The Official ES All Things Redskins Name Change Thread (Reboot Edition---Read New OP)

[Momma There Goes That Man]

12 hours ago, dfitzo53 said:

To paraphrase Indiana Jones's father, "@ConnSKINS26, let it go."

Son of a **** I already used this reference while getting caught up on this thread only to find this posted on the next page. Now I look like a jackass using the same reference so close together 

 

it’s unbecoming 

[88Comrade2000]

All that’s going to happen this year is the removal of the name and logo.

 

We will have a temporary name for 2020. Probably something generic like Washington Football Club.

 

A permanent name will happen in 2021.

[Riggo#44]

2 hours ago, -JB- said:

Here’s what we are up against.. Another excerpt but this time from Erik Brady’s column in USA Today.

 

“But let’s say, for the sake of argument, that the team jettisons all Native American imagery and still chooses Warriors. Sorry, that won’t work either: Some Washington fans would see it as an invitation to continue dressing up as play Indians — more white guys in war paint.”

 

Oh, you mean like Chief Zee?

 

They can ban this sort of behavior, can't they? Even fan base has its assholes, how is the team responsible for idiot fans? The Eagles certainly don't condone horse****-eating, do they? 

 

This seems like being a dick for the sake of being a dick.

12 hours ago, CRobi21 said:

@Jumbo

 

Have the mods looked into a "Dislike" feature for posts? A post gets enough dislikes that user gets a temp-ban?

 

 

Um, I don't like that. @Spaceman Spiff, @Dont Taze Me Bro, and several others will just down vote everything I post. (Mostly because they can't handle me keepin' it real)

[Momma There Goes That Man]

11 hours ago, Mr. Sinister said:

A trident would offend people who paid to go see Aquaman

 

11 hours ago, The Evil Genius said:

All 6 of them.

There were 7 of us! 

[MartinC]

45 minutes ago, heyholetsgogrant said:

 

It appears all of the threads associated with names changes in the Stadium are closed?

Yeah. I wasn’t aware when I posted the above - the thread in the Stadium was closed at the request of the person who started it and at MOD discretion. It had become a **** show of people flinging mud at each other.

[Dissident2]

3 minutes ago, MartinC said:

Yeah. I wasn’t aware when I posted the above - the thread in the Stadium was closed at the request of the person who started it and at MOD discretion. It had become a **** show of people flinging mud at each other.

 

Sure didn't SMELL like mud. 

[RichmondRedskin88]

12 minutes ago, Rdskns2000 said:

All that’s going to happen this year is the removal of the name and logo.

 

We will have a temporary name for 2020. Probably something generic like Washington Football Club.

 

A permanent name will happen in 2021.

Doubt it.  They want this over quickly.  Letting this hang over is just a distraction plus they won’t want to hear commentators go on non stop about the temp name.  I’m sure networks will be told to just go with the new name and avoid the discussion on the air. 

[MartinC]

2 minutes ago, Dissident2 said:

 

Sure didn't SMELL like mud. 

Very true.

[Commander PK]

19 minutes ago, Rdskns2000 said:

All that’s going to happen this year is the removal of the name and logo.

 

We will have a temporary name for 2020. Probably something generic like Washington Football Club.

 

A permanent name will happen in 2021.

 

I hope not.  I'm like Rivera, the sooner the better.  Once you accept the name must go, it is relatively easy to pick a replacement.  Now a fully realized logo and branding could take some time.  Even the Ravens ended up changing their original logo just a few years in to the one we see now.  The original looked a lot different.  

[Dissident2]

2 minutes ago, RichmondRedskin88 said:

Doubt it.  They want this over quickly.  Letting this hang over is just a distraction plus they won’t want to hear commentators go on non stop about the temp name.  I’m sure networks will be told to just go with the new name and avoid the discussion on the air. 

 

Which is insane really. They need to take their time with this, they need to allow fans to weigh in, and I think they should even have the opportunity to let NAs en masse weigh in on a new name and look. I absolutely hate how this is being railroaded into something we're all going to have to live with for who knows how long. 

 

I really think they should just make an announcement that the name and logo will be changing in 2021. This is the final year of "Redskins" and the current helmet. The reason for this is not to cause further offense, but to conduct this rebranding the way it SHOULD be conducted and the way it HAS been conducted by other teams for decades. This should NOT be a two-month process or whatever it's been. It also gives fans an opportunity to say goodbye. I know many will find fault with THAT idea, but, respectfully, **** that. They're ultimately getting what they want, and to demand this happen in this sort of warp-speed way, which can cause so many issues down the road, is simply wrong. 

