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The Official ES Redskins Name Change Thread---All Things Related to Changing the Team's Name Go Here

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The redskins word, at least me isn't intended to be racist, and I don't think google cares whether or not the actual word is. Google is in the business of guessing what most people are looking for. When most people think "redskins" they think football. That is fine, that doesn't the absolve the word from its questionable nature. 

 

Unless you believe the majority is always right...of course the majority changes with time. Segregation I'm sure polled alright back in the earlier parts of the 20th century. (No these sins aren't equivalent just using an example as society changes its views on social paradigms.)

 

What is it's questionable nature?

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What is it's questionable nature?

 

reference to the skin color of an ethnic group. If I google "redskin meaning" the first couple of things I get is that it refers to native Americans, and that it is a racial slur. Do you really think there is only one absolute meaning of the word? It isn't like Titan, or Falcon unfortunately where there is only one way you can interpret it. 

I must admit though, google searches aren't the end all on definitions either ;)

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reference to the skin color of an ethnic group

 

 

so this makes it questionable?  Referencing the skin color of an ethnic group?

:)

Referencing people's skin color is automatically derogatory?...because that is what a "slur" is.

 

(Don't feel I'm attacking you, these are more rhetorical questions than anything)

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so this makes it questionable?  Referencing the skin color of an ethnic group?

:)

 

naming an extremely relevant football franchise after a ethnic group is not good policy IMO. You don't see any brownskins, blackskins or yellowskins in the NFL...And that is just assuming the word itself has no ill meanings. (I don't think redskins was intended to be used maliciously but I can see how people would take it as so, and even if it is a small group of people that decry it, like a few thousand, there complaints must be weighted). 

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and here is another rhetorical.

 

Does it matter that just because people of another race, say African Americans would find the term "Blackskins" to be unacceptable, does that automatically mean that Native Americans should find the term "Redskins" just as unacceptable?

 

What if at large they do not?  Is there something wrong with them?

Edited by Painkiller

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That's not true in the slightest. The only reason the Redskins name debate has gotten any traction is because the name sounds like a slur and ignorant people like to talk about things they know nothing about. Seen anything suggesting other Native-theme teams are feeling heat? Nope.

 

I really believe this as well.

 

I also think that this is a losing battle for us.   The name really does sound like a slur, and the dictionaries really do treat it like a slur.  For us to win this battle, we would have to convince the entire world that we were fighting for something really important, important enought to overrule the general understanding in the public eye of what the word Redskin means in the English language.   I don't think not wanting to change the name of a professional football team rises even close to that level.  

Edited by Predicto

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Unless i've been misreading, my race is the only one that is known by color on every form that asks about it.

 

I've never seen "Hispanic" referred to as "light brown", or asian as "Often very pale, but sometimes very dark"

But I am white.

 

I know there's idiots out there who actually DO make a stink about that and scream Racism.

But we all ignore them for the over-sensitive angry dopes they typically are.

 

~Bang

Edited by Bang
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That's not true in the slightest. The only reason the Redskins name debate has gotten any traction is because the name sounds like a slur and ignorant people like to talk about things they know nothing about. Seen anything suggesting other Native-theme teams are feeling heat? Nope.

 

To a point you're right; the Redskins are the only team under siege. However I believe this is a direct result of being the 3rd most valuable franchise in the league (8th most valuable in the world according to Forbes), a superstar QB, and a "ruthless" owner with a "grudge" towards the media (See Snyder's City Paper Lawsuit).

 

However some of the name change activists want all Native American imagery removed. This includes names, logos, colors, history...everything. If they successfully overthrow the Skins then other teams will fall too. It won't be long before all things names after Native Americans are removed.

 

I think I just found a good piece of evidence to support our name.

 

Type "Redskins" into Google images and scroll down. Keep scrolling until you see a picture that isn't football related...

 

Oh, what's that? EVERY image result is related to football?

 

IF it was a racial slur, we have CHANGED the meaning. We should be honored. 

 

If I walked into a mall and started yelling, "Redskins, Redskins, Redskins!" People would stare at me like I was some crazy nut talking about a 2-4 football team. Now if I went into a mall and started yelling "N word, N word," well you can guess what will happen.

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and here is another rhetorical.

 

Does it matter that just because people of another race, say African Americans would find the term "Blackskins" to be unacceptable, does that automatically mean that Native Americans should find the term "Redskins" just as unacceptable?

 

What if at large they do not?  Is there something wrong with them?

 

I'm aware of what polls you're trying to insinuate. If 75% of em have thicker skins then most african americans might with regards to racial slurs directed at them, then kudos to them. That doesn't mean the word is something society should go around championing. 

 

Most dictionaries don't have a positive definition of the word. That is what matters to me. What the word implies. I don't give a damn about the word itself, but its definition is not something you can change. Its a battle I don't think Snyder can win, and more over its an actual distraction from football, which ought to be the primary focus. 

Edited by nuposse87

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If I walked into a mall and started yelling, "Redskins, Redskins, Redskins!" People would stare at me like I was some crazy nut talking about a 2-4 football team. Now if I went into a mall and started yelling "N word, N word," well you can guess what will happen.

Can I use this? lol

Most dictionaries don't have a positive definition of the word. That is what matters to me. What the word implies. I don't give a damn about the word itself, but its definition is not something you can change. 

But they (the dictionaries) did change the definitions. It's been documented what the FIRST usage of the word Redskins meant.

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I really believe this as well.

