Nazis showing up at places uninvited.

[NoCalMike]

4 minutes ago, RedskinsFan44 said:

Interesting point someone made on a Sunday talk show, you have to look at when these monuments were put up too. Stone Mountain and the statue of Lee in Charlottesville were put up in the late 1910s and early 1920s after Birth of a Nation and the resurgence of the Klan. Apparently a lot of confederate monuments also went up in the late 50s/early 60s as desegregation and civil rights became hotbed issues in the south.  That was also when the stars and bars came into prominence again. The guy on the talk show posited that these monuments were meant to send a message to blacks in the areas they were erected. 

 

Of course it was. Nothing to do with heritage or "history." It was always about sending a message and intimidation and making non-whites feel like they were on borrowed time in that part of the country.   Tear the damn thing down already. 

[Kilmer17]

47 minutes ago, Destino said:

 

I must have missed the crowd of people defending nazi here.  I have seen a lot of them elsewhere on the internet and on TV though. 

 

Edited August 14, 2017 by Kilmer17

[skinsmarydu]

10 minutes ago, NoCalMike said:

Tear the damn thing down already. 

Stone Mountain?  ...

~just thought I'd try to lighten things up a bit~

[TradeTheBeal!]

I refuse to condemn Teddy Roosevelt.

[Burgold]

8 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said:

You didn't.  This place has become the epitome of absolutism.  If you don't absolutely condemn something or someone you are guilty of tacitly supporting it or them. 

 

Yep. You don't absolutely condemn Nazis and find a way to rationalize their activities then you are guilty of tacitly supporting them or worse. After all, that's the first lesson of history.

 

All the good men and women in Germany who turned a blind eye and decided that the little wrongs or the great wrongs they were seeing could be explained away or forgiven share a burden of guilt.

Edited August 14, 2017 by Burgold

[The Evil Genius]

10 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said:

You didn't.  This place has become the epitome of absolutism.  If you don't absolutely condemn something or someone you are guilty of tacitly supporting it or them. 

 

 

I think you're wrong on that. But failing to call out the leader of your party for being tone deaf of race issues because.. well you won the last election, is cowardly.

 

Forgive us for having higher opinions for some posters than they (appear to) deserve.

Edited August 14, 2017 by The Evil Genius

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

Georgia added the Confederate flag to its state flag in 1956. Which was totally a coincidence I'm sure.

 

But I think it's not exactly accurate to say that Confederate monuments happened as a result of Birth of a Nation. Confederate monuments started going up pretty quickly after the war. And it seems like they really exploded in the 20s and 30s, which likely coincides with there actually being money to put the damn things up.

 

 

12 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said:

You didn't.  This place has become the epitome of absolutism.  If you don't absolutely condemn something or someone you are guilty of tacitly supporting it or them. 

 

 

What is the middle path on Nazism?

[Kilmer17]

Delete

Edited August 14, 2017 by Kilmer17

[Jumbo]

 

Right now don't have the mindset to type out a thorough post on the matter of prioritization and selection in perspective taken and nautre of "points" being made when some people engage certain topics, and what it might indicate about them especially when it's such a consistent feature, and how unproductive their "timing" thing is at the very minimum. Until then, there are a few here I suggest try to use their great brain best they can and figure it out for their own preservation.

 

Martin (and Des earlier) is saying things I suggest people take to heart.

 

We have a lot of latitude in expression here, and there is a great deal of patience on the part of the staff, but this is not a place where there is unlimited moral ambiguity in argument, or unlimited freedom for stupidity/personal issues/being an annoying dick, is available.

 

There are people who enjoy/push the envelope here and have for years. And then a time comes that they're not here anymore.

 

Here's some specific problem behaviors that you can't eliminate but are often over-indulged in by some folks. I'd advise people to be aware of and ration these behaviors judiciously as I am feeling like loading up a short bus with deportees:

 

Goalpost moving (uh huh)

False equivalences (I can't count the body bags)

Over the top posting (spamming consistent insult/hyperbole/hysteria)

 

 

Among the handful of folks most prominent in my mind (almsot all of whom I like other than the issue) who fit the problem are a few righties,a few  lefties, and a couple others, so major demographics are represented.

 

 

ps--well, and i was just going to post the above when i see kilmer 17's latest...i was trying not to name names...but you went again...you do way too much here that's some of the bull**** i just outlined plus complaining about the forum..maybe it's time for you to take a voluntary break....i do that and recommend it to everyone)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[tshile]

hi @Predicto

You should stop by more often

[Kilmer17]

13 minutes ago, Jumbo said:

 

<edit to comply with rule 11>

ps--well, and i was just going to post the above when i see kilmer 17's latest...i was trying not to name names...but you went again...you do way too much here that's some of the bull**** i just outlined ab over and  complaining about the forum..maybe it's time for you to take a voluntary break....i do that and recommend it to everyone)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Heard and understood.  I've gone back and deleted my posts in this thread

[ixcuincle]

 

[Jumbo]

8 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said:

Heard and understood.  I've gone back and deleted my posts in this thread

  Don't over understand me.

 

The deletions weren't necessary, but if that's cooperation and not passive-aggressive reaction, cool.

 

You weren't individually targeted. 

 

I also edited your quote to comply with rule 11 and save you a penalty from Mad Dog Martin.

 

you also bring a solid share of good and worthy stuff or you'd have been gone years ago at the hands of OM and several others since lol ...i'd sure rather not be that guy

[tshile]

There was a time I accepted, and even regurgitated, the "don't tear down" history arguments.

 

I'm quite embarrassed.

