Mike Shanahan Press Conference: "I haven't made a decision on the starting QB **UPDATE** per John Keim: Cousins will start

[darrelgreenie]

I agree that he needs to learn to throw the ball away, but KC didn't really show how things should be done.

RG3  46% of his passes(pathetic)  13.7 yards per completion

KC     44% of his passes(pathetic)  8.4 yards per completion

 

Either guys were not open or he didn't hit them.  All I know is when you have a WC style offense, when there are quick timing patterns with lots of slants, the receivers need to get off the line and get some space between them and the dbs.  When we run those types of passes where there are 3 step drops and pass, our receivers are NOT open.

Woah, woah we don't talk actual football here friend. It doesn't fit into the narrative.

Kirk was better then Griffin in the KC game that's the company line. Stick to it.

_{we won't mention that Griffin was 16/17 1 TD in the first half of the Giants before we started running triple option!}

[thedeadliving5]

Because RG3 is a player and has no say in it?

Exactly!

[KingDinka]

Kirk starting is the only thing that will interest me in watching these next three games. And it isn't because I hate RG or think KC will be better. It is pure curiosity. I'd be curious to see what KC has to offer given three full weeks. It might be a total disaster worse than it is now. I don't know. But it would make me go from having zero interest in the Atlanta game to mild interest. Again, not because I beleive RG deserves to be "benched" or made a scapegoat. He's healthy right now (supposedly) and we are toast--- I do see the value in making sure he ends the season in one piece while at the same time seeing a little bit what KC has to offer. But yes, if it happens, it will only cause the drama meter to go from a 9.5 to a 10. But at this point, who cares?

If they put Kirk in they better not change the freaking offense to suit him. Kirk needs to run his anus off like RG. I wanna see him carry the ball 10-15 times every game like RG. I better not see any goddamn short quick passes the entire game, which is what the game plan should have been the whole year.

 

You know what, I wanna see Kirk in for this reason. I wanna see if the Redskins with Shanahan is an Equal Opportunity Employee. If he's not this is the wrong league for him.

[Skinsinparadise]

The risk of getting Griffin injured? Really? 12 carries against the Giants, some on TRIPLE OPTION.

In the first half of the Giants game Griffin was 16/17 1 TD sell that crap about Griffin not being able to play at a high level somewhere else. Get the gameplan and playcalling right FIRST then talk about the QB.

Oh, wait whut? Admitting that Griffin's poor play is linked to the gameplan and playcalling is an admission on fault and the Shanahan's don't play that game.

 

If you take Shanny at his word, which I don't, as opposed to him playing games this week -- he is also basically admitting that the O line that he puts together not only stinks but is so bad that he can't ensure the safety of his QB.  Talk about an extreme admission of failure.  So all the young O lineman he drafted outside of Trent are busts?  And his vaunted zone blocking scheme just doesn't cut it when it comes to the big picture?

 

Shanny's IMO ego is too big to admit such a failure -- so I agree with those who say he is using RG3 as leverage with the owner -- and its about as petty as it gets.

 

This all fits the same script as McNabb, leak bad stories about the player they have issues with and with 3 games to go find some excuse to bench that player with some crazy story that relates to next season.

 

This is the same dude, who just a couple of weeks ago said that the most important thing is for RG3 to get game reps for learning purposes.

[returnofthefunbunch]

Woah, woah we don't talk actual football here friend. It doesn't fit into the narrative.

Kirk was better then Griffin in the KC game that's the company line. Stick to it.

_{we won't mention that Griffin was 16/17 1 TD in the first half of the Giants before we started running triple option!}

Got it.  How's this?

 

Man, Kirk was so much better than Griffin on Sunday.  We should sit Griff for the next three games so he can learn from the best.

 

Better?

[martytheman]

I agree that he needs to learn to throw the ball away, but KC didn't really show how things should be done.

RG3  46% of his passes(pathetic)  13.7 yards per completion

KC     44% of his passes(pathetic)  8.4 yards per completion

 

Either guys were not open or he didn't hit them.  All I know is when you have a WC style offense, when there are quick timing patterns with lots of slants, the receivers need to get off the line and get some space between them and the dbs.  When we run those types of passes where there are 3 step drops and pass, our receivers are NOT open.

 

yes he missed some throws, but also made some. I expect the timing would improve if he actually got first team reps with the starting wr's.

 

That's why I'll be curious to see how he does with a full week of prep instead of being thrown into the game late in the 4th quarter down 35 points.

 

Woah, woah we don't talk actual football here friend. It doesn't fit into the narrative.

