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Why is Kirk Cousins an Interception Machine?


RiverboatGambler

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Cooley today on his film watching made basically three recommendations for Cousins as to improvement, relating to INTS

 

1.  He said its clear that Cousins makes up him mind as for who his first read based on what he sees from the defense and locks in on that guy.  He said the defenses can see that and that has to stop.

 

2.  playing off of the above point, Cousins needs to scope the field better, mentioned in the last game a bunch of plays had players wide open for big plays and some cases touchdowns but Cousins didn't go there because he locked into his first read. 

 

3.  his balls float too much, not enough zip on them, giving CBs time to get in front of those passes

 

Cooley does think that Cousins is capable of fixing all of the above

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Cooley today on his film watching made basically three recommendations for Cousins as to improvement, relating to INTS

 

1.  He said its clear that Cousins makes up him mind as for who his first read based on what he sees from the defense and locks in on that guy.  He said the defenses can see that and that has to stop.

 

2.  playing off of the above point, Cousins needs to scope the field better, mentioned in the last game a bunch of plays had players wide open for big plays and some cases touchdowns but Cousins didn't go there because he locked into his first read. 

 

3.  his balls float too much, not enough zip on them, giving CBs time to get in front of those passes

 

Cooley does think that Cousins is capable of fixing all of the above

That's crazy, I have the same issue.

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Cooley today on his film watching made basically three recommendations for Cousins as to improvement, relating to INTS

 

1.  He said its clear that Cousins makes up him mind as for who his first read based on what he sees from the defense and locks in on that guy.  He said the defenses can see that and that has to stop.

 

2.  playing off of the above point, Cousins needs to scope the field better, mentioned in the last game a bunch of plays had players wide open for big plays and some cases touchdowns but Cousins didn't go there because he locked into his first read. 

 

3.  his balls float too much, not enough zip on them, giving CBs time to get in front of those passes

 

Cooley does think that Cousins is capable of fixing all of the above

He's been doing these things his entire college and pro career though.

We all laughed when the Broncos said they could fix Tebow's mechanics, QBs like Kirk are mostly finished products coming out of college. I don't forsee him learning to overcome his instincts/muscle memory and to look to other reads consistently, and I especially don't see him developing enough arm strength to make a real difference in how his passes get there.

 

 

Grant Paulson, "Peyton Manning was an INT machine too"

 

Ugh.

 

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What little credibility I still felt he had has evaporated in the past 24 hours. He's getting worse than Russell when he carries water for Haz.

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It obvious that certain folks turned the page on Robert already, so they need Kirk Cousins to be everything they think he is in order to be validated.  Every excuse they make for Kirk, you could say about the team when Robert was under center.

 

I used to enjoy listening to Grant Paulson but ever since he became the official mantel bearer for Kirk Cousins it has become pretty unbearable to listen to him.  Anything Kirk does wrong, Grant's immediate reaction is to point out a Top QB who "also did that stuff too" yet he ignores how many not elite QB's also did and didn't end up turning into a top QB.

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I am going to support Kirk, and Robert. Both are young QB's that are going to have bad games. The Giants played a completely different scheme, this impacts the way he reads the D completely, thus impacting his decision making. He will improve, he has shown flashes. He can get to multiple receiver reads, and releases the ball quickly. I would like to see more dump offs, or screens to open the field. As well as stick to our run game. As for Robert he has not shown the ability to scan the field for receivers in the pocket, and has not moved the ball. 2nd game they ran the read option to help him, can he do this long term and stay healthy? HTTR, may the best player for our team start!

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How exactly do you fix a noodle arm?

We get it. You don't like the guy. Noodle armed QB's can't make that bomb to DJax against Philly. Now you can say he turns it over too much, or he's got some Grossman in him, or he's hot and cold, but the guy does not have a weak arm.

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We get it. You don't like the guy. Noodle armed QB's can't make that bomb to DJax against Philly. Now you can say he turns it over too much, or he's got some Grossman in him, or he's hot and cold, but the guy does not have a weak arm.

 

Do you understand anything about football? Have you ever actually played football? You come off absolutely clueless. Anybody in the NFL can throw a ball 60 yards, that's not arm strength. Bombs float, anybody can do that. Arm strength comes into play on short / intermediate throws, on curls to the sideline for instance, that's when the ball sails on a lot of quarterbacks, that's when you throw those pick 6's if you don't have a laser and give the corner enough time to react. RG3 has a laser, Kaepernick has a laser. Cousins has a noodle arm. So does Andy Dalton. He throws the ball downfield a lot but that doesn't give him a big arm.

 

I like Cousins. I just don't think he's a starting QB in the NFL. He lacks arm strength, he can't scan the field, he locks on to receivers, he makes bad decisions all the time, he can't create plays, he struggles bigtime under pressure, he can't carry the offense like a franchise QB should. Just because I don't buy into the hype or didn't buy into the hype doesn't mean I don't like him or hate him. Off the field he seems like a down to earth, classy guy. He always says the right things. I like him off the field, I'd like him to stick around as a backup. But that's it. He's not a starter. Much less a franchise QB.

