Seymour Hersh: Story About Killing Osama Bin Laden Is One Big Lie

[SkinsHokieFan]

http://www.alternet.org/media/seymour-hersh-story-about-killing-osama-bin-laden-one-big-lie?page=0%2C0&akid=10983.38044.3iPMRk&rd=1&src=newsletter902420&t=3

 

Link for rest

 

 

Seymour Hersh: Story About Killing Osama Bin Laden is One Big Lie

 

Seymour Hersh has got some extreme ideas on how to fix journalism – close down the news bureaus of NBC and ABC, sack 90% of editors in publishing and get back to the fundamental job of journalists which, he says, is to be an outsider.

It doesn't take much to fire up Hersh, the investigative journalist who has been the nemesis of US presidents since the 1960s [3] and who was once described by the Republican party as "the closest thing American journalism has to a terrorist".

He is angry about the timidity of journalists in America, their failure to challenge the White House and be an unpopular messenger of truth.

Don't even get him started on the New York Times which, he says, spends "so much more time carrying water for Obama than I ever thought they would" – or the death of Osama bin Laden. "Nothing's been done about that story, it's one big lie, not one word of it is true," he says of the dramatic US Navy Seals raid in 2011.

Hersh is writing a book about national security and has devoted a chapter to the bin Laden killing. He says a recent report put out by an "independent" Pakistani commission about life in the Abottabad compound in which Bin Laden was holed up would not stand up to scrutiny. "The Pakistanis put out a report, don't get me going on it. Let's put it this way, it was done with considerable American input. It's a bull**** report," he says hinting of revelations to come in his book.

The Obama administration lies systematically, he claims, yet none of the leviathans of American media, the TV networks or big print titles, challenge him.

"It's pathetic, they are more than obsequious, they are afraid to pick on this guy [Obama]," he declares in an interview with the Guardian.

"It used to be when you were in a situation when something very dramatic happened, the president and the minions around the president had control of the narrative, you would pretty much know they would do the best they could to tell the story straight. Now that doesn't happen any more. Now they take advantage of something like that and they work out how to re-elect the president.

He isn't even sure if the recent revelations about the depth and breadth of surveillance by the National Security Agency will have a lasting effect.

 

 

[Springfield]

I agree that the major media outlets lack any sort of real journalism any more. I don't agree that you come out and call the narrative about OBL and then offer no real facts to back up what you're saying.

Of course, I'm sure that he will tell you in the book he's trying to sell. So how is this guy any different than the media he denounces?

(Note: I just read the OP and didn't click the link. If my answers are in the link than I'm just a giant jerkstore)

[Larry]

The guy's probably got a point.

If he wasn't foaming at the mouth with conspiracy theories, he'd probably get paid more attention.

(But probably not. The People Have Spoken, and they don't mind the way things are.)

[TheGoodBits]

I'm sure the book will sell plenty among a certain lunatic demographic in this country. Props to the guy for inventing a nice story.

PS- what happened to the old SHF?

[Duckus]

I agree that the major media outlets lack any sort of real journalism any more. I don't agree that you come out and call the narrative about OBL and then offer no real facts to back up what you're saying.

I was about to write the exact same thing.

I think most folks would agree that the quality of media is embarrassingly poor - but I don't get the OBL point.

The article is a little all over the place. Maybe it is the fault of the author - but he comes across as a ranting conspiracy theorist.

[twa]

He has always come across that way,except to those that need him

[zoony]

This guy has all the answers. A one man wrecking crew who has cracked the code.

Start with a universal truth and sell that... I.e. "politicians lie!" And weave into a tapestry of bull**** that you can package neatly and sell to every idiot on the web who lacks critical thinking skills.

Nope, we've not seen the likes of this before. Bravo sir, bravo

[zoony]

And why does it always come down to the Jews with these types? Ron Paul and his white power editorials, now this guy. Not very flattering company for you there SHF.

A quick google search...

"As for the Obama administration’s posture toward Iran, it was little better than that of its predecessor. “The new report, therefore, leaves us where we’ve been since 2002, when George Bush declared Iran to be a member of the Axis of Evil,” Hersh wrote, “with lots of belligerent talk but no definitive evidence of a nuclear-weapons program.”

What could explain the positions of Obama and Clinton—liberal Democrats who, in Hersh’s eyes, have made the cardinal sin of expressing such distress about a nuclear-weapons program that doesn’t even exist? “Money. A lot of the Jewish money from New York. Come on, let’s not kid about it,” Hersh said in a 2007 interview on the far-left Democracy Now! radio show, in a discussion about the Democratic presidential primary. “A significant percentage of Jewish money, and many leading American Jews support the Israeli position that Iran is an existential threat,” he continued. “And I think it’s as simple as that.”

