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Is it time to start evaluating the Scouting Dept? (what should we do going forward?)


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[quote name=maskedsuperstar;9266230

Vinny never listened to the scouts. Lets be for real here. Garcon has been injured. So' date=' how can you judge him? Dezmon Briscoe was not traded for. Tampa Bay cut him.[/quote]

From what's been reported Garcon has a low pain threshold and can't seem to handle running with pain. I stand corrected on the Brisco thought, but he definitely hasn't been what we need him to be.

:helmet:

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So, you think that not sticking with a coach was Snyder's mistake in the past? I'm curious. Which one would you have stuck with and for what reason?

Thank you for making this point.

People against Shanny being on the hot seat point to the fact that we need continuity and Snyder has had too quick of a hook on coaches on the past but can never point to a specific coach we "should" have kept. In the end, it's about results. The fact is is that outside of Gibbs 2 (which really only netted us two fluke playoff appearances with no future development), Snyder hasn't HAD a good coach. Schottenheimer was probably the closest thing to one, but he also has his limitations and I doubt he would have had the sustained success we needed coming off of the 8-8 season.

We need to learn to accept the fact that while Shanahan seems all nice and glamorous with his track record of success, we need to come to grips with the fact that he just may be another bad coaching hire that needs to be let go. I hope things pick up in the second half of the season and we have something to hang our hat on regarding Coach Shanahan, but I'm not optimistic and wouldn't be too upset if we moved in another direction both at GM and HC.

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Superbowl winning teams...

2012: Giants - Eli Manning

2011: Packers - Aaron Rogers

2010: Saints - Drew Brees

2009: Steelers - Ben Rothlesburger

2008: Giants - Eli Manning

2007: Colts - Payton Manning

2006: Patriots - Tom Brady

2005: Patriots - Tom Brady

Yeah, the impact of a great QB is vastly over-rated. :rolleyes:

Of the QBs you show, only one was obtained using multiple picks - Eli. Brees was picked in the 2nd, Brady in the 6th, Ben and Rodgers were picked towards the bottom of the first. So, yes, I think there is a real possibility that a QB capable of taking a team to the super bowl will be available in 2013 or 2014 at the position that would have been the Redskins pick. I never once said that the QB position was overrated. I said that the best QB doesn't always win, the best team generally wins. If the best QB always won, the Patriots would have won the super bowl in every year other than the one that Brady was injured.
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That makes sense but it probably wouldn't have made any difference. The money Dan Snyder has thrown at players and coaches has been wasted. He would probably screw up throwing money at scouts also.

If he were to just sign the checks, as it seems he's mostly doing now, then someone else could run the scouting department properly. I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt now (to an extent), where before I wouldn't have. He seems to understand that he doesn't know enough to run things.

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only time maryland produced a 3-4 OLB they ran a 3-3-5 and Shawne Merriman played DE and OLB.

He is 90% right tho.

Georgia ? they just started running this. Justin Houston was drafted in 2011 he plays OLB for the chiefs. Is playing well... he played DE in a 4-3 while at georgia.

LSU plays with 4 down linemen your just flat out wrong here.

Notre Dame has produced 0 nlf caliber 3-4 OLBs or 3-4 DEs .

He said he didn't know of any college team that ran a 3-4. Whether or not players go to the NFL and are successful is irrelevant to the question. I may have been wrong on a couple, but it was just my guess without looking it up. I was just answering the question, not debating who was good or not. Get off your high horse.

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lmao

His argument was that they play a 3-4 and they don't. This further proves my point about majority of the 3-4 OLB come from college 4-3 schemese

Montgomery will most likely play in a 4-3 he has that profile

Mingo will be a 3-4 OLB or a 4-3 pass rush specialist a la Bruce Irving

I am confused though. Do you stand on the side where transitioning players to from 4-3 DE to 3-4 OLB is not the best idea? or are you on the side that feels that it's common practice and that's where the majority and best 3-4 pass rushers come from?

I didn't mention any names but yeah those 2 can stand up and rush the passer. Generally, you would want your best 3-4 OLB to rush the QB's blind side. It also comes down to comfort. The defenses main purpose is confusion. It would be a plus if both OLB could rush from both sides.

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Lets be for real here. Rak is missed. The Skins aren't getting the sacks. Its frustrating. But it just goes to show you that in the 3-4, you need 2 OLB that can rush. Now, offenses are keying on Kerrigan. The Skins finished with 40 plus sacks last year. Haslett likes to bring pressure. But he can't. Too many break downs in the secondary.

---------- Post added November-14th-2012 at 02:59 PM ----------

I don't consider all those QBs "great." But, since I don't want to get into a debate about all of them, can you explain why you think Eli is great?

2 rings on his fingers?

---------- Post added November-14th-2012 at 03:02 PM ----------

I don't consider all those QBs "great." But, since I don't want to get into a debate about all of them, can you explain why you think Eli is great?

Oldfan, I know where you are going with this. I don't like Eli but you have to give him credit. He wins big games. No?

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...2 rings on his fingers?
That's probably Mike's answer too. That the logical fallacy called 'circular reasoning."

Mike: It takes a great QB to win Super Bowls;

Why do you think Eli's great?

Mike: Because he won two Super Bowls.

BTW, I read an NFL column by Brian Billick claiming that Eli should now be considered elite because he won two rings. I went back a couple of days later and the column had been edited -- no mention of Eli. Someone must have alerted Billick to his circular reasoning. Peyton would not be elite by the two-ring standard.