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Kirk doesn't have the physical tools to overcome the deficiencies in his game. I believe that RG3 does, which is why we were able to win with him in 2012. At full health, he was too much of a physical freak for defenses to overcome. Kirk is what he is; a B-level athlete that doesn't have the experience yet to overcome his shortcomings.

 

There have been QBs that were C-level athletes that became superstars. Just look at Brady: his combine numbers were horrendous, far worse than Kirk's. But he was an odd duck. If you watch him in college and early on with the Pats, his determination was incredible. That guy would have rather died than be second best and always found ways to win. I think we have that in Robert AND the physical tools, which is why he has a much higher ceiling than Kirk. Not that it matters if he's always hurt.

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Kirk doesn't have the physical tools to overcome the deficiencies in his game. I believe that RG3 does, which is why we were able to win with him in 2012. At full health, he was too much of a physical freak for defenses to overcome. Kirk is what he is; a B-level athlete that doesn't have the experience yet to overcome his shortcomings.

 

There have been QBs that were C-level athletes that became superstars. Just look at Brady: his combine numbers were horrendous, far worse than Kirk's. But he was an odd duck. If you watch him in college and early on with the Pats, his determination was incredible. That guy would have rather died than be second best and always found ways to win. I think we have that in Robert AND the physical tools, which is why he has a much higher ceiling than Kirk. Not that it matters if he's always hurt.

 

I don't think you're allowed to compare RG3 to Brady. Only Kirk.

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Confident young quarterbacks throw interceptions. I can't remember who i was listening to, somebody on the radio or TV last week.. might have been Brian Billick.. and he said that the problem and benefit of Kirk is that he thinks he can make every throw, he is so confident in himself that he KNOWS he can make every throw, and the fact is he can't, and he won't. he may eventually, but right now he can't. 

And like a lot of young QBs with huge confidence, it's confidence born of being able to be that good at the previous level. Right now defenses and defensive players are at a level he has not learned to master yet.

So there is one of two things that can happen going forward.

1. he will still believe he can make every throw and just get better at every throw and start putting balls in where they need to go, ala Peyton Manning (another "interception machine" in his first two years), or

2. He will realize his limitations and mold his game around them, so he cuts down on mistakes. the short side of that is he could possibly depress his development and limit his potential.

 

So realizing Kirk is going to throw INTs, the question is then, do we want him to learn from them in the manner of 1, which means more INTS and probably lost games while he becomes a quarterback that matches his own expectation, or 2, have him cut down on picks and perhaps become less of a QB then he could be.

 

~Bang

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Do you understand anything about football? Have you ever actually played football? You come off absolutely clueless. Anybody in the NFL can throw a ball 60 yards, that's not arm strength. Bombs float, anybody can do that. Arm strength comes into play on short / intermediate throws, on curls to the sideline for instance, that's when the ball sails on a lot of quarterbacks, that's when you throw those pick 6's if you don't have a laser and give the corner enough time to react. RG3 has a laser, Kaepernick has a laser. Cousins has a noodle arm. So does Andy Dalton. He throws the ball downfield a lot but that doesn't give him a big arm.

 

I like Cousins. I just don't think he's a starting QB in the NFL. He lacks arm strength, he can't scan the field, he locks on to receivers, he makes bad decisions all the time, he can't create plays, he struggles bigtime under pressure, he can't carry the offense like a franchise QB should. Just because I don't buy into the hype or didn't buy into the hype doesn't mean I don't like him or hate him. Off the field he seems like a down to earth, classy guy. He always says the right things. I like him off the field, I'd like him to stick around as a backup. But that's it. He's not a starter. Much less a franchise QB.

 

 Funny, but that very same arguement could be made about Griffin.

 

 Why don't some of you guys just relax a little; let the kid get some consecutive reps under his belt. Yea he played badly against the Giants, but the same could be made for the other QB in many games as well. It happens.

 

I don't expect to see anything near decent against the Seahawks, and rightfully so; they have a very good defense and will create problems for him. But if we do put up 21+ points, I would consider it a positive, going against them.

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How exactly do you fix a noodle arm?

 

Let me preface this by saying back when Cousins would considered by some as the be all and end all, after the Eagles game, I got trashed on a thread for preferring RG3 over him -- so am no Cousins homer.  Plus I gave Paulsen and Galdi on Twitter for being so carried away with Cousins that it was comical.  Now to answer the question from the framework of Cooley, he doesn't think Cousins has a noodle arm but that he puts too much touch-air on his throws and he needs to stop doing it. 