Kirk was better then Griffin in the KC game that's the company line. Stick to it.

_{we won't mention that Griffin was 16/17 1 TD in the first half of the Giants before we started running triple option!}

 

yeah.. company line... 

[Lombardi's_kid_brother]

None of those players had a torn ACL for the 2nd time in their career and has shown major signs of struggling either. That comparison is apples to oranges except Rodgers who won't play another game this year.

 

Rodgers probably is playing again this year.

[Lavarleap56]

For this to be a serious consideration it means; Shanny realizes RG3 is nowhere near ready to play QB at a high level. He is making the same mistakes week after week. 3 more weeks of the same mistakes won't help him. Only a ton of work in the off-season can help him develop into a better pocket QB. The risk of RG3 getting hurt and not having a healthy offseason outweights the benefits of 3 more games that really don't matter.

 

A side benefit of playing Cousins is he gets some game experience, and some more indication of how good he can be. If he stinks it up, he's the backup anyway and you have a healthy RG3 in the offseason. If he lights it up, then you can decide how things play out next year, maybe have an open competition in camp.

 

Winning games is the goal of any team not avoiding controversies because you have competition at a position.

 

No. It is a power play to force Dan to fire him period.

[KingDinka]

I better not see any modified game plan for Kirk. I wanna see 10-15 rushing attempts, a bunch of read option, and I better not see any quick short passes either the entire game. If they call a WC offense with short quick passes and Kirk doesn't run the ball and we win or the team perform well, we all need to call the radio stations and cry foul and racism. There is no place for this poo in this NFL.

[Lavarleap56]

Mike Shanahan is a ballsy dude, I'll give him that. I find it ironic that Mike is playing hardball right now and turning around and claiming that poor little head coach mike shanahan was hindered by Griffin's relationship with Snyder.

 

Fire this dude.

And I'm not a guy that calls for a coaches job lightly.

Didn't call for Kyle or Haslett's or Danny Smith or even Zorn.

But enough is enough.

 

It is a frustrating and embarrassing situation, and one that has the Head Coach holding the franchise hostage. Dan thinks this man will quit, but I think Shanahan is more vindictive & stubborn than the Danny himself. Mike started pouring gas on the ground last week, won't be long until he drops the match on his way out.  

[KingGibbs]

Who do you blame in this cluster **** of a mess LL?

[ConcordNCSkinsFan]

I don't even give a crap anymore. Let Cousins play and make his fanboys including Shanahan happy. Maybe he has a good couple of games and some team is stupid enough to actually give up a mid round draft pick for him. Griffin goes into offseason healthy and ready to learn a new Offense. Skins fans can move on and Cousins fans can go root for whatever team he gets traded to.

[ncr2h]

I better not see any modified game plan for Kirk. I wanna see 10-15 rushing attempts, a bunch of read option, and I better not see any quick short passes either the entire game. If they call a WC offense with short quick passes and Kirk doesn't run the ball and we win or the team perform well, we all need to call the radio stations and cry foul and racism. There is no place for this poo in this NFL.

 

Racism because the coaches adjust the offensive gameplan to each player's strengths?  RG3 is one of the worst rollout QBs that I've ever seen.  Rex Grossman, who is slow as all hell, runs the rollout better than Griffin.  John Beck, who is the worst QB I've ever seen play in the NFL (including Jamarcus Russel), runs a much better rollout than Griffin.  Jason Campbell, Donovan McNabb, Kirk Cousins - they all do it better than him.  For some reason (and maybe it's just this year), RG3 makes mistakes at an alarmingly high rate on rollouts.  2 weeks ago, he threw an INT.  Last week, he threw a 1 yard pass when he had 2 open receivers who each would have scored TDs.  He often holds the ball all the way until the sideline, at which point he throws it at the very last instant, which resulted in an interception earlier in the season.

 

It's sad because the rollout should be so easy for him.  Simplified reads, simplified protections - it's one of the easiest plays to execute in the NFL.

 

And also - we call tons of short quick passes with RG3 already.  Just because the playcall is for a short, quick pass doesn't mean that's what actually ends up happening.  What typically ends up happening is that RG3 doesn't throw the ball because the window is tighter than the ones he is used to from 2012 and Baylor.  So he goes to his second read.  His decision making is slow, and by the team he is done making his second read the protecton has broken down and he either gets hit hard, takes a sack, or starts running.

[darrelgreenie]

Got it.  How's this?

 

Man, Kirk was so much better than Griffin on Sunday.  We should sit Griff for the next three games so he can learn from the best.

