Standing during the Pledge or National Anthem

[Kosher Ham]

On 8/30/2016 at 1:06 PM, Lombardi's_kid_brother said:

Systemic discrimination....

I'll just ask this question: Does anyone ever wonder why in major cities a neighborhood can go from Jewish to Irish to Italian to Puerto Rican to Asian over 120 years....but the black neighborhoods in 1920 are still the black neighborhoods today?

Do you consider DC a major city? 

[MattFancy]

19 minutes ago, Am-WelshSkin said:

 Do you know I feel it equally disrespectful of the FedEx field crowd when they shout "O" during the anthem.  It's all about respect to your country and your flag!

This is interesting and something I've thought of lately. How many people that don't like what Kap is doing also say "O" or "Red" during the Anthem at the local games?

[grego]

1 hour ago, RonArtest15 said:

I've been nothing but reasonable...maybe you should try being objective or at least attempt try to understand Jones' point. 

I'll even give you an assist:

Adam Jones on his comments regarding race in baseball

artest-

theres no disagreement when it comes to miller- I haven't heard a single person try to argue that miller isn't a dirtbag for fighting a 70 year old. add to that, he was immediately cut from the team. justice served. case closed. nobody's talking about it cuz nobody disagrees.

the very fact that we're talking about Kap doesn't mean that hes a worse guy than miller. children starving in the Sudan or Ethiopia is a huge deal and a tragedy. because its not the subject du jour and we don't talk about it enough doesn't make it less important that Kap.

the narrative for while has been how protests are supposed to make people uncomfortable, to make us talk. its what they are designed to do, yet, now that we're talking, its 'why are we talking about this, when issue X gets no attention'.

22 minutes ago, MattFancy said:

This is interesting and something I've thought of lately. How many people that don't like what Kap is doing also say "O" or "Red" during the Anthem at the local games?

I think that's a good question, matt

[grego]

1 hour ago, btfoom said:

No, this is EXACTLY the issue.  Right now, everyone is talking about who does what during the anthem.  Period.  Not what the 'issues' are.

 

I said this last week and was surprised at the backlash.

this pro adam jones writer notes it as well-

Too much is being made about Kaepernick’s protest and not enough about what his protest is about.

http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/athletes-like-adam-jones-deserve-to-be-heard-with-open-ears-091216

I want to hear more about specific issues- what they are, what are the proposed solutions- not about whether or no Kap has the right to kneel, which nobody is even questioning. just my observation.

[Bang]

So, if he doesn't do what i think he should do, then his thoughts are invalid.

gotta love America...  where you're only free enough to do what others expect of you, or somehow it's invalid.

As far as yelling O!..  i do it in Camden Yards. i wouldn't do it elsewhere,, it's an Orioles thing, not a Redskins thing. (IU might do it in an opposing baseball stadium if the O's were playing..  but it's strictly an Orioles thing.)
And in so far as people finding it disrespectful when we do it in Camden Yards,, well, the fans in Camden yards are a short distance from those ramparts where it was written.

The bombs bursting in air were right over where our heads currently are as the song plays. If not for a few obstructing buildings, we can see where that Star Spangled banner yet waved.

we don't change the song,, we emphasize a word. (Not like "home of the... CHIEFS!".. which i never hear anyone complain about.)

If that offends someone at an Orioles game,, i don't care. Sack up and quit being such a ninny. 
And like i said,, to me, that is the only place it is excusable anyway.

~Bang

Edited September 13, 2016 by Bang

[RonArtest15]

46 minutes ago, grego said:

artest-

theres no disagreement when it comes to miller- I haven't heard a single person try to argue that miller isn't a dirtbag for fighting a 70 year old. add to that, he was immediately cut from the team. justice served. case closed. nobody's talking about it cuz nobody disagrees.

the very fact that we're talking about Kap doesn't mean that hes a worse guy than miller. children starving in the Sudan or Ethiopia is a huge deal and a tragedy. because its not the subject du jour and we don't talk about it enough doesn't make it less important that Kap.

the narrative for while has been how protests are supposed to make people uncomfortable, to make us talk. its what they are designed to do, yet, now that we're talking, its 'why are we talking about this, when issue X gets no attention'.

