Larry Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Oh, I think experience is a factor. I'm not sure it should be an absolute requirement. And it can certainly be abused. Remember when Hillary was completely unqualified, because she'd never been a Governor, and only experience as a Governor counts towards being President? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Excuses Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 1 hour ago, PleaseBlitz said: I also have no issue with unconventional candidates with good ideas. But at the end of the day, I want a steady hand at the wheel, especially after the past 2+ years of chaos. I personally value that return to stability and normalcy over any single policy issue, and I generally care deeply about policy. I certainly don't think Biden is the only one that fits the bill, but he certainly has the most relevant experience of everyone. I suppose you can spin that as a bad thing, but it reeks of spin to me. Not joking about picking Yang over Biden (I'm not voting for either of them anyways). The reason I would do this is because I don't think a return to normalcy is the only thing necessary after Trump. And I don't know what return to normalcy really even means at this point. Normal before Trump was a Democratic Party getting outmaneuvered by Republicans time and time again, with a severe imbalance between how both parties choose to wield power. It effectively allowed the right to become more and more extreme while still gaining electoral power. Going by Joe Biden's recent statements on "across the aisle cooperation", it seems like he is supremely qualified to lead us into several more years of Democrats normally getting punked by a ruthless GOP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 I would also suggest that when Obama was elected in 2008, the expectation was that he would be a lot more progressive than he actually was, as President. So this idea that we need a "stiff centrist to restore order and balance in the world" is a bit silly as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 20 minutes ago, NoCalMike said: I would also suggest that when Obama was elected in 2008, the expectation was that he would be a lot more progressive than he actually was, as President. So this idea that we need a "stiff centrist to restore order and balance in the world" is a bit silly as well. I don't think anyone said a centrist. Joe Biden, "moderate" and Joe Biden, "former 2-term VP and former kajillion term senator" are two different considerations. I'm saying that it would be nice to have someone that knows how government works (and is supposed to work) and wont govern via tweets, won't publicly threaten allies or get into their politics, won't make major diplomatic faux pas like criticizing Americans on foreign soil and understands the roles and boundaries of the myriad pillars of government (e.g., won't neg the Fed, will let insist the DOJ have independence, etc). There are a million little details that matter that have nothing to do with ones place on the political spectrum. I agree with everyone that Biden's statement about working with the GOP is delusional. I also think/hope he said it as more of an exercise in branding himself as a moderate rather than because he actually believes it to be true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tshile Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Here’s my observation in the context of: - I’m reading these threads but probably catching 70% of it - I’m talking about the people I talk to outside the board, in the area I live - the area is probably 65% always vote R no matter what, 25% I’ll go either way if you give me good enough reasons (or bad enough candidate), 10% dem. The dem candidate are not reaching the 25%. Maybe they don’t want to. Maybe the nature of it being a primary and them not caring makes it an impossible task anyways. But theyre not reaching those people here. I’d say about 3 months ago those people were sort of excited. They knew names of people as they declared. They’d say something like “yeah I’m excited to see who they get, because trump is awful” now, when I ask or make a comment about a current event re: dem primaries, I get a “oh no I haven’t heard anything about any of it” sort of responses. Maybe the concern is irrelevant. It just feels like the 25% is being lulled into passive supporting trump. It feels like a strong build up of loathing for trump is sliding away. Id say half of the 25% is so far they’re not voting for trump no matter what. But that other half... I’m concerned. Also, I really like Warren. There’s only one policy I take issue with on her platform. I tried to talk to people about her economic patriotism release and I couldn’t even get people to want to pay attention. They heard her name and the conversation was over before it could begin. I don’t know how you overcome that. She’s easily my favorite (which means little considering how much I’m following it) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Warren also jumped over Bernie in today's Economist/YouGov Poll. https://d25d2506sfb94s.cloudfront.net/cumulus_uploads/document/4etmv6wq62/econToplines.pdf 16 for Warren, 12 for Sanders. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Truth be told, plenty of the voting electorate is not going to be engaged into the election season until the general election is down to Trump and the (D) Nominee. That is just how it works a lot of the time. This is where sometimes I think the 24/7 news cycle hurts on things like the election and even on issues like the Russia Interference investigation. People get tired of it, fatigued. They don't want to hear about things anymore. We are a long ways away from the days you came home from work, sat down for the "News Hour" got your update and moved on for the night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 For the further Left posters here, would any of you NOT vote for Biden if he were the nominee? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
