ was an arrogant dude in his own right, but I kinda hope that Kyle is being trained and brought up by a mixture of AJ and Bruce on how to lead a team. And as much as we want to knock Bruce for various reasons one thing he has done is turned Dan around in terms of how he's building a team.

 

There isn't much I want him to learn from Bruce.  If some are going to give Bruce a complete pass for anything that happened under Shanny (some who cover the team say we shouldn't and that he was involved at times) then that idea cuts both ways.  It was Shanny who started the rely on the draft drill (not Bruce).  The irony of it was Shanny in his previous stint who would rip off Vinny for draft picks.  I've not heard anyone who covers the team contradict that Shanny didn't want McNabb and that Dan-Bruce pushed it. 

 

But yeah I do like the emphasis on the draft.  But I don't give him credit for that.  I'll give him credit for sticking by it when Shanny left.  Other that that?  Don't give multiple years in guaranteed money in his contracts or extend veterans to borrow cap room where it ends up in dead money.  After that, nada.  The most disappointing thing for me about Bruce is the team comes off every bit as sleazy and heck maybe even more so than they did with Vinny there.  He by his own admission is in charge of trades -- most of which were bad and most of which they overpaid.  The culture there according to some isn't good and that Bruce can be every bit as cronyism driven and cutthroat as any GM in the league -- and indications are agents don't trust the dude. 

 

I'd hope Kyle runs with his own instincts which I think are likely really good. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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