Jump to content
Washington Football Team Logo
Extremeskins

The Official(ish) 2012 Quarterback Prospect Thread


KCClybun

What do you think of the new site?  

63 members have voted

  1. 1. What do you think of the new site?

    • Amazing
      30
    • Cool
      24
    • Could be better
      5
    • A letdown
      5

This poll is closed to new votes


Recommended Posts

Cam Newton?

Newton is having a remarkable rookie year but its a bit early - and probably hyperbole at any stage - to say he is revolutionising the game. The impressive thing to me about Newton this year his how well he is throwing the ball from the pocket and his paitence in making his reads and progressions rather than doing the deep/short/run read. He uses his size and athletic abiity when he needs to and there are more called runs especially in the red zone than most NFL offenses but its very much a pro type system and style of play we are seeing from him.

I dont think the book on him is closed yet as it will be interesting to see how DCs play him next year with a year of film but he certainly is well ahead of the curve right now.

I have not watched enough of next years QBs to have a firm opinion and I have seen very little of Griffin in particular. I like the way Jones throws the ball and his arm, Luck looks like a complete package (but without an elite arm I would say) and Barkely leaves me a bit torn but I have warmed to him as the year has gone on. I'm sure we will be doing some more in depth looks at the QB prospects this offseason.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just some thoughts. I don't actually have a clear cut favorite QB from this draft, but I think we need to remember a few things. First of all, we can't base everything on the QB's arm and mobility. There's a lot more to consider. Can that QB make the transition to the style of offense the Redskins currently run? How is he on reading coverages? How quickly does he run through the progression of his receivers, or, does he even scan the field? Does he lock on to one receiver? It's nice to look at stats, but stats is just a piece of the puzzle. I definitely want a play maker at QB, but I want a smart QB with leadership qualities. Aside from athletic skills, you need a QB who can take control of the locker room and be a field general. I don't care if that guy is Griffin, Weeden, Jones, or even Luck. We need someone who can make the transition quickly, because he's going to be starting right away.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm just going to throw it out there that regardless of who the Skins pick (Barkley, RGIII, Jones, or whoever), I think we should also grab Orton in the off-season. The guy is in the last year of his contract, and will probably come pretty cheap in terms of money, and won't cost us anything in draft picks. If it turns out that our franchise QB needs a year or two to get in rhythm (switching from spread offenses to pro-style, etc.) having a guy who's started could be useful.

While I don't endorse Orton as a long term solution, he's certainly an upgrade from our current guys, and having him in our back pocket in case of a rocky transition could save us a lot of trouble.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Newton is having a remarkable rookie year but its a bit early - and probably hyperbole at any stage - to say he is revolutionising the game. The impressive thing to me about Newton this year his how well he is throwing the ball from the pocket and his paitence in making his reads and progressions rather than doing the deep/short/run read. He uses his size and athletic abiity when he needs to and there are more called runs especially in the red zone than most NFL offenses but its very much a pro type system and style of play we are seeing from him.

I dont think the book on him is closed yet as it will be interesting to see how DCs play him next year with a year of film but he certainly is well ahead of the curve right now.

That's the most impressive thing with came to me; seeing him go one, two, three, BACK to first, checkdown, and THEN run. It's pretty frakking impressive for a guy who everyone swore only made one/two reads in college.

Here's more cut-ups of these college prospects. I'll try to include as many as possible and hope the thread doesn't get bogged down.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ayw5EhNV2JM

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not really true, Culpepper was a beast, check out his combine. Thing is, Culpepper blew out his knee and was never the same afterwards. He had about 2 years of greatness, but if he had never gotten hurt he might now be considered in the same league as Brady or Manning. I really think the 2008-2009 Vikings could have had super bowl years with a 31-32 year old healthy Culpepper over Frerotte or a 40 year old Favre. He's definitely a sad story.

No I agree with you for the most part, I just think Newton was better in the open field. It is sad because he was able to run and he had a very good arm.

---------- Post added November-22nd-2011 at 02:02 PM ----------

Where are Kirk Cousins, Chandler Harnish, Kellen Moore?... id take any one of them over Case Keenum for Senior QB's.

Do you seriously like them more than the available choices??

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just some thoughts. I don't actually have a clear cut favorite QB from this draft, but I think we need to remember a few things. First of all, we can't base everything on the QB's arm and mobility. There's a lot more to consider. Can that QB make the transition to the style of offense the Redskins currently run? How is he on reading coverages? How quickly does he run through the progression of his receivers, or, does he even scan the field? Does he lock on to one receiver? It's nice to look at stats, but stats is just a piece of the puzzle. I definitely want a play maker at QB, but I want a smart QB with leadership qualities. Aside from athletic skills, you need a QB who can take control of the locker room and be a field general. I don't care if that guy is Griffin, Weeden, Jones, or even Luck. We need someone who can make the transition quickly, because he's going to be starting right away.

