Makaveli

The Bruce Allen/GM Thread

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11 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I think it was the year before his last one.  It was if I recall for the start of the Zorn tenure.   Eventually, Dan gave in when it hit epic levels of fan discontentment.   We can argue its the case now -- and i agree it is on many fronts.  But the one thing that went down in 2009 that hasn't happened yet are people bringing signs to the stadium.  The firebruce campaign really took off right at the end of the season.  in 2009 it was there for a good chunk of that season - I think that's going down in 2019.  

3

 

Actually lol...Dan wanted Shanahan after the 2008 season but Shanny told him to let Zorn continue coaching (either because he contacted Shanahan too late into the offseason or because Shanny wasn't ready to come back to coaching yet). So Snyder was wanting to replace Zorn before any 2009 fan discontent was being shown. He also wanted Bruce Allen during Gibbs' tenure but Bruce took the Tampa gig instead.

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Is Snyder making any money from the Fire Bruce Allen tee-shirts?  I'm not going to buy a shirt to avoid the possibility of enriching Snyder inadvertently.

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21 hours ago, FrFan said:

Another sad proof we hit rock bottom
Dr. Frankenputz says: 
January 11, 2019 at 3:44 pm

Never thought I’d say this as a lifelong Eagles fan but I really do feel bad for the Redskins fans. Probably similar to how I felt when Norman Braman was the Eagles owner…no hope on the horizon.

famundacheese says:    
January 11, 2019 at 3:52 pm

Eagles fan here. I used to hate the skins. Now it’s hard to. It’s like when the Cardinals left the division the skins took over as bottom feeders. I actually feel bad for the fan base.

Sheesh. I don’t know whether to feel grateful that a fan of another team can commiserate with us or indignant that they’d think fans of a storied franchise like ours would need their sympathy. Meh, who am I kidding. It’s been so long since we were relevant, I’ll gladly take the first option. Thanks Bro.

 

15 hours ago, FrFan said:

 

Let’s face it. It has to be well known around the league that the Skins are where good careers go to die. Nobody worth his salt wants to come here unless it’s to back up the Brinks truck for one last easy, fat payday.

 

I’m glad none of them came here. They’re not R. Kelly. They didn’t do anything to deserve the Danny and Bruce treatment.

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40 minutes ago, Veryoldschool said:

Is Snyder making any money from the Fire Bruce Allen tee-shirts?  I'm not going to buy a shirt to avoid the possibility of enriching Snyder inadvertently.

 

And the Russians. Don't forget them. Russian hackers rigged Bruce's promotion. 

 

 

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5 hours ago, Rufus T Firefly said:

On the 6-3 start: We had the 10th easiest schedule in the league this year. In going 6-3 we only outscored our nine opponents by a net total of 1 point (176-175). We only beat one team that would end up in the playoffs, the Cowboys, on a really weird penalty call.  We caught them two weeks before they started their 6-1 finish. We got the Colts in the middle of a 1-5 start, and lost anyway (we were the 1 in 1-5). The only team you could argue we caught at a bad time was Carolina.  We were in the hunt for a playoff spot only because of a strangely fluky year where an inordinate amount of top echelon NFC teams were undone by key injuries or bad coaching, or both (Philly, Green Bay, Minnesota, Atlanta, Carolina).

 

We were extraordinarily lucky to be 6-3 and in the playoff hunt. The fact that Snyder looks at last season and sees bad luck just tells us how incompetently we are run. It's going to go badly next season and he's going to be shocked by it.

 

Copy and paste this for the 6 average to above average teams that make playoffs each year. 

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1 minute ago, wit33 said:

 

Copy and paste this for the 6 average to above average teams that make playoffs each year. 

 

I like that even in your wild, kool-aid guzzling dreams we only compare to "average to above average teams". Open your eyes, dude. 

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2 minutes ago, ConnSKINS26 said:

 

I like that even in your wild, kool-aid guzzling dreams we only compare to "average to above average teams". Open your eyes, dude. 

 

Next year I expect Skins to be below average to average. No QB. No kool-aid. 