[twa]

you can even get a pulitzer or peace prize if ya time it right

[SkinsHokieFan]

I'm sure the book will sell plenty among a certain lunatic demographic in this country. Props to the guy for inventing a nice story.

PS- what happened to the old SHF?

 

The "old SHF" (whatever that means..) in his younger days was a Republican party hack who once worked on the Hill and swallowed all the BS we are fed constantly and refused to critically think.

 

Once you start actually thinking about things, the evidence is right there in front of your face.

 

Add Hersh, a Pullitzer prize winning author , who helped expose My Lai Massacre and Abu Gharib to being thrown under the liberal bus, just like Daniel Ellsberg of the Pentagon papers fame, because Hersh doesn't toe the line of the WH and the establishment Republicans. Instead he is a conspiratorial lunatic, despite his multi decade illustrious career in not believing the packaged nonsense we now get from media sources everyday.

 

There literally is a network on television that is a propaganda arm for a major US political party, and whose viewers don't have a simple grasp of established facts. 49.8% of this country bought enough of the nonsense from Fox News to actually pull the level for Mitt Romney in 2012. You have an unhinged, lunatic, right wing in this country, and a weak feckless President, who despite super majorities in 2009-2010, changed very little, and in fact gave bi-partisan consensus to the worst of GW Bush's policies.

 

Start with a universal truth and sell that... I.e. "politicians lie!" And weave into a tapestry of bull**** that you can package neatly and sell to every idiot on the web who lacks critical thinking skills.

 

 

I'd state that those who are willing to just go along and not really critically think about the status quo are the idiots who have no issues with being spied on by the NSA, no issues with giving away billions to Wall Street with no accountability, probably believed Saddam had WMDs (I did), couldn't even fathom that US troops would torture at GITMO or Abu Gharib, thinks that drones are just a dandy way to execute diplomacy, and would have gone along just fine with a war in Syria.

 

These same people have no issue with spending 600B a year on the military, which goes to contractors, which makes Washington DC and the areas surrounding it one of the richest areas in the world, while millions in this country can't get health care and we are one industrialized nation on earth that still hasn't figured out the most efficient way to deliver health care is via single payer.

 

But hey, the official story we have gotten from this White House has to be 100% true, just like the story we got from the previous administration. Journalism doesn't need to investigate, it should just publish press releases from the White House and Congress and call it a day

[TheGoodBits]

So is this thread about the media or is it about a conspiracy theory? It seems like both, but the conspiracy theory part overshadows any real substantial discussion that is possible.

[afkidd]

so does this mean snowden is lying?

[SkinsHokieFan]

So is this thread about the media or is it about a conspiracy theory? It seems like both, but the conspiracy theory part overshadows any real substantial discussion that is possible.

 

The headline is provocative , clearly done to draw attention, but Hersh's overall point is correct. The 21st century media is an echo chamber cheerleading whatever they are told by the White House or Congress. And people like Zoony like it that way. He should just not bother with reading the paper and instead take a look at the press releases and save some time everyday. 

[zoony]

You're descent into extremity has been troubling over the last 2 years SHF. I genuinely wonder where you'll be in another 2.

This will be my last post on this topic but just know it is truly a position of concern for your well being.

[Dan T.]

If Hersh has been digging into the supposed non-death of Osama Bin Laden, I'd like to see his evidence.  And I don't consider some biased, U.S.-influenced Pakistani report about life in the Abbottabad compound evidence of the massive lie he is alleging.

 

His criticisms of modern journalism are fair enough.  But he's gone all in suggesting that the U.S. President, the administration, Congress, and the Navy Seals have perpetrated a massive lie to the world.

[KuNiT21]

Hasn't he seen "Zero Dark Thirty?"  Of course it's real.....On the real though, I do believe the raid.  I think some pretty good evidence was the guy that kept tweeting about loud helicopters roaming over his coffee shop.  I don't entirely remember, but he tweeted like 3-4 tweets about the raid that were pretty interesting.

[Predicto]

Hersh is not the first guy to start out as a honest outsider and genuine muckraker, and end up as a whacked out conspiracy theorist.   It's a danger of the profession.  

 

He makes good points about the state of American journalism, but the rest is kind of sad.

