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MMQB: RG3 - It's Not Just the Knee


Hitman21ST

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http://mmqb.si.com/2013/07/18/washington-redskins-2013-preview/

 

Here’s what we know about RG3: he’s fast, agile and has a lively arm with a quick, compact release. People respect his character and like his personality. If healthy, he can be be one of the most dynamic threats the league has ever seen.

 

What we don’t know is whether or not Griffin can consistently operate as a drop-back passer in a traditional NFL offense. If he can’t master downfield reads from the pocket, he’ll never be more than a likable version of Michael Vick, assuming the knee injury hasn’t already affected his athleticism.

 

Last season the Redskins used play-action on 42% of their pass plays, by far the highest rate in the NFL since Football Outsiders started tracking the stat in 2005. Here’s the thing about play-action: While it’s used to freeze defenses, it’s also used to simplify the offense for the quarterback. After faking the handoff, the QB typically has an either-or decision to make. The read could be to throw to the designed target or run the ball; it could be to throw to the designated target or check-down to another predetermined receiver. Play-action is cut and dried, often with no progressions in between. It can be very effective—but also very limiting. Which is why teams with great quarterbacks use it judiciously, not predominantly.

 

This isn’t to say Griffin can’t execute a traditional progression-read passing attack. We just don’t know yet. Even when he dropped back without faking a handoff last year, the majority of those reads were either-or, which explains why he tucked the ball and scrambled so often. This was simply good coaching by offensive coordinator Kyle Shanahan, who put the rookie in the best position to succeed.

 

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I really don't see RGIII regressing and slumping this year but I can see Shanahan using less read option and more bootlegs to protect him.

 

Also, who cares whether RGIII uses traditional drop back and goes through progressions as defining an 'Elite' QB.  We had the most productive offense for passing and rushing yards per play.  THAT is the definition of  an effective offense led by a great QB. 

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I think it's a fair enough point, but I don't think he's breaking any news here.

 

We've seen one season of Griffin in the NFL. During that one season, we relied heavily on play-action. So, it's a valid statement that it remains to be seen if he can be as successful running play-action less frequently.

 

I don't know that I've seen anything from Griffin to doubt that he will succeed, but it's technically true that we don't KNOW yet. I think Griffin will play out of the pistol and we'll use that formation the way New England uses the shotgun. From the pistol though, you have more running options, so why not use the play-fake?

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Blah blah blah it doesn't look like our traditional duck so we're going to say it's not a successful drop-back passing duck.

 

Low INT rate, high comp %, not a lot of dropped INTs, and just not a lot of bad throws... I dont care what type/tricks/style of offense they used to generate those passing numbers. I saw a wealth of good decisions made by Robert on pass plays and that's all I (and pundits should) care about.

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I don't get the media. Robert ran the play action as well as anyone in the league. As a ROOKIE. Of course they are going to use it a ton. They have an excellent running game, and when coupled with Griffin's great fake... But instead of giving props, they harp on how he doesn't do things exactly like they think a QB should. They need to wake up and realize Griffin is breaking that mold, he is something better.

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The one thing that gets me is that while we play faked 42% of the time, that means we used traditional drop backs 58% of the time. So we HAVE seen him do it, and he's done it well. Although it hasn't been Manning or Brady numbers, we have seen it, and Griffin has done it.

 

And like OF has posted in his QB threads, the use of the shotgun simplifies (for lack of a better term) the reads and actions of Brady and Manning, but we don't take anything away from them. As an OC, your job should be to find that point where effectiveness and simplicity meet. As an example, if you're an OC and your running back gets 6 or 7 yards every time you run a dive, you're not really going to call a sweep or counter. You're going to keep running that dive until the D stops it. Does that take anything away from your RB?

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I'd be curious to see what RG III's stats are in comparison to his peers (younger but good QBs) when it comes passing production on non play action plays. Its obviously not his strongest area right now, but almost every competent QB can improve in that. No reason to be worried about it yet. Unless Morris has a massive downfall in production its kind of a moot point. Stop Morris (good luck with that) otherwise we'll play action you to death. 

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We play action a ton because we're a smash-mouth running team. We're not a pass heavy offense so you can't expect us to play offense like the saints, broncos, cowboys and patriots do. Teams that run the football very well are always high play-action teams because they go hand in hand like peanut butter and jelly. 

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Tom Brady and Peyton Manning have made a career off play action

 

Furthermore, with very few exceptions, whenever Brady is under center, it's off play action. Peyton Manning has been running PA with no run game for years.

