stevemcqueen1

2018 Comprehensive NFL Draft Thread

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16 minutes ago, JamesMadisonSkins said:

Just listened to Stick to Football Wednesday podcast from B/R Matt Miller and gang ... some tidbits:

 

- Barkley to a tee is a clone of LaDanian Tomlinson as far as measurable and physical attributes

 

 

 

I've heard that comp A LOT. Also is comped to a souped up, and bigger, more athletic version of David Johnson. 

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10 minutes ago, JoggingGod said:

If Rosen somehow is there at 13, do you take him or look for a haul in a trade down?

 

I think you get the haul right?  Alex Smith's contract becomes very onerous with Rosen there.

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No. Draft Rosen. How often do you see a guy with Rosen's profile as a QB available outside the top 2-3 picks, and you get them on an extreme rookie contract (btw, this seems to be what the Rams and Eagles are doing: Following the Seattle model under Russell Wilson: If you get the young stud QB on a rookie deal, you have a five year window to win super bowls due to said contract (either you have the young stud rookie QB on a super cheap deal, or you have the vet earning 4-6 times as much money per year and killing your cap flexibility in the process). If we have a chance to get Rosen, and even better, get him on a rookie contract based on the 13 slot, you do it, period. It opens a window for you, if he hits, five years long where you can sign expensive FA stop gaps, and really go hole hog after the super bowl.

 

We'd be total idiots to pass on Rosen. It makes no sense.

 

You're going to pass on him because we signed freaking Alex Smith? 34 year old Alex, Dump Off, League average, Smith? Just absurd. If you get Rosen, you do what the Cheifs did and you trade Smith for what you can get. The cheifs swindled us, we would'nt be so lucky, but we still should be able to get something worthwhile and get out from under his awful contract. 

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all of this is for naught, Rosen isn't gonna fall out of the top 5-6. SOMEONE will trade up for him if he goes below the top 3.

Teams won't be sitting around at 13 wondering, hey should I trade up for him?

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3 hours ago, dswerdlw said:

Increasingly, I think Fitzpatrick, James, Nelson, and Smith will be gone by the time we pick.  My hunch is that we will be choosing between Tremaine Edmunds, Vea, Payne, and Guice.  In my mind, the value is with Edmunds, but I'm not certain.  I'd like to hear anyone's thoughts on taking Edmunds over the tackles or the running back.  If this question has been covered earlier and I missed the responses, please ignore and forgive.  Thanks.

Harold Landry in a heartbeat for me. 

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With a little more than two weeks before the NFL Draft kicks off, you can expect a surge of news and rumors to hit the airwaves. Here’s the latest on what we’ve been told.

The top 10 players on many boards around the league right now are the four quarterbacks,Saquon Barkley, Bradley Chubb, Quenton Nelson, Tremaine Edmunds, Denzel Ward and Roquan Smith.

Minkah Fitzpatrick and Derwin James do not crack the top 10 on many boards, and most in the league believe they will be selected somewhere between picks 11 and 20.

Boards at the tight end position are all over the place, and we’ll explore that tomorrow, while the receivers could be in for a surprise on draft day as many will slide further than expected.

The belief is that the Chicago Bears will be in prime position to trade down from the eighth spot regardless of whether the top four quarterbacks are off the board. The Bears would like to recoup some of the selections they gave away one year ago after moving up to select quarterback Mitchell Trubisky.

The offer will have to be significant if either Nelson or Ward is available when the Bears are called to the clock, as the team is very high on both players.

Depending how far the Bears trade down, assuming they do, expect Isaiah Oliver to be one player they consider selecting. I’m told the team is picking the brain of University of Oregon defensive coordinator Jim Leavitt, who held the same position at Colorado, about Oliver’s next-level potential. 

Leavitt is a close friend of Bears defensive coordinator Vic Fangio and has been relied on in the past for information on players he coached at Colorado such as Chidobe Awuzie and Ahkello Witherspoon. Word is that he’s giving the Bears rave reviews on Oliver.

Several people I’ve spoken with speculated that the New York Giants and Buffalo Bills likely have a blueprint in place for a trade that would allow the Bills to move up to the second spot in the draft. They also believe that the trade won’t happen until very late in the process, if it happens at all, as the Giants want to field further offers.

Several people have confided in me that additional and new red flags have popped up on former Florida receiver Antonio Callaway since the combine.

