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The Official ES All Things Redskins Name Change Thread (Reboot Edition---Read New OP)


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Somewhat interesting article about sports brand equity:

 

We would be naive to think the only real costs to re-branding the Redskins would be putting the new name on everything and the only effect it would really have on fans is them buying new team jerseys.

 

 

Very interesting article. I personally really don't see myself wearing a new logo. 

It won't be enough for some of the activists. 

 

But will it be enough for 90% of folks? 

 

(Problem with that point, though.  Seems like "Redskins" is good enough for 90% of folks, already.) 

 

(Yes, I'm rounding things off and speaking in generalities.  This was not a post about statistical analysis and margins of error.

 

I don't know why Larry but after reading a few posts above this last disclaimer reminded me of a pharmaceutical ad. lol.  

I could hear it in a nondescript voice over. lol. 

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At the crux of the problem is the name. I could probably handle losing the logo if it were replaced with a Redskins "R" or an arrow. I couldn't handle losing the name Redskins and keeping the imagery. I wouldn't identify with a Washington team that has the look of the Redskins but has the name of the Warriors or Braves.

The Warriors are a ****ty California basketball team and the Braves are a baseball team I hate that has half their fanbase populated by bandwagoners. Neither of those are the name of the Washington football team.

Edited by SpringfieldSkins
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We would be naive to think the only real costs to re-branding the Redskins would be putting the new name on everything and the only effect it would really have on fans is them buying new team jerseys.

 

I'm naive.  Tell me what a name change would do to the bottom line of the Redskins as a profitable organization.  And as I asked at the beginning, give me specifics.

 

Have you wondered why the Redskins are valued at $1.3 billion? Ever wonder why ALL NFL franchises aren't valued at that amount?

A big part of that is its loyal fan base. (And I'm not convinced that fan base would abandon the team because of a name change. I wouldn't. Would you?)

A bigger part of that is that, unlike most NFL teams, the Redskins own the stadium they play in.

 

My conclusion is that a name and a logo are important in sport branding. Recently, we saw it when more than 16,000 fans of the English football club Everton protested against the club’s new crest...

Don't bring soccer fans into this. Those ****ers are crazy.

Edited by Dan T.
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One major problem that I think the team is going to have moving forward, is keeping that minority element of the fan base who just want this to go away from exerting too much influence.

 

If you want the name to change, and you are a fan of the Washington Redskins...I ask you please make sure that you want it for a good reason.  If you want the name to change because 10 to 20% of Native Americans and 10 to 20% of the rest of America find it offensive, and that is enough for you....than so be it.  Own that position.

 

...but for me, if you want the name to stay, but simply want this controversy to go away more, it means you are caving under pressure,

 

Don't cave under the pressure.  Fight the good fight if you believe in it. 

 

Obviously, this is rhetorical and not meant for any single member or other reader of this thread.

Edited by Painkiller
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A big part of that is its loyal fan base. (And I'm not convinced that fan base would abandon the team because of a name change. I wouldn't. Would you?)

I might.

I would try. It wouldn't be the same team though. It could be years before I buy anything related to the new team. I don't see millions of die hard Redskins fans jumping out of their shoes to buy some new Washington Warriors jersey just because the team changed it's name. We aren't sheep.

Dan would lose money (make less money) if the team changed it's name.

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Hail yeah I support the name, ordering one today. 

 

 

redskinsshirt_zps62a19090.png

 

http://httr4life.spreadshirt.com/hail-yeah-i-support-the-name-t-shirt-A16575210/customize/color/22

 

 

Support the team with this HAIL YEAH "I Support The Name" T-Shirt. ALL proceeds from this shirt will be donated to "The Native Americans Who Support the Name Fund" to further awareness of the term "Redskin" and Native culture as a whole.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

 

https://m.facebook.com/ChippewaCree?_rdr

 

The Chippewa Cree Tribe of Rocky Boy Montana
Jul 17 at 4:30pm · 
Team Redskins, with the generous support of the Washington Redskins Original Americans Foundation is proud to announce that we will building a new rodeo theme playground for the children of the Rocky Boys Reservation, Montana.

The playground, which is the first phase of other… See More
Edited by SWFLSkins
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A big part of that is its loyal fan base. (And I'm not convinced that fan base would abandon the team because of a name change. I wouldn't. Would you?)