 

I also think that this is a losing battle for us.   The name really does sound like a slur, and the dictionaries really do treat it like a slur.  For us to win this battle, we would have to convince the entire world that we were fighting for something really important, important enought to overrule the general understanding in the public eye of what the word Redskin means in the English language.   I don't think not wanting to change the name of a professional football team rises even close to that level.  

 

Eh. Arguing "The dictionaries are wrong, and when are horribly racist owner named the team, he wanted to honor Native Americans" is a pointless exercise.

 

Snyder can only win this by somehow convincing the public that the team deserves an exception.

 

PS

 

I'm really depressed that Larry is not a Cleveland Indians fan. I would enjoy watching him tie himself in knots in defense of Chief Wahoo.

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But they (the dictionaries) did change the definitions. It's been documented what the FIRST usage of the word Redskins meant.

 

the definition that seemed most apt to was from the oxford one. While the word was literally use to describe the characteristics of the people, it said it came to have pejorative connotations. I don't know when society decided back then it was a "bad word" but I think the bigger issue is naming a franchise over an ethnic race. Just seems like bad policy. 

 

Also, do people actually think they can convince, meriam-webster, oxford and all other dictionaries back to what the "original intent" of the word was? I don't think PC society will let that happen. 

Edited by nuposse87
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There is really nothing for Snyder to win.  The overwhelming majority have no problem with it.  It would only be a losing battle if the majority were offended and revenue took a hit because of it.  Those wanting a change are fighting the losing battle, not Snyder.

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We are losing the battle

 

If you look at this in terms of we only need a couple more decades to brainwash an entire race of people into believing that this Football team named to honor them, with a Native American logo on the helmet, and a legion of devoted fans who sing "Hail to the Redskins" before every game, and after every score, is ACTUALLY disparaging and disrespecting them.  

Edited by Painkiller

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There is really nothing for Snyder to win.  The overwhelming majority have no problem with it.  It would only be a losing battle if the majority were offended and revenue took a hit because of it.  Those wanting a change are fighting the losing battle, not Snyder.

 

As far as trademark battle goes (the one potential form of revenue loss that could coerce a name change), each time the plaintiff's have failed to show how the team used the name in a derogatory fashion.

 

I think if Snyder pulled an FSU with some local tribes, who have already gone on record in favor of the name, it would end a lot of the noise, not all, but a significant portions, especially in the media.

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I will say this...strictly speaking...some of the logo designs I have seen for a renamed Washington Redskins are really cool looking. Some are atrocious.  

 

The only thing that would eventually make a name change tolerable is if they came up with something that frankly....doesn't suck.  

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Here is a couple questions for the masses.  

 

Do you think people would expect this team to retain Native American imagery if the name had to be changed?  

 

Not understanding that the racist Harjo eventually wants ALL Native American imagery removed from sports teams?

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Here is a couple questions for the masses.  

 

Do you think people would expect this team to retain Native American imagery if the name had to be changed?  

 

Not understanding that the racist Harjo eventually wants ALL Native American imagery removed from sports teams?

I think it's pretty much a slam dunk that if the name changes, they will go with the Warriors and the armed forces route. I mean, Warriors is such a generic name, but if it honors the armed forces, I am down with it. 

However, if they do decide to keep the Native American imagery. and go with the Warriors, it would be interesting to see how they would make it work. 

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Here is a couple questions for the masses.  

 

Do you think people would expect this team to retain Native American imagery if the name had to be changed?  

 

Not understanding that the racist Harjo eventually wants ALL Native American imagery removed from sports teams?

If you change the name, who might or will be offended? If even one person is offended......bla,bla bla

 

The term Tarheal was offensive to most people in North Carolina 200 years ago, now try to take that nick name away from them. Words are only as offensive as you allow them to be. To most of us, Redskins mean pride, respect, honor, and tradition. All of those who try to say it racist term just don't get it, and never will.

Oh yeah, almost forgot. 

 

To Whom it may concern, jms, not very wise mike, cowgirl costas, crissy wourthless....for you,

 

1385422_10200795195821655_1025165982_n.j

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I think it's pretty much a slam dunk that if the name changes, they will go with the Warriors and the armed forces route. I mean, Warriors is such a generic name, but if it honors the armed forces, I am down with it.

However, if they do decide to keep the Native American imagery. and go with the Warriors, it would be interesting to see how they would make it work.

I'd rather the team get out of the honoring business if the name had to change. No military. No Native American imagery. Just go with something wonderfully sports appropriate that doesn't require the team to give any current group special attention or consideration. Snyder and the team can honor anyone they want by supporting causes and charities.

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I'd rather the team get out of the honoring business if the name had to change. No military. No Native American imagery. Just go with something wonderfully sports appropriate that doesn't require the team to give any current group special attention or consideration. Snyder and the team can honor anyone they want by supporting causes and charities.

If that is the case, I would like us to go with what I originally said and that is The Football Club of Washington.

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If that is the case, I would like us to go with what I originally said and that is The Football Club of Washington.

I like that, FCWDC and make shirts like the FDNY. No logo just the acronym.

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Personally the Washington REDSKINS is the final connection I have to the D.C. area. I grew up in Hyattsville, Maryland as a Redskins Fan. I took them with me to Florida when my parents and I move down there in the mid '80s. I brought them with me when I moved to North Georgia. I have Redskins pictures and banner hanging on the wall of the family room.

If the name Redskins goes, I may go as well.

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