The talented receiver and return specialist turned in a terrific combine last month after sitting on the sidelines in 2017. Callaway, along with six other players, was suspended by the Gators last August for a violation of team rules. Josh Norris of Rotoworld reported earlier this week that the New York Jets brought Callaway in for an official visit.

http://draftanalyst.com/nfl-draft-news-notes-april-11

 

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58 minutes ago, JoggingGod said:

Barkley has a slight chance of being there at 13 if teams don’t want to draft a RB that high

 

I think there's about a .1% chance of this. Technically not impossible but insanely unlikely.

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Vea could go top 10 and others feel Oakland will take him at 10. If teams feel Vea could develop into an excellent pass-rusher then it makes sense he’d go higher. One scout considered him a better version of Danny Shelton, the 12th overall pick in 2015. And another defensive coach who has scouted both likes Vea more and viewed Payne more as a two-down player. That coach did say if Vea got past Oakland he could last until the middle of the first round. The Redskins like both players, though to say which one they favor more can require sifting through the smoke. Still, if what others say is accurate about which one is better, it would be surprising if the Redskins went in this direction.

 

...Redskins coach Jay Gruden has mentioned he wants a thumper, but also has said he wants the best back possible. It does seem like there’s a group at Redskins Park who favor more powerful backs -- Derrius Guice, Nick Chubb, Rashaad Penny -- and others who like backs such as Ronald Jones II and Michel, the slightly smaller but perhaps more explosive guys. There's a reason team president Bruce Allen attended the makeup pro day at USC last week (and why Jones was at Redskins Park on Monday). So it’ll be interesting to see what direction they go. 

http://www.espn.com/blog/washington-redskins/post/_/id/36202/mel-kipers-latest-mock-fills-holes-for-redskins-but-leaves-room-debate

Edited by Skinsinparadise

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On 4/10/2018 at 9:09 PM, JamesMadisonSkins said:

Browns signed Carlos Hyde though 

Really? It doesn't appear to look like they're going to draft a RB.

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Oh man I would be so stoked if someone reached for Vea in the top 10. That means a better chance that a legit stud falls to us.

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15 hours ago, stevemcqueen1 said:

All that said, I really hope this kid pans out.  More so than anyone else in the draft.  The league needs men like him in it to evolve past its incredibly regressive social and moral cowardice.

https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/first-draft/id304434112?mt=2&i=1000408665588

 

I’m rooting for him. I think he would be a good fit in Denver. I bet Elway would like him. The worst thing that could happen to him would be to go to the Jets.

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Allen liking Jones doesn’t really give me the warm and fuzzies.  While I think we need to add some speed there, Jones just has too many questionable stats/is smaller than I like and I’m just not sure he’s a fit for us.  I see him more as a Ryan Matthews type - possibly a 3rd down back or change of pace guy.  I think we need a power guy with good vision that also offers the speed/burst Kelley me Perine lack.  

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JP has some good data on his twitter feed after speaking to Bucky and Jeremiah.

Edited by HigSkin
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6 hours ago, skinny21 said:

Allen liking Jones doesn’t really give me the warm and fuzzies.  While I think we need to add some speed there, Jones just has too many questionable stats/is smaller than I like and I’m just not sure he’s a fit for us.  I see him more as a Ryan Matthews type - possibly a 3rd down back or change of pace guy.  I think we need a power guy with good vision that also offers the speed/burst Kelley me Perine lack.  

 

I was high on Jones when the process started.  Hearing Clinton Portis rip him and reading that he wasn't a good interview has dampened it some for me. I see what Portis is talking about in that he often didn't have stacked boxes and he also had big holes to run though. 

 

But when I watch him, I love the dude's burst through the hole.  I also tend to fall for RBs with quick feet and cut-change directions fast and can stop and reaccelerate fast.  It's part of the reason why I liked Cook and Kamara last year even though their speed wasn't anything special so the combine hurt them.  But when you watch them you can see their quick feet and cutting ability and if they get into open field watch out.

 

It makes me think of those runs Robert Kelley had against the Rams where he seemed to have no vision and cutting ability to juke defenders in the open field. Jones would have likely taken those two runs to the house.  Jones has some sick moves in the open field.  You can see the home run ability which we don't have here sans Chris Thompson and even Thompson can get caught from behind.

 

So I got some cognitive dissonance about Jones.

