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2018 Comprehensive NFL Draft Thread


stevemcqueen1

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10 hours ago, Momma There Goes That Man said:

Let’s just go all in on Bama front 7 players. We can call our defense the Burgundy Tide. At least we’d have a fun nickname 

 

Harrison, Payne, Evans (Fitzpatrick is likely out of reach) -- I don't mind if we start going all in like Ozzie Newson. Alabama defenders every draft.  :)

9 hours ago, Berggy9598 said:

Id take Kerryon Johnson in a heartbeat in the second round. The explosion he is able to generate with no downhill momentum at his back is ridiculous and he's a very good receiver. One of the more underrated draft eligible players ATM. 

 

I've only watched Auburn twice this season. But I noticed Jeremiah keeps touting the dude on twitter so just googled the two together.  Le'veon Bell is quite the comparison.

 

http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000882489/article/scouting-iron-bowl-shades-of-leveon-bell-in-kerryon-johnson

1. I'll be sticking with my Le'Veon Bell comp for Kerryon Johnson after watching the Auburn RB on Saturday. After studying Johnson last week, I came away thinking the two backs had similar running styles, and Johnson validated that comp on Saturday. He showed he's a complete back against Alabama. He did get beat on one occasion in pass protection, but there were several other times when he put himself right in the middle of the pass rush and held up well.

He also had some impressive runs where he was able to pick up at least a few yards when there were no holes open for him. Johnson carries a heavy workload (30 carries for 104 yards and 3 catches for 21 yards vs. Alabama) and had to leave the game late with a shoulder injury. Hopefully he's OK and will be ready to go against Georgia next week.

I think he's one of the four best running backs in college football with Penn State's Saquon Barkley, LSU's Derrius Guice, and USC's Ronald Jones. Those are the best RBs I've seen this fall.

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9 hours ago, SlkyCaramel said:

 

Despite the fact neither has played particularly well this season, I’m told the unimpressive play by the top-rated quarterbacks is making the decision easier. The expectations of a coaching change at Nebraska are also pushing Lee to declare for the draft.

 

The one thing I like about this is the NY Giants are in best position in the division to get their Wentz with their high draft pick.  That seems unlikely.  And there is still a shot Darnold and or Rosen don't enter the draft.   For me, though my top thing is for the Giants to not end up with Barkley.  I desperately want them to win today and find their way to #5 as opposed to #3..

 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/draft/2017/11/30/nfl-draft-qbs-2018-quarterbacks-sam-darnold-josh-rosen-allen/906640001/

But as the college season has played out, the 2018 quarterback crop has, predictably, been picked apart by scouts and executives. Even in a league starving for quarterback talent — just watch the games every Sunday — there’s less excitement about this group than there was a year ago. 

“It’s a bit of a lackluster class,” Eric Galko of Optimum Scouting said.

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After looking at some tape and doing some research....thus far

 

The QBs I like  (that the Redskins would have a shot at without trading up):

Baker Mayfield

Riley Ferguson

Clayton Thorson (watched a lot of him last night and this morning)

 

Intrigued by these two but need to see more:

Chase Litton

Kurt Benkert (I wish he was more athletic though)

 

The QBs I'm meh on:

Josh Allen (perfect size and athleticism, but his accuracy issues are yikes)

Lamar Jackson (his accuracy issues scare me and I think a team would have to mold their offense to fit his strengths)

 

The QBs I don't like:

Luke Falk (if we're moving on from Kirk, I don't want yet another QB with meh mobility and little athleticism)

Ryan Finley

 

 

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1 hour ago, SlkyCaramel said:

After looking at some tape and doing some research....thus far

 

The QBs I like  (that the Redskins would have a shot at without trading up):

Baker Mayfield

Riley Ferguson

Clayton Thorson (watched a lot of him last night and this morning)

 

Intrigued by these two but need to see more:

Chase Litton

Kurt Benkert (I wish he was more athletic though)

 

The QBs I'm meh on:

Josh Allen (perfect size and athleticism, but his accuracy issues are yikes)

Lamar Jackson (his accuracy issues scare me and I think a team would have to mold their offense to fit his strengths)

 

The QBs I don't like:

Luke Falk (if we're moving on from Kirk, I don't want yet another QB with meh mobility and little athleticism)

Ryan Finley

 

 

 

Mostly agree... I really like Thorson and Mayfield. One of them will be available with our 2nd round pick, and I wouldnt hesitate.

 

Thoughts on Stidham?

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19 minutes ago, LuRedskins said:

I really like Mayfields passion. We need more of that on offense.

