2018 Comprehensive NFL Draft Thread

[Skinsinparadise]

1 minute ago, RWJ said:

I really hope that this is a ploy to get someone to move up to #13 and trade with us for Jackson.  Gruden has got to like him in order for us to draft him.  Don't see it.  

 

I don't either.   But its interesting that they are kicking the tires on him and Mayfield.  And we've heard of multiple meetings with Riley Ferguson.  All of this might be leading nowhere but just keeping it all in mind in case other stuff pops up.

[RWJ]

Really, I'm not familiar with Jackson.  Love Mayfield though so IF Mayfield feel to #13, I'd be running to the podium to hand the card in with his name on it.  Do you know much about Jackson?

[HardcoreZorn]

I don't buy that we told Alex Smith we wouldn't draft a QB this year. And if we did, I'll be pissed. Not because I think we should definitely take a quarterback but because you should NEVER in the NFL ignore the most important position in football if the right guy falls.

 

I think Mayfield and Jackson will be the best QBs from this class so I wouldn't at all be upset to see them learn and develop behind Smith for a couple of years. Could also be a ploy to get other teams to trade up in front of us and select them, pushing other top talent down the board. Or we could want to trade back. Who knows, but I really hope we didn't tell Smith we wouldn't take a QB as part of the deal.

[wilco_holland]

3 minutes ago, RWJ said:

Really, I'm not familiar with Jackson.  Love Mayfield though so IF Mayfield feel to #13, I'd be running to the podium to hand the card in with his name on it.  Do you know much about Jackson?

 

Jackson is a wild card. Lively arm, ball comes out nice. Very athletic. But he is that type of player that is either going to be a Vick/Rodgers type of player (off script amazing, but can make an O# go from the pocket) or he is going to get killed like a RGIII.

 

You don't draft him for the QB he is but the QB he can become. 

 

I think his type can be super good in NFL. Run pass option type of stuff is just super hard to stop (see Eagles past season) and excels with athletic QB. But you need to keep the QB healthy. 

[RWJ]

15 minutes ago, wilco_holland said:

 

Jackson is a wild card. Lively arm, ball comes out nice. Very athletic. But he is that type of player that is either going to be a Vick/Rodgers type of player (off script amazing, but can make an O# go from the pocket) or he is going to get killed like a RGIII.

 

You don't draft him for the QB he is but the QB he can become. 

 

I think his type can be super good in NFL. Run pass option type of stuff is just super hard to stop (see Eagles past season) and excels with athletic QB. But you need to keep the QB healthy. 

Makes sense.  Read a little bit ago that he's one of the guys when it comes to the team and not a real leader.  Who knows.  If you took him and let him sit for a couple of years he may be the steal of the draft.  Got to think Williams loves the kid. but Jay would have too also.

21 minutes ago, HardcoreZorn said:

I don't buy that we told Alex Smith we wouldn't draft a QB this year. And if we did, I'll be pissed. Not because I think we should definitely take a quarterback but because you should NEVER in the NFL ignore the most important position in football if the right guy falls.

 

I think Mayfield and Jackson will be the best QBs from this class so I wouldn't at all be upset to see them learn and develop behind Smith for a couple of years. Could also be a ploy to get other teams to trade up in front of us and select them, pushing other top talent down the board. Or we could want to trade back. Who knows, but I really hope we didn't tell Smith we wouldn't take a QB as part of the deal.

Yep

[Always A Commander Never A Captain]

35 minutes ago, HardcoreZorn said:

I don't buy that we told Alex Smith we wouldn't draft a QB this year. And if we did, I'll be pissed. Not because I think we should definitely take a quarterback but because you should NEVER in the NFL ignore the most important position in football if the right guy falls.

 

I think Mayfield and Jackson will be the best QBs from this class so I wouldn't at all be upset to see them learn and develop behind Smith for a couple of years. Could also be a ploy to get other teams to trade up in front of us and select them, pushing other top talent down the board. Or we could want to trade back. Who knows, but I really hope we didn't tell Smith we wouldn't take a QB as part of the deal.