Edited by Skinsinparadise
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16 hours ago, Skinsinparadise said:

With a little more than two weeks before the NFL Draft kicks off, you can expect a surge of news and rumors to hit the airwaves. Here’s the latest on what we’ve been told.

The top 10 players on many boards around the league right now are the four quarterbacks,Saquon Barkley, Bradley Chubb, Quenton Nelson, Tremaine Edmunds, Denzel Ward and Roquan Smith.

Minkah Fitzpatrick and Derwin James do not crack the top 10 on many boards, and most in the league believe they will be selected somewhere between picks 11 and 20.

Boards at the tight end position are all over the place, and we’ll explore that tomorrow, while the receivers could be in for a surprise on draft day as many will slide further than expected.

The belief is that the Chicago Bears will be in prime position to trade down from the eighth spot regardless of whether the top four quarterbacks are off the board. The Bears would like to recoup some of the selections they gave away one year ago after moving up to select quarterback Mitchell Trubisky.

The offer will have to be significant if either Nelson or Ward is available when the Bears are called to the clock, as the team is very high on both players.

Depending how far the Bears trade down, assuming they do, expect Isaiah Oliver to be one player they consider selecting. I’m told the team is picking the brain of University of Oregon defensive coordinator Jim Leavitt, who held the same position at Colorado, about Oliver’s next-level potential. 

Leavitt is a close friend of Bears defensive coordinator Vic Fangio and has been relied on in the past for information on players he coached at Colorado such as Chidobe Awuzie and Ahkello Witherspoon. Word is that he’s giving the Bears rave reviews on Oliver.

Several people I’ve spoken with speculated that the New York Giants and Buffalo Bills likely have a blueprint in place for a trade that would allow the Bills to move up to the second spot in the draft. They also believe that the trade won’t happen until very late in the process, if it happens at all, as the Giants want to field further offers.

Several people have confided in me that additional and new red flags have popped up on former Florida receiver Antonio Callaway since the combine.

The talented receiver and return specialist turned in a terrific combine last month after sitting on the sidelines in 2017. Callaway, along with six other players, was suspended by the Gators last August for a violation of team rules. Josh Norris of Rotoworld reported earlier this week that the New York Jets brought Callaway in for an official visit.

http://draftanalyst.com/nfl-draft-news-notes-april-11

 

While I don't necessarily trust this source to be draft experts, they make a good point in regards to the consensus although I disagree about the DB's. I've read and re-read hundreds of big boards from the reputable draftniks and there is a general consensus top 12 that has been very consistent up to this point. This puts the Skins in a precarious situation. Pretty much every mock/big board I've seen have the top 6 set with the 4 QB's, Barkley and Chubb. This is followed by the ND G - Nelson, the 3 DB's and Smith from Georgia. That's 11. A recent addition to the top 12 has been Tremaine Edwards. I'd say 8 out of 10 mocks you see will have these 12 as the top 12. After that, there really is no consensus but generally speaking Vea is probably the prospect ranked the highest across the majority of the boards. 

 

That being said, I you've got to think, one of the big 12 will slide as some GM/HC will fall in love with a prospect or draft on need. I'm thinking the tackle from ND perhaps?

 

I'm in the corner of if any of the top 12 slide, we have to draft them. The only reservation I would have would be with the two LB's and if they wouldn't be a fit. I've heard Smith is too much like Brown however, he excels in pass coverage which is something Brown does not. 

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@Skinsinparadise

Yeah, Jones was my #3 behind Barkley and Chubb when I started watching film this offseason, but the combine, the interviews, the stats vs stacked boxes,  etc, the personnel groupings he ran behind, some of the analysis critiquing his vision, and so on have soured me just a bit.  The bottom line is, although I really liked him (and still do to a large extent), I’m just not sure about him as a fit for our team.  

 

I actually have a little of the opposite thing going with Ballage - really did not like him as a runner, but some of the things I’ve seen/heard since watching tape have me questioning my stance on him.  

Edited by skinny21
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I think we are skipping over a few key things the Skins might do. I really believe they might snag an OLB earlier than we all think. 2nd round early to be exact.  Ogbonnia Okoronkwo,  Uchenna Nwosu,  Duke Ejiofor, and  Marcus Davenport could all be picked in that second round. Davenport gets a lot of love but I hope the Skins pass due to lack of big school opponents. Okoronkwo and Nwosu have me really excited and would love either one of them. Ejiofor is in the Trent Murphy ilk and could be used as OLB or DE.

