No Excuses

Nationwide Removal of Confederate Statues

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5 hours ago, Riggo-toni said:

Apologies if this is already posted in this thread somewhere, but THIS is the Confederate General of whom we should be building statues. If it were truly about heritage and not hate (hint: it's not), we should replace statues of Forrest and Lee with Mahone and Longstreet.

 

https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_599b3747e4b06a788a2af43e

 

I'm reading Ron Chernow's biography "Grant," and I'm at the post-Civil War era where Reconstruction is falling apart and Southern whites are usurping State authority through terror and armed militias, essentially intimidating blacks out of the political arena by threat of violence or death.  New Orleans was the scene of some particularly violent episodes.  Longstreet, in New Orleans, helps fight a mostly losing battle against that tide. 

 

President Grant deserves credit for his desire to enfranchise blacks and give them equal footing.  Early in Reconstruction, he sent Federal forces down to quell the violence, but later on, as Northern sentiment toward Reconstruction faded and turned openly hostile to black enfranchisement, he hesitated to respond to pleas for Federal help to quell the violence. Things got worse. The ideal of equality for southern blacks was lost for a hundred years. Or more.

 

I hadn't heard of Mahone.  Thanks for sharing that piece about him.

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Hmm... Of all things wrong in the world...

Vandalism of monuments is completely different than an empty wall or a train. 

 

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17 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said:

Anarchy is awesome 

 

The statue was erected to honor people who rebelled against a duly elected government. (Because of fear of ending slavery). 

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The confederacy were traitors to America and lost a war they started (over the right to subjugate other human beings). I dont see the point in them having statues in their honor. Doesn't make any sense to me. 

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Monuments to treason are, generally speaking, in poor taste.

 

Especially when they are specifically constructed to serve as tools of terrorism.

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No it’s fine.  Laws don’t matter if you don’t agree with them.  Or if you decide that the outcome is more important than the law itself. 

24 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

So is supporting fascist figures.

As long as you get to decide who is and who is not worthy of support or memorial right?

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Granted, I can understand not wanting see another group feel justified in tearing down a different monument for a different reason, but looking at laws North Carolina has on books to stop legal removal of these statues, I'm not suprised.  State should fix their laws or this will keep happening, they do need to go.

1 minute ago, Kilmer17 said:

No it’s fine.  Laws don’t matter if you don’t agree with them.  Or if you decide that the outcome is more important than the law itself. 

As long as you get to decide who is and who is not worthy of support or memorial right?

The people that hid Anne Frank were breaking the law, the people that killed Anne Frank were following it. Fix the law so they can legally take down the statues, then we can talk.

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4 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

Granted, I can understand not wanting see another group feel justified in tearing down a different monument for a different reason, but looking at laws North Carolina has on books to stop legal removal of these statues, I'm not suprised.  State should fix their laws or this will keep happening, they do need to go.

The people that hid Anne Frank were breaking the law, the people that killed Anne Frank were following it. Fix the law so they can legally take down the statues, then we can talk.

You’re equating people hiding Jews from nazis to idiots toppling statues of people?

 

your first point is right. Don’t like the law?  Change it.  Or accept everyone can do the same 

Just now, Llevron said:

You know we all see right through your BS right @Kilmer17?

And I yours 

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Is it acceptable for anyone to break the law and destroy statues or monuments to people with which they disagree?   

 

If not, who gets to determine which ones are acceptable to violate the law and destroy and which are not?

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Bad people put up a statue to honor slavery and violence. 

 

Dumb kids breaking the law took it down. 

 

The world moves on.

 

 

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6 minutes ago, No Excuses said:

 

 

The world moves on.

 

 

 

with the dumb kids in jail?

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2 minutes ago, twa said:

 

with the dumb kids in jail?

 

Nobody is going to jail, fine at most :ols:

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4 minutes ago, spjunkies said:

 

Nobody is going to jail, fine at most :ols:

 

of course

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Just a reminder that the Confederacy lasted four years...FOUR YEARS.  Surely there are other folks in the nearly 400 year history of North Carolina deserving of a statue?

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1 minute ago, twa said:

 

of course

 

What, your reaction to this or anything involving trump?

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1 minute ago, TryTheBeal! said:

Just a reminder that the Confederacy lasted four years...FOUR YEARS.  Surely there are other folks in the nearly 400 year history of North Carolina deserving of a statue?

 

so it can be knocked over? :ols:

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27 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said:

You’re equating people hiding Jews from nazis to idiots toppling statues of people?

 

your first point is right. Don’t like the law?  Change it.  Or accept everyone can do the same 

And I yours 

No, I'm blasting your shortsighted statement on the dangers on the law not mattering if you disagree with it.

 

Slavery was also legal at one point, I'd say this a little less extreme then starting a war.  If anything people taking down these statues themselves will help force the issue for change in that state, which as visionary had pointed was matter  impossible via legal means.

 

  So fix the law the we can talk about whether losing patience and tearing down the statues themselves are justified, because I want to agree with you.  I'd feel differently if it was a state that was actively taking statues down so it didn't come to this.

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