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Kyle Shanahan in Houston


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I'm not as down on Kyle as some posters here. And I find it difficult to believe he had NOTHING to do with their offensive success. But was there anything during his Houston tenure that would have predicted the offense's struggles here? Or is it just a lack of talent at QB and the skill positions dragging him down?

Did people in Houston question his playcalling as much as people do here? Was it purely having Matt Schaub and Andre Johnson that made him good? (keep in mind that people are questioning Schaub as a franchise QB).

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They have a lot better receivers, better running backs, and a better QB. If we had those, Kyle Shanahan would look like a genius. Since we dont have those, and have trouble executing his plays, it makes him look really bad.

I disagree with the calls he makes sometimes, but our players just arent good enough to go out there and execute them with any consistency, so it ends up rubbing off on Kyle. We suck

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I think one of our major issues is also the offensive line. We can't really run at will, sure Hightower fought his ass off for a lot of yards today but we don't have good running lanes half the time and our pass protection is bad. We lack the truly athletic linemen we need to run this offense.

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I think the anger at Kyle Shanahan is twofold.

1) Has to do with the fact that we don't have an NFL caliber QB or receivers to drive the offense. Kyle Shanahan took a very good group of players and made them great. Houston didn't have the talent of the Colts or Saints (worse QB, worse WRs) but made them a better offensive system, at least for those few years.

2) People still expect the Redskins to be defined by smashmouth running and ball control. That's just not how it's going to work, and then people get mad if he doesn't call enough running plays. The NFL is pass oriented and Kyle is trying to bring that to the team, but we just don't have a QB to execute it.

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Houston's offensive rankings with Kyle.

2009:

Total Offense 4th

Points per game: 10th (24.2)

Passing: 1st

Rushing: 30th

2008

Total 3rd

Points per game 17th (22.9)

Passing 4th

Rushing 13th

Redskins offensive ranking with Kyle

2010

Total 16th

Points per game 25th (18.9)

Passing 8th

Rushing 30th

2011

Total 15th

PPG 22nd (19.3)

Passing 17th

Rushing 20th

He hasn't been an offensive coordinator any other seasons.

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I think the anger at Kyle Shanahan is twofold.

1) Has to do with the fact that we don't have an NFL caliber QB or receivers to drive the offense. Kyle Shanahan took a very good group of players and made them great. Houston didn't have the talent of the Colts or Saints (worse QB, worse WRs) but made them a better offensive system, at least for those few years.

2) People still expect the Redskins to be defined by smashmouth running and ball control. That's just not how it's going to work, and then people get mad if he doesn't call enough running plays. The NFL is pass oriented and Kyle is trying to bring that to the team, but we just don't have a QB to execute it.

You still have to know WHEN to run. I see no evidence here that he does.

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Houston's offensive rankings with Kyle.

2009:

Total Offense 4th

Points per game: 10th (24.2)

Passing: 1st

Rushing: 30th

2008

Total 3rd

Points per game 17th (22.9)

Passing 4th

Rushing 13th

Redskins offensive ranking with Kyle

2010

Total 16th

Points per game 25th (18.9)

Passing 8th

Rushing 30th

2011

Total 15th

PPG 22nd (19.3)

Passing 17th

Rushing 20th

He hasn't been an offensive coordinator any other seasons.

with the lack of talent that we have those numbers really aren't that bad. it is tough to watch these games though.

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Not like it needs to be said again so i'll say it a lil different.They have much more talent on their team. We could have Pete Carmichael here or any other great OC and the struggles would continue. We are cursed until every player and every taint of Vinny is gone.

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A good/great OC can design the best plays to fit around the talent.

Kyle looked like a genius with Shaub and Johnson, but take them away and you have the Redskins.

Yes, to a degree, its the talent, but look at Gibbs; he didn't have the tallest, fastest, most skilled players, but he DID have the ability to put these players in situations through strategies which gave them the best chance to succeed.

A good barometer of a great OC or DC is how much they succeed with the talent they have. There are quite a few very good players on both sides of the ball for the Skins, but they're not being utilized right.

It doesn't help when they drop balls or blow coverages, and thats where the OC and DC are supposed to be on top of it and make the changes needed.

Family and football do not mix well in Washington, and the Shottenheimers are another example of this...

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Thanks for posting the stats, Destino. What side of the debate are you on though? Kyle sucks or Kyle doesn't have the talent to work with?

I rant about him during the game but I'm not on either side. I am a little annoyed that we seem to only have stretch running plays. There is very little creativity in the running game other than few times Helu gets the ball. He also seems to "go with the hot hand" too much. When the running game works we run the hell out of it. When it slows down it almost disappears entirely. Having said that the offense is far more effective with him, in terms of moving the ball, than before he came to town. The scoring hasn't changed much but it has improved some.

My concern with the offense is that I see a whack-a-mole situation on offense. One week the running game works, the next week it doesn't. The passing game is the same thing. That is alarming to me because it appears that nothing is sticking. In other words when the coaches focus on A, B falls apart. When they address B, the players forget A. Not sure what is going wrong but it's not a player... it's widespread.

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You know when you're playing Madden and you have this genius play set up, and you're thinking "Aw this is totally going to be 6" and you begin basking in the glory with that grin just as you press "A" to snap the ball. You drop back, see your receiver get open and think to yourself "Checkmate" and press your receiver's trigger, just to see the ball spiral 20 yards left of where he is at? You forgot Bradford is hurt and Feely is your QB. You begin to realize, no matter how good your plays are, this guy will find a way to screw it up, or Kendrick will find a way to drop the pass, or Lloyd is actually not going to stop on the curl route.

So, do you really blame the loss in this game on your playcalling, or the fact that you picked one of the worst rated teams in the game?

Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's a video game. This is real life. In this case, the point remains.

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i get that we dont have the talent that he had in houston, but couldnt a decent OC at least get something out of our players? isnt that what he's paid to do? houston doesnt seem to miss him, correct?

i really do think that our WR's are bad ( i had high hopes for them this year, but i've seen nothing so far). i thought it might be all rex, but they continue to drop too many passes and seem to not be able to get separation. not every down, of course- there are times when they are open and our QB's need to find them.

i digress. what i'm saying is that, we have a running game at times. in fact, at times, its a very good running game. didnt we run all over arizona? didnt we run all over st louis? didnt we start today running all over carolina? in all of those games, how many points did we have to show for those performances?

btw, anyone have a problem with his consecutive shotgun formations on 3rd and 4th and 2?

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This team just doesn't have the skill players to get anything done inside the 30 against anybody. We move the ball up and down the field and more often than not end up with 3 or 0 points from drives. For instance, we punted 1 time in this last game, lol.

That and the OL has 0 depth and the WR's drop as many passes as 50/50 as a unit.

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You still have to know WHEN to run. I see no evidence here that he does.

I don't see any evidence that the run is more likely to be successful than the pass in certain situations where people say we "should" run. Not with our personnel. Our OL is still a weakness and whether people want to admit it or not, our RB's are NOT playmakers.

We're built to be a finesse team on offense now, not a smash-mouth run-fest. That doesn't mean we shouldn't run, or that we can't, its just unfortunate that we still don't have the QB capable of truly opening this offense up. Newton was making throws today that a Redskin's QB hasn't DREAMED of attempting for years and years. Throws that require top-notch anticipation, velocity, and arm strength. He was throwing some absolutely gorgeous outs along the sideline, never mind the deep ball to Smith.

Well, I take that back. Rex dreams of them AND attempts them. But it doesn't go well.

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