 

Team last year even with a Smith at helm was just solid, never implied anything else. The main ingredient team had over other average teams was an identity of playing old school football (even though Jay didn’t embrace it). 

 

 

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5 hours ago, wit33 said:

 

Next year I expect Skins to be below average to average. No QB. No kool-aid. 

 

Team last year even with a Smith at helm was just solid, never implied anything else. The main ingredient team had over other average teams was an identity of playing old school football (even though Jay didn’t embrace it). 

 

 

 

I like when fans say "Some of us saw how fake that 6-3 record was and expected this," with "this" meaning a 1-6 record over the last 7 games. Yeah, people saw the Skins losing the majority of 1st and 2nd string players to injury game after game, since that played the biggest role in going 1-6. Either that, or they feel talking of injuries is just an excuse.

 

I don't know what our record would have ultimately been if we didn't lose, say, Richardson, Scherff, Dunbar, and Alex...but there's nothing that makes me believe it still would have been 1-6 no matter who we had on the field. The team playing in December was nowhere close to resembling the team playing in September. Teams win with starters in September and with depth in December, but we were playing with the depth's depth lol (and in some places the depth's depth's depth's cousin-in-law)....As you said, the Skins were winning by churning out some 70s-type football: focusing on the run, playing stout defense against the run, applying good QB pressure, minimizing mistakes and making just enough big plays to get more W's. You can't go season to season doing that and expect to win, unless you have top flight talent along both lines and at RB and even then it's tricky. But the 6-3 start was anything but fake.

 

Our biggest issue was that we didn't see much improvement during that 6-3 start, and in terms of points saw things get worse. I think everyone expected (or hoped) the offense would start looking more dynamic as the weeks progressed. Smith started showing improvement but in much smaller increments than desired. But imagine how the Texans game progresses if he doesn't throw that VERY-unlike-Alex-Smith pick-6 in the red zone against the Texans. Then imagine he doesn't break his leg in that game, and that Scherff is still on the field protecting him. I'd think the team could have found a way to win one, maybe even two, additional games and go 3-4 instead of 1-6. 9-7 instead of 7-9. Playoffs or 5 spots higher in the 1st round. Players reacting to the leadership of Alex Smith down the stretch as opposed to the leadership of Colt Mc--whoops, I mean, Mark Sanch--er, I mean Josh Johnson...that's his name, right?...

Edited by Califan007
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25 minutes ago, FrFan said:

We need a tsunami to clean the augean stables imo.

 

Why can't Skins tempt top coordinator candidates?

 

Could it also be because they don't have any open positions to fill, outside of special teams coach? It's hard to tempt a top candidate for a position that doesn't exist yet.

 

These things are usually instigated by agents, not the actual coaches. Teams have positions open and contact the coaches' agents about their client, or agents contact the team about their openings. Could be that the Skins haven't actually contacted any agents yet, and when agents contact the team to inquire about possible openings the Skins don't say "yeah, we will be looking for a new defensive coordinator" but instead say "We're still going over things, we'll let you know." And since Bruce is supposed to be GM who is the least trusted by agents, unless there is a gaping hole at a coaching/coordinator spot those same agents could be thinking 'eh, why bother' lol... There is very little about the Skins' actions right now that says "We're hiring". It's 95% the press that says they are. And they are presenting it as the Skins desperately want to upgrade their coaching staff but are either being shot down by quality candidates or are bumbling along and missing out on quality candidates due to their inaction.

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8 hours ago, Califan007 said:

 

Actually lol...Dan wanted Shanahan after the 2008 season but Shanny told him to let Zorn continue coaching (either because he contacted Shanahan too late into the offseason or because Shanny wasn't ready to come back to coaching yet). So Snyder was wanting to replace Zorn before any 2009 fan discontent was being shown. He also wanted Bruce Allen during Gibbs' tenure but Bruce took the Tampa gig instead.