I'm glad you said this because sadly this thread was starting to turn into another Barkley vs. Griffin thread.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm glad you said this because sadly this thread was starting to turn into another Barkley vs. Griffin thread.

I barely even look at mobility. Arm strength is fine, but I don't think there's really a quarterback in this draft that has eye popping arm strength.

I look at footwork first. I try and watch a guy's feet in the pocket. Ever since the McNabb fiasco, we've learned that Mike and Kyle really value a guy's footwork. Footwork really determines where you're going with the football in our offense, not to mention it helps you throw the ball better and with more accuracy. I think that's where guys like Tannehill, Barkley and of course Andrew Luck have an advantage; every hitch is a progression, usually when they move their feet it's because they're going from one progression to the next and not because of happy feet. A lot easier to tell what they're reading. And I think mobility is about more than being able to run, but the subtle sliding and avoiding pressure you do INSIDE the pocket.

It's harder to tell what read is what with guys who comes out of the spread.

But I try and take the "big arm, mobile quarterback" part of the discussion out of it. Matt Schaub doesn't have a huge arm and doesn't run a bunch, but his footwork and his ability to move inside the pocket is what gives him an edge, m thinks.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I barely even look at mobility. Arm strength is fine, but I don't think there's really a quarterback in this draft that has eye popping arm strength.

I look at footwork first. I try and watch a guy's feet in the pocket. Ever since the McNabb fiasco, we've learned that Mike and Kyle really value a guy's footwork. Footwork really determines where you're going with the football in our offense, not to mention it helps you throw the ball better and with more accuracy. I think that's where guys like Tannehill, Barkley and of course Andrew Luck have an advantage; every hitch is a progression, usually when they move their feet it's because they're going from one progression to the next and not because of happy feet. A lot easier to tell what they're reading. And I think mobility is about more than being able to run, but the subtle sliding and avoiding pressure you do INSIDE the pocket.

It's harder to tell what read is what with guys who comes out of the spread.

But I try and take the "big arm, mobile quarterback" part of the discussion out of it. Matt Schaub doesn't have a huge arm and doesn't run a bunch, but his footwork and his ability to move inside the pocket is what gives him an edge, m thinks.

nlc, ive wanted a thread like this for a while because qb talk usually hogs the draft thread.. so good job there.

anyways, i think it would be nice if we could continually update the OP with all of this years game play from each QB prospect. i know most of it has been posted in the draft thread or elsewhere, so it is available, just not organized.

its a big undertaking, but it would be one heck of a reference.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I barely even look at mobility. Arm strength is fine, but I don't think there's really a quarterback in this draft that has eye popping arm strength.

I look at footwork first. I try and watch a guy's feet in the pocket. .

Agree with you 100% on the footwork - you play QB from the ground up. I'm amazed every year how many highly touted Division 1 QBs have awful footwork and weight transfer. After footwork I look at throwing motion and mechanics because the combination of footwork and mechanics will determine accuracy and consistency. Good shoulder rotation and wrist snap are part of that.

I also agree with you that the ability to move within the pocket to aviod pressure and reset your feet when you work through your progressions is important. All things being equal in these areas having the athletic ability to operate outside the pocket and make plays when the original design breaks down or you get pressure is highly desirable - but only after the footwork and mechanics to operate from the pocket boxes have been ticked IMO.

As for arm strength clearly to be effective in the NFL you need the arm to make all the throws in the offense you operate. People say Joe Montana had a weak arm for example and they are right he was not a strong armed guy but he could throw a deep out and make the stick throws he needed to. I think again all things being equal you take a guy with the stronger arm rather than weaker but as long as the guy has enough arm to make all the throws you need pure arm strength is over rated IMO.

The thing it's just about impossible as a fan to get a good feel for though are the intangibles - the six inches between the ears - and how a young QB will translate his skills and desire onto an NFL stage and handle becoming a multi millionaire with all the pressures and temptations that brings. How badly does the guy want to work to be great - because no matter how good the physical skills unless a guy loves the game and wants to be the very best QB he can be its not going to work out.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How do we know for sure Griffin III will decide to enter the draft? I think right now hoping for him is just the same as hoping for Luck. Some believe the Colts won't draft Luck number 1, because it will be too much of a mess with Peyton Manning.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

How do we know for sure Griffin III will decide to enter the draft? I think right now hoping for him is just the same as hoping for Luck. Some believe the Colts won't draft Luck number 1, because it will be too much of a mess with Peyton Manning.

we dont because he doesnt know yet. he got asked whether he would be returning to baylor next year in this article (http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/39778/qa-baylor-qb-robert-griffin-iii) but he said he needs to talk to the people he's close to and decide if it would be the right time to declare for the draft, but it doesnt have to do with his draft position or the money he would make

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Agree with you 100% on the footwork - you play QB from the ground up. I'm amazed every year how many highly touted Division 1 QBs have awful footwork and weight transfer. After footwork I look at throwing motion and mechanics because the combination of footwork and mechanics will determine accuracy and consistency. Good shoulder rotation and wrist snap are part of that.