 

Speaking of DE's they are one of the biggest reasons I dont want to draft Vea's fat ass. (sorry I really just dont want him lol) Rasheem Green is the man here. That guy is explosive and holds the POA very well. Great against the run. I also can see my personal favorite Harrison Phillips here and this guy is the one that they want for 3 downs. Play him inside early then flip him on the end. He is literally the perfect fit for the way we run the 3-4. Cannot forget Taven Bryan here also who is raw but looks damn impressive at times. Maurice Hurst too? Another one that can play inside and out. Just too many good lineman to go grabbing overhyped players in the 1st. In 2 weeks I guess we are going to find out either way though.

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Mr @TheJoeMarino had the most accurate Mock Draft in the nation in 2017. In his latest, #Browns take Josh Allen, #Giants Sam Darnold, #Jets Baker Mayfield, #Bills Josh Rosen:

 

https://www.ndtscouting.com/marino-6-pack-thursday-two-weeks-out-mock-draft/amp/?__twitter_impression=true

 

1. Cleveland Browns – Josh Allen, QB, Wyoming

Will John Dorsey get lost in Allen’s physical traits and pull the trigger with him at pick No. 1? I don’t think it’s out of the picture.

 

2. New York Giants – Sam Darnold, QB, USC

Darnold is the one QB I believe New York would take at No. 2 and the Browns selection of Allen makes it a possibility.

 

3. New York Jets – Baker Mayfield, QB, Oklahoma

Mayfield is a perfect fit for Jeremy Bates system and is the type of locker room presence the current Jets’ regime prefers to complement last year’s top pick Jamal Adams.

 

4. Cleveland Browns – Bradley Chubb, DE, NC State

John Dorsey is a believer in having a deep pool of pass rushers and Chubb is the best one in the draft. He could pair with Myles Garrett and Emanuel Ogbah to form a lethal trio.

 

5. Denver Broncos – Quenton Nelson, G, Notre Dame

The opportunity to pair Nelson with Garett Bolles on the left side of the line is not one I foresee John Elway passing up. Nelson has the upside to become the best offensive lineman in the NFL.

 

6. Indianapolis Colts – Saquon Barkley, RB, Penn State

The Colts trade back with the Jets works to perfection and they still get an elite prospect at No. 6. Barkley can become the focal point of the offense as Andrew Luck is re-acclimated and form a potent backfield tandem for years to come.

 

7. TRADE:  Buffalo Bills – Josh Rosen, QB, UCLA

Buffalo didn’t spend the last year stockpiling draft capital and trade away Tyrod Taylor to enter the season with A.J. McCarron and Nate Peterman as its quarterbacks. Rosen is a perfect fit for Brian Daboll’s Erhardt-Perkins passing game.

 

8. Chicago Bears – Tremaine Edmunds, LB, Virginia Tech

Edmunds is a rare blend of size, speed and physicality that would fit perfectly in the middle of Vic Fangio’s defense and continue the tradition of tone-setting middle linebackers in Chicago.

 

9. San Francisco 49ers – Roquan Smith, LB, Georgia

Whether it’s the off-field issues for Reuben Foster, returning from injury for Malcolm Smith or the shaky performances so far from Eli Harold, question marks surround all three of the 49ers current projected linebackers. Smith is a speedy and physical linebacker with exceptional processing skills.

 

10. Oakland Raiders – Mike McGlinchey, OT, Notre Dame

Starting left tackle Donald Penn is 35 years old and right tackle Vadal Alexander is an underwhelming option, leaving the short- and long-term future of the offensive tackle position questionable. McGlinchey is the best offensive tackle in the draft.

 

11. Miami Dolphins – Vita Vea, DT, Washington

The release of Ndamukong Suh leaves a hole in the middle of Miami’s defense and Vea can help fill the void. If he develops, Vea is rare blend of strength, size and movement skills.

 

12. TRADE:  Tampa Bay Buccaneers – Derwin James, S, Florida State

The Bucs needs playmakers on defense to complement its potent offense. With improvements upfront via free agency and trades, James can help solidify the back end and provide a versatile defender.

 

13. Washington Redskins – Denzel Ward, CB, Ohio State

Washington gets its replacement for Kendall Fuller and arguably the best corner in the draft. With 15 pass breakups and two interceptions this season, Ward has played like a shutdown corner on an outstanding Buckeyes defense.