 

Better?

lolololololol Now were talking! Welcome aboard the Shanaplan exit strategy phase II.

But we need a reason to remove all that read-option/triple option crap we make Robert run....

[Taylor703]

I sort of hope this turns into a Drew Brees situation. I hope the entire fanbase turns on RGIII the way the chargers fanbase did Brees and he gives the haters a big middle finger as he hoists the Lombardi with another team. This fanbase doesn't deserve an exciting young QB because they don't understand what development entails. As much as the fans bash Snyder for trying quick fixes there are so many fans of this team that are exactly like him. Zero patience whatsoever.

[ncr2h]

Can we just think about the ridiculousness of this thread?  People calling for the firing of the head coach because the last straw, the thing that they couldn't handle, was that a QB who has struggled mightily all season might get benched for a QB in need of evaluation for the final 3 games of a 3-10 season.

 

And the Giants game was far from a passing clinic.  1 yard dumpoffs to Fred Davis when Logan Paulsen and Josh Morgan are both running wide open in the endzone show up in the stat line as successful plays.  6 yard passes on 3rd and 7 when Aldrick Robinson was wide open on the 15 yard post show up in the stat line as successful plays.  The Giants game was hit and miss.  Which means it was one of the best games of the year for 2013 Robert Griffin, but not for what this offense is capable of.

[darrelgreenie]

ncr2h-

 

Griffin is a bad rollout QB? Okay.

I sort of hope this turns into a Drew Brees situation. I hope the entire fanbase turns on RGIII the way the chargers fanbase did Brees and he gives the haters a big middle finger as he hoists the Lombardi with another team. This fanbase doesn't deserve an exciting young QB because they don't understand what development entails. As much as the fans bash Snyder for trying quick fixes there are so many fans of this team that are exactly like him. Zero patience whatsoever.

Woah, tranquilo caballero. Some I would argue most fans want RGIII here.

[Sekhmet187]

Can we just think about the ridiculousness of this thread?  People calling for the firing of the head coach because the last straw, the thing that they couldn't handle, was that a QB who has struggled mightily all season might get benched for a QB in need of evaluation for the final 3 games of a 3-10 season.

 

And the Giants game was far from a passing clinic.  1 yard dumpoffs to Fred Davis when Logan Paulsen and Josh Morgan are both running wide open in the endzone show up in the stat line as successful plays.  6 yard passes on 3rd and 7 when Aldrick Robinson was wide open on the 15 yard post show up in the stat line as successful plays.  The Giants game was hit and miss.  Which means it was one of the best games of the year for 2013 Robert Griffin, but not for what this offense is capable of.

 

So we just magically forget that in 4 seasons, the most notable thing the Head Coach has done is admit the offensive line he put together through drafting and free agency over the course of 4 seasons isn't even good enough to keep the starting QB safe enough to play? 

And since when does a backup late round draft pick "need evaluation"? We don't "need" to find out what the Redskins have in Cousins. In fact, the best case scenario is that he hardly sees the field so that a QB needy team that doesn't get a good draft pick next year is willing to dump a 1st, 2nd or 3rd in exchange for him and hope those teams aren't scared by the horrible stories of Cassel or Flynn. 

 

By the way, Aaron Rodgers is not going to be sitting the rest of the season as Green Bay still has an outside shot at winning the division if the Lions lose a game and the Packers win out. 

[TheGoodBits]

I sort of hope this turns into a Drew Brees situation. I hope the entire fanbase turns on RGIII the way the chargers fanbase did Brees and he gives the haters a big middle finger as he hoists the Lombardi with another team. This fanbase doesn't deserve an exciting young QB because they don't understand what development entails. As much as the fans bash Snyder for trying quick fixes there are so many fans of this team that are exactly like him. Zero patience whatsoever.

I'd much prefer a call-out public shaming thread in a couple years when he hoists a trophy for us. I'm taking names.

[TD_washingtonredskins]

It is a frustrating and embarrassing situation, and one that has the Head Coach holding the franchise hostage. Dan thinks this man will quit, but I think Shanahan is more vindictive & stubborn than the Danny himself. Mike started pouring gas on the ground last week, won't be long until he drops the match on his way out.  

 

Do you think he will follow through and bench Griffin? I wonder if Dan would up the ante by firing Kyle?

[kleese]

The narrative that Redskins fans want rg3 gone is so tired.

He has had a bad year. He hasn't gotten much help and lately the scheme has gotten even worse as the entire team has devolved into a mess. But he hasn't been good this year independent of other factors, IMO.