 

I LOVE that guy's passion.  Teammates also seem to really like him.  If what the local beat reporters say is true and Cousins is unlikely to sign here, I'd be ecstatic if we drafted Mayfield.  The main knock on him is his size...he's 6'1, so while his height isn't ideal, he's not Drew Brees/Russell Wilson short.  And the guy is deadly accurate on the deep ball.  

 

We also need to look for a bigger, possession type WR early in the draft.  Doctson seems soft and too mild mannered...I don't feel comfortable relying on him to continue developing into a  #1, and Ryan Grant has been our best receiver this year...this cannot be the case for 2018.  

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27 minutes ago, Area51 said:

 

I LOVE that guy's passion.  Teammates also seem to really like him.  If what the local beat reporters say is true and Cousins is unlikely to sign here, I'd be ecstatic if we drafted Mayfield.  The main knock on him is his size...he's 6'1, so while his height isn't ideal, he's not Drew Brees/Russell Wilson short.  And the guy is deadly accurate on the deep ball.  

 

We also need to look for a bigger, possession type WR early in the draft.  Doctson seems soft and too mild mannered...I don't feel comfortable relying on him to continue developing into a  #1, and Ryan Grant has been our best receiver this year...this cannot be the case for 2018.  

I think Doctson can come out of his shell a little bit more if we can get people around him with attitude like mayfield. When he makes a good play on a db he can get into their face. But I think since he is shy he doesn’t want to be the only one.

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the more common refrain about Kirk is he's back on the tag versus gone.   JLC isn't the only one on that train but we will see.   

 

I am not a Mayfield guy at least in terms of wanting him here.  One of the things that I wonder is can the dude get away with all those scrambles which he can pull off in college (where players don't play as fast as the pros) in the pros.  I hunted around for his speed and the only thing I caught was DJ saying he heard he was clocked somewhere around 4.9.  That's actually slow for a QB.  Pretty much identical to Kirk's speed.  If so I don't see him running by safeties and CBs in the NFL. 

 

Lost amid all of the speculation about Kirk Cousins future (I expect a tag), the Skins are working to extend LB Zach Brown I'm told

 

I've been told by scouts that Mayfield has been timed in high 4.8's/ low 4.9's.

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12 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

the more common refrain about Kirk is he's back on the tag versus gone.   JLC isn't the only one on that train but we will see.   

 

I am not a Mayfield guy at least in terms of wanting him here.  One of the things that I wonder is can the dude get away with all those scrambles which he can pull off in college (where players don't play as fast as the pros) in the pros.  I hunted around for his speed and the only thing I caught was DJ saying he heard he was clocked somewhere around 4.9.  That's actually slow for a QB.  Pretty much identical to Kirk's speed.  If so I don't see him running by safeties and CBs in the NFL. 

 

Lost amid all of the speculation about Kirk Cousins future (I expect a tag), the Skins are working to extend LB Zach Brown I'm told

 

I've been told by scouts that Mayfield has been timed in high 4.8's/ low 4.9's.

 

Timed 40 speed is not the primary attribute to look at in regards to QB's being able to scramble/buy time/evade pressure.  Tony Romo is a prime example...he wasn't particularly fast but was brilliant at evading oncoming defenders.  Mayfield's speed isn't what makes him great at eluding/avoiding pressure, it's his field/pocket awareness, quickness/agility, and overall football smarts that makes him highly effective at it.  RGIII, even after his injuries, was still a pretty fast QB, yet that dude couldn't avoid pressure to save his life(nor career).  

 

As for Kirk, if we can't sign him to a long term deal, then tagging and renting him for one more year at 34.4 million would be pointless, as we're only delaying the inevitable and he will leave after 2019.  

 

Then again, maybe Snyder comes to his senses, fires Bruce Allen and signs Kirk to a long term deal, but I doubt that happens.

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Every now and then I like to pop in to thank you guys who have been such stalwarts at this deal for so long---this is always one of the highest quality threads with some of the most intelligent conversation (and minimal dumbassery) on here, year in year out.

 

This is why you rarely see mods in it. :806:

 

For me, having grown up where college ball and that whole world wasn't part of the regional culture (AK 50's/70's), I never got the habit and never really followed it, though i had always devoured the pro game since a kid. Sure, I pick up a fair amount of basic stuff just by association with that level of pro interest, but nothing like actual college ball fans or actual college team fans (esp. alumni). so i get a ton of valuable credible info and insights from this thread.

 

I'm still quite ignorant on it in general though, which is why when I am in here I just read and don't post. :D

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2 hours ago, pcbothwel said:

Thoughts on Stidham?

 

Classical mechanics. Great base platform. Light, springy hop footwork. Inconsistent with vertical passes, off timing, off target. Actually more than inconsistent, a deficiency. Reliant on quick game. 