[No Excuses]

 

His criticisms of modern journalism are fair enough.  But he's gone all in suggesting that the U.S. President, the administration, Congress, and the Navy Seals have perpetrated a massive lie to the world.

 

That's basically what I got out of it as well. I think modern day journalism is filled with hacks and it's very difficult to get an unbiased worldview. The closest I get to it is through The Economist and even that can occasionally have articles that make you go WTF. 

 

I was hoping the article explained his take on the Osama situation more. I don't get what he's saying. Is he saying we staged the entire event or is he saying the details we received are not true and that something else took place? Seems like a publicity stunt to sell his book which is ironic considering what he's lambasting in the article.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

Hasn't he seen "Zero Dark Thirty?"  Of course it's real.....On the real though, I do believe the raid.  I think some pretty good evidence was the guy that kept tweeting about loud helicopters roaming over his coffee shop.  I don't entirely remember, but he tweeted like 3-4 tweets about the raid that were pretty interesting.

 

I remember that. It was just some webpage developer type kid. And I believe he they were flying over his apartment.  He kept ****ing about the Pakistani Army making noise so late at night. Next day, he was a celebrity. Was pretty funny actually.

[Predicto]

What appears to be happening to Hersh seems very similar to what happened to Les Kinsolving.  He was a very respected investigative reporter who, among other things, investigated Jim Jones' People's Temple and tried to warn people about it a long time before the Jonestown Massacre.   He was a valuable gadfly at White house press conferences, asking questions that no one else would ask. 

 

Now he's a birther and a total hack working for WorldNetDaily.  

[Corcaigh]

So he's claiming that the raid is "one big lie". But not saying any more. And we should take him seriously and buy his book.

[MartinC]

weave into a tapestry of bull**** that you can package neatly and sell to every idiot on the web who lacks critical thinking skills.

 

The thing is that demographic is big enough to sell a LOT of books to, at least a few of which will actually be read.

[JamesMadisonSkins]

I've got a few friends who are starting to delve into consipracies ... now more than ever. Kind of frightening. One of them actually scares me with his anarchist-leaning thinking. Every conversation now revolves around the govt. control over everything and how we have to start a grassroots effort to stand against them ... 

 

I'm not going to pretend that our government is always honest and forward-acting ... and I'm the first to stand up and speak out against the crappy food and health regulation in this country that has us in the place we are from a health standpoint, but some of this stuff is just crackpot ... and it worries me that there seems to be a growing voice among this extreme group

[SkinsHokieFan]

The raid itself clearly happened. There are enough Pakistani's in that town who witnessed it that yes there was a raid.

 

Hersh is probably referring to several things, and below is simply my guess at it. 

 

1) That it was so incredibly dramatic and tense. Odds are, Seal Team 6 was able to walk in and quickly kill Bin Laden with no resistance and get out of there with no issue

 

2) The Pakistani gov't not knowing the raid was about to occur. This is probably the biggest crock that has become part of the "official" story, both in American media and in Pakistan. The "ignorance" of the Pakistani government serves both governments quite well, which is most likely why Hersh is referring to the official Pakistani inquiry as utter crap.

 

The American exceptionalsts need it to have been a dramatic danger filled raid that alluded the Pakistan military with our brave Navy seals putting their lives at risk, with CIA doing incredible work over the years to identify this tall guy in some military town in Pakistan.

 

The establishment in Pakistan needed to be in the dark about the raid and have had Pakistani sovereignty violated by the evil Americans and how dare they do this to noble Pakistan, lets arrest that doctor and throw him in jail!

 

Odds are the Pakistani ISI no longer had use for Bin Laden and cooperated fully in the raid, which went quicker and easier then has been reported.  

[MartinC]

I've got a few friends who are starting to delve into consipracies ... now more than ever. Kind of frightening. One of them actually scares me with his anarchist-leaning thinking. Every conversation now revolves around the govt. control over everything and how we have to start a grassroots effort to stand against them ... 

 

I'm not going to pretend that our government is always honest and forward-acting ... and I'm the first to stand up and speak out against the crappy food and health regulation in this country that has us in the place we are from a health standpoint, but some of this stuff is just crackpot ... and it worries me that there seems to be a growing voice among this extreme group

 

The thing about these conspiracy theories of how our Governments control events and keep silence about their manipulations is I just wish they were competent enough to actually carry off that kind of stuff. My experience as a supplier to various Governments worldwide is that most Government Departments and staff are incapable of the organisational ability required to do anything like as orgainsed as some of the conspiracies they are accused of. At least on purpose.