 

Besides, I would personally be shocked if we have a full season of games this year. You're probably not going to have many "Redskin" games anyway considering this ****ing pandemic. Do the right thing for the longterm. 

[No Excuses]

Can anyone point to the origin of “The Redskins name was honoring Native Americans” talking point?

 

Comes across as a wholly disingenuous claim for the franchise that was last to integrate and was basically forced to do it.

[Jumbo]

if you actually read the threads final post i made on the last page (as we've often done here forever when closing a thread) in the closed "logo"  thread and the earlier post it directs you to you'll get the info on why and what you should and should't do--and while not it's not always an automatic yes from a mod in response, the close was also requested by the op towards the end of the thread

 

there is also a pinned locked thread at the top of the stadium that give instructions everyone should know by now

 

no active poster has a good excuse  for not knowing by now, period

 

link: 

 

 

 

any mod who wants to reopen that to stop the willfully blind from posting on logos in  here (haha), can feel free to do so

 

 

now ya'all need to internalize this to protect your posting privileges, becuase warnings are done: repeatedly off-topic (non-humorous), uber-repetitive, fixated types will be banned from the topic just like we did to more than a few such folk in the infamous rg3ocd days, or it will be bans depending on the case

 

some people are posting they're close to leaving the team as a fan, and that's always ok anytime and this org has given the fans plenty of reasons to leave long before this

 

but this site will be moving on from some of the posters who can't follow mod directives made over and over again and who keep ignoring warnings

[Spaceman Spiff]

31 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said:

 

They can ban this sort of behavior, can't they? Even fan base has its assholes, how is the team responsible for idiot fans? The Eagles certainly don't condone horse****-eating, do they? 

 

This seems like being a dick for the sake of being a dick.

 

Um, I don't like that. @Spaceman Spiff, @Dont Taze Me Bro, and several others will just down vote everything I post. (Mostly because they can't handle me keepin' it real)

 

Eh, I think if anyone cares about how many likes/dislikes a post gets, their priorities are a bit out of whack.  For the record, I wouldn't downvote anything you say, there's no real reason to.

[Riggo#44]

1 minute ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

 

Eh, I think if anyone cares about how many likes/dislikes a post gets, their priorities are a bit out of whack.  For the record, I wouldn't downvote anything you say, there's no real reason to.

 

I figured at this point it would just be a reflex

 

(by the way, that was a joke, much like the Orioles...  )

[Momma There Goes That Man]

41 minutes ago, RichmondRedskin88 said:

We get it already you want to change everything.  Maybe we should just send the team to Nebraska and wait for a expansion team then? 
 

Spears were used throughout history and if we’re the warriors there’s absolutely no reason it can’t be used.  Hell I think of Trojan War before NA as far as spears.  If we were changing from anything else but a Native American reference no one would raise a eye brow to a spear. If someone finds a spear offensive they should consultant a psychologist.

 

And we already get that you are digging up every possible negative connotation for every single team name you can find, as if that matters at all or changes anything. Those teams can answer for those, it doesn't impact whether or not we should change our name at all. 

 

Saying a spear is not NA imagery may fly in a vacuum but in the context of this team that has repeatedly used spears as a logo and part of our imagery, it's a lie and nobody will buy it which is why we won't be using it.

[Spaceman Spiff]

3 minutes ago, Riggo#44 said:

 

I figured at this point it would just be a reflex

 

(by the way, that was a joke, much like the Orioles...  )

 

Well, yes, my baseball team is terrible, much like my football team.  Let me know if you have any original thoughts on either matter. 

 

Anyway, I think we'll get an announcement in the next few days on a name change.  

[Conn]

11 minutes ago, No Excuses said:

Can anyone point to the origin of “The Redskins name was honoring Native Americans” talking point?

 

Comes across as a wholly disingenuous claim for the franchise that was last to integrate and was basically forced to do it.

 

The idea is because Marshall named it that when we had a Native American HC, it was to honor him.

 

Except then someone here (in defense of it somehow) posted a link explaining that Marshall would make the HC wear a headress on the sideline and make other members of staff wear warpaint etc.....so it was obviously always exploitative and treated as a gameday sideshow for the entertainment of the fans. Not an honor, a racist marketing gimmick for white man's entertainment.

[Spaceman Spiff]

18 minutes ago, Dissident2 said:

 

Which is insane really. They need to take their time with this, they need to allow fans to weigh in, and I think they should even have the opportunity to let NAs en masse weigh in on a new name and look. I absolutely hate how this is being railroaded into something we're all going to have to live with for who knows how long. 

