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US Soccer thread.


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30 minutes ago, Elessar78 said:

Nice big sample size for your anecdotal reason.

How many English players out of total play in the top ten teams of the ENGLISH premier league. How many Spaniards, Italians, Germans, Brazilians, Argentines, and French play for the top teams in their respective domestic league?

2

 

 

https://www.si.com/planet-futbol/2017/06/27/england-historic-penalty-kick-shootout-woes

 

As for who plays where I don't know, I was just answering your question on why England cant win a major cup.  They did slump a bit in 2010 and 2014 but for years they played as good as anyone but somehow always found a way to lose in the big games.

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8 hours ago, FanboyOf91 said:

Small players develop all the time because their lower center of gravity allows them to pivot quicker and tighter than a taller defender can compensate. They are only 'rare' in America because our coaches have inherited the English obsession for pace, power, and size. If Pulisic had stayed in the United States, he would either be playing college soccer (career death) or wasting away on Philadelphia Union's reserve side in USL.

 

Same is true for basketball, football, and middle in-field positions in baseball.  Pulisic is where he was because:

1.  He comes from a soccer family and his parents likely taught him high level soccer and he grew up in a soccer culture.

2.  His family likes soccer enough that they were willing to re-locate to Europe to play soccer.  The dream of most parents with young kids is NOT to have their kid move to Europe as a teenager.

 

(Realistically, until very recently Pulisic did develop here and several of the MLS coaches are non-American and non-English.)

 

If IT came from a family that had a strong soccer background and not basketball and his family was willing to relocate to Europe, he'd be right there.  But that didn't happen.

 

US men's soccer has the same issue that US men's gymnastics has, and it isn't a coaching bias against short people.

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OK, about this soccer being a short man's game, there is this other non Brazilian country that has won a few world cups...and their players aren't typically the short guys.  Those German teams have enjoyed some success over the years.  How do you explain their success?

 

The beautiful game of Brazil and the orange men is not the only route to winning.  Granted, I am a bit biased as a 6'4" guy who played soccer for 20 years. There is something to be said for being precise and using body positioning akin to boxing out in basketball to make up for our higher center of gravity. I always found it helpful on the defensive side to have the long stride to catch up during the time it takes to swing a kick for a cross or a shot.  

 

I think the problem comes with not having enough skill to properly exploit the advantages we have and often trying too hard to play to a style we wished fit us better than identifying one that actually fits us.  After that, we have to be flexible enough to not become overly reliant upon any single way to play so as to be able to exploit comparative advantages.  The last is a point where I think we, like most,have often failed.    

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3 hours ago, gbear said:

OK, about this soccer being a short man's game, there is this other non Brazilian country that has won a few world cups...and their players aren't typically the short guys.  Those German teams have enjoyed some success over the years.  How do you explain their success?

 

The beautiful game of Brazil and the orange men is not the only route to winning.  Granted, I am a bit biased as a 6'4" guy who played soccer for 20 years. There is something to be said for being precise and using body positioning akin to boxing out in basketball to make up for our higher center of gravity. I always found it helpful on the defensive side to have the long stride to catch up during the time it takes to swing a kick for a cross or a shot.  

 

I think the problem comes with not having enough skill to properly exploit the advantages we have and often trying too hard to play to a style we wished fit us better than identifying one that actually fits us.  After that, we have to be flexible enough to not become overly reliant upon any single way to play so as to be able to exploit comparative advantages.  The last is a point where I think we, like most,have often failed.    

 

Just to add on, in my experience, that most coaching at the youth level favors quicker players where they don't spend much time on using your body to control and shield defenders in either soccer or basketball.  From the start, it is face forward like you are squared up to the defender and try and go by the defender by changing directions (and I've seen multiple trainer programs come through and coach kids).  The one year my daughter played basketball, I sat her down and showed her some some videos of Magic using his body to shield the ball, while dribbling against smaller players.

 

For young kids, they recently went to an even smaller soccer field, which even more favors the quicker player.

 

And I've yet to see a soccer trainer yet that talks about if you have a quicker defender on you how to actually use their quickness against them.

 

(The larger fact is the average Brazilian male is about 2 inches shorter than the average American and so obviously the average American soccer player is going to be taller than the average Brazilian soccer player and that's true for most of S. America so if soccer is particularly a short person's game we are going to be at a disadvantage.  Though I don't really believe that.  It is just even for shorter US male athletes other sports have had more of a draw so even the best short US athletes even end up in other sports.  The reason that US men's gymnastics struggles is not because of a lack of short athletic Americans.  It is because even the very best short US Americans make it in other sports where there is more of a financial upside in the US.)

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Maybe it was because I had a Brit for a soccer coach in high school, but the practice of shielding was stressed, especially for those players in the center of the field.  We were taught to look for the square passes and how to complete the one touch passes with men on our back.  It was taught right along with the value of making a  run to create space behind you as a defender makes the run with you.  Having a player with size show for the ball with a defender on his back is still a safety valve. for a player under pressure.

 

I always appreciated this role because I played basketball too.  I am frequently surprised at how rare these touch plays are in the U.S., but they are taught on some squads.  In general as a country though, our one touch passing is poor, so the ability to use the big pivot player is far less than it could be.