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21 hours ago, crabbypatty said:

all of this is for naught, Rosen isn't gonna fall out of the top 5-6. SOMEONE will trade up for him if he goes below the top 3.

Teams won't be sitting around at 13 wondering, hey should I trade up for him?

 

True. I think Rosen goes to the Jets at #3, or the Broncos at 5. And both of those franchises should be dancing a jig if they're so lucky. For Rosen, Denver is probably better as they have a couple of veteran WR's, and a good young one in Henderson, that's some tools to work with. If he landed with the jets, he's got a DC as HC, a GM that isn't very good, and an offense w/o a RB, and w/o WR's or a TE. Basically there's nothing in place, even the OL is a mess. Their best WR is a guy who got into it with cops and said stuff I can't believe he said, Robby Anderson is really risking a year long suspension. Crowell is also in hot water for a variety of reasons, but if nothing else, they do have several RB's with skill sets, if none that are great (Powell is a good runner and a good satellite back, with 3 down potential but they refuse to give him that job, McGuire is adequate, a solid guy, Crowell is a 2 down thumper whose really erratic and is also incredibly stupid). 

 

But yeah, seems like he lands either with NYJ, Denver, or a team that trades up with NYG or the Browns. Oddly the Browns situation is both great and horrible: tons of offensive weapons, easily more than any offense picking in the top 10, but the OL took a big hit last year, the GM is a total idiot, and the HC is a scumbag and an idiot. The GM's job is safe despite being an idiot as he's a new hire, but the HC will be fired after this season. Not sure, if I was Rosen, I would be praying for a Rodgers styled fall just to open up opportunities to land w/better franchises and teams with more pieces (good young OC, good HC, good GM, and a solid OL and collection of playmakers: for me that sounds like San Diego in a trade up (great WR's, solid OL, adequate run game, solid F.O. and Rivers to train under).

 

But yeah, I think he'd go to the Giants if they weren't idiots, otherwise I think he goes NYJ, Denver, or to a team that trades up for him. 

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Cooley went today that he has started looking at Guice's tape and falling for him hard.

 

https://www.si.com/nfl/2018/04/12/cleveland-browns-nfl-draft-rumors-quarterback-mmqb?utm_campaign=themmqb&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_medium=social

Here's some MMQ rumor stuff

 Late first-round picks lack value. The other day, I was spit-balling on a potential Bills-Giants swap with a team exec, who said to me, “The problem is that the 22nd pick might as well be in the third round.” He was exaggerating, but only a little bit. The consensus I’ve heard is the difference between 22 and 52 is minimal this year, which is part of why the Colts did well to land a couple high second-rounders in their trade with the Jets.

 

The linebackers are rising. I believe that if Bradley Chubb is gone by No. 6, and Indy sticks there, Georgia’s Roquan Smith and Virginia Tech’s Tremaine Edmunds would be in play. And I think each would be a consideration for San Francisco at 9, Oakland at 10, Miami at 11 and Buffalo at 12, if those teams don’t move. And if Smith and Edmunds go earlier than expected, that would stand to help Alabama’s Rashaan Evans and Boise State’s Leighton Vander Esch.

 

What the Giants do will dictate a lot. I’ve heard that Giants GM Dave Gettleman really likes Darnold. I’ve heard the coaches like Allen. I’ve heard everyone there likes Barkley. And I know Gettleman has no history of trading down, but rumors of the work the team has done on University of Texas-San Antonio pass-rusher Marcus Davenport indicate that they’re at least considering it here. Bottom line, what the Giants do will help paint the picture for the rest of the top 10. If they take a quarterback, then that would mean QBs go 1-2-3 and could create a feeding frenzy for Cleveland’s pick at 4. If someone else trades up, then another team comes off the market for one. And if the Giants take Barkley, one of the QBs could slide a little. Gettleman is holding the cards.

 

• A good draft for grunt positions. You like interior offensive linemen? How about nose tackles? Nickel corners? Then this is the draft for you. We told you a couple months ago that Barkley and Nelson would likely be the top two prospects in the class—and that a back and a guard being rated that high would cause positional value debates all over the Top 10. Well, those could continue on down the line with really good tailbacks and guard/centers, and inside corners and big bodies for the defensive line available late in the first round and into Round 2.

 

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