@SkinsGoldPants

All Things North Korea Thread

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So seems like we gave NK tons of publicity and legitimacy and put us on equal terms and got nothing in return.  Pretty much what was expected.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by visionary

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Without details it sounds like what they've said before. 

Disturbing to think of Kim in the White House though.

Also I am very curious what these security guarantees are that Trump keeps mentioning.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by visionary

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The...one that was heavily reported on weeks ago?

 

 

 

 

So ending war games, big equal footing photo op and handshake and glowing praise of Kim, and a future visit to the White House.

Did he get a happy ending too?

Edited by visionary

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Media playing right into the hands of those who claim unfair bias and fake news, etc.  As per usual

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40 minutes ago, zoony said:

Media playing right into the hands of those who claim unfair bias and fake news, etc.  As per usual

Are you suggesting that this meeting was any more of a substantial step forward than anything else that NK has "promised" since '92?

 

The only actual substantive change to the peninsula is that Trump says we'll stop wargames, which is 1) a huge loss for us, and 2) it's not even in the actual document, which means it carries the same value as all of Trump's other off-the-cuff statements (which is to say none), and could be reversed whenever Trump desires.

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How is stopping war games a huge loss for us?  We wouldn’t normally have the war games for about another year anyway, so that leaves plenty of time on the table to find out what NKs true intentions are.... I am suprised we made the concession without talking to south korea first.

Edited by CousinsCowgirl84

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2 minutes ago, CousinsCowgirl84 said:

How is stopping war games a huge loss for us?  We wouldn’t normally have the war games for about another year anyway, so that leaves plenty of time on the table to find out what NKs true intentions are....

If we actually stop them, it obviously drastically lowers preparedness in the event of a war.

 

War games on the Korean peninsula isn't just about NK, but about China.

 

Consider that at the current moment our entire submarine fleet is basically compromised:

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/ct-china-hack-navy-contractor-20180608-story.html

 

It's a fixable issue, but it requires the military to amend procedures and then, of course, to ensure those new procedures work.  It's always a bad idea to implement untested things in the middle of a war unless you have no choice.  War games would help to ensure that all the changes we've made to handle the breach in data will function in the event of actual combat.

 

Getting war games to end has also been a major goal of NK for decades.  Us saying we'll give them up is a major PR win for NK, and we got zero solid concessions in return.

 

 

But on the whole, I sincerely doubt giving up war games happens.  Trump will keep flapping his gums about denuclearization, Kim will do nothing, and eventually things will break down and war games will resume as normal.  But if we did give it up it's a major concession.

 

Further, ANY concession to NK, without a corresponding concession by NK, should be considered a major concession.  We got nothing, and supposedly are giving them something.  That's a pretty major loss for us, isn't it?

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I am as skeptical as anyone about the prospects for success with NK because it is very dangerous for a dictator to loosen control and their hard-won nukes are really all NK has but Bill Richardson said it well, bottoms up negotiations with NK have failed maybe top-down negotiation will succeed.  We will have to see if we are just getting jerked around again in a year or so, I fear we are but this is worth a try.

Edited by Veryoldschool

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32 minutes ago, DogofWar1 said:

Are you suggesting that this meeting was any more of a substantial step forward than anything else that NK has "promised" since '92?

 

The only actual substantive change to the peninsula is that Trump says we'll stop wargames, which is 1) a huge loss for us, and 2) it's not even in the actual document, which means it carries the same value as all of Trump's other off-the-cuff statements (which is to say none), and could be reversed whenever Trump desires.

 

Im suggesting that the vast majority of media and liberals are hoping for a disaster, and looking for anything negative they possibly can.  Because they are all hysterical *******.

 

All of us should be weary of NKs intentions, and I personally do not trust them a bit.  But reading some of these chicken **** comments about the summit are disgusting.  Especially when they dont want to credit basic negotiating skills and diplomacy.  Any comment about legitimizing the regime should have been shared prior to the summit.  Otherwise, drink a tall glass of stfu

 

I mean, I guess everyone was hoping trump would throw a baby fit during the meeting acting like a straight up little girl and make things worse?  We wouldnt want to `legitimize` illegal regimes of course

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/05/barack-obama-and-vladimir-putin-hold-blunt-meeting-at-g20/

 

16 minutes ago, Kilmer17 said:

I’m SURE that we can believe NK this time!

 

Im not sure how we move forward in good faith

 

But, communication is never a bad thing

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6 minutes ago, zoony said:

Any comment about legitimizing the regime should have been shared prior to the summit.  Otherwise, drink a tall glass of stfu

 

 

They were. Extensively. 

 

For decades, the US has had a long list of preconditions that needed to be met before agreeing to meet with NK leaders. Trump got nothing, balled up that list of preconditions and tossed it in the corner for his document taper to repair, and proceeded to fellate a brutal dictator in front of the entire world while achieving next to *nothing*. 

 

Trump’s Tennessee trailer park base won’t see anything wrong with this but the summit was an utter embarrassment. 

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7 minutes ago, zoony said:

 

Im suggesting that the vast majority of media and liberals are hoping for a disaster, and looking for anything negative they possibly can.  Because they are all hysterical *******.

 

All of us should be weary of NKs intentions, and I personally do not trust them a bit.  But reading some of these chicken **** comments about the summit are disgusting.  Especially when they dont want to credit basic negotiating skills and diplomacy.  Any comment about legitimizing the regime should have been shared prior to the summit.  Otherwise, drink a tall glass of stfu

 

I mean, I guess everyone was hoping trump would throw a baby fit during the meeting acting like a straight up little girl and make things worse?  We wouldnt want to `legitimize` illegal regimes of course

 

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/05/barack-obama-and-vladimir-putin-hold-blunt-meeting-at-g20/

 

 

Im not sure how we move forward in good faith

 

But, communication is never a bad thing

 

I'm on the same page.  Very skeptical but top-down negotiations is a different approach and China is concerned about Trump's trade policies so we probably have more leverage on China now and therefore more leverage on NK.  Probably Trump is going to be jerked around for a year or two like his predecessors but maybe not, maybe Kim wants to change NK and Trump is offering him path, we'll see how this develops.

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I can’t get my head wrapped around why Un is so in love with Trump.  Maybe it took the anti-president to get through to the man child.  

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North Korea will never up its nukes. 

 

Libya will always be a stark reminder to authoritarians around the world to pursue their own nuke programs if they have the capacity. Cancelling up the Iran deal also showed that our diplomatic efforts can’t be trusted either. 

 

Great photo ops for Kim Jong Un and Trump however. Looking forward to the ribbon cutting ceremony of the Pyongyang McDonalds.

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4 minutes ago, skinsfan_1215 said:

 

 

Trump’s Tennessee trailer park base won’t see anything wrong with this but the summit was an utter embarrassment. 

 Can we keep this on topic and not attack each other? Thanks. 

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