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  • 2 weeks later...

Big Sam remains interested

 



Allardyce, 63, who has since been linked with the Everton job, has now said he would be keen on a return to international management, although he said any discussions will have to wait until after the new U.S. Soccer Federation president is elected in February. 

 

"Yes, I would go I think, but I think there's a president elect in January [sic] which has stalled the process, so if I got the opportunity to speak to the U.S. then I would look forward to that," he told talkSPORT.

 

Allardyce, whose brief stint as England boss ended in September 2016, is currently out of work after deciding to leave Crystal Palace in the summer.

Asked if his wife would be happy to relocate to America, Allardyce said: "Why wouldn't you want to live in the States, man?

 

"International football is totally different from Premier League football. It's 10 games a year and there's a huge amount of downtime for yourself to go and watch the players and all that, but it's not the same day-to-day pressures you get in the Premier League."

You all know I want my boy DAVID WAGNER as US MNT coach but Big Sam will be like a temp hire to hold the fort until Wagner is experienced enough to take over. 

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Encouraging to see how some of these young players play. I really don't want to see guys like Michael Bradley, Altidore, etc back starting on the national team. Whats the point? Seeing how these young guys played yesterday really highlighted the lack of effort, desire, drive that these guys have had. I would much rather roll with all of these guys and see what happens then the same tired group of players that couldn't qualify out of CONCACAF.

 

In the end its probably a blessing we didnt make it so that these changes are forced through. We have needed an influx of talent for awhile but we have been stuck on these senior players. We have needed to give a chance to a young goalkeeper for at least 5 years but we keep sticking with Howard, Guzan, and MIND BLOWINGLY Nick Rimando. Why have we been wasting a spot all of these years on him and not giving Hamid, Horvath, etc more experience. Give the 3rd GK spot to a guy like Rimando is such a waste of space and opportunity.

 

Moving forward I want to see a midfield with Pulisic, McKinnie, maybe Acosta, Tyler Adams, etc. Whats the point of sending Michael Bradley out there to walk around, slow the game up, lose the ball, pass it back, etc? Lets see what we have, give them experience, let them grow together. We would be much better off in a couple of years for WCQ doing that then trotting out these old guys. They have already shown their lack of drive, effort, skill, desire. As fans we have seen this coming for awhile, we have seen this coming. Lets be done with it, blow it up and move on. We have to make changes, at least make this failure be useful and revamp not only US Soccer as an organization but the players as well.

 

Yedlin, Miazga, Brooks in the back from here on it. Not sure about LB to be honest.

 

Fill the midfield with Pulisic, McKinnie, Adams, Acosta, Gooch, Fabian, Hyndman, Saief, and Arriola.

 

Forwards keep Wood, start giving time to Sargent, Weah, etc. They will be hitting 20, 21 for next WCQ cycle, lets start integrating them.

 

Not all of these guys are good enough, will be good enough, at least right now. But they are young, driven, have more skills. Lets at least see where they are and what they can provide.

 

Im excited about the back end, I really like what Yedlin is becoming, Brooks I think is great, and Miazga I think can be right there. Blows my mind that Gonzo and Besler have been getting time over him this last year or so. Those 3 can be manning the back line for a long time. And can we please play the same back line rather than constantly change it? These guys need to know each other and have chemistry.

 

I am excited about the talented kids we have in the midfield. With Sargent and Weah at this point its hoping that they can continue to develop and be players for us. Them already being over in Europe will be a big help and is a good sign.

 

 

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1 hour ago, MisterPinstripe said:

Encouraging to see how some of these young players play.

Very encouraging result yesterday against the #3 team in the world rankings, and reigning Euro champs. Yeah, Ronaldo and a couple others didn't play, but there were plenty there that will be in Russia for Portugal. Quite encouraging for those of us who've been clamoring for these youngsters to get some Caps.

 

Miazga was a monster. He, Brooks, Carter-Vickers, and Palmer-Brown look like the makings of a solid CB group. Yedlin is progressing nicely, though he didn't have a good showing yesterday. LB continues to be a problem, but, hopefully, they can find someone to develop there. MP named a lot of good young talent, and there's still Morris, Zelalem, Green, Wright, De la Torre, Perez, and others playing in Europe and the MLS to draw from.

 

I think the Pulisic article is spot on. Talent is not the problem. Developing that talent during the critical 15-19 year old age is the problem. Europe has better academies to develop that talent than here in the states. The US needs to up their academy structure, and allow kids to go to Europe early if they can/want to in order to develop until the US gets their academies right.

 

 

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53 minutes ago, Elessar78 said:

But but, everything is so wrong with US Soccer development. There is no way these guys could've come through this busted, mangled talent pipeline. 

The issue with development in US Soccer isnt so much that. The issue is pay to play which keeps us from finding a lot of young talent. The issue is MLS clubs not playing young players. The issue is the college system where players barely play. 16-18 is a very important time for development and its where we fall behind the rest of the world. College is horrible for developing players and I think players who want to become professionals should skip college. Soccer development doesnt work like the rest of our sports do and people are too caught up in "you must get a degree". Doesnt work for everyone and if your goal is to be a professional soccer player its a hindrance to that.

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