 

Not a finished product. 

 

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Ferguson is not even a consideration for me. He's a Kaepernick level QB. I'd even say a poor man's Kaepernick. 

I wouldn't draft him.

 

And certainly not the kind of QB I'd consider especially in a rebranding of the franchise.

 

Quick hits: Exclusively targets primary. Also doesn't seem to be able to progress beyond primary. No coverage look off, quite literally does "stare down."

If primary is taken away, the off-schedule becomes school-yard. Also holds the ball if the primary is taken away.

 

Lack of processing apparent. Have serious concerns he can even read a defense in action. 

 

The spread system is a valid demerit because of the limited route tree and the constant overuse of screens, swings and short hitches. Vast majority of passes are very short, many of the screens and swings are behind the LOS. Yesterday was a great example of classic easy spread concepts. Day 1 install stuff.

 

The shotgun mesh-point fake to hold the LBs then a quick pass, 3/4 follow through, to the primary (TE) up the seam. The one thing RG3 was able to do successfully and consistantly. Which furthermore, most spread QBs can do too. They also split the field for him on rollouts targeting one backside primary opposite from the play action. 

 

Never saw anything complicated. Additionally, classic spread demerit, the offense lines up in formation then the QB and skill positions look over to the sideline for the coaches' augmentation audible. Further questioning how much of the decisions making is already done for him.  

 

Likewise, never seen so many short passes on screens and such turn into 40 and 50 yard chunk plays. The stats on this guy are way inflated. 

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1 hour ago, Area51 said:

 

Timed 40 speed is not the primary attribute to look at in regards to QB's being able to scramble/buy time/evade pressure.  

 

Sure, I didn't say otherwise.  But I didn't realize he was that slow.  It got my attention when I saw it.    Watching his 50 yard run against TCU yesterday -- doubting he replicates that in the NFL with 4.9 speed.   Unlike Romo though part of Mayfield's game is rushing for some yards versus scrambling to buy time.  Doubt he has similar success on that front in the NFL.   

 

Having said that, I agree that speed isn't the be all and end all.  It's a small part of the equation.  But with Mayfield, there is so many physical limitations you got to overlook:  he's short, on the scrawny side, slow, small hands.  Then you got him playing in a spread system out of the shot gun -- where even guys like Tebow said he has a hard time envisioning him adjusting to pro type offense and you have to build a special offense for him.  Then you got all these personality red flags.

 

 

http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/mac-engel/article187739178.html

Oklahoma quarterback Baker Mayfield will be an NFL bust

 

ARLINGTON 

Baker Mayfield is the best player in college football, and a worthy recipient of the Heisman Trophy, who will go on to become JAG in the NFL.

Mayfield is your typical NFL “Just Another Guy” in the making.

If Mayfield is smart, and there’s evidence to suggest that’s not a given, he will just follow the Colt McCoy, Chase Daniel model and be a good soldier and figure out the NFL.

In Oklahoma’s 41-17 win against TCU in the Big 12 title game on Saturday at JerryWorld, Mayfield did nothing to damage his overwhelming odds to win the Heisman Trophy, nor help his chances of being a good NFL quarterback.

 

Because he won’t be one.

As seen by too many previous examples to list, the Heisman doesn’t correlate to a long, successful NFL career. Mayfield will not be an upper tier NFL quarterback. Five years from now, he will be lucky to be an NFL quarterback.

He’s generously listed as 6-foot-1, and there is nothing to suggest he can be a typical drop-back passer, which is what all NFL teams want, and need, to succeed. He’s a good athlete who knows how to win, and once he puts on an NFL uniform you will see just how small he actually stands.

 

Mayfield is a great college quarterback who can make a game 1-on-11; he’s the 6-foot-5 center who can win an NCAA tournament basketball game but, when facing the biggest and meanest at the next level, will be exposed.

He’s also a punk who will earn a punch, kick, and a late hit or two – maybe from his own teammates – when he reaches the NFL.

Mayfield will likely fall in line with the many other great college quarterbacks who won the Heisman trophy but flamed out in the NFL: Robert Griffin III. Johnny Manziel. I’m calling Jameis Winston a bust right now. Sam Bradford. Tim Tebow. Troy Smith. Matt Leinart. Jason White. Eric Crouch. Chris Weinke. Danny Wuerffel. Gino Torretta. Charlie Ward. Ty Detmer. Andre Ware.

 

Those quarterbacks have won the Heisman trophy since 1989, all were NFL busts.