I think that's a good question, matt

The narrative is that some folks are pushing the false equivalency of black-on-black crime to police brutality. 

To me, it's sad/pathetic that this is the retort to Kap's (and others) protest. 

[MattFancy]

1 hour ago, Bang said:

So, if he doesn't do what i think he should do, then his thoughts are invalid.

gotta love America...  where you're only free enough to do what others expect of you, or somehow it's invalid.

As far as yelling O!..  i do it in Camden Yards. i wouldn't do it elsewhere,, it's an Orioles thing, not a Redskins thing. (IU might do it in an opposing baseball stadium if the O's were playing..  but it's strictly an Orioles thing.)
And in so far as people finding it disrespectful when we do it in Camden Yards,, well, the fans in Camden yards are a short distance from those ramparts where it was written.

The bombs bursting in air were right over where our heads currently are as the song plays. If not for a few obstructing buildings, we can see where that Star Spangled banner yet waved.

we don't change the song,, we emphasize a word. (Not like "home of the... CHIEFS!".. which i never hear anyone complain about.)

If that offends someone at an Orioles game,, i don't care. Sack up and quit being such a ninny. 
And like i said,, to me, that is the only place it is excusable anyway.

~Bang

Your freedom of speech only applies when it coincides with what I believe in, got it?

As for the "O" during the Anthem, I agree. I only yell it at O's games. Seems silly to hear people yell it during a Redskins game.

It's just funny to me that people get so uptight over this. Kap gave a great response to Trent Dilfer's ignorant crap last night. Dilfer basically said that Kap should be quiet because he's a backup QB and they're job is to be quiet. To which Kap responded perfectly:

“I just heard briefly about it. But I think that’s one of the most ridiculous comments I’ve heard. The fact that you say, ‘You’re a back-up quarterback, stay in your place’… that’s an issue. To me, you’re telling me that my position as a back-up quarterback and being quiet is more important than peoples’ lives. I would ask him to really have a conversation with the families of people that have been murdered and see if he still feels that way. Because I’d bet you he doesn’t. Just because he hasn’t experienced that type of oppression.”

Edited September 13, 2016 by MattFancy

[Bang]

Completely agree.. this notion that a person's station in life should direct their social conscience reeks.

I guess we should just take away the vote for people making under ..oh,, let's say 225,000 per year.

Phhh what the hell.   White landowners only.

 

~Bang

 

Edited September 13, 2016 by Bang

[Bozo the kKklown]

17 hours ago, BornaSkinsFan83 said:

It's amazing how quickly we went from celebrating Muhammed Ali to screaming about Colin Kaepernick.

I wish.

A lot of people in this thread and across the country only liked Ali because he couldn't talk anymore, and they were told to like him. If he still was able to talk and spoke out about injustice, a lot of people would dislike him still.

[Why am I Mr. Pink?]

10 minutes ago, BenningRoadSkin said:

I wish.

A lot of people in this thread and across the country only liked Ali because he couldn't talk anymore, and they were told to like him. If he still was able to talk and spoke out about injustice, a lot of people would dislike him still.

A lot of people or just the loud small percent of extremes? Sometimes I think people think those loud small percent of ppl at the polar end of the spectrum speak for an entire group of not so loud ppl in the middle. Not referring to you Benning, i like your posts and read what you say. I try not to allow the loud minority (liberal or conservative) to brand and speak for the less loud middle. 

[Bozo the kKklown]

24 minutes ago, Why am I Mr. Pink? said:

A lot of people or just the loud small percent of extremes? Sometimes I think people think those loud small percent of ppl at the polar end of the spectrum speak for an entire group of not so loud ppl in the middle. Not referring to you Benning, i like your posts and read what you say. I try not to allow the loud minority (liberal or conservative) to brand and speak for the less loud middle. 

those who don't think its the right time to protest, which coincidentally happens to be every time there is a protest.

[RonArtest15]

I never really thought of it, but it was a good point that I think Bang brought up about yelling "O" during the anthem (Orioles), or "RED" during Caps games.  That's disrespecting the song/flag, right?  Are there different layers to this, or am I missing something? 