 

We weren't the only team competing to trade for him, we had to agree to terms for a long term deal as well.  Enough people have reported Smith being adamant that the team he gets traded (and signs a LTD with) not draft a QB in the 1st in 2018...that I feel like it's true.

 

The odd thing is the possible #1 but likely not worse than #2 QB is viewed by some as having only the 4th or 5th best talent.  Darnold could be the 1st QB taken despite some teams having him as the 5th QB on their board, in part because he's the only guy without any issues.  So if the FO/Scouts/etc view the other QB's as having more risk than normal, why wouldn't you tell the new QB you want inked into a deal that you wouldn't draft a QB in the 1st round?

 

As far as what's reported.  I believe Alex Smith's request was only for the 2018 draft.  It doesn't pertain to never drafting a QB in the 1st while he's here.  Speaking from a dollar stand point.  Why would you ink Smith to a 23.5 million a year contract with 70+ million guaranteed...and then immediately try and undermine him by drafting a QB in the 1st?  Poof, there goes a significant chunk of your cap.

[mistertim]

49 minutes ago, HardcoreZorn said:

I don't buy that we told Alex Smith we wouldn't draft a QB this year. And if we did, I'll be pissed. Not because I think we should definitely take a quarterback but because you should NEVER in the NFL ignore the most important position in football if the right guy falls.

 

I think Mayfield and Jackson will be the best QBs from this class so I wouldn't at all be upset to see them learn and develop behind Smith for a couple of years. Could also be a ploy to get other teams to trade up in front of us and select them, pushing other top talent down the board. Or we could want to trade back. Who knows, but I really hope we didn't tell Smith we wouldn't take a QB as part of the deal.

 

No way in hell a team drafts a QB at #13 overall and lets them sit on the bench for 2 seasons, especially with how often it is that rookie QBs start nowadays, especially high picks. You do that with a mid to late round guy, not a 1st rounder.

[wilco_holland]

The issue with a first round QB in my opinion is that you have one less impact player (he is going to the bench). We bring in Smith to make a run now. Get in the playoffs and see where it takes us. A second string QB is not going to help with that.

 

If Smith doesn't deliver, we don't reach the playoffs and hand the keys over to the young guy. Then I think Jay is going to get fired. So you then need to find a HC who likes your young QB. 

 

And for all the Green Bay examples. That's very rare and in current NFL not the best move. A QB on his rookie contract is super cheap compared to a veteran. You want to start him early so you can invest in other parts of your team. Sitting him for three years is just a wasted opportunity to have this great cap situation. Look at Seattle (in the past) and Philly. They where able to make super bowl runs because they could spend big money on players because there young QB on rookie deal saved 10 to 15 million in cap space. 

[Skinsinparadise]

57 minutes ago, HardcoreZorn said:

I don't buy that we told Alex Smith we wouldn't draft a QB this year. And if we did, I'll be pissed. Not because I think we should definitely take a quarterback but because you should NEVER in the NFL ignore the most important position in football if the right guy falls.

 

 

Yeah me too.  And if this QB class is as deep in talent as some say it is -- Bruce Arians said its the best draft he's seen for QB in over 20 years -- and a QB you love falls in your lap -- IMO you take the dude.

 

I get all the media backlash that might happen if it went down.  And people questioning why have both, etc.   But I wouldn't care.    And I am not saying go as aggressive as the Chiefs did and trade up.  Just saying if a QB that you love falls in your lap, take them  -- or if there is someone who is willing to give up a lot in a trade, then I'd be ok with that, too. 

 

Having said that I am doubting they go QB early.  But maybe the 4th rd? 

[Skinsinparadise]

16 minutes ago, Alcoholic Zebra said:

Why would you ink Smith to a 23.5 million a year contract with 70+ million guaranteed...and then immediately try and undermine him by drafting a QB in the 1st?  Poof, there goes a significant chunk of your cap.

