inmate running the asylum Posted November 15, 2003 Share Posted November 15, 2003 How about this idea to upgrade our DL and our entire defense in 2004? Both Jevon Kearse and Champ Bailery figure to franchised next year. So we trade a #1 and #3 draft pick for Champ and give up a #1 and #3 pick for Jevon Kearse. We use our new #1 pick to draft the best DT in the draft. We use our #2 pick to replace Champ or sign one of the many free agent CB's available in 2004. With an improved pass rush, we will probably have improved secondary play even without Champ Bailey, who has only 1 INT anyway. Now our new defensive line in 2004 looks like this: RDE - Jevon Kearse - RDT - Our #1 draft pick and Lional Dalton LDT - Darrell Russell - resigned LDE - Renaldo Wynn and Regan Upshaw Or we also move Renaldo Wynn inside to DT and use the #1 pick on another DE to play on the left side. I would rather have Kearse than Champ and think we would improve our overall defense with a better pass rush, rather than keeping Champ and using the #1 pick on a risky rookie DE who may not pan out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted November 15, 2003 Author Share Posted November 15, 2003 Titans to Say Adios to Kearse & George in 2004? -- from FFMastermind.com ESPN's Len Paquarelli reports one 2004 free agent getting a lot of attention right now is Tennessee Titans DE Jevon Kearse, who seems fully recovered from the foot injury that limited him in 2002. The Titans have suggested they won't allow Kearse to escape and that is probably the case. But a few personnel directors feel Tennessee is so cap-strapped for 2004 that it might not be able to afford Kearse's demands. There is also talk that, given his lofty cap number for '04, RB Eddie George won't be back with the Titans unless he takes a paycut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shawn Posted November 15, 2003 Share Posted November 15, 2003 that is to assume anyone is willing to give up a #1 and #3 for Champ? if he is that valuable then why are the skins trading him. I doubt if the skins franchise baily wnyone would make him an offer. that is to also assume that the skins would franchise baily, which means top 5 money for a year to baily. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yank Posted November 15, 2003 Share Posted November 15, 2003 Franchising Champ seems to be the most likely scenario at this point . Losing one of our few Pro Bowl draft picks for $ will be poison PR for this free-agent-happy FO ... He aint exactly earning that dough this year though Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted November 15, 2003 Author Share Posted November 15, 2003 The Skins may not have any choice but to trade Champ, if he is going to insist on a signing bonus of near $20 million. The Skins are entitled to two #1 picks if they franchise Champ -- although I doubt they can get that -- so a #1 and #3 would be easier for another team to swallow. Atlanta reportedly might be interested in Champ. The Titans are under a lot of cap pressure too, so I'm not sure they can sign Kearse to a big contract. The Skins can probably give Kearse the signing bonus he wants -- less than what Champ is asking for -- PROVIDED they don't spend the money on Champ. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bishtw Posted November 15, 2003 Share Posted November 15, 2003 How much exactly is they top 5 avg CB salary going to be and what is the differance in that and what we offered Champ? Wasn't it the bonus amout he had the big problem with? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSF Posted November 15, 2003 Share Posted November 15, 2003 I might be in favor if that plan if Kearse could stay healthy. I do think that Champ is going to be somewhere else in '04. If we could get a first and third for him, we'd have a lot of picks in the first 3 rounds to use on Dline and maybe a CB in the second. For the same money we would spend on Kearse, we could pick up a solid vet at corner and DE/DT. :2cents: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montilar Posted November 16, 2003 Share Posted November 16, 2003 As a GM, why would you trade multiple picks for Champ when there are other good CB's potentially on the market? Say you can get Taylor for free (other than salary), wouldn't you take Taylor and keep your draft picks? This is a very rare CB heavy free agent market... Unless many get franchised, I'd expect the unfranchised cb's to get all the attention in the beginning. Why give up picks when you can get someone almost as good for free? Then, after the market price has been set and the free agents are dissapearing, someone one might nibble at a franchised Champ. If anyone still has the money... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skinsfanjoe Posted November 16, 2003 Share Posted November 16, 2003 I'd like to see us resign Russell, draft Will Smith or another stud DE in the first round, draft another DT or DE in the second, draft a CB or Safety in the third, draft a linebacker/ fullback/another DL in the later rounds. Release Wynn or make him take a pay cut, same with Trotter (Mitchell isn't that bad) and cut two or three of the bums that we have right now. (Haley,Holsey,Chase,B.Smith,or Upshaw) take your pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mania Posted November 16, 2003 Share Posted November 16, 2003 That is absolutley absurd. We have offered around 14 million and he wants 18 million. Hopefully we can get him for a 16 million signing bonus and lock him in for 7 to 8 years, lessoning the impact on the cap. Getting rid of him is not an option. Not many teams have a shutdown corner like him. He only has 1 interception because teams don't test him much. