US Soccer thread.

[btfoom]

You never did have any patience! 

 

16 days. Friday July 8. Over the water at Tranmere. Everything will be back to normal then. Hang in there kid. 

 

Hail. 

 

Exactly, that is the day Pool go for a 7th place finish.

 

What is that I hear, oh yeah, it's GHH and DC9 weekday evenings are WELL open, for the entire year (well, they may make another run at the 3rd tier 'cup').  enjoy fellas, Europe doesn't miss ya!!!!

[MisterPinstripe]

Bradley and Wondo had some gorgeous passes to setup a few Argentinian chances. Wish they could make passes like that for us.

Also, apparently Wondo actually has a worse touch than Zardes.

[Destino]

Other than Wondo, who should never be allowed to wear a national team uniform again let alone actually play, I'm proud of what these guys have done so far in this tourny.  We're hosts and unlike the Euro Cup the biggest issues here were mistaken national anthems.  No violence and plenty good futbol that all could enjoy. 

 

I'd love to see the US in Copa America regularly.  If the team wants to get better, it makes sense to regularly play better competition in games that count.  Plus I think it would grow the sport in the US to have a major tournament yearly.  This loss doesn't change the fact that the US had a great result and a chance to finish third, which is better than the odds makers predicted.

 

Argentina is ranked #1 for a reason and Messi was firing on all cylinders tonight.  We've all seen how great teams can make good ones look bad in many different sports.  Tough break for us. 

 

Could be worse though, Mexico fans are still working out how to appease the gods that forsook them.  I bought a case of 7up (diet, admittedly) that I'm still working through to celebrate that wonderful result.     

[DC9]

Other than Wondo, who should never be allowed to wear a national team uniform again let alone actually play, I'm proud of what these guys have done so far in this tourny.  We're hosts and unlike the Euro Cup the biggest issues here were mistaken national anthems.  No violence and plenty good futbol that all could enjoy. 

 

I'd love to see the US in Copa America regularly.  If the team wants to get better, it makes sense to regularly play better competition in games that count.  Plus I think it would grow the sport in the US to have a major tournament yearly.  This loss doesn't change the fact that the US had a great result and a chance to finish third, which is better than the odds makers predicted.

 

Argentina is ranked #1 for a reason and Messi was firing on all cylinders tonight.  We've all seen how great teams can make good ones look bad in many different sports.  Tough break for us. 

 

Could be worse though, Mexico fans are still working out how to appease the gods that forsook them.  I bought a case of 7up (diet, admittedly) that I'm still working through to celebrate that wonderful result.     

 

It's a really good tournament and Ecaudor was a quality win for us.  Especially given how the match played out... we normally bottle those at the end but we didn't.

 

The Argentina match was just too big for the players and you could tell in how they played, I think you mentioned we hadn't had a 3 pass move in the first half and for me that's just a sign that we weren't mentally there.  The players had time on the ball and they rushed everything.

 

Who shouldn't not be allowed to wear a US shirt again, imo?

 

- Wondo

- Bradley

- Beckerman

and I'd flirt with Zusi, but he could still offer a veteran presence in qualifiers and friendlies.  Not sure I want him as a regular. 

 

Guzan still has a place in the team but we need to get behind someone else to be the starter... whether that's Sean Johnson or Bill Hamid. 

 

We need to usher out this previous generation.

 

He wasn't in this tournament due to injury, but I'd also like to see us move on from Jozy Altidore and give more reps to Bobby Wood, Jordon Morris, and Juan Agudelo. 

 

Need to start distancing ourselves from Dempsey, but he still needs to be involved in the team - he just can't BE the team.

 

Also, there's a little know American named Brooks Lennon who is SHREDDING for the Liverpool U-21s.  I haven't seen hide nor hair of the kid in any of the big MNTs mentions.  Give him and players like him a shot.  He should be getting called up on the regular to see what he's got.  Start moving on from the generation that wasn't good enough.  Klinsmann basically forced Landon Donovan out of the game when he was still in decent form... time to do it with his team mates.

I'd also start putting Birnbaum in over Cameron, though Cameron has been a pretty good player throughout his time.  It's time to give Birnbaum his chance.  He came into a DC United team that was worst in MLS and instantly helped them win the regular season Eastern Conference.

[Kilmer17]

I want the US to play copa every year. Unfortunately unless they keep this format, we won't. Even if we are invited, it wouldn't count as an official Fifa match day for the US, so all of the euro clubs wouldn't be obligated to release our players.

So we'd see a bunch of mls or u23 guys. You know, more Wondo and Beckerman

[DC9]

I want the US to play copa every year. Unfortunately unless they keep this format, we won't. Even if we are invited, it wouldn't count as an official Fifa match day for the US, so all of the euro clubs wouldn't be obligated to release our players.