If Mayfield is smart, he will simply figure it out and try to get paid for as long as he can. Guys like former Texas quarterback Colt McCoy and Missouri star Chase Daniel aren’t starters, but they are NFL veterans cashing six-figure checks.

If Mayfield can make it that far, he’s a smashing success who will never buy a drink or dinner in Norman, Oklahoma, for the rest of his life.

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5 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Sure, I didn't say otherwise.  But I didn't realize he was that slow.  It got my attention when I saw it.    Watching his 50 yard run against TCU yesterday -- doubting he replicates that in the NFL with 4.9 speed.  

 

I agree that speed isn't the be all and end all.  But with Mayfield, there is so many physical limitations you got to overlook:  he's short, on the scrawny side, slow, small hands.  Then you got him playing in a spread system out of the shot gun -- wherever even guys like Tebow said he has a hard time envisioning him adjusting to pro type offense and you have to build a special offense for him.  Then you got all these personality red flags.

 

 

http://www.star-telegram.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/mac-engel/article187739178.html

Oklahoma quarterback Baker Mayfield will be an NFL bust

 

ARLINGTON 

Baker Mayfield is the best player in college football, and a worthy recipient of the Heisman Trophy, who will go on to become JAG in the NFL.

Mayfield is your typical NFL “Just Another Guy” in the making.

If Mayfield is smart, and there’s evidence to suggest that’s not a given, he will just follow the Colt McCoy, Chase Daniel model and be a good soldier and figure out the NFL.

In Oklahoma’s 41-17 win against TCU in the Big 12 title game on Saturday at JerryWorld, Mayfield did nothing to damage his overwhelming odds to win the Heisman Trophy, nor help his chances of being a good NFL quarterback.

 

Because he won’t be one.

As seen by too many previous examples to list, the Heisman doesn’t correlate to a long, successful NFL career. Mayfield will not be an upper tier NFL quarterback. Five years from now, he will be lucky to be an NFL quarterback.

He’s generously listed as 6-foot-1, and there is nothing to suggest he can be a typical drop-back passer, which is what all NFL teams want, and need, to succeed. He’s a good athlete who knows how to win, and once he puts on an NFL uniform you will see just how small he actually stands.

 

Mayfield is a great college quarterback who can make a game 1-on-11; he’s the 6-foot-5 center who can win an NCAA tournament basketball game but, when facing the biggest and meanest at the next level, will be exposed.

He’s also a punk who will earn a punch, kick, and a late hit or two – maybe from his own teammates – when he reaches the NFL.

Mayfield will likely fall in line with the many other great college quarterbacks who won the Heisman trophy but flamed out in the NFL: Robert Griffin III. Johnny Manziel. I’m calling Jameis Winston a bust right now. Sam Bradford. Tim Tebow. Troy Smith. Matt Leinart. Jason White. Eric Crouch. Chris Weinke. Danny Wuerffel. Gino Torretta. Charlie Ward. Ty Detmer. Andre Ware.

 

Those quarterbacks have won the Heisman trophy since 1989, all were NFL busts.

If Mayfield is smart, he will simply figure it out and try to get paid for as long as he can. Guys like former Texas quarterback Colt McCoy and Missouri star Chase Daniel aren’t starters, but they are NFL veterans cashing six-figure checks.

If Mayfield can make it that far, he’s a smashing success who will never buy a drink or dinner in Norman, Oklahoma, for the rest of his life.

One of the laziest write-ups I've ever had the misfortune of laying eyes on. Not sure who wrote it but it sounds more like a disgruntled ex-girlfriend than a talent evaluator. 

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4 minutes ago, Berggy9598 said:

One of the laziest write-ups I've ever had the misfortune of laying eyes on. Not sure who wrote it but it sounds more like a disgruntled ex-girlfriend than a talent evaluator. 

 

Maybe so.  As I said in a recent post, I have a tough time getting a read on Mayfield.  To me all the Big 10 QBs are especially tough because you got to project apples to oranges.  I lean more on the cynical side on Mayfield if I had to pick a side.  But I presume based on your response you are sold.  If so why?  That dude isn't the only one cynical on Mayfield -- you got some draft geeks who think he belongs in the 4th round and some who see him as a first rounder.  He's one of the more polarizing prospects I can think at that position in quite some time.

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8 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

Maybe so.  As I said in a recent post, I have a tough time getting a read on Mayfield.  To me all the Big 10 QBs are especially tough because you got to project apples to oranges.  I lean more on the cynical side on Mayfield if I had to pick a side.  But I presume based on your response you are sold.  If so why?