 

More than that, I also feel sad. A lot of people had to look at/walk past/attend statues/buildings/schools/roads that were obviously named to intimidate them (at the very least)

 

 

[DogofWar1]

Predicto is alive!

 

My day is actually honestly better for seeing his avatar in a recent post in a thread.  Missed you, buddy.  Swing by more often.

[Kilmer17]

1 minute ago, Jumbo said:

  Don't over understand me.

 

The deletions weren't necessary, but if that's cooperation and not passive-aggressive reaction, cool.

 

You weren't individually targeted. 

 

I also edited your quote to comply with rule 11 and save you a penalty from Mad Dog Martin.

Come on!  You know I'd have a much better passive aggressive response if that was my intention.....

[Predicto]

For whatever it is worth, I think my friend Kilmer's comments were more a matter of tone deafness than anything more.  

 

Sometimes playing the devil's advocate is useful, sometimes it is just very poorly timed, and sometimes it is borderline trolling.   This was the second of those three possibilities.  Kilmer is not defending Nazis.

[Kilmer17]

2 minutes ago, Predicto said:

For whatever it is worth, I think my friend Kilmer's comments were more a matter of tone deafness than anything more.  

 

Sometimes playing the devil's advocate is useful, sometimes it is just very poorly timed, and sometimes it is borderline trolling.   This was the second of those three possibilities.  Kilmer is not defending Nazis.

Thank you P.  My initial post said it probably belonged in a separate thread.  And it does. Otherwise it can be construed the wrong way.  Which I didn't exactly run away from.....

[Destino]

 

1 hour ago, MartinC said:

 

100% this.

 

I've posted this statement in another thread but I think it bears repeating here. This is no longer a left v right issue. Its wrong v right. Pick a side and be judged by that choice.

 

Maybe you can tell me who the nazi sympathizers are then?  I've been reading through the thread on a righteous mission to root them out and I can't come up with any.  This place isn't reddit, we don't tolerate no nazi fanboys here.  I take offense to the notion that there are many here that have escaped my notice.

 

The only recent attempt to discuss the motives of the hate riot in Charlottesville was that poor misguided soul that wanted to talk about well treated slaves.  Good grief.

 

They can't hide forever!

[Jumbo]

8 minutes ago, Predicto said:

For whatever it is worth, I think my friend Kilmer's comments were more a matter of tone deafness than anything more.  

 

Sometimes playing the devil's advocate is useful, sometimes it is just very poorly timed, and sometimes it is borderline trolling.   This was the second of those three possibilities.  Kilmer is not defending Nazis.

 

  agrered and i know.  i even said something nice to him in pm and public. he's way ahead of the last lefty and libertarian i dealt with mod-wise. 

 

meanwhile, we're still in the game, whatever our level of skill is at this point. 

 

 

[Predicto]

3 minutes ago, tshile said:

There was a time I accepted, and even regurgitated, the "don't tear down" history arguments.

 

I'm quite embarrassed.

 

More than that, I also feel sad. A lot of people had to look at/walk past/attend statues/buildings/schools/roads that were obviously named to intimidate them (at the very least)

 

 

 

 

Don't be embarrassed.   I did the same thing for years.  It was something that was taught to me from a very young age growing up in Virginia.  I did the Heritage not Hate thing, and the whatabboutism, and the "don't we have better things to worry about" deflections, and all the rest.  It was something that I needed to be educated about before I could wake up and move away from it.   It rarely just happens that we just figure it out on our own that our feelings and cultural allegiances have been manipulated.  

 

The fact that you are honest and introspective about it is a huge mark in your favor.    Most people dig in their heels, put their fingers in their ears, and fight back forever.   Or they weakly acknowledge the point, but come back the next week spouting the same old nonsense with no sense of irony at all.   

 

11 minutes ago, DogofWar1 said:

Predicto is alive!

 

My day is actually honestly better for seeing his avatar in a recent post in a thread.  Missed you, buddy.  Swing by more often.

 

I will, but I'm done for today.  Work has be buried.

[TradeTheBeal!]

12 minutes ago, tshile said:

There was a time I accepted, and even regurgitated, the "don't tear down" history arguments.

 

I'm quite embarrassed.

 

More than that, I also feel sad. A lot of people had to look at/walk past/attend statues/buildings/schools/roads that were obviously named to intimidate them (at the very least)

 

 

 

I can echo this.  Word for word.

[Jumbo]

mod fight!!!

 

these are great

 

i love these

[The Evil Genius]

9 minutes ago, Destino said:

 

 

Maybe you can tell me who the nazi sympathizers are then?  I've been reading through the thread on a righteous mission to root them out and I can't come up with any.  This place isn't reddit, we don't tolerate no nazi fanboys here.  

 

Without trying to be an ass..well a bigger ass than normal, I'd say anyone who tries to compare the white nationalists/neo Nazis goobers with the BLM people are guilty if it.

 

They aren't equivalent.

5 minutes ago, Jumbo said:

mod fight!!!

 

these are great

 

i love these

 

I hear LKB stashed some chairs under the ring. I'd watch out for that zoony guy though. He's likely to pull a roll of quarters out of his tighty whities.

Edited August 14, 2017 by The Evil Genius

[Destino]

1 minute ago, The Evil Genius said:

Without trying to be an ass..well a bigger ass than normal, I'd say anyone who tries to compare the white nationalists/neo Nazis goobers with the BLM people areas equally guilty if it.

 

They aren't equivalent.

 

Agreed.  I cringe every time I hear a right wing analyst say that on the news.  It really is an awful thing to say as it literally compares a civil rights organization to a hate group.