No Excuses Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 3 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said: For the further Left posters here, would any of you NOT vote for Biden if he were the nominee? I will vote for a donkey that has been run over by a tank over Trump so Biden will still get my vote if he’s the nominee. I would just have very low expectations about what his admin would actually do to advance the liberal cause. He’s not a thought leader on any key liberal issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Good riddance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 15 minutes ago, TheGreatBuzz said: For the further Left posters here, would any of you NOT vote for Biden if he were the nominee? I'd say I'm center left, but I don't mind Biden specifically because I think he probably has the best chance to beat Trump. I ****ing hate Bernie Sanders. I'd vote for him in a heartbeat if he wins the nomination. I think Andrew Yang is less qualified than I am to be President. I'd still vote for him over Trump. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 I view Biden as a less-good, but less baggage-y version of Hillary. Am I excited to see him as the nominee? No. Would I ever consider staying home and not voting because he is the nominee? Hell No. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted June 12, 2019 Author Share Posted June 12, 2019 5 hours ago, BenningRoadSkin said: The problem with Biden is that its 2019 and a lot of people see through what he is doing. Look at how he flip-flopped on the Hyde Amendment stuff. Did he really flip flop after nearly 40 years from when he supported it or is he trying to get in line with the current Dem party and appeal to people? Or the environmental policy he put out after saying there is a middle ground we can reach? He said there was a middle ground and then plagiarized - not the first time he has done that - bits and pieces from policy groups. I keep saying it, dude stands for nothing and will be out of here really early. He would have been a better candidate in 1988 when Reagan was king. 87-88 is when the plagerism scandal drove him out of the race. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NoCalMike Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 If Biden keeps answering questions like Trump, "No one has done more for.............than me!" the debates are going to be hysterical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 You know, I don't think we've been saying enough about Yang. He's got some good ideas. (now how can I hook myself up with this money) 😉 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visionary Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nonniey Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 Another question for those of the left on this board. Which is more important for a new Democratic Administration? 1) A return to normalcy/civility. 2) Making the former administration, GOP Congress members and supporters pay for their "crimes". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 1 hour ago, TheGreatBuzz said: For the further Left posters here, would any of you NOT vote for Biden if he were the nominee? I'll vote for him because I am a regular voter and I will never vote for a Republican. But I'll tell you what will happen if Biden is the nominee--huge swaths of core Democratic constituencies won't show up at all. It will be the same song and dance as with Hillary and Kerry, and Trump will win again. He's been completely normalized for the core Republican constituencies, and they will be enough to win him a second term. Republican candidates have a built in advantage through the electoral college, and the only way Democrats can win the presidency is by motivating high turnout. Committed, principled partisans, left + right, are probably less than 40% of eligible voters. The rest swing in and out, and they need a strong hand to lead them to the polls. Biden is not that kind of leader. He's an empty suit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cooked Crack Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 7 minutes ago, nonniey said: Another question for those of the left on this board. Which is more important for a new Democratic Administration? 1) A return to normalcy/civility. 2) Making the former administration, GOP Congress members and supporters pay for their crimes. If people committed crimes shouldn't they be pay for said crimes? That seems normal to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Going Commando Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 7 minutes ago, nonniey said: Another question for those of the left on this board. Which is more important for a new Democratic Administration? 1) A return to normalcy/civility. 2) Making the former administration, GOP Congress members and supporters pay for their crimes. 3) Progress. The GoP definition of civility is for Democrats to know their place and not fight back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PleaseBlitz Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 13 minutes ago, nonniey said: Another question for those of the left on this board. Which is more important for a new Democratic Administration? 1) A return to normalcy/civility. 2) Making the former administration, GOP Congress members and supporters pay for their crimes. The first one. Hopefully Trump is defeated and the GOP goes into a period of turmoil between a group that wants to continue down the Trump path (but with nobody that can really pull off Trump's craziness) and a group that wants to return to Reagan-esque GOP orthodoxy, and they consume themselves and the Dems take that opportunity to show they can govern as responsible, normal, civil adults and enact significant changes to the current social contract that benefit the 99%. Trump will continue to snipe from Twitter, at both sides and everyone else in the world that he blames for losing, then he'll die soon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bozo the kKklown Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 1 hour ago, TheGreatBuzz said: For the further Left posters here, would any of you NOT vote for Biden if he were the nominee? Why ask this question? All of us want Trump out. The point is not repeating the same ol mistakes like the Tame Impala song. That’s what primary season is about. Biden is the same ol mistakes and seeing how he runs his campaigns, he doesn’t come across as a good leader. 1 hour ago, Rdskns2000 said: 87-88 is when the plagerism scandal drove him out of the race. I know, I referenced that in my post. My point is Biden’s worldview belongs in that era. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheGreatBuzz Posted June 12, 2019 Share Posted June 12, 2019 4 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said: Why ask this question? Curiosity. Seemed a lot of posters here wouldn't like him as the nominee. I was wondering just how much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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