 

Actually, LOL.  Thanks for educating me.  But yeah I know I follow this stuff too.  My only distinction with your narrative (not that it means anything to my point) is if Dan wanted Bruce that badly BEFORE he ultimately took action on it, well, Bruce was hanging on the employment line for almost a year, he could have easily dumped Vinny for Bruce, then.  Vinny was every much a pal with Dan that Bruce is now based on reports.  In fact I recall you arguing with me the point awhile back about whether Bruce and Dan are pals with you doubting it.  Its popping up by the way these days in narrative after narrative with even a league source at meetings joking about it.  But I don't care it has nothing to do with my point.

 

Regardless, I don't give a rats behind right now as for who the coach is but who is calling the shots for personnel right now Bruce Allen.    Dan was said to be dissatisfied with Vinny at that point in 2009 (even Vinny admitted so in an interview and said the fan pressure got to him) the fact that Shanny wanted Vinny gone too and replaced looked to be redundant.  But to play along, I don't care what makes Bruce leave the building -- if its Jay getting fired and a new coach insists, cool with me. 

 

Edit:  if your point is about the article that Dan had his eye on Bruce for a long time.  I've seen it.  But I doubt he would have dumped him when he was thick as thieves with Vinny.  And if he wanted it that bad, he had an opportunity to act on it when Vinny was in charge.  Bruce and Vinny have something in common besides the BFF stuff with Dan.  They both were on the unemployment line when Dan grabbed them.   With Vinny not sure about the first time but certainly the 2nd time he was. 

 

 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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49 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

But imagine how the game progresses if he doesn't throw that VERY-unlike-Alex-Smith pick-6 in the red zone against the Texans. Then imagine he doesn't break his leg in that game, and that Scherff is still on the field protecting him. I'd think the team could have found a way to win one, maybe even two, additional games and go 3-4 instead of 1-6. 9-7 instead of 7-9. Playoffs or 5 spots higher in the 1st round. Players reacting to the leadership of Alex Smith down the stretch as opposed to the leadership of Colt Mc--whoops, I mean, Mark Sanch--er, I mean Josh Johnson...that's his name, right?...

 

He threw 2 INTs went 12-27 that game wasn't going well.  Colt brought them back some but still fell short.  The game before that, I took a 4 hour drive to see the Tampa game.  The first half was so lethargic and maybe the worst football game I've ever seen for a Redskins offense who was playing against at the time a pass defense that might have been the worst in the NFL who was being mostly lit up otherwise.  I felt like I had to apologize to my kids at half time for taking the drive. 

 

The 2nd half, Tampa imploded with turnovers, missed field goals and it had a nice ending.  But heck that game even got mentioned on national sports shows as if I recall the only time a team has amassed 500 yards and the stats lined up the way they did and lost a game.  It was one of the luckiest games for the Redskins I've ever seen.  But the offense was beyond putrid.  They could have easily lost Alex's last 3 games as opposed to 2 out of the last 3.  Then after that they lost 6 out of 7.

 

The first half of the season (or maybe 6 games don't recall) I saw somewhere that the Redskins had the most field goals missed against them.  The defense led by Swearinger was also a turnover machine.  They slowed down after that.   The only team blown out by more than 24 points more than the Redskins was the worst team in the NFL -- the Cardinals. 

 

But even if I played into the premise that Alex is just a winner and he was a key cog in some of their early mostly ugly wins.  And while I was surprisingly unimpressed with the player - loved the dude so if people want to make the claim that the players responded better to his personality versus the scrubs that replaced him -- I could go on that ride for sure.  I am not a Colt guy personally.  I've said multiple times on the Alex thread, I think Alex is better than him.  Josh Johnson teased a little in the first two games but still wasn't that good (granted of all the QBs he had the worst lot weapons wise) and was horrific in the last game.   So with Alex unlikely back in 2019.  We got the QB crew who went 1-6 and could have easily gone 0-7 unless they sign or draft someone new.

