The immigration thread: American Melting Pot or Get off my Lawn

[Larry]

56 minutes ago, The Evil Genius said:

Personally, I wish some people would stop referring to others as illegal. 

.. merely because the trait that defines them is them knowingly doing something illegal. 

[CousinsCowgirl84]

30 minutes ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

I don't entirely disagree with that.  It's fun to point out hypocrisy but it often doesn't really help with anything and it's above all else, a pretty lazy way to make an argument.

What argument do you think I am making?

[Califan007 The Constipated]

44 minutes ago, Larry said:

.. merely because the trait that defines them is them knowingly doing something illegal. 

Why should that be the trait that defines them?

[China]

1 hour ago, China said:

 

 

Gavin Newsom jumping in on this as well:

 

 

[TheGreatBuzz]

1 hour ago, tshile said:

it’s fun for me to discuss the strategy, impact, law, etc. and like I said early I enjoy a good “**** you” move as much as anyone. But - these are people and I hate that aspect of it.

 

This is pretty much where I'm at.

[Renegade7]

1 hour ago, China said:

 

 

Only a matter of time until it was pointed out specific law they were breaking.

 

Ball is in DoJ court to make an example out of them, those two governors were essentially bragging about breaking the law, there's no way to wiggle out of that one if DoJ comes after them.

[tshile]

20 minutes ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

Why should that be the trait that defines them?

Because it’s the one that separates them from everyone else. 
 

And until people actually adhere to this idea across the board, and don’t just demand it when it’s used about a group they support, spare me the dehumanizing argument. We’re a society that gets by with labels. It’s lazy. That’s why we do it

 

It’s no less lazy when you use it on other groups - which I’m sure you do, because basically everyone does. 

[TheGreatBuzz]

17 minutes ago, Renegade7 said:

 

Only a matter of time until it was pointed out specific law they were breaking.

 

Ball is in DoJ court to make an example out of them, those two governors were essentially bragging about breaking the law, there's no way to wiggle out of that one if DoJ comes after them.

 

Is the DoJ brave enough to go put cuffs on those two?  Doubt it.

[TradeTheBeal!]

11 minutes ago, The Almighty Buzz said:

 

Is the DoJ brave enough to go put cuffs on those two?  Doubt it.

Laws are for brown people.

[tshile]

15 minutes ago, The Almighty Buzz said:

 

Is the DoJ brave enough to go put cuffs on those two?  Doubt it.

Cuffs? No

 

but they could go after the state for civil rights violations or whatever and seek monetary damages

 

 

[Renegade7]

21 minutes ago, The Almighty Buzz said:

 

Is the DoJ brave enough to go put cuffs on those two?  Doubt it.

 

If they don't indict Trump for possession of those Top Secret docs at Mar-la-go, that's your answer...

[LD0506]

[The Evil Genius]

3 hours ago, Larry said:

.. merely because the trait that defines them is them knowingly doing something illegal. 

 

Because people are not illegal. 

[Larry]

3 hours ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

Why should that be the trait that defines them?

For the same reason that the trait that defines Cowboy fans is being a Cowboy fan?  

[Larry]

1 hour ago, The Evil Genius said:

 

Because people are not illegal. 

And not one person has said that they are.

[The Evil Genius]

1 minute ago, Larry said:

And not one person has said that they are.

 

Who exactly do you think you are arguing with?

[Larry]

https://www.miamiherald.com/news/state/florida/article265882236.html

 

 

 

Quote

 

Even before its role in shipping a planeload of migrants to Martha’s Vineyard with scant advance notice, Florida had been steadily chipping away at the state’s role in sheltering and caring for migrants, especially children. Last winter, the administration of Gov. Ron DeSantis formally notified the federal government that the state would no longer participate in a federal program that paid states to house kids called “unaccompanied alien children’‘ until “significant changes” were made in federal immigration policies.
 

Such children enter the country without their parents; often, they are later sent to live with relatives in the U.S.

 

The announcement followed DeSantis’ signing of an executive order in December that instructed the Department of Children & Families not to renew the licenses of “any family foster home, residential child-caring agency or child placing agency” that housed or offered services to undocumented children

 

 

 

Really think the GOP needs to change their icon to an asshole. (Although a swastika fits, too.)

 

 

5 minutes ago, The Evil Genius said:

 

Who exactly do you think you are arguing with?

The person I quoted?  
 

We gonna argue the meaning of the word "person" now?  

Edited September 16, 2022 by Larry

[The Evil Genius]

Sorry, I don't play your stupid semantics game. Try harder. 

[CousinsCowgirl84]

28 minutes ago, The Evil Genius said:

 

Who exactly do you think you are arguing with?

Your take is a little dumb honestly. They are breaking the law. They are immigrating illegally. You can say you don’t think it should be illegal, that’s fine, but it’s irrelevant. They are still illegally immigrating. 
 

You want to conflate  the descriptive phrase “illegal immigrant” with a slur like “midget” for example but they aren’t the same.

Edited September 16, 2022 by CousinsCowgirl84

[TheGreatBuzz]

2 hours ago, The Evil Genius said:

 

Because people are not illegal. 

 

The same reason we refer to people as "drunk drivers".  Because they have committed a crime with their actions and it is a simple way to define a group of people who have committed that particular illegal act?

[Califan007 The Constipated]

4 hours ago, tshile said:

Because it’s the one that separates them from everyone else. 
 

And until people actually adhere to this idea across the board, and don’t just demand it when it’s used about a group they support, spare me the dehumanizing argument. We’re a society that gets by with labels. It’s lazy. That’s why we do it

 

It’s no less lazy when you use it on other groups - which I’m sure you do, because basically everyone does. 

 

So "undocumented" won't do?

[Larry]

2 hours ago, The Evil Genius said:

 

Because people are not illegal. 

 

56 minutes ago, The Evil Genius said:

Sorry, I don't play your stupid semantics game. Try harder. 

"Don't play it"?  You initiated it. 
 

Own it. 

[Califan007 The Constipated]

3 minutes ago, The Almighty Buzz said:

 

The same reason we refer to people as "drunk drivers".  Because they have committed a crime with their actions and it is a simple way to define a group of people who have committed that particular illegal act?

 

For the most part, we don't actually label people "drunk drivers"...we label the act as "drunk driving" or say they were arrested for DUI. I was (wrongfuly) arrested for drunk driving once...they were putting me in a room with several other people who could barely hold their heads up. I looked at the officer and said "Were they all arrested for drunk driving?" What I--nor the police--did not say was "Are they all drunk drivers?"

[Larry]

3 minutes ago, Califan007 The Constipated said:

 

So "undocumented" won't do?

No. It won't. Because it's not accurate. 
 

These aren't people who are here legally, they just left the house without their photo ID. (At least, the people I'm talking about aren't. Yes, I am sure that there are people who do fit that description.)

[Califan007 The Constipated]

1 hour ago, Larry said:

For the same reason that the trait that defines Cowboy fans is being a Cowboy fan?  

 

So "undocumented" won't do? Seems to be more accurate when labeling a person instead of the act.

 

 

Just now, Larry said:

No. It won't. Because it's not accurate. 
 

These aren't people who are here legally, they just left the house without their photo ID. (At least, the people I'm talking about aren't. Yes, I am sure that there are people who do fit that description.)

 

Fortunately "undocumented" does NOT mean "left home without their ID". Nobody who lives in this country is ever called "undocumented" because they left their purse at home. Never. Ever.