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The Official ES All Things Redskins Name Change Thread (Reboot Edition---Read New OP)


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at least the slate article acknowledges their are high school teams named 'redskins' (conveniently leaving out the fact that some of them are native american). and even notes the term may be 'only a bit' offensive- a far cry from the 'obvious slur' that most make it out to be.

 

Somehow, I'm willing to bet that it doesn't once mention the fact that it isn't offensive. 

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I've stated my position numerous times throughout this Cult of Colt....er....Name, thread...

 

I don't want them to change the name, I don't think Dan has to change the name, and I think people are too quick to make snap judgements without knowing the facts.

 

What is really alarming to me, and yes I know Dan did say he would "NEVER" change the name, is the lack of education or release of historical items behind the team name and logo.  I would never trust or truly encourage our PR department to do anything having seen how they have handled themselves for two decades....but does anybody else think its weird that the team never discusses the following:

 

*Walter Wetzel

*Ives Goddard - or other historical / significant quotes of Native American tribal leaders referencing themselves as "Red Skins"

*Suzan Harjo's "Seeing Red" radio show - or other standout forms of hypocricy like "Oklahoma"

 

It almost makes me think they are, sooner than later, going to move away from Redskins.  The ammunition is out there and they are clearly NOT using it. 

 

Washington Burgundy and Gold works for me - and I'll ALWAYS rock my Sean Taylor authentic...and follow the franchise religiously 24 / 7 / 365

Edited by Troy Fakeman
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Troy,

 

The poll that says that 90% of Natives say that the name of the Redskins isn't offensive is around 10 years old. 

 

Do you think Tony Kornheiser (to use him as an icon for the media in general):

 

1)  Has never been told this?

2)  Knows it, and chooses not to mention it?

 

Far as I'm concerned, that poll completely settles the issue.  When the question is "Is the name offensive?", and 90% of people say "no", then the only evidence that could possibly dispute that, would be another poll, that says differently. 

 

(And I assert that there's exactly one possible reason why Harjo et al haven't run another poll.  It because they know what the results would be.) 

 

No, the media (well, most of them.  No doubt there's some who are simply ignorant) knows what the facts are.  (At least that one fact.)  And they've made a conscious decision to leave that fact out of the discussion, and to simply announce that the name is offensive, despite the fact that it isn't.  

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at least the slate article acknowledges their are high school teams named 'redskins' (conveniently leaving out the fact that some of them are native american). and even notes the term may be 'only a bit' offensive- a far cry from the 'obvious slur' that most make it out to be.

 

Somehow, I'm willing to bet that it doesn't once mention the fact that it isn't offensive. 

 

Definitely does not - its the same trash you see from Steinberg, Boren, Wise, Kornehiser, Wilbon, Graziano...the ENTIRE Around the Horn cast...or any other prominent member of today's sports media. 

 

Considering Goodell's stance and that he is a Redskins fan - HE should be the one to come out and educate the sports media / general public on Walter Wetzel providing the design and concept of our current logo, as well as highlight the many forms of evidence supporting how Native Americans once referred to themselves as Red / Red people / Red Skins. 

 

We can sit here and cry "facts" all we want...but neither of us on here has the ability to reverse the current trend on this issue.  It has to start with Goodell or some really good campaigning from Dan. 

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Troy,

 

The poll that says that 90% of Natives say that the name of the Redskins isn't offensive is around 10 years old. 

 

Do you think Tony Kornheiser (to use him as an icon for the media in general):

 

1)  Has never been told this?

2)  Knows it, and chooses not to mention it?

 

Far as I'm concerned, that poll completely settles the issue.  When the question is "Is the name offensive?", and 90% of people say "no", then the only evidence that could possibly dispute that, would be another poll, that says differently. 

 

(And I assert that there's exactly one possible reason why Harjo et al haven't run another poll.  It because they know what the results would be.) 

 

No, the media (well, most of them.  No doubt there's some who are simply ignorant) knows what the facts are.  (At least that one fact.)  And they've made a conscious decision to leave that fact out of the discussion, and to simply announce that the name is offensive, despite the fact that it isn't.  

 

 

Good questions Larry - a few things come to mind...

 

For starters the polls have already started to shift.  The shift is slight, I agree...but they are already changing from that 90%.  Tony Kornheiser, if he is the example we want to discuss, most likely has NO idea about Suzan Harjo's radio show...or the true definition of "Oklahoma".  And to be fair...I myself didn't know the definition of Oklahoma until a Redskins fan pointed it out to me like three years ago.  Secondly, and I'm completely allowed to say the following and have the necessary credentials to state what I'm about to say, Tony Kornheiser is a member of the tribe, or in other words, is also Jewish...like Dan.  He would never try to do anything to hurt Dan or Dan's business.  I doubt Tony K has some malicious intention to just hide or fail to recognize certain facts that would support Dan's business.  I do, however and like most people in here, agree that people in the media have NO choice but to go with the current media status quo and just say "It's racist".  Earlier in this thread I noted this...b/c nobody in media can afford to be "branded" as such. 

 

But when I talk about educating those on the facts or "campaigning'...I guess I should clarify that Goodell or Dan's PR department should be doing this to the general public, and then letting the sports media pundits re-evaluate their stance.  I think it would at least soften the blow, right? 

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The Green Bay packers CEO Mark Murphy was on the radio yesterday. He mentioned that the Redskins nickname is “very derogatory to a lot of people”.

 

Funny how he never complained about the Redskins name during his tenure from1977-1984.

 

I think Green Bay should change their name because it's possible 10% of homosexuals may be offended.