 

The point below from Finlay is how I see it, too.  Feels different coming into 2019 versus 2018.  The defense was relatively healthy last year.  The offense was killed injury wise but they didn't look that hot early in the season at least not the passing game when healthy.  If I was Bruce-Jay and was under a win now verdict -- I'd beef up the O line and add some depth on it for a change and just hope I could run the heck out of the ball.  I think am probably the President of the Derius Guice fan club and was for months before we even drafted him so if there is a guy who could change their fortune IMO its that dude.

 

 

 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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7 hours ago, Veryoldschool said:

Is Snyder making any money from the Fire Bruce Allen tee-shirts?  I'm not going to buy a shirt to avoid the possibility of enriching Snyder inadvertently.

 

That would be hilarious.  Bruce goes to Dan hey you know those passionate misguided Redskins fans they just hated that we lost to the Eagles in the last game and want to take out their passion on me.  God bless them.  They will get over it.   Lets sell some T-shirts.   Will see how it goes and if it works, will sell those rascals some Fire Dan Snyder shirts.  

 

I'd put money, that the next shirt coming out would be Fire Dan Snyder.  Imagine enough of them in the stands to be caught by camera.  That would be cool.

 

 

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1 hour ago, Califan007 said:

 

Could it also be because they don't have any open positions to fill, outside of special teams coach? It's hard to tempt a top candidate for a position that doesn't exist yet.

 

These things are usually instigated by agents, not the actual coaches. Teams have positions open and contact the coaches' agents about their client, or agents contact the team about their openings. Could be that the Skins haven't actually contacted any agents yet, and when agents contact the team to inquire about possible openings the Skins don't say "yeah, we will be looking for a new defensive coordinator" but instead say "We're still going over things, we'll let you know." And since Bruce is supposed to be GM who is the least trusted by agents, unless there is a gaping hole at a coaching/coordinator spot those same agents could be thinking 'eh, why bother' lol... There is very little about the Skins' actions right now that says "We're hiring". It's 95% the press that says they are. And they are presenting it as the Skins desperately want to upgrade their coaching staff but are either being shot down by quality candidates or are bumbling along and missing out on quality candidates due to their inaction.

Bruce + the never ending dysfunction, the inability to keep our good ones (Shanahan, McVay, LaFleur, etc...) ! Allen fired 4 last year, have we got any better? No. That includes Joe Barry, oh wait he's with the Rams :806: .

As I said before if we were functional we should have fired a few and make openings, instead we're riding the same old carriage. We extended (short time) a mediocre HC who keeps on making the same mistakes (clock management, third and short, play calls)

"Could it also be because they don't have any open positions to fill, outside of special teams coach? It's hard to tempt a top candidate for a position that doesn't exist yet."

Maybe it's because they know all the good/worthy ones won't sign with us that there are fewer openings this year ;)

 

 

Edited by FrFan
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48 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Actually, LOL.  Thanks for educating me.  But yeah I know I follow this stuff too.  My only distinction with your narrative (not that it means anything to my point) is if Dan wanted Bruce so bad, Bruce was hanging on the employment line for almost a year, he could have easily dumped Vinny for Bruce, then.  Vinny was every much a pal with Dan that Bruce is now based on reports.  In fact I recall you arguing with me the point awhile back about whether Bruce and Dan are pals with you doubting it.  Its popping up by the way these days in narrative after narrative with even a league source at meetings joking about it.  But I don't care it has nothing to do with my point.

 

Regardless, I don't give a rats behind right now as for who the coach is but who is calling the shots for personnel right now Bruce Allen.    Dan was said to be dissatisfied with Vinny at that point in 2009 (even Vinny admitted so in an interview and said the fan pressure got to him) the fact that Shanny wanted Vinny gone too and replaced looked to be redundant.  But to play along, I don't care what makes Bruce leave the building -- if its Jay getting fired and a new coach insists, cool with me. 

 

 

 

I thought your point was that fan anger spurred actions by Snyder:

 

"Eventually, Dan gave in when it hit epic levels of fan discontentment."

 

That's the part of your post I bolded.