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That's probably Mike's answer too. That the logical fallacy called 'circular reasoning.

It takes a great QB to win Super Bowls;

Why do you think Eli's great?

Because he won two Super Bowls.

I'm a little confused as to why they are even holding the super bowl this year or next. With Eli at his prime, I may as well go catch a movie. Giants can't possible lose.
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Trent Dilfer is on a level with Peyton Manning and Brett Favre, right? Is it possible that the remaining players on the Giants roster and their coaching staff had something to do with the wins?

Sure but when it comes down to it, a QB makes or breaks a team. The NFL is about scoring points. Green Bay sucked on defense last year. But they still went 15-1. Why?

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Trent Dilfer? He has ring because of the Ravens defense. Nothing more.
Well... the Raven's offense didn't score much, but they did play excellent ball control with Jamal Lewis which kept the defense off the field.

---------- Post added November-14th-2012 at 03:27 PM ----------

Sure but when it comes down to it, a QB makes or breaks a team. The NFL is about scoring points. Green Bay sucked on defense last year. But they still went 15-1. Why?
One reason Green Bay's defense looks so bad is that the offense is a quick strike team. They're not very good at putting together ball control drives to keep their defense off the field.

---------- Post added November-14th-2012 at 03:38 PM ----------

He wins games. Can't say much more than that.
He does not win games. His team wins games.

The question that a fan should ask is: Just how much did Eli contribute to those wins? He's a B-minus passer and he can't run. Thus, he needs much stronger team support to win than RG3 who is more talented as a passer and far more talented as a runner.

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Sure but when it comes down to it, a QB makes or breaks a team. The NFL is about scoring points. Green Bay sucked on defense last year. But they still went 15-1. Why?

Rodgers was a low first round draft choice. Ben was too. Brady and Brees further down in the draft. All obviously good enough to win a super bowl. The Skins would have been drafting in the early part of the first rounds for the next two years if they hadn't spent their picks on RG3. Why couldn't they find a QB of that quality in one of the drafts? Giving three #1s and a #2 on one player is unprecedented, especially considering how bad the core of the team is. Where do you plan on getting 2 WRs, 2 ILBs, 2 safeties, at least one CB, and a RT?

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Rodgers was a low first round draft choice. Ben was too. Brady and Brees further down in the draft. All obviously good enough to win a super bowl. The Skins would have been drafting in the early part of the first rounds for the next two years if they hadn't spent their picks on RG3. Why couldn't they find a QB of that quality in one of the drafts? Giving three #1s and a #2 on one player is unprecedented, especially considering how bad the core of the team is. Where do you plan on getting 2 WRs, 2 ILBs, 2 safeties, at least one CB, and a RT?

There is no such thing is a franchise QB tree. If a QB is there that you think will be under center for the next 10-15 years, you pull the trigger. RG3 hasn't disappointed me. And they only gave up 2 first round draft picks. They have 8 picks next year. Trade down and get more picks.

You act as though there is a RG3 in every draft.

---------- Post added November-14th-2012 at 04:18 PM ----------

Well... the Raven's offense didn't score much, but they did play excellent ball control with Jamal Lewis which kept the defense off the field.

---------- Post added November-14th-2012 at 03:27 PM ----------

One reason Green Bay's defense looks so bad is that the offense is a quick strike team. They're not very good at putting together ball control drives to keep their defense off the field.

---------- Post added November-14th-2012 at 03:38 PM ----------

He does not win games. His team wins games.

The question that a fan should ask is: Just how much did Eli contribute to those wins? He's a B-minus passer and he can't run. Thus, he needs much stronger team support to win than RG3 who is more talented as a passer and far more talented as a runner.

Eli contributed a lot to those games. Is he flashy? No! Does he get the job done? Yes! I bet if Jason Campbell was under center for the Giants, they wouldn't have sniffed the Super Bowl.

---------- Post added November-14th-2012 at 04:21 PM ----------

Eli is garbage... He throws more blind passes than anyone i've ever seen. He makes it look like a hot potato when he's about to get hit and just chucks the damn thing... He doesn't hold a candle to Peyton...

Eli looks pathetic at times, yes. He did against the Skins this year. But he always finds a way.

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To squash this right now.... Eli is a product of a consistent OLine the past few years. The dude doesn't buy time, he just simply has it. With the slightest bit of pressure, the true Eli comes out and he looks like a fish out of water. Peyton Manning makes his receivers look like superstars.... Giants receivers and OLine make Eli look decent.

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To squash this right now.... Eli is a product of a consistent OLine the past few years. The dude doesn't buy time, he just simply has it. With the slightest bit of pressure, the true Eli comes out and he looks like a fish out of water. Peyton Manning makes his receivers look like superstars.... Giants receivers and OLine make Eli look decent.

That's why he won a SB with what PFF called one of the worst OLs in the NFL last year. That OL sucks, and has for a while, but Eli, like Brady, makes them look a lot better than they are.

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That's why he won a SB with what PFF called one of the worst OLs in the NFL last year. That OL sucks, and has for a while, but Eli, like Brady, makes them look a lot better than they are.

Brady gets a lot of help from Welker and his guys underneath but his talents for a 6th rounder are undeniable. The touch on his pass, finesse, and accuracy are phenomenal.

Eli's game last week against the Bengals is the true Eli Manning in its truest form. Go watch if you haven't seen it...

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