So we'd see a bunch of mls or u23 guys. You know, more Wondo and Beckerman

 

Good thing it's in the summer when there are no matches in Europe...

I still don't think we get invited to each one, nor should we.

[Major Harris]

The basic fundamentals that are lacking across the board are frightening.

I honestly thought you'd been slowly progressing the last few WC's but this just encapsulates CONCACAF and how third rate the whole region is. You're going backwards FAST!

Hail.

Well, at least we still dominate in the sports we created.

How is it to be average in everything?

Hail.

Edited June 22, 2016 by Major Harris

[DC9]

Exactly, that is the day Pool go for a 7th place finish.

 

What is that I hear, oh yeah, it's GHH and DC9 weekday evenings are WELL open, for the entire year (well, they may make another run at the 3rd tier 'cup').  enjoy fellas, Europe doesn't miss ya!!!!

 

If only we had 38 bye weeks a year...

Oh, and Christmas Vacation!!!

[Elessar78]

Right. But here's what is TOTALLY unacceptable. You're on home soil. In a major semi-final. You might not be anywhere near as technically gifted as Argentina. You might not be anywhere near as tactically savvy or experienced on this stage as Argentina. But there's NO excuse for Argentina being first to every ball all over the park. The very LEAST you should expect is to match them for heart and effort. 

 

I'm not seeing that through the US side. That IS unacceptable. It starts and ends with the coach of course but every last one of them needs to take a long hard look in the mirror half time. 

 

Hail. 

Why is that on the coach? I don't think I buy the idea that a professional must be explicitly told to take 2-3 steps toward a pass. 

 

I put that on the players. Conversely, I don't think Argie manager had to tell his players to jump the passing lanes. 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Well, at least we still dominate in the sports we created.

How is it to be average in everything?

Hail.

 

 

Naturally. There's only American's play them!

 

But to answer that I'd need to direct you to an Englishman .....

 

Hail. 

Edited June 22, 2016 by Gibbs Hog Heaven

[Elessar78]

 

 

We also had zero development in the states under Bradley.  That part of the program has grown at a ridiculous rate just in the last 3-4 years under Klinsmann.

 

 

Don't disagree with you there. But to be fair, JK, asked for that to be part of his purview. Bradley was head coach at a time when USSF felt that the senior team was disconnected from the talent pipeline—that the head coach didn't need to oversee all that. From my perspective, JK, has fingerprints on things like how the talent pipeline is managed now and coaching education. 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Why is that on the coach? I don't think I buy the idea that a professional must be explicitly told to take 2-3 steps toward a pass. 

 

I put that on the players. Conversely, I don't think Argie manager had to tell his players to jump the passing lanes. 

 

Rightly or wrongly the buck stops with him. He prepares them. Physically and tactically. He motivates them. If they're lacking in either, it falls firstly on him. But again, that's not to abdicate player responsibility. 

 

Hail. 

[Elessar78]

Well, at least we still dominate in the sports we created.

How is it to be average in everything?

Hail.

Made me think of a Ricky Bobby/Jean Girrard moment. Someone needs to train some gay French man to become a QB and hopefully start for the Dallas cowboys.

[ixcuincle]

The anger and rage over an overmatched us team losing to the best team in the world is hilarious. Especially when it fires up the fire Jurgen convo again.

That's a good team. Step off the ledge.

[DC9]

The anger and rage over an overmatched us team losing to the best team in the world is hilarious. Especially when it fires up the fire Jurgen convo again.

That's a good team. Step off the ledge.

 

I'm not sure you've ready anything in here before posting that, ix.

 

 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

The anger and rage over an overmatched us team losing to the best team in the world is hilarious. Especially when it fires up the fire Jurgen convo again.

That's a good team. Step off the ledge.

 

 

Argentina, trophy less as a Nation since 1993 (1986 when it comes to the major International prize) are the best team in the World by virtue of the FIFA rankings nobody gives ANY credibility to?

 

Stop laughing in Germany

 

Hail. 

Edited June 22, 2016 by Gibbs Hog Heaven

[Old Bay]

Argentina, trophy less as a Nation since 1993 (1986 when it comes to the major International prize) are the best team in the World by virtue of the FIFA rankings nobody gives ANY credibility too?

 

 

USA: 31 in FIFA standings, number 1 in our hearts.

[pjfootballer]

I feel like every four years, when the World Cup rolls around, people in the US think that soccer in this country "will take off" and this is when we become a "major power" in the world.  I feel like we've been saying this for over 30 years. 

 

Let's face it.  We as a nation, just do not put in enough resources when kids are young.  We don't train them from a young age, like we do other sports.  We have too many other sports played in this country, that kids have too many choices. We have a ton of academies for all different sports. Whereas most of the other countries in the world are all about soccer and have set up a system for that.

