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Presidential Election:11/3/20 - Biden Restores Democracy vs Trump Dictatorship Begins


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Biden doesn't really have much to gain from a debate to be honest. Just let Trump talk and vomit all over himself.

 

Its kinda like in NFL. If the opponent is turning it over every possession, just run run run punt and let them beat themselves.

 

I think Biden's supporters are aware of this. He's also been known to say dumb things and any little mishap is going to cause an s storm among the conservatives.

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12 hours ago, The Evil Genius said:

 

He's not liberal enough for SF. 

 

There's some truth to this, and it caused me to reflect this morning... As in so many things, California was a forerunner of trends in the rest of the country. I remember @Predictotalking about how he'd LIKE to vote for a more fiscally conservative candidate, but the Republicans starting with Pete Wilson and the anti-immigrant Propositions had gone off the deep end, and now a state that once brought the country Ronald Reagan is so deep blue that Republican presidential candidates don't really even campaign much there.

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1 hour ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Biden has less then two years before possibly going through same thing Obama did. Bush who? There's a Muslim in the White House trying to pass universal healthcare!?

 

Everyone was sick of Bush until Bush was gone, nobody better think for two seconds Lincoln Project won't point that gun at Biden once the existential threat is gone. Is the enemy of my enemy my friend?

 

Say it with me now, half the country is still Conservative. I don't predict Biden flopping, but let's be absolutely clear the GOP will storm back if he does.

 

My dad keeps telling me Biden was best chance to beat Trump and there is no post-Trump without that first.  My response is usually "does that mean we forget what got us Trump in the first place?".  Just saw a poll that has McConnel up by 17 points in his race right now, for example.

 

I can also see a future where Biden is bogged down by recovering from Bush II on steroids and folks losing patience with not getting it all done in two years.  "Slowest economic recovery in US history", let's not make that mistake again, please.

 

Yes, RIGHT NOW the enemy of my enemy is my friend. After the election, we will 99.9% chance go right back to hating each other and going to war. So?  What is your point you keep trying to make? Are we supposed to hate the LP because we know they will turn on Joe right after the election? Can't worry about that. Need to get the waste of human flesh who is in the WH out. And if the LP wants to help - I will praise them, support them, say thank you, and may even give them money.  BTW: No one, not a single person is arguing that the LP will turn. Not sure why you keep bringing it up. 

 

Here is a news flash - to hell with the LP and Republicans. I and many dems will be expecting a lot from Joe if he is elected. If he does not deliver I will be all over him and the dems for wasting the opportunity. I am hoping he will let whoever he picks as VP have a major role - a more major role than most on VP in history - shape policy or we will be ****ed. If he doesn't then very little will change. But right now we need to get bunker boy the **** out of the WH. That needs to be the singular focus and anyone who wants to help, bring it! So why do we need to care what the LP does after the election! They are our friends right now! We will deal with what happens after it is gone when it happens. 

 

You bring up McConnell - you are missing a major point there BTW. Watch below. Dems do not expect or need to win there. Just keep him occupied so the Rep lose the Senate overall. Also, once bunker boy is gone, there is chance that some republicans may find their conscience and start working with dems to actually help people. All we would need are less than a handful. So there are also potential positives. 

 

Not going to discuss the last very misleading statement here as it does not belong in this thread. But we can talk about the so called slowest economic recovery in another thread. Here is the best thread I can see for it. Let me know. Tag me in the thread. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Warhead36 said:

Biden doesn't really have much to gain from a debate to be honest. Just let Trump talk and vomit all over himself.

 

Its kinda like in NFL. If the opponent is turning it over every possession, just run run run punt and let them beat themselves.

 

I think Biden's supporters are aware of this. He's also been known to say dumb things and any little mishap is going to cause an s storm among the conservatives.

 

I somewhat agree, but I also think that Joe should showcase one of the things that he's naturally quite good at and that Trump is naturally awful at (sort of a consequence of being a sociopath)...and that's displaying empathy. Joe speaking with empathy and genuine concern for Americans who are suffering and dying due to Trump's incompetence and indifference to human pain would paint a huge contrast.