 

My point--and I do have one--is that fan discontentment played pretty much no role in Allen being hired. Shanahan played a larger role. The combination of Shanahan reportedly insisting that Allen be made GM coupled with Snyder's already-existing infatuation with Allen made that happen...not fan anger. if Shanahan had said he'd only take the job if Vinny were kept on, trust me, Vinny would have been kept on...no matter how many fan cards got mailed into Redskins Park.

 

And that's the thing about getting rid of Bruce...fans think they have any real say-so in this, but all the #firebruceallen hashtags deluging the Skins' twitter feeds and angry posts here on ES don't mean anything, at all. Never has, never will. The reason is because it's easy and it's action that is rarely backed up by anything. Fans do this stuff because it's easy and doesn't require any sacrifice on their parts. If you're not willing to sacrifice anything then it doesn't mean anything. And Dan and Bruce know this. Which is why they don't give a ****. They see the disconnect between fan anger over how Allen is supposedly manipulating Snyder in order to keep his job, and fan desire for Snyder to be manipulated by their anger lol...either way, it would mean Snyder is being manipulated. And no fan should EVER want the owner of their team to be manipulated into moves by anyone, even themselves.

 

But it doesn't matter to them, because Bruce and Snyder know hashtags and t-shirts and angry articles and livid posts on message boards mean nothing...only those actions that require sacrifice means anything. Not going to games means something, athough it's passive. But it requires a small level of sacrifice--meaning, skipping seeing your favorite team live. Again, very passive action but at least it involves some small level of sacrifice so it's noticed more. That's why something like a full-page ad in the WP would mean a ****load, because it means a ton of fans sacrificed a ton of money to get that message across to the owner.  I actually checked gofundme this weekend to see if anything had been started to protest the Redskins in any way (well, Allen and Snyder anyway). Here's what I found:

 

"Help to buy the Washington Redskins" - $15 raised

"Open Letter to Dan Snyder in Washington Post" - $25 raised

"Free the Redskins from Dan Synder!" - $5 raised

"Fire Gruden and Bruce Allen!!!"- $0 raised

Numerous "Buy the Redskins back from Snyder" campaigns - $0 raised

 

"Tippy the Blind Redskins Park Cat" - $1,085 raised

 

The effort to buy the Redskins aren't to be taken seriously for obvious reasons lol...but they help illustrate the point I was making, that Snyder's decisions aren't being influenced at all by 'fan anger" because fans aren't sacrificing much of anything to show their anger, and until they do it's all just a bunch of ****ing and complaining that usually starts subsiding when free agency and the draft roll around, and can be wiped out almost entirely by acquiring the right player and winning some games. I mean, when Tippy the cat generates more sacrifice from Skins fans than wanting to send Snyder an unmistakable message via a full-page ad, that tells you how they view all this. And to add on, I may be the only ES member who actually went to gofundme.com to see if any efforts were in place to register fan resentment over the front office actions. i would think everyone would have gone there by now.

 

Which is why I've always taken the stance of hoping all decisions work out for the Skins no matter who is making them and that the Skins win as many games as possible, while also hoping that Dan constantly looks to upgrade all positions in the business and football offices, no matter how happy fans are or how much we win...that he's getting more than one person giving him their ear and their advice. Which is what he was doing with both Shanahan and Allen, but fans didn't know. Which, yes, was my point.

Edited by Califan007

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34 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

He threw 2 INTs went 12-27 that game wasn't going well.  Colt brought them back some but still fell short.  The game before that, I took a 4 hour drive to see the Tampa game.  The first half was so lethargic and maybe the worst football game I've ever seen for a Redskins offense who was playing against at the time a pass defense that might have been the worst in the NFL who was being mostly lit up otherwise.  I felt like I had to apologize to my kids at half time for taking the drive.

