kleese Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Not posting this to be a smart aleck or sinply stir the pot. I also know there is a bunch of QB discussion out there right now but I really haven't seen it framed in this way yet. Before you post and answer PLEASE read the following: This poll question is based on the following set of assumptions: 1. Manning is cleared medically to resume his career with no more risk of reinjury than anyone else. 2. Manning can prove he still has the arm strength to make the throws. 3. Manning would be a FA signing and would cost nothing in terms of picks or players. 4. He would be coming to Washington because he wanted to be here, not because we outbid people by millions and millions. We all know in order to get RG3, we are obviously giving up the 6th pick. I would also say its probably close to certain our 2nd round pick this year would b involved as well. There would most likely be additional picks (maybe even our 2013 first) but for arguments sake we will focus on this year's top two picks. So, with that in mind, would you prefer --RG3 and no second round pick Or --Manning, the 6th pick, and our second rounder This is not an easy decision for me, but I went with the Manning option for the following reasons: 1. I like RG3 but I'm not in love with him like many are. I know history and of the 46 SB champions, 45 of them have had pure pocket passers. Steve Young is the one exception and even he was pocket first. The two guys in th SB this year couldn't outmaneuver most of ES on an obstacle course. I am also wary of RG3's build... Cam Newton is enormous and more likely to absorb or even deliver contact with ease; RG3 is much more slightly built. I think RG3 is a solid prospect and worthy of a top 10 pick, but I do not consider him a slam dunk ala Luck. 2. Keeping the picks matters. We need help obviously and being able to address our biggest need (QB) while keeping two high draft picks is very appealing. 3. I think Manning is a gamer and will be highly motivated. I think he could easily play 2-4 more years at an all pro level. And remember is he is a FA that means that he will have chosen the Redskins and you can assume he's comfortable with the Shanny's and the system. 4. I think the Redskins are close to competing at a high level given a major upgrade at QB. We've spent two years getting other pieces in place and building a new culture. The defense was good and should only get better; the offense was surprisingly solid the last half of the season despite major ol injuries, below average QB play, and getting two top performers suspended. I 100% understand the desire to try and finally find our own franchise QB that can lead us for the next 10+ years... If I had a crystal ball and could see RG3 being on the level of either of the Mannings, etc... I'd take him in a heartbeat and give up whatever picks to took to get him. But there are no crystal balls... If we signed Manning I could see us a major playoff contenders next year with a 2-3 year window for the SB after that. And here is a huge key: Signing Manning does not stop us from drafting a QB along the way... Maybe even in the second round this year. If they liked a guy like Tannehill for example, we could still take him and let him learn under Manning for a few years so we weren't back to square one once he retired or if it didn't work out. Bottom line, I'm all for Peyton given the above guideines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skin'Em84 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I wish there was a none of the above option..but I'd take RG3. Young, lots of potential, and the possibility to lead us for 8-10 years, vs. 2-3. I don't want to win 1 superbowl, I want to win 3 or 4. I want the Skins to be the next Patriots, or Colts, or Packers, and we need to do that by building a team with cornerstone pieces that will last. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kleese Posted February 13, 2012 Author Share Posted February 13, 2012 I wish there was a none of the above option..but I'd take RG3. Young' date=' lots of potential, and the possibility to lead us for 8-10 years, vs. 2-3. I don't want to win 1 superbowl, I want to win 3 or 4. I want the Skins to be the next Patriots, or Colts, or Packers, and we need to do that by building a team with cornerstone pieces that will last.[/quote'] I'll take one Super Bowl at this point And like I said, signing Manning doesn't stop you in any way from still trying to find a QB of the future to groom. Might even be better that way to go the Favre-Rodgers route. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan T. Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I assume it'll take a lot more to land RG3 than a swap of firsts and our 2nd. But if that's the cost, I do that in a heartbeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skin'Em84 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I'll take one Super Bowl at this point And like I said, signing Manning doesn't stop you in any way from still trying to find a QB of the future to groom. Might even be better that way to go the Favre-Rodgers route. Harder to do that, minus picks. And IMO, you should build the supporting cast around your QB until you find your QB. Makes him stepping into the system that much easier, and puts you only 1 QB away from a Super Bowl team, vs a QB, a WR, a RB, etc... If we don't have the QB we want at 6, trade down to him, or get one next year. The last thing I want to do is mortgage draft picks to get 1 player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