I think this stems from three main things:

1. The physical toll of the injury; not feeling as strong/fast/comfortable etc. developing some bad habits due to over compensation.

2. Mental; lack of confidence, which gets worse when the team struggles; very little opportunity to hone his craft in the off season due to rehab. No pre season reps; limited camp action. For a second year QB, those things were essential and he didn't have them.

3. Defense adjusts. This falls more on the staff, but again, because RG was rehabbing, he wasn't able to sort of work through these things in advance and had to try and figure it out on the fly.

RG also doesn't have anyone to bail him out on the field. Only Garçon ever makes a tough play. Margin of error is smaller when that is the case.

DG and I disagree on this--I don't think RG had played well and I don't think it is due mainly to scheme and coaching--- it all goes together of course, but RG IMO, would not have been good in any offense this year--- better for sure, but nowhere near 2012.

I think he will be back. Hopefully we clean up some of this mess and this off season he can focus fully on football and his development. I look forward to seeing him next year.

If that makes me a hater or a KC fanboy, then I guess that's what I am.

[ncr2h]

We have an excellent O-line, which you will see as soon as we get a QB in there who makes quick decisions.

 

Note that Griffin took 5 sacks on roughly 31 pass attempts.  He also scrambled on several others in order to evade the rush.  That's a pressure rate of roughly 20%.

 

Cousins took 1 sack on 16 dropbacks, with no scrambles.  His pressure rate was 6%, more than 3 times better than Griffin's.  You'll note that Cousins made a crucial adjustment to the protection on third and long to slide his line to the right in order to account for an overload blitz coming from the right side.  This bought him time to hit Paulsen for a first down.

 

Let's say, for the sake of argument, that I'm right and you are wrong - the QB is the reason we are taking so many sacks/hits, and not the offensive line.  But let's say that we do things your way, and keep RG3 in for the final 3 games, instead of putting Cousins in for at least a game or 2.  Under your plan, we would go into the offseason thinking that it's necessary to overhaul our entire O-line, when that really isn't the problem.  Additionally, we will not know any more about what we have in Cousins than we did at the beginning of 2013.  If we put Cousins in, we get a lot more clarity into the offensive line situation as well as the potential we have in Cousins.

[Taylor703]

I'd much prefer a call-out public shaming thread in a couple years when he hoists a trophy for us. I'm taking names.

Well, yeah, that would be the more ideal situation lol

[TheGoodBits]

Do you think he will follow through and bench Griffin? I wonder if Dan would up the ante by firing Kyle?

I thought of that possibility. Not sure how the PR battle would turn out for Dan with that one.

[Sekhmet187]

We have an excellent O-line, which you will see as soon as we get a QB in there who makes quick decisions.

 

Note that Griffin took 5 sacks on roughly 31 pass attempts.  He also scrambled on several others in order to evade the rush.  That's a pressure rate of roughly 20%.

 

Cousins took 1 sack on 16 dropbacks, with no scrambles.  His pressure rate was 6%, more than 3 times better than Griffin's.  You'll note that Cousins made a crucial adjustment to the protection on third and long to slide his line to the right in order to account for an overload blitz coming from the right side.  This bought him time to hit Paulsen for a first down.

 

Let's say, for the sake of argument, that I'm right and you are wrong - the QB is the reason we are taking so many sacks/hits, and not the offensive line.  But let's say that we do things your way, and keep RG3 in for the final 3 games, instead of putting Cousins in for at least a game or 2.  Under your plan, we would go into the offseason thinking that it's necessary to overhaul our entire O-line, when that really isn't the problem.  Additionally, we will not know any more about what we have in Cousins than we did at the beginning of 2013.  If we put Cousins in, we get a lot more clarity into the offensive line situation as well as the potential we have in Cousins.

 

So lets say that we do as you say, and ignore the fact that even in your assumptions the fact remains that the offensive line is incapable of holding blocks for a longer period of time (hence why you're saying Cousins is doing better than RGIII because he gets the ball out quicker), how can you say that we don't already have some analysis on how the oline is doing when the oline is clearly unable to let a QB stay in the pocket long enough for deep routes? Unless you have data that suggests the oline is indeed good at sustaining blocks for a long time, it tells me that having an offense based solely on quick throws to avoid the weakness in the oline still doesn't address the fact that you have to cater your offensive gameplan to a position that isn't playing optimally. 

 

No offense, but throwing data that Cousins gets rid of the ball quicker and thus the oline plays better with him does not at all show anything other than we know the oline isn't bad if the QB doesn't have to throw it deep.