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Posted (edited)

If you are expecting a lot from Biden, you may be diassapointed.  He will be more just a transitional president. Trying to undo the damage Trump did. I am sure he will have a big agenda. Actually getting it passed, even with Democrats controlling everything will be difficult. The left will want full Bernie agenda. Not sure if the centrist Dems remaining will support a full Bernie agenda. Joe will get some things done but those expecting a pure progressive agenda getting passed, will be disappointed. Biden will have trouble from Getting all the Dems agreeing on things on the progressive agenda. Don't believe me, then why isn't Bernie or Elizabeth the nominee.

 

As for the GOP, they will do the exact same thing they did under Obama. They will not agree with Joe on anything. They will vote against his entire agenda. They will do everything they can, to make Joe fail. They will hope that Joe's agenda will be viewed as too far to the left, that it helps them  retake Congress  in 22.

 

We will have to see where we are in the Fall of 22, to see what happens in that election. Don't expect **** from the GOP. Their only goal is undermining Biden and taking back power in 22. Also, you will see Trump blabbing his mouth somewhere to undermine Joe.

Edited by Rdskns2000
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1 hour ago, mistertim said:

 

I somewhat agree, but I also think that Joe should showcase one of the things that he's naturally quite good at and that Trump is naturally awful at (sort of a consequence of being a sociopath)...and that's displaying empathy. Joe speaking with empathy and genuine concern for Americans who are suffering and dying due to Trump's incompetence and indifference to human pain would paint a huge contrast.

 

I don't think this can be over-stated... Biden takes a lot of flak for not being the first choice of many, but in this one very important aspect he's the perfect candidate for this moment, and it's genuine, reported over and over by people across the years and political spectrum. This is one moment that stood out to me:

 

https://www.cnn.com/2020/03/27/politics/joe-biden-coronavirus-victims-phone-number/index.html

 



"That's one of the cruelest, cruelest things that's happening," Biden said. He described a friend who sits outside the window of her mother's nursing home as the two touch hands through the window. "The human connection is so, so profoundly important. And when you don't have it, you've got to get help."

 

Biden urged people to "seek help afterwards" and "talk to people who have been through it so ... they can tell you that you can get through it."

 

Biden then began to give his phone number, but stopped himself.

 

"You can contact my campaign. I'm happy to try to talk to you," Biden said. "Not that I'm an expert, but just having been there. I'm so sorry for you."

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1 minute ago, PleaseBlitz said:

 

I was going to go with Shaun King. 

 

I don't get the sense from Rdskns2000 that he is a leftist grifter. But the sheer volume of bad political hot takes is a skill of its own.

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1 minute ago, No Excuses said:

 

I don't get the sense from Rdskns2000 that he is a leftist grifter. But the sheer volume of bad political hot takes is a skill of its own.

 

Bad political takes and absolute self-confidence their acuity. 

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1 hour ago, Rdskns2000 said:

If you are expecting a lot from Biden, you may be diassapointed.  He will be more just a transitional president. Trying to undo the damage Trump did. I am sure he will have a big agenda. Actually getting it passed, even with Democrats controlling everything will be difficult. The left will want full Bernie agenda. Not sure if the centrist Dems remaining will support a full Bernie agenda. Joe will get some things done but those expecting a pure progressive agenda getting passed, will be disappointed. Biden will have trouble from Getting all the Dems agreeing on things on the progressive agenda. Don't believe me, then why isn't Bernie or Elizabeth the nominee.

 

Sanders once again lost the primaries. So did Warren plus misogyny. Edited to add:  if Sanders hadn't needed his ego fix again and he fully backed Warren, we might have had a different primary outcome.

 

As for the GOP, they will do the exact same thing they did under Obama. They will not agree with Joe on anything. They will vote against his entire agenda. They will do everything they can, to make Joe fail. They will hope that Joe's agenda will be viewed as too far to the left, that it helps them  retake Congress  in 22.

The Republicans will do as they always will. Hopefully the electorate will reject them, and Democrats can do what they can to repair our country after this **** administration and years of Republican crap.

 

Quote

 

We will have to see where we are in the Fall of 22, to see what happens in that election. Don't expect **** from the GOP. Their only goal is undermining Biden and taking back power in 22. Also, you will see Trump blabbing his mouth somewhere to undermine Joe.

 

Democrats are building a good base of support for years to come. Republicans are going to lose for years, especially after this economic depression of four years of Trump, even ruining his base.