 

I agree in theory but I think it all depends.  Eagles trade for Bradford but then fall in love with Wentz.  Bears sign Glennon for 18 million and they trade up when they fall for a QB.  In both cases they traded up.

 

For the Redskins if they for example love Josh Rosen or name that guy and he surprisingly drops to their pick where they don't have to trade up...and they think he's better than Alex so be it.   Alex is a classy guy, he's used to having young proteges under him.  I've heard him interviewed on it.  He said more or less look he doesn't get bitter he just does his thing and helps the young guy because its the right thing to do.

 

Having said that do I expect a franchise Qb that they love fall in their lap?  Nope.  So i think the point is more relevant to 4th round down.  If they are kicking the tires on guys like Lauletta or Ferguson and want to groom them -- I got no problem with that.  I understand the mindset behind it.  

[Koolblue13]

If any team is going to draft a QB in the first after promising the QB you just traded for, that you wouldn't, it's the ****ing redskins.

[Est.1974]

I know it's kinda obvious, but the key really is FA. Gruden implied that we nail that and it opens up the draft for us to be agressive. Get 4 impact signings made and we could hit the draft well. I'd love to find a route to get another second rounder, or recover a third rounder back (without trading back in the first).

 

I could see us trading this years 4th say and our 2019 3rd to move up in this draft.

[Skinsinparadise]

who knows if true but some gossip, from a guy who supposedly knows someone who sat on a plane next to Tomsula

 

Burgundy Blog‏Verified account @BurgundyBlog 50m50 minutes ago

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My guy asked Tomsula about DL draft prospects, specifically Payne and Vea. JT barely said two words about Payne. He lit up over Vea. "That's a big nasty f***in' cat!"

[Skinsinparadise]

JP Finlay‏Verified account @JPFinlayNBCS

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Yes, I've heard about #Redskins reported interest in Lamar Jackson. Recording podcast now.

[mistertim]

15 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

who knows if true but some gossip, from a guy who supposedly knows someone who sat on a plane next to Tomsula

 

Burgundy Blog‏Verified account @BurgundyBlog 50m50 minutes ago

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My guy asked Tomsula about DL draft prospects, specifically Payne and Vea. JT barely said two words about Payne. He lit up over Vea. "That's a big nasty f***in' cat!"

 

I'd take Vea over Payne, but I don't think either of them are worth #13 overall.

[Skinsinparadise]

 

1 minute ago, mistertim said:

 

I'd take Vea over Payne, but I don't think either of them are worth #13 overall.

 

Not sure personally. I haven't watched any of his games.  He seems all over the place with draft geek types with some calling him a top 10 guy, some 10-20. 

[dcdiscokid]

Am I missing something or all of you arguing BPA, I'm all for BPA, if thats a qb at 13 then ok, if its a corner than sure.. This is a game of attrition and has a salary cap so impact player is impact player. and I think most of us would be shocked if smith is the starter in year 3 of his contract at 37 years old....

[CTskin]

27 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

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Yes, I've heard about #Redskins reported interest in Lamar Jackson. Recording podcast now.

I'm hoping this is just for trade bait purposes... get the QB-needy teams' ears perked up.

 

Nooo way do you sign a QB for 5 years and then draft a QB with your 1st round pick. Next off-season, I'd consider it, but not now. Do you really want to immediately jump back into the QB circus discussion? And we especially shouldn't waste it on Mayfield or Jackson, two guys with plenty of questions. We will have some holes to fill coming out of FA, we need to find impact players in the draft.

13 minutes ago, dcdiscokid said:

Am I missing something or all of you arguing BPA, I'm all for BPA, if thats a qb at 13 then ok, if its a corner than sure.. This is a game of attrition and has a salary cap so impact player is impact player. and I think most of us would be shocked if smith is the starter in year 3 of his contract at 37 years old....

I'm fairly certain that we'd face a stiff cap penalty until after year 4. I don't want to pay a guy $24M to sit on the bench.

 

EDIT: I believe we wouldn't face a penalty until after year 3, not year 4.

