Burgold Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 A Why should I start a small business and want to grow it into a huge multimillion dollar corporation like GE and Apple when I'll have to pay the highest business tax rate in the world? Interesting that you chose GE who paid zero taxes last year. Obama's really gouging corporations, huh? :doh: The truth is that no one makes it on their own steam. We require safe water, police, courts, education, and a certain standard of living to have an opportunity to suceed. It is in your self-interest to see that disease does not run rampant or that the water you shower with or drink is not toxic. It behooves you to have roads that are in good repair and police to roam the streets. It helps you to have an army to protect our borders and defend our interests. All of these require us paying our "fair" share. What your complaining about is just another side of the entitlement generation. You don't want another 9/11, but you sure as hell don't want to pay for the war. You want your taxes lower. Maybe I'm wrong and that's not what you think, but it sure sounds like it... and that's the notion that's dividing our people. We should be like the Greatest Generation and sacrifice for each other. Heck, any honest person knows that when this country was at its most prosperous the tax rate was always higher. These lower tax rates that we've had for about a decade have not stimulated the economy. They have not boosted hiring. They have not increased spending. The whole mindset is based not in reality, but in abstract thinking and self-interest. Look at the periods of growth in this nation and you will not see the attitudes being expressed here. Okay, that's enough high horsing... I just find the false rhetoric of saying others are playing class warfare games while deeply engaging in it disquieting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chipwhich Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Interesting that you chose GE who paid zero taxes last year. Obama's really gouging corporations, huh? :doh: Is this a true statement? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Yup. GE paid zero taxes... as did Pepco locally despite making nearly a billion in profit last year (750 million) http://www.nytimes.com/2011/03/25/business/economy/25tax.html?_r=1&pagewanted=all Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexey Posted February 27, 2012 Author Share Posted February 27, 2012 What is the point of succeeding in this country if the President of the United States wants to make you pay for that success? Why should I start a small business and want to grow it into a huge multimillion dollar corporation like GE and Apple when I'll have to pay the highest business tax rate in the world? Or have the strictest EPA standards anywhere all based on the lie of man made global warming? Why become a millionaire when the Government will step in and tell me that I don't pay enough and I should contribute my money to ... Because being rich is still nicer than not being rich. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirtyfive2seven Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Because being rich is still nicer than not being rich. Thankfully I don't have to worry about it right now but with this economy anything can change ---------- Post added February-26th-2012 at 10:30 PM ---------- Interesting that you chose GE who paid zero taxes last year. Obama's really gouging corporations, huh? :doh:The truth is that no one makes it on their own steam. We require safe water, police, courts, education, and a certain standard of living to have an opportunity to suceed. It is in your self-interest to see that disease does not run rampant or that the water you shower with or drink is not toxic. It behooves you to have roads that are in good repair and police to roam the streets. It helps you to have an army to protect our borders and defend our interests. All of these require us paying our "fair" share. What your complaining about is just another side of the entitlement generation. You don't want another 9/11, but you sure as hell don't want to pay for the war. You want your taxes lower. Maybe I'm wrong and that's not what you think, but it sure sounds like it... and that's the notion that's dividing our people. We should be like the Greatest Generation and sacrifice for each other. Heck, any honest person knows that when this country was at its most prosperous the tax rate was always higher. These lower tax rates that we've had for about a decade have not stimulated the economy. They have not boosted hiring. They have not increased spending. The whole mindset is based not in reality, but in abstract thinking and self-interest. Look at the periods of growth in this nation and you will not see the attitudes being expressed here. Okay, that's enough high horsing... I just find the false rhetoric of saying others are playing class warfare games while deeply engaging in it disquieting. That was my point - GE didn't pay much in taxes. I read on another site that they paid a little but not zero. My point is how come no one seems to go after GE for paying no taxes? You hear all this crap about Oil company execs are too rich and yet there is Apple and GE who seem to be above the fray. As for this country being the most prosperous when the tax rate was higher I'd like to see some statistics on that. What else would you call it if not class warfare? Raising taxes because Government is getting too big is not the answer. Please tell me you don't think the stimulus money actually went to 'shovel ready jobs' and repaired roads and bridges. If it did, then why do we need another stimulus to do it again? Believe me, I pay my fair share. I was gouged at an extremely high tax rate. what you are talking about makes sense but what you are saying is that there is little to no government waste. If all our taxes went directly to those things then I would agree with you but we both know they don't. Not all of them. Not even half of it. As for protecting our borders and country I know all about that and sure defense spending is out of control too. But that also goes to make my point. Government is a little out of control right now and there needs to be cut backs to help get it under control. It's why this country is in such a huge amount of debt. Obama is adding to what the other moron, Bush, started in that regard. And he's making it worst! ---------- Post added February-26th-2012 at 10:54 PM ---------- If Obama is, in your words, such a "radical left wing ideologue", then the text from speeches he delivered should be enough to make your case without resorting to sites