 

And like Hitman said, if he's running play action 42% of the time, that means he's dropping back or in the gun 58% of the time. I know some guys are bad at math, but last time I checked, 42% is LESS than 58%. 

 

Shocker, I know.

 

SMFH...

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Tom Brady and Peyton Manning have made a career off play action

 

Furthermore, with very few acceptions, whenever Brady is under center, it's off play action. Peyton Manning has been running PA with no run game for years.

 

And like Hitman said, if he's running play action 42% of the time, that means he's dropping back or in the gun 58% of the time. I know some guys are bad at math, but last time I checked, 42% is LESS than 58%. 

 

Shocker, I know.

 

SMFH...

I can't wait until the season starts man so if RG3 plays well all these negative nancy's (in the sports media) will have to eat crow. 

 

btw good news guys RGIII is cleared. 

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Just wait until you read more of the article (NLC, you're gonna love it):

 

Shanahan often used Griffin in the Redskins’ ballyhooed pistol set, from which they ran the zone-read option. This drove a lot of their potency in play-action, opening up short slants and hooks because linebackers had to honor Griffin’s crafty fake handoffs. And just like play-action passes, Washington’s zone-read options are controlled, reactionary plays for the young quarterback. We may see less of these called in the coming season, especially since defensive coordinators spent the offseason devising ways to snuff out the scheme. Their rather simple solution will be to hit the quarterback whether he keeps the ball or not, which is legal because he is essentially a running back taking a direct snap. The hits just have to be delivered within the natural timing of a handoff, which won’t be a problem since unblocked edge defenders have an unimpeded path to the mesh point. (Think of hockey defenders playing the man instead of the puck.) We already saw the Ravens start delivering zone-read hits like this with Terrell Suggs in the second half of Super Bowl XLVII.

 

and

 

Up front, the men doing the zone blocking don’t quite have the chemistry or athleticism that, say, Houston’s line has, but at least the group has now played together for two full seasons.

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Definitely, it seems that the media assumes that Defenses already know how to stop RG3.

 

Other than the freak injury that happened to him in the Ravens game, I havent seen a defense stop this offense since the second half of the season.  

 

We know RG3 and Kyle will mature this offense but lets not assume that defenses have them figured out until we see some evidence of that.

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Can I throw the BS flag on this writer?  You noticed how these writers never once mention the impressive 7-0 to win the division last year WITH some major starters out for the season?  Do you ever notice how no one has the balls to say the obvious which is:  Even if the skins lost 6 games last year, they were in all of them (except maybe the Steelers game but then again our receivers dropped 9 passes, two for scores).

 

Is it just noticeable to me that they consistently dismiss Morris, a rookie that broke the teams rushing record and come in 2nd in the league behind AP who had the 2nd best RB season in NFL history?  Oh yea its Shanny's scheme or just because of RGIII, never mind the fact he had more yards after contact than just about any other RB?  if Morris had Portis speed when in prime he probably breaks the historical NFL rushing record which AP missed.

 

Don't know about you guys but I can't wait for the season to start if only for these so call ANALysts can disappear like the hating idiots fans of other teams did last year when RGIII and company served crow.

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If the offense were so easy to run then why didn't every team in the league run it?

 

Points Per Game Leaders
RK TEAM YDS YDS/G PASS P YDS/G RUSH R YDS/G PTS PTS/G 1 New England 6846 427.9 4662 291.4 2184 136.5 557 34.8 2 Denver 6366 397.9 4534 283.4 1832 114.5 481 30.1 3 New Orleans 6574 410.9 4997 312.3 1577 98.6 461 28.8 4 Washington 6131 383.2 3422 213.9 2709 169.3 436 27.3 5 Green Bay 5751 359.4 4049 253.1 1702 106.4 433 27.1 6 NY Giants 5687 355.4 3825 239.1 1862 116.4 429 26.8 7 Atlanta 5906 369.1 4509 281.8 1397 87.3 419 26.2

 

Exactly!  and ever team would also have finished 4 in points!

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https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/12/01/robert-griffin-perfect-play-action/

 

The link above shows that through the November games last year, Griffin did better on play-action, but he was still very good on non-play action passes. He completed two-thirds of his passes, had an 8-1 TD-to-interception ratio, and over a 92 QB rating.

 

I'll live with those numbers!

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I think most people forget the basic facts. RGIII was a spread option QB so that's one transition. Lets not over look the transition from college to the pros. More importantly, our OL played well above what was expected. But on the same note do you think they could hold up to 25-30 pure drop back pass protection? That's at least 20+ times you leave RGIII at the mercy of Polumbus. Thanks, but no thanks.

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