timitim Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 This is a very good argument and its nice to see that there are a lot of Redskins fans out there who's thoughts are occupied by this debacle. I have thought a lot about this issue myself and its nice to see some different opinions out there. I normally wouldn't say anything but there is a trend that I have started to notice as of late. I have seen it in a lot of documentation and a ton in the media. This comparison of just about every QB in the draft to Cam Newton. I even heard one media commentator compare Andrew Luck to Cam Newton. That being said I don't think i have to discuss how upsetting it is to compare Cam Newton to anyone in the draft this year, let alone RG3. I am also wary of RG3's build... Cam Newton is enormous and more likely to absorb or even deliver contact with ease; RG3 is much more slightly built. Anyway nice post and good argument. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kleese Posted February 13, 2012 Author Share Posted February 13, 2012 Harder to do that' date=' minus picks. And IMO, you should build the supporting cast around your QB until you find your QB. Makes him stepping into the system that much easier, and puts you only 1 QB away from a Super Bowl team, vs a QB, a WR, a RB, etc...If we don't have the QB we want at 6, trade down to him, or get one next year. The last thing I want to do is mortgage draft picks to get 1 player.[/quote'] Which is why I like the Manning option... He's "free." We can sign Peyton, improve dramatically by doing so, an still keep all of our picks... One of which (now or later) can be used to take a QB. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clskinsfan Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 It will cost the Skins a lot more than you have listed here for RG3. Manning is the smart choice IF he is the same healthy player he used to be. That is a big if. Imagine Manning with our full draft and a couple of quality free agent pickups. That makes the Skins an instant contender for the NFCE. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THE HAMMER'IN HOG Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Why would Manning want to come to DC? Money is not a motivator for him at this point in his career legacy is, and there are better teams than us with possible openings at QB, Houston would be perfect for him if they don't mind alienating Schaub who can't seem to stay healthy, the 49'ers are also in line for a QB who can air it out, a healthy Manning makes either one odds on favorites to win it all next season, the Jet's could become a big player depending how there off season goes as well, who's picking us to win it all if Manning makes it to DC? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UK Redskins Fan Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Given the scenario, I voted RG3 without hesitation but, in reality, I doubt we can get him that cheaply. Throw in next year's 1st Rounder and i'd probably switch to the Manning option. Then again, in reality, we will never have such clear cut information about Manning's health and motivation to play for the Redskins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kleese Posted February 13, 2012 Author Share Posted February 13, 2012 I assume it'll take a lot more to land RG3 than a swap of firsts and our 2nd. But if that's the cost, I do that in a heartbeat. It will certainly cost more than that, just trying to simplify it for the poll. My guess is that it takes two firsts and a second to really get close to a deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clskinsfan Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Why would Manning want to come to DC? Money is not a motivator for him at this point in his career legacy is' date=' and there are better teams than us with possible openings at QB, Houston would be perfect for him if they don't mind alienating Schaub who can't seem to stay healthy, the 49'ers are also in line for a QB who can air it out, a healthy Manning makes either one odds on favorites to win it all next season, the Jet's could become a big player depending how there off season goes as well, who's picking us to win it all if Manning makes it to DC?[/quote']Wow. I would take Schaub in a heartbeat. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kingdaddy Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Rule 11. Please do not use the “Quote” feature to quote any large sections of text, or to quote pictures, gifs, or videos. It unnecessarily extends and clutters threads and wastes space in databases. If you would like to respond to the contents of a particular post, simply quote the sentence or idea that you're commenting upon, not the entire post if it's lengthy. Assuming all of your assumptions come thru, I like your strategy. Getting Manning would, if he stays healthy, buy us time to groom a rookie. And, we'd be relevant immediately with Manning running the show. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COWBOY-KILLA- Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 Manning at this point is a total question mark. The fact is we don't know he'll be just fine and that alone gives me pause to sign him. I think what this franchise needs is a commitment to the fan base to build a real team long term. Whether RG3 is that guy we won't know for a while, but we, imo, should do everything possible to secure our QB of today and the future which is RG3 or Luck. Manning is neither today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
S.T.real,lights,out Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I would take RGIII and give up the picks. I would really like to keep our 2nd this year and give up next years but i doubt that will happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Audible_Red40 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I am all in for RGIII. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