 

I really think they should just make an announcement that the name and logo will be changing in 2021. This is the final year of "Redskins" and the current helmet. The reason for this is not to cause further offense, but to conduct this rebranding the way it SHOULD be conducted and the way it HAS been conducted by other teams for decades. This should NOT be a two-month process or whatever it's been. It also gives fans an opportunity to say goodbye. I know many will find fault with THAT idea, but, respectfully, **** that. They're ultimately getting what they want, and to demand this happen in this sort of warp-speed way, which can cause so many issues down the road, is simply wrong. 

 

Besides, I would personally be shocked if we have a full season of games this year. You're probably not going to have many "Redskin" games anyway considering this ****ing pandemic. Do the right thing for the longterm. 

 

I think letting fans weigh in isn't a good idea.  That's how you ended up with the Sea Dogs, Express, Stallions, Dragons and Wizards.  And then you get the "keep it!!!!111 or else!!!!111" crowd.  

 

If they are going to let anyone else weigh in, I agree it should be left up to Native Americans.  Quite frankly, I'm tired of a certain group of people in this country informing me on when I should be offended by something.  It should be left up to the group that is being offended, let them speak for themselves.  Too many people and companies are virtue signaling (yep, I said it) and getting caught up in trying to let everyone know that they're on the right side of history to even care what the offended minority group of people has to say on the subject themselves.  

 

But even then, we're all aware that Native Americans can't all agree on this...which is to be expected, it's hard for any group to 100% agree on one thing.  You have Native Americans who don't feel that their imagery should be related to sports, you have some that don't care and you have some that like it and are in favor of it.  It would be hard to get a consensus answer from them.

 

I don't feel the need to say goodbye to a team name/logo mascot.  I say goodbye to friends and family members, business associates and people in stores that I visit, not inanimate objects, logos and concepts.  You can say goodbye all you want, no one's saying goodbye back.  The DMV area will still have a football team, that's the most important thing, this isn't the Colts leaving in the middle of the night.  I also don't feel the need for outpouring of emotion for a team name and logo that's been abused and tarnished for years by Dan Snyder.  Other teams rebrand, other teams take their time and still come up with terrible jerseys and logos, the idea and notion that other teams take their time doesn't hold any water.  Look at the new Rams logo, it's terrible.  The new Bucs jerseys are pretty weak.  How much time, effort and money went into those efforts?

 

Ultimately, I agree though, there will not be a season this year so perhaps they can take their time, not that I think taking their time is what matters.  

[BurgundyMalaise]

Yeah, I've been a fervent, vocal Skins fan growing up, taking **** from redneck Ravens fans in the boonies my whole life. Never once thought of abandoning our sinking and dry-rotted ship but I'll be out as a "fan" of the team if they drop everything, and replace it with some lame red, white and blue palette and have ties to the military/monuments, etc. It's so lazy and pandering, just like how the NFL panders to the military every game. That would be like me rooting for the NFL (outside of individual players) rather than our team which has been the redheaded stepchild of the division in which us die-hards held firm with, often to the point of NFL fan pariah territory. If that were the case, I'd never buy any new merch or attend games again. If I want the NFL live experience, I guess I'd put money in Bisciotti's pocket. Better experience anyways, regardless of any phony fakeover we would endure. Snyder still sucks.

 

Regardless of the socio-political climate, I believe it's odd that it is so taboo to reference the honorable traits (obv the name is different) of the original inhabitants of the continent, even for something like a football team. I know some natives feel differently and their opinions are more important it just stinks of leftist white sanctimony. Actually, it would be pretty hilarious if they ended up replacing the noble, classic, Indian profile with some generic soldier avatar associated with one of the old wars. In essence, replacing the Natives place in pop culture nomenclature with predominantly white "saviors" ...

 

[RichmondRedskin88]

26 minutes ago, Momma There Goes That Man said:

 

Saying a spear is not NA imagery may fly in a vacuum but in the context of this team that has repeatedly used spears as a logo and part of our imagery, it's a lie and nobody will buy it which is why we won't be using it.

That’s your opinion.  Whether or not it is used has yet to be determined.  There’s a big difference between using a Native American as our main logo and a spear which has been used on all kinds of contexts.  Throw in Riviera’s comments it’s completely believable we may use a spear.  

[Riggo#44]

29 minutes ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

Anyway, I think we'll get an announcement in the next few days on a name change.