 

In truth, it probably depends on how it is viewed.  Some will not forgive Dan if the impression is that he just buckled under the pressure of a relentless minority percentage of people backed up by a relentless media that is bullying the NFL and the team.

 

If Dan was somehow actually forced to change the name through a major loss in his bottom line...different story.      

 

Also in truth, I would probably not leave the team either...because there is no question this is a tough predicament.  He's damned if he does and damned if he doesn't, but I wouldn't blame anybody who did jump ship.  The bottom line, is it would just not be the same, and when you have generations of Redskins fans involved....multi-generational fandom passed down through the years (such as my family) people will be far less apt to just "get over it"

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I might.

I would try. It wouldn't be the same team though. It could be years before I buy anything related to the new team. I don't see millions of die hard Redskins fans jumping out of their shoes to buy some new Washington Warriors jersey just because the team changed it's name. We aren't sheep.

I defintely agree that merch sales would move much slower than most in favor or indifferent to a name change would like to admit. NFL merch costs a pretty penny and it's hard for people to justify buying things like a second RGIII authentic a couple years after they got their first just so they can stay current.

As I've stated before, for me personally it would all have to depend on how a new logo or jersey would look. I'm a bigger fan of the Wizards than any DC sports franchise but I never really bought merch until they reverted to the old bullets look.

When it comes to the Skins though I'm the exact opposite, the team colors, at least as arranged look terrible on me. If they changed to something new that didn't I'd probably be all in on a jersey or a ballcap or two.

 

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Dedicated to the Native American fans of the team.  "Don't let this white man's world tell you what (offends) you."  I'm sure there are those who will try to apply this same song to the other side of the argument, but I think the larger point is let them decide what is best for them.

 

They don't need the enemy to "save" them, unless you are planning to donate your time and finances to help them with their real problems.

 

Kick ass track.  

 

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I'm trying to figure out - specifically - how a name change would effect a team's bottom line.  The physical rebranding of stuff has fixed costs associated with it. That's measurable.

I have no idea how large a part of the fan base roots for the team based on its NA iconography, anecdotally at least some portion of NAs do.  I do believe that most team loyalty is geographic.  It would probably depend on how well the new name, theme, and colors were received (and the success of the team). 

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I have no idea how large a part of the fan base roots for the team based on its NA iconography, anecdotally at least some portion of NAs do.  I do believe that most team loyalty is geographic.  It would probably depend on how well the new name, theme, and colors were received (and the success of the team). 

 

I doubt fan loyalty is based on NA iconography. It's based on the emotional experiences associated with rooting for and following the team...the name and emblem give fans an extremely strong link to those emotions and experiences, no matter what the iconography is based on. And that name and emblem connect generations of fans who have experienced different highs and successes in different eras.

 

If the Skins change their name/emblem, none of the past success and emotional connection will be associated with whatever new name they come up with, only the present success--or lack of--will be associated with it. If the Redskins had become the Warriors in 2009, fans on the whole would associate the ultra-crappy performances of 2009, 2010, 2011 and 2013 with the name "Warriors", not Darrell Green or John Riggins 4th down TD run or Moss' "Monday Night Miracle" destrusction of the Cowboys or Sean Taylor or Doug Williams' 2nd quarter frenzy in the SB, or any number of highlights associated with the Redskins. In fact, they would probably blame the name change for the suck of the last 5 years. If this were the Jaguars it might be different. They don't have much of a history...but even they wouldn't think about re-branding without also moving to another city.

Edited by Califan007
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I'm part Native, & I consider myself one of the most rabid, loyal, dedicated of fans if we're labeling fandom. As I had thought about this several times, I had always believed that I would still support the team...inconsequential of what it was named. Today I realize that this simply isn't true.

1) I root for this team in large part because of the representation. It is a source of pride, & gives me something to cheer for besides seeing everyone get off of our rock.

2) to lose that name & imagery would not only revoke that source of pride, but would replace the "team formerly known as Redskins" in my heart with an empty shell of a franchise masquerading as a 15" tumorous mass that hurts to the touch, & immeasurably so to the mention...right on both eyeballs. It would hurt with searing pain to watch the Washington Whatevertheyrecalled play on TV, & to see or hear mention of every naive, hate mongering, race-baiting, white-guilt sycophant celebrating at the monumental epicness of momentus revolutionary progress would literally make me wince in pain, & lose my appetite.