I also agree with you that the ability to move within the pocket to aviod pressure and reset your feet when you work through your progressions is important. All things being equal in these areas having the athletic ability to operate outside the pocket and make plays when the original design breaks down or you get pressure is highly desirable - but only after the footwork and mechanics to operate from the pocket boxes have been ticked IMO.

As for arm strength clearly to be effective in the NFL you need the arm to make all the throws in the offense you operate. People say Joe Montana had a weak arm for example and they are right he was not a strong armed guy but he could throw a deep out and make the stick throws he needed to. I think again all things being equal you take a guy with the stronger arm rather than weaker but as long as the guy has enough arm to make all the throws you need pure arm strength is over rated IMO.

The thing it's just about impossible as a fan to get a good feel for though are the intangibles - the six inches between the ears - and how a young QB will translate his skills and desire onto an NFL stage and handle becoming a multi millionaire with all the pressures and temptations that brings. How badly does the guy want to work to be great - because no matter how good the physical skills unless a guy loves the game and wants to be the very best QB he can be its not going to work out.

Great post.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Agree with you 100% on the footwork - you play QB from the ground up. I'm amazed every year how many highly touted Division 1 QBs have awful footwork and weight transfer. After footwork I look at throwing motion and mechanics because the combination of footwork and mechanics will determine accuracy and consistency. Good shoulder rotation and wrist snap are part of that.

I also agree with you that the ability to move within the pocket to aviod pressure and reset your feet when you work through your progressions is important. All things being equal in these areas having the athletic ability to operate outside the pocket and make plays when the original design breaks down or you get pressure is highly desirable - but only after the footwork and mechanics to operate from the pocket boxes have been ticked IMO.

As for arm strength clearly to be effective in the NFL you need the arm to make all the throws in the offense you operate. People say Joe Montana had a weak arm for example and they are right he was not a strong armed guy but he could throw a deep out and make the stick throws he needed to. I think again all things being equal you take a guy with the stronger arm rather than weaker but as long as the guy has enough arm to make all the throws you need pure arm strength is over rated IMO.

The thing it's just about impossible as a fan to get a good feel for though are the intangibles - the six inches between the ears - and how a young QB will translate his skills and desire onto an NFL stage and handle becoming a multi millionaire with all the pressures and temptations that brings. How badly does the guy want to work to be great - because no matter how good the physical skills unless a guy loves the game and wants to be the very best QB he can be its not going to work out.

It's why I never understood the hype about Gabbert. Everyone said he had everything you wanted in a quarterback, and my response was always "have you watched his feet in the pocket?" Mechnically he was fine, but footwork wise, blaaaah. And you see the same problems with Gabbert now; anytime he feels the rush, his footwork goes to crap. He plays with a wide base, making all 6'4" of him like 6'0", his arm strength disappears, and he plays poorly.

I say look for footwork and throwing motion first, and then you look at arm strength, but probably more importantly, velocity. Mobility is a plus, but look for mobility inside the pocket; stepping up against the rush, sliding around. Any ability to run outside the pocket is just a plus. Also like to see quarterbacks call their own audibles and check to runs or quick passes if they see something in the coverage they don't like.

I'll try to add more updated videos as I see them get uploaded. If you guys could help me out with that, I'd appreciate it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I voted for Landry Jones. It seemed that his game has dropped a small bit from his sophomore year, but his stats are close as good in his junior campaign. He's still very good and he has potential for greatness in the NFL. Robert Griffin III would be my second choice. He's the complete package- he throws, he runs, he's accurate, and he has a powerful and nice deep ball. He's also athletic. In my opinion, he's just as good as Luck. Barkley is great too. He's accurate, and has a quick release. His arm strength is suspect, but he has a great command of the huddle and his teammates at USC respect him. Lately, the most recent mock drafts are projecting the Redskins to draft one of these three fine young men come April.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I wonder if this comparison will piss anyone off, but after watching that texas A&M game Griffin looks to me to be a more accurate version of Jake Locker if Locker had better receivers. Locker looks to me to be a little stronger but Griffin seems for the most part to make better decisions although a few of his throws were bad choices. While I would say Griffin overall is accurate I don't see this pin-point accuracy people claim he has but it's certainly as good as you could hope for especially taking into account his athleticism. I don't think he's on par with Luck like some here claim but I certainly don't think I would be hurt if the Skins drafted him.

As for Barkley (not to further turn this into a barkley vs. griffin thread but jones to me is a poor option) I like a lot of his throws in that game posted above, but I really don't like his deep ball. And as someone stated earlier the last thing we need is another qb who can't make a defense play the deep ball honestly. But I much prefer him to Landry Jones who makes bad decisions too frequently for my taste.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...