Oldfan Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 . P = Premise C = Conclusion (P1) There are no Grade A teams in the NFL Unless we grade on a curve, there are no teams without significant weaknesses. (P2) There is not even a solid Grade B team in the NFC East. The Eagles have the best individual talent, but they are 2-4 because their talent does not fit together well on offense or defense. They will do well to finish 9-7. The Giants and Cowboys don’t figure to be any better. (C1) So, even though the Skins are just an average NFL team with obvious weaknesses, it is not out-classed by any team within the division. (P3) Given his mobility advantage, his running and a sharp short game, John Beck is a better fit for our offense than Rex. (C2) So, John gives Kyle the tools to run a more conventional, ball control WCO than Rex did. And, if he can do that, then the Skins can keep the opponent’s offense off the field. For example, had Beck practiced with the first team over the bye week, and started the game, it’s unlikely that the Eagles would have dominated the TOP the first half of Sunday’s game and gotten off to a 20-0 lead. Our defense played well enough overall to win that game. We would have no fear that the Eagles will overwhelm us in the rematch if Beck starts. (C3) Beck’s mobility would also allow the Shanahans more options to gameplan for protection despite the O-line injuries. (P4) Our 3-2 record still has us in the mix for the division which could be won with a 9-7 record. (C4) So, we don’t need to get a whole lot better to have a good shot at winning the division. Since he’s a better fit for the offense, if the Shanahans start him, John Beck would improve us enough to allow us to be there fighting for the division at season's end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I can go for that. I think we'd have a shot winning yesterday if Beck was the starter. In one quarter he did something Rex couldn't do in three and that is score a touchdown. Heck if Beck is just a competent and not careless with the ball it should be an upgrade. We've talked about this, neither one of us is banking on Beck being a stud, he's a great unknown, but Rex's pros and cons are established. Beck seems at the very least more athletic -- mobile with a stronger arm. He has potential which at the very least should be explored. It's hard IMO to play worse than Rex. Having said all that, a straggler or two in the media think Rex might keep his job, if that happens, i will be extremely upset. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted October 17, 2011 Author Share Posted October 17, 2011 ...Having said all that, a straggler or two in the media think Rex might keep his job, if that happens, i will be extremely upset.I think the stragglers don't realize that a good argument could have been made for pulling Rex before the Eagles game. Many in the media are like fans in general. The team's record of 3-1 was all they needed to hear to reject the idea of yanking him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I don't think he gives you a GOOD shot. He gives you more of a shot. Realistically, if you stay with Grossman, you are staying with a guy that isn't a good NFL QB. You may as well see if Beck is any better at this point in time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins4ever Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Beck is more athletic than Grossman. So was Brian Greise, and of course John Elway. Beck has made errors throwing the ball also. Does anyone remember that roll out from the back of the endzone against the Ravens in preseason, and Beck throwing a bomb down the field that was intercepted? Beck makes his mistakes too. But Beck will not make as many as Grossman has made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted October 17, 2011 Author Share Posted October 17, 2011 I don't think he gives you a GOOD shot. He gives you more of a shot.Are you saying that you don't think we would have a good shot? If so, why not? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
#98QBKiller Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Realistically, if you stay with Grossman, you are staying with a guy that isn't a good NFL QB. You may as well see if Beck is any better at this point in time. This is what it comes down to IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Are you saying that you don't think we would have a good shot? If so, why not? At winning the division? No. Because you have the 4th best team in the division. The Giants, Cowboys, and Eagles are all better teams. I'm not sure they are a lot better, but they are all better. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