3) I live, & have always lived in LA. We're getting a franchise soon. I have always maintained that when this happens I would get season seats, & still root for the Redskins as my #1 team (unless it's the Raiders or Chargers). If the name gets forcibly changed, & it is not Dr. Who, crushingly, Gohan obliteratingly, Hulk demolishingly epic...I don't know how I could bring myself to care as much as I would my local team with just as fresh a start.

I know it would be the same historical franchise...but then again...it won't be. So yeah...you probably do lose me. Mostly out of a combination of a sequence of circumstances....but yeah.

Now how many more of much less loyal, dedicated, passion would follow suit? I'd say the term is "SELL SELL SELL!!!"

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At the crux of the problem is the name. I could probably handle losing the logo if it were replaced with a Redskins "R" or an arrow. I couldn't handle losing the name Redskins and keeping the imagery. I wouldn't identify with a Washington team that has the look of the Redskins but has the name of the Warriors or Braves.

The Warriors are a ****ty California basketball team and the Braves are a baseball team I hate that has half their fanbase populated by bandwagoners. Neither of those are the name of the Washington football team.

That last paragraph is wrong on both fronts.

I might.

I would try. It wouldn't be the same team though. It could be years before I buy anything related to the new team. I don't see millions of die hard Redskins fans jumping out of their shoes to buy some new Washington Warriors jersey just because the team changed it's name. We aren't sheep.

Dan would lose money (make less money) if the team changed it's name.

Wait..so you accuse half of the Braves fan base of being "band wagoners" (even though they haven't won a title since 1995), yet you would possibly stop rooting for the Redskins if they change the name?

Makes sense.

/sarcasm

Edited by Bubble Screen
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s0crates,

 

I seriously doubt it'll attract more fans versus repelling old fans if we were to rebrand. Much more to lose on Snyders end than gain in this situation. This is not the same situation with the Bullets/Wizards, Redskins are on a whole different spectrum monetary and fanbase wise.

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So on Mike and Mike this morning, Greeny is asking people should he refrain from saying Redskins on air because he thinks the name should change. He admits he's done no research on the name, but thinks it's "common sense" it's racist, while completely ignoring all tweets educating him on the matter.

 

Meanwhile, the usual Name Change tweeters were out in full force throwing hyperbole all over the place and either making up their own facts or ignoring the real facts. One guy had the audacity to claim Goddard said it was a slur, posted a section of his paper that doesn't mention anything remotely to what he claimed, and refused to admit he's lying.

 

There is no debating anything with people like this.

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Yeah, I'm still gonna root for them whether they are the Redskins or not. They'll still have the same history. That's not changing.

I'll still remember 2005, 2007, and 2012. You old heads are still gonna remember the 3 titles. Basically, I'm saying you guys aren't going anywhere.

I doubt it changes any time soon but it it did, you may be pissed for awhile but you'd get over it. We love the team too much

Edited by BRAVEONTHEWARPATH93
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Over the last 50 years, has any NFL team re-branded itself without also moving to another city/state?

 

Yes. The Titans kept the Oilers name for 2 season before changing to the Titans. But yes, that was due in part to a move. But I don't think any NFL team has changed their name for the sake of changing their name. Don't think it's happened in the NFL or NHL either. Only ones I can think of are the Pelicans (formerly the Hornets) and the Hornets (formerly Bobcats and Hornets).

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Yes. The Titans kept the Oilers name for 2 season before changing to the Titans. But yes, that was due in part to a move. But I don't think any NFL team has changed their name for the sake of changing their name. Don't think it's happened in the NFL or NHL either. Only ones I can think of are the Pelicans (formerly the Hornets) and the Hornets (formerly Bobcats and Hornets).

 

The NBA examples are teams that moved.

 

The Titans changed from Oilers because they were not in their own stadium. They waited until the stadium was built. So it was a move.

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The NBA examples are teams that moved.

 

The Titans changed from Oilers because they were not in their own stadium. They waited until the stadium was built. So it was a move.

 

Moved, yes. But the New Orleans Hornets kept their name for a while before changing to Pelicans. They were the Hornets for 11 years.

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