 

Giants may be offensive to the obese, so we better dump that too.

 
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The most recent poll says 90% of Native Americans aren't offended by the name and there hasn't been polling of them since. Recent poll across the U.S. showed more than 70% don't think the Redskins should change their name.

 

IF the name were truly so offensive and derogatory then the above statistics would be for the opposition and this issue would have been a lot bigger a lot sooner than 2013. 

 

As I have pointed out previously, this reminds me of the college team out west whose name escapes me at the moment. The local tribes there wanted the team to keep the Native American-themed name, but the majority-white town population deemed, incorrectly and ignorantly, that the team name was offensive. They literally ignored the voices of the people they were claiming offense for. The townspeople voted in record numbers and changed the name. Ignorance at its finest. We Redskins fans need to keep at it and keep pointing out that the majority are not offended, unless that changes, because the more that give up then the less there are to voice opposition and the more people hear something the more they'll start to believe it.

 

I assume this isn't a large concern for the organization right now, because they certainly have the resources to interview tribes and show that the team name isn't considered offensive, publish those results, and then force media contrarians to do actual investigations themselves and actually talk to Native Americans instead of making up their minds for them.

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Well, I get the impression that the media has decided to get involved on one side of this issue.  (And I can kinda understand why.  It's a profession where being perceived or labeled as being even slightly racially insensitive can damage one's career, for life.) 

 

I'm starting to believe that the writing (or the op-ed, or the blogging, or the video) is on the wall, and the media is gonna keep reciting the same talking points that haven't been true for Harjo, for 20 years.  And, a few years from now, the media is going to change people's minds, so that the untrue things they're repeating will become the Truth. 

 

They're simply going to claim that it's offensive and racist, until people agree that it is. 

 

The facts aren't important, when you have the power to create facts. 

 

 

The "media" have been doing that in this country for 250+ years. it's what they do. It's their SOP. Their wanted ends justify the means and anyhting to accomplish that is just fine.  No surprise what so ever IMO. And that's why their believable ratings are in the tank. One can only lie so many times before being tuned out.

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Just to make a point I think Boss_hogg made UnWise Mike is trying to salvage his carrer so he want to lead the cursade, but me and him got into it I told him he lost after he left 106.7 (but we all know they have a hidden agenda at the station) it got so bad  Dan Stineberg told him to shut up pretty much 

Edited by uncleelroy89
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Keep the name. Change the logo.

**** THAT!!!! The logo is awesome and respectfull!  I don't want a name change but would find it more offensive to change the logo then the name.

 

The irony that ESPN, reruns a show that that calls out RG3 for not "being BLACK enough and down with the cause" whatever the **** that means, but yet goes on and on about our team being called the Redskins.  Nor does Wilbon seem to have any issues with rappers making millions on the word ****** yet has plenty to say about the word Redskins.

Edited by isle-hawg
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**** THAT!!!! The logo is awesome and respectfull!  I don't want a name change but would find it more offensive to change the logo then the name.

Exactly! Where's any hubbub over Chicago about their logo?

Actually, if the PC gods threw down their lightning bolts and made us change the name from that day forward, I wouldn't mind us being the 'Redhawks' if it weren't for the stinkin' Seahawks (we couldn't shorten it to the 'Hawks' like we do the 'Skins').

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Why would that bother you?

All the rest of the bull**** that makes up your side of the argument seems to give you so much satisfaction.

I would think such a ridiculous statement would be cause for celebration in your tiny little circle.

The entire premise of this satire is a ridiculous sham, what does it matter how far anyone takes it?

~Bang

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 Why would that bother you?

The entire premise of this satire is a ridiculous sham, what does it matter how far anyone takes it?

~Bang

Because it's a shot at the team I love.

Edited by RFKFedEx
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a good retort to the leftist PC police.

 

 

 

The online magazine Slate announced last week that it will never again
refer to the Washington's National Football League team, the Redskins,
by its name.

 

 

 

The name, according to Slate, offends American Indians, and therefore
should be dropped. And until such time, Slate will never mention it. It
will become, in effect, the R-word.



The article, to its credit, acknowledged that the term "redskins" was not coined as a racist epithet:



"The word redskin has a relatively innocent history. As Smithsonian
linguist Ives Goddard has shown, European settlers in the 18th century
seem to have adopted the term from Native Americans, who used 'red skin'
to describe themselves, and it was generally a descriptor, not an
insult."

 

 

 

Continues here-

http://townhall.com/columnists/dennisprager/2013/08/13/nis-prager-n1662604?utm_source=thdaily&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=nl

Edited by aREDSKIN
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  • 2 weeks later...

PTI...today...topic #2 on the list.

 

MMQB will no longer use the name...including Peter King / SI. 

 

Korheiser says the only way to get it done (change) is to have ESPN / FOX stop using it...

 

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/08/29/peter-kings-mmqb-will-no-longer-use-redskins-nickname-in-writing/

 

I've said it before - I don't want them to change, I don't think they need to change - but the writing is on the wall and all of you better start embracing the inevitable.  One media outlet will lead to another...no matter how small at first...and at one point larger networks will fall to pressure because nobody wants to be associated with "racism" - no matter what we say about Ives Goddard, Red Mesa, Philogy, Oklahoma, the Paleface River, "Seeing Red"  - Suzan Harjo's own radio show, war paint, etc.............etc. 

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It's just too bad not one of them urging a name boycott has bothered to actually talk with Native Americans about the subject or, at the very least, consider the results from the last polling of Native Americans on the subject, or even consider why there isn't as much of an uproar from the Native American community save for a vocal few if the name were so blatantly racist, as is the claim

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