[mistertim]

2 minutes ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

 

Not sure personally. I haven't watched any of his games.  He seems all over the place with draft geek types with some calling him a top 10 guy, some 10-20. 

 

If you mean Vea, yeah I've seen him all over too. Though he does trend towards the first half of the first round for the most part. Obviously I'm a complete amateur but his film just worries me with how hot and cold he seems to run. Dominant one snap then hardly seems to even give effort the next. No doubt he's incredibly physically gifted but if that is an effort/motivation issue then I'd steer clear. I also don't see him as much of a pass rusher. Yeah, he had a decent amount of sacks for a guy his size but from watching his tape most of those were pure size mismatches with him 1 on 1 with a G or C (or coverage sacks), and had little to do with actual pass rushing technique. He'll still have the same size in the NFL but the guys he'll be going against will be bigger and much more technically sound than the guys he went against in college, so he'll have to develop more than a pure size based bull rush.

[Skinsinparadise]

3 minutes ago, CTskin said:

I'm hoping this is just for trade bait purposes... get the QB-needy teams' ears perked up.

 

Nooo way do you sign a QB for 5 years and then draft a QB with your 1st round pick. 

 

I get the point.  5 years though isn't real, contract in guaranteed money is likely 2-3 years.  I wouldn't go out of my way to draft a QB but if one drops in your lap that you love I don't think you pass.  Do I think one of the big names drops in their lap that the love?  Very doubtful.

[JSSkinz]

2 hours ago, RWJ said:

I really hope that this is a ploy to get someone to move up to #13 and trade with us for Jackson.  Gruden has got to like him in order for us to draft him.  Don't see it.  

 

It absolutely is, there's no way we take a QB in the 1st round.

 

There's a lot of bluffing going on by all teams at this time of the year.

[CTskin]

1 minute ago, Skinsinparadise said:

 

I get the point.  5 years though isn't real, contract in guaranteed money is likely 2-3 years.  I wouldn't go out of my way to draft a QB but if one drops in your lap that you love I don't think you pass.  Do I think one of the big names drops in their lap that the love?  Very doubtful.

Very fair. Being that the talk is about Mayfield and Jackson falling in our lap, I'm a definite pass. I don't see anyone else falling anywhere near 13...

 

And I think I was wrong about my previous post; he's guaranteed $71M, so my novice cap analysis says that we'll be all set after year 3.

 

 

[dcdiscokid]

10 minutes ago, CTskin said:

I'm hoping this is just for trade bait purposes... get the QB-needy teams' ears perked up.

 

Nooo way do you sign a QB for 5 years and then draft a QB with your 1st round pick. Next off-season, I'd consider it, but not now. Do you really want to immediately jump back into the QB circus discussion? And we especially shouldn't waste it on Mayfield or Jackson, two guys with plenty of questions. We will have some holes to fill coming out of FA, we need to find impact players in the draft.

I'm fairly certain that we'd face a stiff cap penalty until after year 4. I don't want to pay a guy $24M to sit on the bench.

No way they dont have outs, I mean I know they are idiots but have to believe the contract is structured in way they have outs after a few years.  The average players career is less than 4 years to think a 34 year old is going to play for 4 years would be asinine. And im not advocating either, ill leave that for the people who watch CF, and really for the coaches, just saying if they deem thats the best player available then it would be crazy to not draft him just cause we signed a qb this year.

[CTskin]

Just now, dcdiscokid said:

No way they dont have outs, I mean I know they are idiots but have to believe the contract is structured in way they have outs after a few years.  The average players career is less than 4 years to think a 34 year old is going to play for 4 years would be asinine.

Look up current QB ages... it seems like this will surprise you. We're not talking about "the avg NFL player," we're talking about a proven QB. Big difference.

[dcdiscokid]

2 minutes ago, CTskin said:

Look up current QB ages... it seems like this will surprise you. We're not talking about "the avg NFL player," we're talking about a proven QB. Big difference.

I know i get it, but there's like a handful of proven qb's, much less that can go year in and out without a drop off or injury...  Im mean less than half the league actually has a proven starting caliber qb...