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thinker Posted November 16, 2003 Share Posted November 16, 2003 I think franchising Bailey in 2004 would cost us over $6 million in cap space - which they have budgeted for. That really restricts what else the Skins could do in the offseason though. A long term contract is only going to count about $3 million in 2004 (assuming $18 million bonus - seven years and $500k salary in the first year) But that would not allow us to resign Russell at DT -- Who is either going to want a lot more $$ or isn't worth having anyway. Also Dalton is scheduled to make $1.6 million in 2004 - hardly worth it - same for Wynn at about $2 million for 2004. I think there are going to be wholesale changes on the line again next year with possibly only Haley and Chase a lock to come back. Zellner has played well but he'll be an UFA. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted November 16, 2003 Author Share Posted November 16, 2003 Skinsfanmania, Champ Bailey is a top cornerback, no doubt. But shutdown cornerback in the old Deion Sanders mold....... no way. The last two seasons, some WR's like the NY Giants, Omani Toomer has had him for lunch. In addition, Champ just doesn't make enough BIG PLAYS (INT's, etc.) that turn a game around, for a guy who wants an $18-20 Mil signing bonus. I would rather see us obtain a proven pass rusher instead AND sign say another CB like Bobby Taylor who Philly is letting go, for a lot less money. Two good players for one makes better sense to me. When the Skins formerly had Dexter Manley and Charles Mann playing DE, we didn't have the greatest CB's or secondaries in the world, but Joe Gibbs won 3 Super Bowls. IMHO if you have an outstanding pass rush, you can still excell with an average secondary. But if you have a lousy pass rush and the QB has all the time in the world to throw, even Deion Sanders and Champ Bailey can't cover a WR forever. Montilar, When I say trade Champ, let me explain further. I assume Champ is now going to be franchised, which would tie up $6 Mil in 2004 salary unless he is resigned. If $6 Mil is tied up, that almost precludes us from going after other top free agents. And I also assume that the Redskins are not going to let him sign with another team and get nothing in return. Therefore, if the Skins are not willing to give him what he wants, they only have two options. 1 - Pay him his franchised salary of say $6 Mil for 2004, which is not a good option because it ties up a lot of the teams alotted salary. 2 - Allow him to sign with another team and NOT MATCH the other team's contract. Although the Skins are entitled to two #1 picks, that price is so steep that most teams are unwilling to make it. Therefore a team like Atlanta might agree with the Skins beforehand to give us a #1 and #3 pick, and in return the Skins agree to not bid for Champ's services and drive up the cost. Teams do this all the time, which is the "arrangement" that Buffalo made, in allowing WR Peerless Price to sign in Atlanta. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lucky*13 Posted November 16, 2003 Share Posted November 16, 2003 Yes, but if we had any kind of pass rush champ would have many ints,he is still the best corner in the league. No one can stick with an nfl wr for as long as champ usually has to............. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
inmate running the asylum Posted November 16, 2003 Author Share Posted November 16, 2003 Beer Belly, Yeah, but thats the whole point. If we give Champ $18-20 Mil in 2004, we aint gonna have no pass rush. :laugh: It will be the same situation we have today. Look at all the DL that were drafted this year in an exceptional draft, and how many of these rookies are proving to be a terror at rushing the QB this year? There are exceptions, but it usually takes 2-3 years for a rookie to develop into a top pass rusher. Looking at the 2004 draft, I don't see any rookie DE's that are proven pass rushers. And even if there were one or two, we will probably draft so low, that we won't be able to get them. Even Dexter Manley and Charles Mann were not top pass rushers until about 3 years after they were drafted. If you don't believe me, ask Bulldog......... the final authority at Extremeskins. :laugh: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aREDSKIN Posted November 16, 2003 Share Posted November 16, 2003 Champ has not "proven", to me at least, that he can "cover" any reciever in this league. His play , I think, demonstrates that he wants out of DC. We will franchise him and get what we can given all of the situational specifics alluded to above. As for Wynn, I'm not sure why he's here or even why anyone would want him here next year. Unless we cannot afford to let him go because of the cap I say the faster we replace him the better. Not a peep from him and given his contract we have too many of those. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Symbol Posted November 16, 2003 Share Posted November 16, 2003 I say no on Kearse, simply because he will cost too much. I say we franchise Champ if we can't resign him, which looks like we can't. If we lose him, then we take our extra #1 pick this year and our #1 pick and pick up a stud rookie defensive lineman, with our other 1st, if we lose Champ, we pick up the best corner to replace Champ. In the second round, we pick up the other side of the defensive line, if we picked up a DE in the first, we pick up a DT in the second and vice versa. We have to keep Russell also. In the 3rd + rounds, we can always pick up depth and position players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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