authentic Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I don't know what the "real" feelings are in the lockerroom towards Rex, but i think a permanent change to Beck is what's needed at this point. A performance like that (after a bye week no less) is an indicator that Rex is that Rex will not get better through out the course of the season. And will actually be THE reason why we lose games. Lets see what Beck can do, can't be any worse. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I totally concur with the points about Becks attributes fitting the system. That's never been in question. But the guys akin to a rookie. Yesterday was his first regular season action in 5 years. He's a grand total of 6 pro games with 4 starts under his belt. And his team got shut out in one of those. He's a TOTALLY unknown quantity at this point. No question a change had to be made. And I'm real happy to see most ANYONE bar Interceptus Rexus back there. But until we actually see him for an extended period under center let's not make any wild predictions. Besides his total pro inexperience, he's stepping into an offense that has a multitude of problems from the OC's calling of games (I know, that should improve with Becks better suited skill set in theory); to a lack of top class personnel. I honestly don't see that much of a difference in output or increase in W's. Good luck John. You'll need it. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mahons21 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 With our current o-line woe's, and lack of depth in our d-line rotation, I just don't see us winning the division. With that being said, I think we will be in contention as I believe every team in our division will be in contention. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RemoveSnyder Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 You got to find out what Beck has to offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted October 17, 2011 Author Share Posted October 17, 2011 At winning the division?No. Because you have the 4th best team in the division. The Giants, Cowboys, and Eagles are all better teams. I'm not sure they are a lot better, but they are all better. I don't think the evidence so far this season supports your opinion, but if that's the way you see it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 With our current o-line woe's, and lack of depth in our d-line rotation, I just don't see us winning the division. With that being said, I think we will be in contention as I believe every team in our division will be in contention. The O line is arguably the last place where we want to incur injuries, little depth. Should be interesting to see if we can mount a running game and protect the Qb. The running game struggled at times even when they were all healthy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointyfootball Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Non-skins fan. But, do people discount that the coaches know what they have in their two QBs? There has to be a reason they went with Rex over Beck, or else they suck as coaches, right? Either Beck doesn't know the system, struggles making pre-snap reads or other reasons, but I can't believe that a head coach with Mike Shanahan's experience would continue to insert Rex in the lineup if he had a better option that might fit his long-term need @ QB. My feeling is Beck has some major deficiencies that opposing defenses will be able to exploit just as much, or more than Rex's inability to avoid turnovers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Non-skins fan. But, do people discount that the coaches know what they have in their two QBs? There has to be a reason they went with Rex over Beck, or else they suck as coaches, right? Either Beck doesn't know the system, struggles making pre-snap reads or other reasons, but I can't believe that a head coach with Mike Shanahan's experience would continue to insert Rex in the lineup if he had a better option that might fit his long-term need @ QB. My feeling is Beck has some major deficiencies that opposing defenses will be able to exploit just as much, or more than Rex's inability to avoid turnovers. I think it purely came down to experience. As bad as Rex can be, he proved through the pre-season that that experience is a million miles ahead of Beck for a team Shanahan believes can win now. It's an indication of just HOW bad Grossman's been when 5 games in he's switching to a 30 year old 'rookie.' Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted October 17, 2011 Author Share Posted October 17, 2011 Non-skins fan. But, do people discount that the coaches know what they have in their two QBs? There has to be a reason they went with Rex over Beck, or else they suck as coaches, right? Either Beck doesn't know the system, struggles making pre-snap reads or other reasons, but I can't believe that a head coach with Mike Shanahan's experience would continue to insert Rex in the lineup if he had a better option that might fit his long-term need @ QB. My feeling is Beck has some major deficiencies that opposing defenses will be able to exploit just as much, or more than Rex's inability to avoid turnovers.Like most coaches, Mike Shanahan makes win-now moves. Grossman had a better grasp of the scheme than Beck giving him an edge in their competition, but defenses found Rex easy to defense, a problem which grew worse until Grossman's edge over Beck disappeared. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sportjunkie07 Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 he is probably our best shot at winning the division, but with yesterday's loss, i dont see it happening. we lost a lot on the oline. in one week, the oline is already on par with the 09' oline. hopefully beck can use his mobility to extend plays and light a fire under our offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Atlanta Skins Fan Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I agree that a good helping of C4 is what's needed for this offense. Unfortunately, C4 isn't on the roster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Non-skins fan. But, do people discount that the coaches know what they have in their two QBs? There has to be a reason they went with Rex over Beck, or else they suck as coaches, right? Either Beck doesn't know the system, struggles making pre-snap reads or other reasons, but I can't believe that a head coach with Mike Shanahan's experience would continue to insert Rex in the lineup if he had a better option that might fit his long-term need @ QB. My feeling is Beck has some major deficiencies that opposing defenses will be able to exploit just as much, or more than Rex's inability to avoid turnovers. Keiland Willaims beat Torain for the starting RB position last preseason. Devin Thomas beat Brandon Banks in the preseason to be the KR. It doesn't mean that those players aren't as good and will always live in the shadow to the players they lost the preseason battle to. Heck we can talk about a ton of examples from other teams including Bledsoe beating Romo sits to pee and initially Brady too. Yeah guys win jobs in the preseason and lose them in the season, happens all the time in every sport. the Yankees demoted a pitcher to the minors mid season who ended up by far to be their 2nd best starter and was much better than the pitchers who were initially ahead of him after Spring Training. It's a fairly routine thing in sports so don't see why its a bigger deal in this case. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pointyfootball Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Like most coaches, Mike Shanahan makes win-now moves. Grossman had a better grasp of the scheme than Beck giving him an edge in their competition, but defenses found Rex easy to defense, a problem which grew worse until Grossman's edge over Beck disappeared. Understand that, but my big question mark would be why didn't they give Beck some real game-time at the end of last season? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oldfan Posted October 17, 2011 Author Share Posted October 17, 2011 he is probably our best shot at winning the division, but with yesterday's loss, i dont see it happening.we lost a lot on the oline. in one week, the oline is already on par with the 09' oline. hopefully beck can use his mobility to extend plays and light a fire under our offense. I think the running game might suffer a little more than the pass protection losing Lichten--- and TW. But, neither was a stud.---------- Post added October-17th-2011 at 01:28 PM ---------- Understand that, but my big question mark would be why didn't they give Beck some real game-time at the end of last season?Rex wasn't under contract. Beck was. They needed to find out whether they wanted to re-sign Rex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Califan007 The Constipated Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Non-skins fan. But, do people discount that the coaches know what they have in their two QBs? There has to be a reason they went with Rex over Beck, or else they suck as coaches, right? Either Beck doesn't know the system, struggles making pre-snap reads or other reasons, but I can't believe that a head coach with Mike Shanahan's experience would continue to insert Rex in the lineup if he had a better option that might fit his long-term need @ QB. My feeling is Beck has some major deficiencies that opposing defenses will be able to exploit just as much, or more than Rex's inability to avoid turnovers. Grossman has gotten progressively worse with each game: QB ratings: Game 1 - 110.5 Game 2 - 74.9 Game 3 - 77.5 Game 4 - 48.5 Game 5 - 23.7 Over the last three games, Rex has 2 TDs and 8 turnovers. This is clearly no longer the Rex Grossman that Shanahan saw over the span of the preseason. If this Rex had shown up in the preseason, we might have kept Clemens instead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Skinsinparadise Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 Understand that, but my big question mark would be why didn't they give Beck some real game-time at the end of last season? some say it was because Rex was a free agent to be, they wanted to see what they had there as to whether he was worth resigning. Also Rex had more time in the offense, Beck was signed if I recall mid summer that year. If they thought Beck was bad, why sign him to a three year contract? or why not release the dude? They threw Beck in game #5 that IMO is fairly early in the season -- Shanny said yesterday Beck's been looking good in practice, maybe he isn't BSing? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gibbs Hog Heaven Posted October 17, 2011 Share Posted October 17, 2011 I think the running game might suffer a little more than the pass protection losing Lichten--- and TW. But, neither was a stud. What's scary is Trent is by far and away the best ofrensive lineman we have, and he has been up and down right through his young career. With him down, and a reshuffle right across the line, I fear for Beck's health. Good job he's got legs. Hail. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.