 

Two things that would annoy me about the Cousins is some sort of Greek QB God crowd was a lot of them were trashing RG3 in the process and among the things that they said were more or less sacks given up by Polumbus are RG3's fault, RG3 stares down receivers, and RG3 doesn't see wide open receivers but locks in instead of the #1 target -- well, we saw Polumbus give up a Cousins sack, and ironically Cooley said Cousins stares down receivers and doesn't see open guys.

 

I'd give Cousins more games to show what he has.  I do think potentially he could be Dalton like.  But yeah for me its not hard, I definitely prefer RG3 and said so before it was vogue to say so to some post Giants game.

 

As for the comments about Grant Paulsen, yeah his man crush on Cousins is huge, I got into a debate with him about playing well with the game on the line -- his response was more or less who cares, he doesn't put much stock in "clutch" play -- if its the 1st quarter or 4th quarter who cares?  I responded tell that to Yankee fans who get on A-rod for not hitting in the clutch versus Jeter who is a gamer.

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The interceptions are troubling, no doubt. It could be something he learns to overcome. He's still an inexperienced quarterback afterall.

I'm not comparing the two and I could be wrong but didnt Peyton Manning have the same problem his rookie year?

As I have stated in a different thread, yes, Peyton had thrown 28 Ints his first full season, Brett Favre threw 24 Ints his first full season, the list could go on, however, point is made.  Young QBs are going to make mistakes and just because you had 1 great season doesn't make a career.  Both of our QBs need to play better for this team to win. 

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Let me preface this by saying back when Cousins would considered by some as the be all and end all, after the Eagles game, I got trashed on a thread for preferring RG3 over him -- so am no Cousins homer.  Plus I gave Paulsen and Galdi on Twitter for being so carried away with Cousins that it was comical.  Now to answer the question from the framework of Cooley, he doesn't think Cousins has a noodle arm but that he puts too much touch-air on his throws and he needs to stop doing it. 

 

Two things that would annoy me about the Cousins is some sort of Greek QB God crowd was a lot of them were trashing RG3 in the process and among the things that they said were more or less sacks given up by Polumbus are RG3's fault, RG3 stares down receivers, and RG3 doesn't see wide open receivers but locks in instead of the #1 target -- well, we saw Polumbus give up a Cousins sack, and ironically Cooley said Cousins stares down receivers and doesn't see open guys.

 

I'd give Cousins more games to show what he has.  I do think potentially he could be Dalton like.  But yeah for me its not hard, I definitely prefer RG3 and said so before it was vogue to say so to some post Giants game.

 

As for the comments about Grant Paulsen, yeah his man crush on Cousins is huge, I got into a debate with him about playing well with the game on the line -- his response was more or less who cares, he doesn't put much stock in "clutch" play -- if its the 1st quarter or 4th quarter who cares?  I responded tell that to Yankee fans who get on A-rod for not hitting in the clutch versus Jeter who is a gamer.

 

 Thats what alot of people need to do; just give him some time.

The Eagles game didn't define KC, the Giants game didn't define KC, and the Seahawks game will not define him.

 I'm the same way with Griffin as I am Cousins; they both need time, better protection, etc, I just want to see them win, whoever the QB is. But it does irk me to see how polarized some are to one or the other; Griffin has had many more starts than Cousins, but still needs more; Cousins hasn't had near the starts and needs time to build a little chemistry with the offense.

 

If it doesn't work out it doesn't work out, and we move on, but give the kid more than a few weeks for god's sakes.

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Harry Callahan can sum it up for us:
 


 
 
Cousins is a smart guy, and with experience he'll learn what throws he can make and which ones he can't.  He doesn't have a noodle arm, exactly.  But he also doesn't have the arm strength to make some of the throws he's trying to make. Last week was a crash course in that learning experience.
 

Look closely at his eyes...he is kind of cross-eyed.


Wouldn't that actually be a good thing for a QB staring down receivers? D-backs wouldn't know where the the hell he was looking.

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He's been doing these things his entire college and pro career though.

We all laughed when the Broncos said they could fix Tebow's mechanics, QBs like Kirk are mostly finished products coming out of college. I don't forsee him learning to overcome his instincts/muscle memory and to look to other reads consistently, and I especially don't see him developing enough arm strength to make a real difference in how his passes get there.

 

Ok, so  what was RGIII coming out of college?  Using your statement and applying it to RGIII, does that mean RGIII can't overcome his instincts/muscle memory either?  RGIII is a spread option QB, not a pocket passer, never has been one.  If I use the same on him, we really can't expect him to be better in this system either.  Looks like we are screwed either way we go.

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Is that how he made the Pro Bowl and set all kinds of passing records? How delusional are you?

That was in a gimmicky offense that defenses have long figured out. He's done nothing in a traditional offense. And he isn't a franchise QB. Yet we gave up a boatload of picks, hoping he could/would be. If anyone is delusional here, it's you.
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