 

I am hoping it's sooner rather than later. You'd hope that Snyder had enough foresight (ok stop laughing) to have contingency plans in place, maybe some preliminary designs in place? If Russell is right and the place is in chaos--more so than it already is--it'll be a while before we see anything.

[Spaceman Spiff]

Just now, Riggo#44 said:

 

I am hoping it's sooner rather than later. You'd hope that Snyder had enough foresight (ok stop laughing) to have contingency plans in place, maybe some preliminary designs in place? If Russell is right and the place is in chaos--more so than it already is--it'll be a while before we see anything.

 

I would think that over the years, he's probably had a thought or two about..."If I had to change it, what would it be?"  I think that would be a natural thought to have but I wouldn't call that a contingency plan of any sort.

 

[Dissident2]

4 minutes ago, Spaceman Spiff said:

If they are going to let anyone else weigh in, I agree it should be left up to Native Americans.  Quite frankly, I'm tired of a certain group of people in this country informing me on when I should be offended by something.  It should be left up to the group that is being offended, let them speak for themselves.  Too many people and companies are virtue signaling (yep, I said it) and getting caught up in trying to let everyone know that they're on the right side of history to even care what the offended minority group of people has to say on the subject themselves.  

 

I also don't feel the need for outpouring of emotion for a team name and logo that's been abused and tarnished for years by Dan Snyder.  Other teams rebrand, other teams take their time and still come up with terrible jerseys and logos, the idea and notion that other teams take their time doesn't hold any water.  Look at the new Rams logo, it's terrible.  The new Bucs jerseys are pretty weak.  How much time, effort and money went into those efforts?

 

Ultimately, I agree though, there will not be a season this year so perhaps they can take their time, not that I think taking their time is what matters.  

 

I agree with a lot of what you say. This is part of the big problem I have with the whole "cancel culture" movement. There can be some instances where that type of approach is warranted, but there are many other times when it becomes a mindless mob mentality that does far more harm than good. The flurry of company statements that were released related to the BLM moment overall rang so hollow to me. You could sense the corporate stooges saying, "We have to get this statement out there fast or we'll be labeled as a racist organization/company!" Much of it was obviously coming from a good place, but a lot of it was also coming from that fear of being singled out. So much of the reaction to "cancel culture" doesn't truly change people's hearts and minds, which should be the ultimate goal. It just invokes fear of being targeted or publicly shamed, and that leads to resentment and that resentment sometimes boils over into OTHER extreme reactions like, imo, the one that resulted in our current president. 

 

As far as the goodbye thing, maybe it's my age and my general nostalgic nature. I came up in the late 70s, and the Redskins were/are an absolute part of my DNA. My best and strongest memories are of the team when it was respected and when it was a clear winner. I would never hold that nostalgia in such high esteem as to overshadow the feelings of another culture that might consider my team name or logo "racist" or a source of hurt and pain. Clearly that's far, far more important to consider. But there really are so many differing viewpoints even among NA culture out there on the logo, etc., that I think a definite argument could be made for a "goodbye" period for sappy fans like me. As ridiculous as it might sound, I would still like the opportunity to say goodbye to this team on the field before it dies.

[BurgundyMalaise]

35 minutes ago, RichmondRedskin88 said:

That’s your opinion.  Whether or not it is used has yet to be determined.  There’s a big difference between using a Native American as our main logo and a spear which has been used on all kinds of contexts.  Throw in Riviera’s comments it’s completely believable we may use a spear.  

 

Man, if we got negative blowback from changing the name to the Warriors and keeping a vague-looking spear (one that looks like the classic helmet but more ambiguous as to what group it represents) it's basically caving into the unreasonable crowd, who say they want to change the name and association but really just want to uproot anything that has "tradition," much like statues and history and all that other crap. The demands to get rid of the logo and colors and everything else associated with the team is a power-grab move to dismantle "white people" traditions.

 

It's like a crude version of "give an inch, take a mile," except giving up the name for a lot of fans is giving a mile and a full on rebrand with new everything is basically taking part of our souls lmao. Anyone who opposes us having a burgundy and gold ambiguous spear helmet and being called the Warriors can **** off. It's never enough for these internet slacktivists. The corporate version of America sucks.

[VeroViper]

As of a few days ago it seemed we would have a name change(ie Warriors) and be able to retain the colors and logo. Why has that suddenly changed? Are corporate sponsors now demanding a complete rebrand? I can't seem to find any solid info on this. Why the change in tone on this?