which have an obvious bias. Ok. everything he says how is government run health care not a step in the direction of socialism? Why do we want or need the government to 'sell' us healthcare. And I'm not even getting into the constitutionality of that. How are these types of policies working out in Greece or Italy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alexey Posted February 27, 2012 Author Share Posted February 27, 2012 Thankfully I don't have to worry about it right now but with this economy anything can change I just think that whole "paying taxes discourages people from trying to get rich" thing is silly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thirtyfive2seven Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 http://www.thefreemanonline.org/featured/does-government-spending-bring-prosperity/ http://www.npr.org/blogs/money/2011/11/28/142846958/should-the-government-narrow-the-income-gap-part-i Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GSF Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 What is the point of succeeding in this country if the President of the United States wants to make you pay for that success? Why should I start a small business and want to grow it into a huge multimillion dollar corporation like GE and Apple when I'll have to pay the highest business tax rate in the world? Or have the strictest EPA standards anywhere all based on the lie of man made global warming? Why become a millionaire when the Government will step in and tell me that I don't pay enough and I should contribute my money to .. and here's the kicker.. a larger, more freedom restricted government? A Government that wants everyone to be 'equal' and have 'free' health insurance. Stop saying it's free. It's not. Have you ever been to a government run business? Can't wait to stand in line for healthcare!! I suppose you also agree with the occupy movement since you agree with 'fair share.' Do you make a lot of money? I'm curious. If so, I deserve some of it because x,y,z. How about this as an alternative. Work for a living and pay your own way and stop expecting someone who was in the same situation as the "99%" and figured out a way to make it with hard work. The entitlement culture in this country needs to change. Not everything in handed to you. Yes, you actually have to work for it. I hear this kind of stuff a lot, but I really don't understand it. You do know that we're currently paying the lowest tax rates in modern American history right. Obama just wants to go back to the pre-Bush cuts rates for those making more than 250K, and he wants to close the loopholes for coorperations and the super rich. That is hardly class welfare. I started a business in 2008, as Obama was getting elected, after I lost my cush job thanks to the economic collapse. I have about 6 employees now and am growing. I will make more in 2012 than I ever have. I crack up when i hear people say Obama is killing small business. Nothing he has done has affected me negatively in any way, or dissuaded from growing my business. I am not all in for Obama either as you say. I voted for Bush twice before Obama. If a good, moderate Republican was in the race this year i might even vote for him, as there are some things about Obama i don't like. i agree with Madison though that much of the criticism of Obama is just rediculously over the top and not based in fact. Unfortunately i think it has a lot to do with his name and skin color. When Santorum gets on TV and says Obama is pro-infanticide you know it's getting rediculous, and i don't think too many reasonably thinking Americans are buying it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 That was my point - GE didn't pay much in taxes. I read on another site that they paid a little but not zero. My point is how come no one seems to go after GE for paying no taxes? They not only paid zero, but got a lot of money back. Click on the link I provided... and there was a huge stink made over it. A lot of people were and are really upset about how one of the largest companies and most profitable in America can get away with this. They were one of the poster children for why we need to revise our tax codes. The fact that Mitt Romney and GE pay less in taxes than you do probably is class warfare and it began long before Obama. You are just fighting against yourself. Take an honest look at the numbers, not the gross numbers, but the net numbers... what people are actually paying. Was the stimulus necessary? A good idea? Almost everyone thought so at the time. Obama, Bernanke, Bush, and McCain as well as 90 percent of the economists on the left and right thought it was necessary. The worst aspect of the stimulus is it wound up not going to the shovel ready jobs... I think only about 10 percent or so was aimed at infrastructure while thirty to forty percent of the stimulus was actually more tax cuts (tax cuts which again failed to stimulate the country). Regardless, the nation was told before the election the size, scope, and degree of the stimulus. I have problems with what Congress put in it. Pelosi et al. did a terrible job with that and they did a terrible job with the Frankenstein of a Health Reform they eventually passed. Far too much corruption and bad compromising. Still, on the level of "fairness" and taxation... it is nonsense to cut taxes during a war. In our history, it has only been done once. The results are what we are living today. Yes, there is class warfare going on, but it's not Obama who is leading it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky21 Posted February 27, 2012 Share Posted February 27, 2012 Please elaborate upon your theory that his policies constitute "socialism". Are you referencing the auto bailouts? Like the ones Reagan approved? Or TARP, i.e., the program that Bush devised? Or the health care mandate, like the one proposed by Newt Gingrich or the other one proposed and actually implemented by Mitt Romney? Or are you talking about the tax hikes on the wealthy, like the ones Reagan implemented? Or, given the thread title, perhaps you are talking about Obama's use of the phrase "fair share." If so, this guy wants to talk with you.... cgbJ-Fs1ikA Contrary to what Fox News and the current lame slate of GOP nominees are spoonfeeding to their followers, Obama is NOT a radical left wing ideologue. He just seems like one because yall have drifted so far to the right that just about everyone, outside of those who wear tin foil hats, seems like Chairman Mao. If there was a Like button on ES, I'd click it for Madison Redskin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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