 

I have a 13 year old great nephew.  He was into tee ball/baseball since he was 5.  He's VERY good at baseball. Not saying he'll be a pro, but he's usually one of the best 3 players on his teams.  He then played tackle football for a couple of years in the pee wee leagues.  Then, when the last World Cup came around, he started getting enthralled with Messi and played soccer for a few years.  He was VERY good at soccer too.  OK at football. Well, this year, with no major soccer going on, he went back to baseball and picked right back up where he left off and still plays GREAT. 

 

I for one, think it's OK that we aren't dominant in soccer like we are other sports. It doesn't bother me as much as if we lost in other sports. I just want us to be able to compete in soccer and maybe pull off some upsets. We don't have to be the best in every sport in the world. We're a pretty dominant "sports" country as you see in both Olympics. Actually, if there was an area I'd love to see us improve on as far as being a world power, is education.  But that's for another thread.

 

Meh, we got to the Semi-finals, when all was pretty much lost after the Columbia opener.  I think we show pretty good most of the time for our skill level.  We're not terrible, but we're not great.  We're average.

 

I don't think I'll ever see the US win a World Cup in my lifetime.

[Elessar78]

It's like Butler and Gonzaga in the NCAA tourney. In any sport, in any one game, there is a chance the underdog will win. One real indicator is how many players you have playing on top NBA teams/Champions League teams. Duke gets beat. Kentucky gets beat. But they still probably put more into the NBA than whoever beat them. Heck we beat Mexico regularly now and their players are much better. 

 

It was a good showing to make it to the semis. we also had to play without our two best players, not saying we would've done differently, but it could've allowed us to do different things tactically. 

 

I think what frustrates people is that countries like Iceland with 21,000 registered players puts out better pros than our country with around 3,000,000 males playing the sport. They're doing something purposefully, we are not. Soccer is not their dominant sport either.

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

.....

 

I think what frustrates people is that countries like Iceland with 21,000 registered players puts out better pros than our country with around 3,000,000 males playing the sport. They're doing something purposefully, we are not. Soccer is not their dominant sport either.

 

 

What is? Out of interest. The only other thing I think of sports wise as regards Iceland is maybe powerlifting as they've had quite a few 'World's Strongest Man' winners. But that seem's too specialised. 

 

Hail. 

[Elessar78]

Archery? Team handball. Crossfit. Competitive svelt fishing. 

[Gibbs Hog Heaven]

Archery and handball? How interesting. Never of thought of those in Iceland.

Hail.

[Major Harris]

Naturally. There's only American's play them!

But to answer that I'd need to direct you to an Englishman .....

Hail.

Basketball is the 2nd global sport.

But i was mostly kidding.

Edited June 22, 2016 by Major Harris

[gbear]

Last night was a reminder to me of how much like every other sport soccer is.  Like the other sports, it's all about time and space.  What I saw last night was a U.S. team unable to get good, clean first touches on the ball which lead to pressure leading to bad passes.  Argentina by contrast were clinical in their passing, needing little extra time or space.  Not that it mattered much, but the U.S. was for the most part content to try and play with numbers between the ball and their goal without consistent pressure on the ball.

 

Outside of the Messi goal (a thing of beauty), I didn't see much from Argentina besides good to great basic fundamentals.  Their passes and traps were clean, and their players maintained spacing to allow for relief when/if the U.S. tried to pressure them.  The U.S. seemed to have decided against applying pressure in the offensive zone, perhaps because there was too much space for them to defend?  Sadly, we did not mark well enough in the defensive half to apply pressure on that end to force Argentina to give the ball up for counter attacks.

 

Argentina played a beautiful game.  Sometimes, you have to just tip your hat to the team that played better in every aspect of the game.

[Elessar78]

 

 

Outside of the Messi goal (a thing of beauty), I didn't see much from Argentina besides good to great basic fundamentals.  Their passes and traps were clean, and their players maintained spacing to allow for relief when/if the U.S. tried to pressure them.  The U.S. seemed to have decided against applying pressure in the offensive zone, perhaps because there was too much space for them to defend?  Sadly, we did not mark well enough in the defensive half to apply pressure on that end to force Argentina to give the ball up for counter attacks.

 

 

The main idea when defending (playing when the other team has the ball) is that your team spacing gets closer together. Left to right, front to back. If you think back, Argentina were playing balls sideline to sideline—about 70-75 yards (so they had players 70-75 yards from each other. In contrast when Argie had the ball, the US defending was about 44 yards wide from the furthest left to furthest right player. When you press in the "offensive zone" a) your front to back spacing or spacing between backline, midfield, forwards gets pulled apart and if it doesn't then you leave a lot of room behind your back line and your goal (allowing for more potential breakaways). 

 

And your point about fundamentals is spot on. Tactics gets the humans where they need to be when they need to be there. Fundamental skills allows you to execute what you need to do in that spot and situation. On attack our guys were where they needed to be about 75% of the time, but their skills and soccer IQ repeatedly let them down.