COWBOY-KILLA- Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 i could also just say, "You know what they say about ASSUMING."....LOL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kleese Posted February 13, 2012 Author Share Posted February 13, 2012 Why would Manning want to come to DC? Money is not a motivator for him at this point in his career legacy is' date=' and there are better teams than us with possible openings at QB, Houston would be perfect for him if they don't mind alienating Schaub who can't seem to stay healthy, the 49'ers are also in line for a QB who can air it out, a healthy Manning makes either one odds on favorites to win it all next season, the Jet's could become a big player depending how there off season goes as well, who's picking us to win it all if Manning makes it to DC?[/quote']He may not want to come here, which of course makes the entire thought moot. I can see him not wanting to compete that directly with his brother. Sure, if the Texans or Niners want him then they are clearly more attractive options for him, but I don't think either of those teams will wind up players. I'd say the Redskins, Seahawks, and Dolphins top the list with the Cardinals and Browns in the mix as well. Of those teams, I think we'd be at least equally attractive. The Jets might factor in, but I just don't see them giving up on Sanchez yet.... And for some reason I don't think Peyton and Ryan would be a great fit (although that's just a gut feeling). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman#21 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 If either happens i consider this offseason a major success. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KDawg Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I am also wary of RG3's build... Cam Newton is enormous and more likely to absorb or even deliver contact with ease; RG3 is much more slightly built. I think RG3 is a solid prospect and worthy of a top 10 pick, but I do not consider him a slam dunk ala Luck. RG3 isn't the same type of QB Newton is. He can run, and will, but he's much more of a pocket passer than Newton ever was in college. Newton is a bruiser and has shown he can stay in the pocket, but they aren't the same quarterback. I'm not even sure why that opinion is still making the rounds. Aside from being athletic, they don't have many other similarities. I don't think RG3's body would take the beating that many think it would Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TotalRecall Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I'm not sold on RG3. If possible, I would trade-up for Luck. My two main options would be Luck or Peyton. If the nerves start firing again, then Peyton is back to normal. The question is when will that be. The 3rd option, which is less palatable, would be to get Weeden or a FA vet to run the 2012 offense, and then draft the franchise QB in 2013. If Peyton can play, that would be the safest bet for us long-term. Peyton would be a starter for maybe 3 years. We draft Tyler Wilson ( or Landry Jones) in 2013 to learn the offense behind Peyton. The other questions concerning Peyton playing here: Would Kyle Shanahan step back and let Peyton run the offense? Would Peyton be willing to compete against Eli for the same division title? I think the potential Kyle power struggle might turn-off Peyton more than anything. The Eli thing would be less of a problem considering that we beat the Giants twice last year and they still won the Super Bowl, Eli plays well on the road in the playoffs, and they would be doing each other a favor by, hopefully, taking out the other NFC competition, including the Cowboys and Eagles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jflow78 Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I'd probably try to get both. Sign Manning, then draft RGIII. We're not winning a SB even if Manning came here. Sorry, but I think we're a couple years away from being a serious competitor and Manning will probably be retired by then. I'd like to have someone like RGIII right behind him. Manning might not like that plan, but I don't think he's going to pick the Skins over some of the other teams who are much closer, like others have said. We have the #6 pick, taking our "franchise QB" isn't going to get any easier than it will this year. I'd rather have a guy who will be here for 10 seasons, including those that we're going to be good enough to compete, rather than a guy who will be here 2 years and not be here when our team is in it's prime. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan T. Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 I'm not sold on RG3. If possible, I would trade-up for Luck. My two main options would be Luck or Peyton. If the nerves start firing again, then Peyton is back as normal. The question is when will that be. The 3rd option, which is less palatable, would be to get Weeden or a FA vet to run the 2012 offense, and then draft the franchise QB in 2013. He may have just been blowing smoke, but Jim Irsay was quoted a couple of weeks ago that the Colts haven't ruled out taking Griffin III over Luck with their pick. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
greenspandan Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 i'm all in for RG3. another stopgap like Manning will make me barf. even if he does win us a few games, we're not close enough for Manning to come in and win a championship with what time he has left, and then 2-3 years down the road we are once again for the millionth time faced with a huge need at QB, and chances are very high we will not then be in as good a position as we are now to bring in someone who may form the next elite class of NFL QBs. it's not every offseason you have a chance to draft someone like RG3. we should grab this opportunity. there are almost always aging superstars for sale, and it's very sad that apparently many of us have still not learned our lesson there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted February 13, 2012 Share Posted February 13, 2012 If you really could be that certain about Manning's health, I'd take Manning trade down, pick up Tannenhill (sp) and address a number of holes on the oline, secondary, and maybe find a pup to begin grooming behind Fletcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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