 

2

 

I never said Smith ONLY had one INT but being in the red zone and throwing a pick-6 is a massive 14-pt swing that is not part of Smith's history--meaning, it's not as if we should have been saying "just wait, this is usually when Smith throws a back-breaking INT." And since there are numerous examples of QBs playing poorly in the first half and then playing much better in the 2nd half--or playing well in the 1st half and then playing poorly in the 2nd half--I never assume the way a QB plays in the first half is exactly how he'd play in the 2nd half. Plus, the first TD with Colt was after the defense got a turnover deep in Texans territory. I think the "drive" was only two plays... I'm not gonna assume that Colt did something there that Alex just couldn't do lol...Plus, when the Skins just needed to get another 10 yards to be in realistic FG range with only seconds to go in the game, Colt went deep instead. While it should have been pass interference that's not something you just hope happens. my thought is that Alex would have made the wiser decision that would have gained the team the additional yards for a more realistic chance at a game-winning FG.

 

At any rate, the point being made is that the biggest factor in having a losing season was injuries. Nothing else tops that. it's not because the rest of the league caught up or that the Skins' luck ran out. I'm not sure there are more than maybe one or two teams in the league that could have suffered the exact same injuries to the exact same positions and still kept winning. 

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34 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

I thought your point was that fan anger spurred actions by Snyder:

 

"Eventually, Dan gave in when it hit epic levels of fan discontentment."

 

That's the part of your post I bolded.

 

My point--and I do have one--is that fan discontentment played pretty much no role in Allen being hired.

 

My point wasn't centered on why they hired Bruce.  My point was centered on firing Vinny.  Dan and Vinny separately even talked about.  Yeah Shanny clearly wanted Vinny gone too.  Marty wanted Vinny gone when he was hired but Dan clearly didn't love it and then hired him back.  With the Vinny firing the 2nd time, Dan in some of his rare comments actually took shots at Vinny.  Vinny himself said the fact that the team was under fire from fans contributed to his demise.  They could have waited until the end of the season to fire Vinny -- but gave some red meat to the fans and fired him before that in season.   

 

But for fun, I'll play with your version of the point.  It was ALL Shanny.  Dan didn't care about fan discontentment at all.  Vinny was totally lying that it was part of what did it him -- citing even Dan's family noticed and were bothered by the fan unrest.  I don't care what gets Bruce fired -- if its a new coach insisting on it, great.  😉

34 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

And that's the thing about getting rid of Bruce...fans think they have any real say-so in this, but all the #firebruceallen hashtags deluging the Skins' twitter feeds and angry posts here on ES don't mean anything, at all. Never has, never will.

 

Says Califan, case closed?  OK.  It's like any decision for the most part -- lots of ingredients in the soup.  If you listen and read to almost any major change its often a whole bunch of stuff influencing things.   I worked for someone who is pretty high up who at times got deluged with letters from angry constituents.   Did it sway him as the operative point to a decision?  Nope.  But when he was on the fence, did it?  Yes, sometimes.  Every little thing CAN help.   

 

And if you listen to Vinny's narratives about why he's gone by the way it paints that picture and the fans discontent was part of the soup.  Just a coincidence that Fassel was supposedly Dan's top target, Fassel said he thought he had the job it went that deep in negotiations.  But fans went nuts.  Fassel blamed the fan outcry for it.  Your point i gather would be it was something else that did it.  Dan would never be taken by that.  My point is maybe yes, maybe no.  But how would you know?  You can't impose your own decision making and logic to how others think.  But you are you.  Dan is Dan. 

 

34 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

it requires a small level of sacrifice--meaning, skipping seeing your favorite team live. Again, very passive action but at least it involves some small level of sacrifice so it's noticed more. That's why something like a full-page ad in the WP would mean a ****load, because it means a ton of fans sacrificed a ton of money to get that message across to the owner. 