Edited by LadySkinsFan
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47 minutes ago, PleaseBlitz said:

The Democrat electorate soundly rejected the Bernie agenda.  

 

Did they or reject Democratic Socialism and the Bernie Bros?

 

Biden has rewritten his climate plan to come closer to Green New Deal. There's a helluva lot more support for Universal Health Care then the Medicare for All bills collecting dust in Congress.

 

Even if people are angry at everything doesn't mean they want another President that acts like that back to back, that was my main takeaway from the primaries.

 

Biden is a bridge president to beat Trump, how many people here complained relentlessly about him as a candidate then accepted he was bear chance to make sure Trump loses?  How many voters are voting against their own political affiliation to get this man out of office?

 

If ever there was an election that wasn't about policy, it's this one.  Unless we want to consider democracy vs authoritarianism a policy issue.

 

I'm not buying what @Rdskns2000 is selling on Biden being too progressive and getting rejected by the moderates, any more them in buying the entire progressive agenda has been swiftly rejected by the electorate. 

 

Biden knows this, that's why he's trying to meet Bernie folks halfway in the platform that will be presented at the convention, Hillary did something similar. This is second convention in a row where Bernie lost and got to have his hand in the platform for the winning candidate to get his voters to vote for them, DNC would not do that if that agenda was swiftly rejected.

 

Moderates aren't going to try to win without progressives and they shouldn't, whether they show up to vote or not remains to be seen, but we know what will happen if they don't try to meet halfway.

Edited by Renegade7
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58 minutes ago, Rdskns2000 said:

If you are expecting a lot from Biden, you may be diassapointed.  He will be more just a transitional president. Trying to undo the damage Trump did.

Isn't that what most people want from him?

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I’m not sure why people are assuming a group that is spending a good portion of their time attacking down ballot Republicans and is formed primarily with cleaning up the Republicans party in mind and in it’s name..., is going to go after Biden.  More likely you will see some individuals speak out if they don’t like some things, while the group will focus on Trump’s supporters who remain.

 

 It’s also good to keep in mind that a lot of Republicans’ views on issues have changed the past few years.

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2 minutes ago, dfitzo53 said:

Isn't that what most people want from him?

 

I don't, but I'll take it given the options left now.

 

Is what it is, I have problems that simply having a different president isn't going to solve by itself, and that's going to take policy changes.

 

I'm uncomfortable with the incredibly low bar Trump has set for Biden, the quicker we get to comparing Biden to any other President except him the easier it will be to keep this conversation honest.  

 

I'm trying to process how to have this conversation post-Election because Democrats do have a tendency to eat their own, Biden is going to get passes we wouldn't normally give but we have to if he's a 1-Term President.  Whoever runs after Biden will pay for how we treat Biden if he wins.

 

This doesn't mean kick cans down the road, this is going to be a delicate time in our history where folks are going to look to answers to their problems and who they believe will actually address them.  That is a pattern of all human history, not just our country.

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1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

Did they or reject Democratic Socialism and the Bernie Bros?

 

The Bernie agenda is Democratic Socialism.  They are the same thing.  

 

1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Biden has rewritten his climate plan to come closer to Green New Deal. There's a helluva lot more support for Universal Health Care then the Medicare for All bills collecting dust in Congress.

 

Well this is confusing.  Bernie's plan is Universal Health Care by way of Medicare for All.  https://berniesanders.com/issues/medicare-for-all/

 

1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Even if people are angry at everything doesn't mean they want another President that acts like that back to back, that was my main takeaway from the primaries.

 

Biden is a bridge president to beat Trump, how many people here complained relentlessly about him as a candidate then accepted he was bear chance to make sure Trump loses?  How many voters are voting against their own political affiliation to get this man out of office?

 

A very vocal minority has claimed that Biden is a bridge president and it's politics, people complain.  The fact of the matter is Biden won the Dem primary in a rout.  It was effectively over before Super Tuesday even happened.  He won two and half times the delegates Bernie and Warren won combined.  

 

1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

 

If ever there was an election that wasn't about policy, it's this one.  Unless we want to consider democracy vs authoritarianism a policy issue.