Edited September 13, 2016 by RonArtest15

[KingGibbs]

On 8/29/2016 at 5:16 PM, mcsluggo said:

Plenty of prominent black athletes oppose Kaepernick's protest. I guess that makes them Uncle Tom's?

Ignore the mcsluggo quote bar. This is my quote. site upgrade won't allow me to delete it.

 

 

Edited September 13, 2016 by KingGibbs

[Gamebreaker]

7 minutes ago, KingGibbs said:

Plenty of prominent black athletes oppose Kaepernick's protest. I guess that makes them Uncle Tom's?

No, it doesn't. May I ask why would you ask such a ridiculous question? 

[The Evil Genius]

1 minute ago, Gamebreaker said:

No, it doesn't. May I ask why would you ask such a ridiculous question? 

I suspect it's because we know all them folk think alike.

I mean..they can't possibly think independently, can they? 

 

[KingGibbs]

Just now, Gamebreaker said:

No, it doesn't. May I ask why would you ask such a ridiculous question? 

It's a ridiculous question? Alrighty then.

Because too many people assume that whitey is automatically a racist when disagreeing with a black man's view.

[Gamebreaker]

Just now, The Evil Genius said:

I suspect it's because we know all them folk think alike.

I mean..they can't possibly think independently, can they? 

 

Independent thought? Them? Laughable. 

2 minutes ago, KingGibbs said:

It's a ridiculous question? Alrighty then.

Because too many people assume that whitey is automatically a racist when disagreeing with a black man's view.

This is called hyperbole. 

[KingGibbs]

So you think it's exaggerated, huh? I don't. So I guess we'll agree to disagree. Hey?! We're making progress.

[The Evil Genius]

I think the problem to me is..when people (especially my fellow porcelain skinned folk) questioned Kap's actions and he gave the response he did (that he was doing it to protest police brutality and bring attention to the killings/social justice causes that he's been talking about for months on social media) - many did not take him at his word and tried to diminish his actions by questioning his importance/intelligence/actions/richness/etc.  edit..Granted his attire choices immediately after didn't help

 

When instead - perhaps they should have spoken more on why Kap was doing what he was doing.  

 

Edited September 13, 2016 by The Evil Genius

[KingGibbs]

That's okay Evil. The majority of the athletes no matter their ethnic background respect the flag because they want to respect the men and women of our military. That's where my issue lies with Kaepernick's protest. His message will fall on deaf ears for that reason alone. You and I don't agree and that will never change.

 

[twa]

12 minutes ago, The Evil Genius said:

 

When instead - perhaps they should have spoken more on why Kap was doing what he was doing.  

 

 

I thought I did....he wants out of his contract/SF.

he is not fond of sitting during games, just before them.

[The Evil Genius]

Just now, KingGibbs said:

That's okay Evil. The majority of the athletes no matter their ethnic background respect the flag because they want to respect the men and women of our military. That's where my issue lies with Kaepernick's protest. His message will fall on deaf ears for that reason alone. You and I don't agree and that will never change.

 

 

I think it has nothing to do with (and Kap has said that repeatedly) not respecting the military. I'd safely bet 99.99% of us stand because that's what we are taught to do. It's socially acceptable and we rarely think of the military during the anthem.

Either way - Kap has been quite successful in getting the ball rolling. It's entered into public discussion. It's made us question the norms and find out more about what he (and now others) are questioning through their actions. 

 

And the reality is - none of it (their actions) harms anyone.

Peaceful protest is awesome.

 

[KingGibbs]

Are you serious Evil? We don't think about the military during the Anthem? What a dumbass statement. 

The Honor guard is on the field holding the flag DURING the Anthem. Military personnel SING the Anthem. There are flyovers just as the Anthem ends. The public announcer says "Please rise as we honor the men and women of our armed forces" before the Anthem begins.

Again. Stupid statement on your part.

Edited September 13, 2016 by KingGibbs

[Springfield]

TBH, the military isn't even the first thing I think of when you mention the flag or the anthem.

[KingGibbs]

4 minutes ago, Springfield said:

TBH, the military isn't even the first thing I think of when you mention the flag or the anthem.

That's fine, but for many it is.