 

I agree with this part of your point.  The newspaper ad idea was mine.  I am going to wait on it for next season.  As for the stadium being more empty I've made the same point in the past, I think that will get Dan's attention the best.  Two different beat guys said they hear Dan more than anything gets irate when the stadium isn't full and it bothers him a lot.  The idea of Dan doubling down on Bruce didn't surprise me at least based on what I've been hearing for the last month or so -- #1 reason I think is the stadium.  And like I said in the paragraph above most decisions have multiple layers to it.   By the way some of the same guys reporting that Bruce would stay for weeks now also said that Dan isn't loving how Bruce isn't liked by fans.  Sometimes things have an accumulative effect.  Timing is key.  If you don't buy that, its cool.  But I've seen it work as PART of the soup in a lot of things related to my work.  There are actually outfits that hire people just to poke the bear with a grassroots effort like this -- politics-corporate stuff, etc and spend millions on it.  And yeah its not the main dance typically for a decision but the cherry on top.    According to a report, Dan had a 6 hour meeting after the last game of the season to talk about what needs to be done -- somehow I doubt that a lot of things were not factored and considered.  

 

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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Last year, as far as I can remember we had like 17 players on IR. This year even worse, I guess something like 24, it seems that we keep on getting burned and not learning.

 

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28 minutes ago, Califan007 said:

 

I never said Smith ONLY had one INT but being in the red zone and throwing a pick-6 is a massive 14-pt swing that is not part of Smith's history--meaning, it's not as if we should have been saying "just wait, this is usually when Smith throws a back-breaking INT." And since there are numerous examples of QBs playing poorly in the first half and then playing much better in the 2nd half--or playing well in the 1st half and then playing poorly in the 2nd half--I never assume the way a QB plays in the first half is exactly how he'd play in the 2nd half. Plus, the first TD with Colt was after the defense got a turnover deep in Texans territory. I think the "drive" was only two plays... I'm not gonna assume that Colt did something there that Alex just couldn't do lol...Plus, when the Skins just needed to get another 10 yards to be in realistic FG range with only seconds to go in the game, Colt went deep instead. While it should have been pass interference that's not something you just hope happens. my thought is that Alex would have made the wiser decision that would have gained the team the additional yards for a more realistic chance at a game-winning FG.

 

At any rate, the point being made is that the biggest factor in having a losing season was injuries. Nothing else tops that. it's not because the rest of the league caught up or that the Skins' luck ran out. I'm not sure there are more than maybe one or two teams in the league that could have suffered the exact same injuries to the exact same positions and still kept winning. 

 

My point wasn't to imply you didn't know about the 2nd interception.  It was that his game was statistically his worse - if I recall worst QBR.  12 for 27.  It wasn't going well.  They haven't come back with him all year so I doubt they were poised for a comeback.  As for the part thinking that Alex could do the same "almost" comeback that Colt "almost" mounted and thinking otherwise deserves LOL status -- what comeback did we watch from Alex that you are referring to that gives us such confidence?  And, clearly, he wasn't hot in that game.   If your point is any QB could put up points and change a bad game into a good one on a dime -- yeah I guess so but we are talking about playing the odds.

 

Clearly, people here aren't dense and can't factor context in the season.  We've factored context in the soup and that's how some of us feel.  If you feel differently about it all, cool.  I watched this offense when it was close to fully healthy including in person and watched some games back on coaches tape including putting up clips on different threads for the offense.  This team IMO injured or not injured is VERY limited in the passing game across the board. That's my layman's take on it but I've put enough thought into it that am not swayed by someone else telling me otherwise.   I can be convinced by an aggressive off season, though.

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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Im reading this board and wondering why Alex Smith is being thrown in here due to his play or lack of....because its irrelevant, what is however is his contract hes not worth what we paid not even close nor is he worth what we gave up....we were better off drafting some rookies to duke it out trading for old QBs never works but we do it all the time aince snyder bought the team. Bruce Allen is around because hes the only person willing to be Snyders puppet anyone who thinks otherwise is lieing to themselves, just look at our history with qbs you will see the Alex Smith trade has snyders writing all over it, which makes me believe we will never have a competent GM because he will tell snyder to F OFF and he will get angry and just fire him we wont be good till he openly responds to the backlash and promises to fully give up control of the team.

Edited by CjSuAvE22
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1 hour ago, Califan007 said:

 

At any rate, the point being made is that the biggest factor in having a losing season was injuries. Nothing else tops that. it's not because the rest of the league caught up or that the Skins' luck ran out. I'm not sure there are more than maybe one or two teams in the league that could have suffered the exact same injuries to the exact same positions and still kept winning. 