 

I mean, policies still matter, especially in the Dem primary where Trump isn't running.  People hate Trump because he is a dumb asshole, but they also hate his policies and want to go a different route, but they have specific opinions on what that route looks like.  

 

1 minute ago, Renegade7 said:

 

I'm not buying what @Rdskns2000 is selling on Biden being too progressive and getting rejected by the moderates, any more them in buying the entire progressive agenda has been swiftly rejected by the electorate. 

 

Biden knows this, that's why he's trying to meet Bernie folks halfway in the platform that will be presented at the convention, Hillary did something similar. This is second convention in a row where Bernie lost and got to have his hand in the platform for the winning candidate to get his voters to vote for them, DNC would not do that if that agenda was swiftly rejected.

 

Moderates aren't going to try to win without progressives and they shouldn't, whether they show up to vote or not remains to be seen, but we know what will happen if they don't try to meet halfway.

 

I'm not sure how you can not buy the notion that the far-left progressive agenda was rejected.  Just look at the results.  There was one pure progressive (Bernie) and one progressive that couches her ideas in capitalism (Warren).  Combined, they won 1,136 delegates.  Biden alone won 2,627.  Biden got nearly twice as many votes as Bernie, 17.6 million to 9.3 million.  

 

As far as meeting Bernie folks halfway, that's just big tent politics.  Biden knows he needs votes from people that are far more progressive than him, so he's doing things to bring them into the fold.  It's smart.  Once he (hopefully) becomes President, he'll get passed what he thinks he can get passed, just like every President ever.  That is how our system of government is designed and Biden has been in that arena for forever.  Where Rdskins2000 goes wrong is when he says "Biden will have trouble from Getting all the Dems agreeing on things on the progressive agenda."  Biden is not going to try to pass "the progressive agenda" he's going to try to pass the Biden agenda, which is the most progressive agenda ever for a Presidential candidate, but not close to the Bernie agenda.  If the far left doesn't support it, they are shooting themselves in the foot.  

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12 minutes ago, visionary said:

I’m not sure why people are assuming a group that is spending a good portion of their time attacking down ballot Republicans and is formed primarily with cleaning up the Republicans party in mind and in it’s name..., is going to go after Biden.  More likely you will see some individuals speak out if they don’t like some things, while the group will focus on Trump’s supporters who remain.

 

 It’s also good to keep in mind that a lot of Republicans’ views on issues have changed the past few years.

 

That's fair to ask this.

 

My concerns is this just feels like Republican tactics used against Republicans that aren't Republicans anymore.

 

It's obvious it's effective and Biden is not what was or is a republican, he's not a conservative, he's a liberal and a Democrat.

 

If Trump loses, will the Lincoln Project go away when? After they defeated Trumpism? Trump was and is a conduit, will they stand ready for the next Trump? On their website they say pretty clearly that they don't agree with Democrats platform, this is about protecting democracy.

 

What I don't see is how they feel about fellow never Trumps running for office. They aren't democrats, talking out loud here, but maybe I am thinking ahead to post-Trump to what the effects will be when they start digging into primaries.  This is what's best for democracy, but how tempting will it be to make sure the primary candidates they support get elected against Democrats when what they are so I g is so effective?

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3 hours ago, goskins10 said:

 

 

You bring up McConnell - you are missing a major point there BTW. Watch below. Dems do not expect or need to win there. Just keep him occupied so the Rep lose the Senate overall. Also, once bunker boy is gone, there is chance that some republicans may find their conscience and start working with dems to actually help people. All we would need are less than a handful. So there are also potential positives. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

The problem with Kentucky and other states surrounding Kentucky that is very conservative. It's gerrymandered so bad, it's geared for McConnell and Paul and any GOP'er Presidential candidate to win every election, no matter how strong the contender is. They only have 6 districts. 5 of them have GOP representation, where 1 district is Dem. I bet you can guess that city. McConnell or Paul will have a seat for life. Their governor, who is a Dem, barely won their gubernatorial election. Think he won barely by a percentage point. I don't see a path towards winning that seat in Kentucky or Graham's seat in South Carolina. Have to win the seats that are toss up. 

 

https://www.270towin.com/2020-house-election/states/kentucky

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  • Rdskns2000 changed the title to Presidential Election:11/3/20 - Biden Restores Democracy vs Trump Dictatorship Begins

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