I'm not sold. I see a sixth sense for making plays that you can't teach, I think he may be a guy teammates would run through a wall for and he does have arm talent. To me the biggest concern is (as always) if he can learn to adjust to a much less cushy post snap life. Ive seen instances in which he had to scan the field and did a good job finding an open man, and I think he has knack for anticipating how things are about to unfold downfield at times, but he's rarely asked to do it under pressure. In the old days you take a guy like this and sit him for a couple of years, but today good luck to whoever's job will hinge on evaluating this kid. 

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2 hours ago, Area51 said:

 

We also need to look for a bigger, possession type WR early in the draft.  Doctson seems soft and too mild mannered...I don't feel comfortable relying on him to continue developing into a  #1, and Ryan Grant has been our best receiver this year...this cannot be the case for 2018.  

 

The Skins possession type WR is Jordan Reed.  Doctson is essentially in his rookie season - there's no cause for alarm IMO.  If the Skins continue to run a WCO with Cousins I really don't see the need for a revamp of the WR/TE core.  There's enough young talent that the Skins can pick one up only if BPA.  I think everyone has been pleasantly surprised with Ryan Grant.  He's shown that he deserves to be on the team - we just don't have to count on him as being "the" guy.  

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16 minutes ago, Berggy9598 said:

I'm not sold. I see a sixth sense for making plays that you can't teach, I think he may be a guy teammates would run through a wall for and he does have arm talent. To me the biggest concern is (as always) if he can learn to adjust to not a much less cushy post snap life. Ive seen instances in which he had to scan the field and did a good job finding an open man, and I think he has knack for anticipating how things are about to unfold downfield at times, but he's rarely asked to do it under pressure. In the old days you take a guy like this and sit him for a couple of years, but today good luck to whoever's job will hinge on evaluating this kid. 

 

OK this isn't directed your way then.   I've seen some of the big Mayfield guys get defensive when you compare him to Manziel.  But isn't it about that same kind of "magic'?  Another short scrambling playground style Big 12 QB -- who knows how to make things happen on the fly.  They aren't conventional QBs but that's part of what makes them special and adds to their mystique.  

 

Mayfield isn't physically gifted to say the least. He plays out of the spread against atrocious defenses and has a knack for burning up those defenses.  I've watched a lot of Mayfield and I get the hype.  He makes sick plays on the move. Can adjust his arm slot -- Favre style.   And he brings swagger and attitude to his playmaking that brings excitement.  But I don't know how that translates to the NFL?  We've seen similar formulas bomb. 

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Just now, Skinsinparadise said:

 

OK this isn't directed your way then.   I've seen some of big Mayfield guys get defensive when you compare him to Manziel.  But isn't about that same kind of "magic'?  Another short scrambling playground style Big 12 QB -- who knows who to make things happen on the fly.  They aren't conventional QBs but that's part of what makes them special and adds to their mystique.  

 

Mayfield isn't physically gifted to say the least. He plays out of the spread against atrocious defenses and has a knack for burning up those defenses.  I've watched a lot of Mayfield and I get the hype.  He makes sick plays on the move.   And he brings swagger and attitude to his playmaking that brings excitement.  But I don't know how that translates to the NFL?  We've seen similar formulas bomb. 

He has a much better arm than Manziel and Sumlin's offense if I'm not mistaken is extremely dumbed down even on the spread spectrum. I've seen plays in every game where Mayfield scans the field and manipulates the pocket fairly well, so to me he's more than just a guy that runs around makes plays, which isn't to say I'm sold, just saying he's not as unpolished as some people think. 

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Duke Ejiofor, Edge, Wake Forrest. One of my favorites in this draft, and in my opinion we're in need of a player that can line up over an NFL left tackle and create consistent pressure. This draft is loaded with pass rushers but this guy hasn't been getting too much pub. Why do I like him? First of all his hands are insane. Quick, violent and incredibly coordinated. He's not overwhelmingly explosive, but he does a great job with speed variance, which allows him to lull opposing blockers, get them off balance and blow by them. He has a wide frame for an edge player but that allows him to play very low and balanced, and you'll see him bending the edge, even when rushing from a 2-point stance, on numerous occasions in this highlight. His center of gravity also allows him to gather his momentum extremely well for a 270 pounder, so he takes efficient angles and doesn't look out of control when breaking into the backfield. He looks more natural doing things from a 2-point stance than a player that size is supposed to, thanks to highly impressive agility and flexibility. I'd take him as early as the second round. 

 

 

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Well if Kirk walks it would really behoove the Redskins to somehow move in front of the Cardinals and Jets who also will likely be in the market for a QB. Of course a trade with the Browns or 49ers would be possible too, or even the Broncos. 

 

I know people are still looking at playoff scenarios but this team is not a playoff team. It just isn't.

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