 

 True, the injury elephant { not bug } took its toll on the team.

 But, even before the injuries began piling up the team was struggling to win against teams that were not going anywhere and even then it was a nail-biter. The first game against the Cards they played a good game [ not knowing the Cards would blow dog all year ] but after that it was barely squeaking by with 1,2,3 point wins, and against the better teams they didn't stand a chance. The Colts came in and shut them down, the Saints blew them out before they even got off the bus, and the Cowboys, well, we all know how those games go.

 

This problem was due to being predictable, and it caught up to Gruden. Opponents were saying after the game they KNEW what play was coming by the formations and downs, and I doubt Alex Smith would have won more than 2 games had he not been injured, and most certainly IF they made the paloffs they would have been blown out.

 

Bruce was the one who gave Alex that nice fat payday which has now backfired and put this team in a hole. Even had Smith not gotten injured, he wasn't worth anything close to what he got.

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1 hour ago, FrFan said:

Last year, as far as I can remember we had like 17 players on IR. This year even worse, I guess something like 24, it seems that we keep on getting burned and not learning.

 

Time for Tony Wylie to get to work and ruin the reputation of another person trying to flee the asylum.  

 

‘Anonymous’ must be Tony’s middle name.

 

Seriously....this is petty and juvenile.  Something you might see in Junior High School but not in large well-run corporations.  

 

The door just slammed shut on Callahan staying.  

 

Next.....

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What all this boils down to, and almost all of us know, is that Dan Snyder does not care what ANY of us think.  Not one bit.  Anyone who thinks differently is dangerously naive.  Reports are that he is amused by the Fire Bruce Allen movement.  When FedEx was mostly Eagles fans for the last home game, he should have blown his top and gone scorched earth.  But, so far, nothing has happened except a minor firing.

 

As long as he is getting 1/32 of the broadcasting and advertisement revenue from the NFL, he doesn't care if the Skins go 1-15 every year until he departs this planet.  Sure, winning would be nice, but why lose sleep over it?  He's like Congress, most of them care about one thing, and that's getting re-elected so they can stay in charge and make easy money.  Serving their constituents is very secondary.

 

If the NFL wanted to change the attitude of these ****ty owners like Dan, they should adjust the revenue sharing to favor the better teams.  Make sure everyone can cover the cap, but no profit for the bottom dwellers.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, XtremeFan55 said:

Time for Tony Wylie to get to work and ruin the reputation of another person trying to flee the asylum.  

 

‘Anonymous’ must be Tony’s middle name.

 

Seriously....this is petty and juvenile.  Something you might see in Junior High School but not in large well-run corporations.  

 

The door just slammed shut on Callahan staying.  

 

Next.....

 

Yes, you can best believe that Wylie, at the behest of the team president, is pushing this ridiculous line about Callahan and the injuries. He's coaching his guys the same way he's been coaching them since he joined the club. And if you look at his history as an OL coach, from that Texas team to the Jets and elsewhere, there was NEVER a spate of injuries like those that have hit the Redskins. And he was probably pushing his guys harder at those other clubs, because that was before the CBA-induced Peter Pan rules for contact in practice. Everybody in the league knows that the Skins injuries aren't due to practicing too hard under Callahan; though the Skins lack of preparation and lack of success might well be due to slack practices under Gruden. Callahan coaches his unit and he does it properly.

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Bruce Allen is exhibiting bunker mentality.  Not only does he cowardly refuse to address the media but I just noticed that his Wiki page doesn’t list his wife Kiersten nor his kids.  He probably knows how unpopular he is and is trying to protect his family by keeping them well under the radar.   The ‘Dark Lord’ is indeed dark and prefers to operate in the shadows.   

 

Another thought...if you are willing to sell your soul to Bruce and Dan and do their bidding, then you have job security and get a Senior Vice President title as a reward.  I sincerely hope that Doug Williams didn’t go over to the dark side like Wylie and that creepy media guy.

Edited by XtremeFan55

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