No matter the QB, the Skins have bigger issues on offense

[FuriousD]

if kyle get criticized for his playcalling, so be it. he deserves every bit of scrutiny he gets after the dallas game. not sure why he gets a free pass.

this is not to say our players are playing well, but his play calling absolutely deserves to be questioned after dallas.

So are you blaming Kyle for Dallas converting 3-21? I thought that loss was all on Haslett! We have post, after post, afterpost by whiners on ES blaming Haslett for losing that game dispite that fact the players completely botched that call but now somehow, Kyle is to blame?

The offense wasn't even on the field when we lost that game! Jeez....

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

Exactly. With Beck in, all of the sudden we have wide open receivers? C'mon. Grossman hasn't been reading the field and making the right reads for weeks. One touchdown pass since Week 2? Grossman is chucking and hoping; he's not a good quarterback and he'll never start in this league again without benefiting from major injuries of others.

And without 4 or 5 drops, Beck's "stats" would look better.

gaffney had a **** game too, there were a few passes he should have hauled in. stallworth dropped that bomb didnt help either.

but the QB situation is our anchor at the bottom of the NFL sea.

[U C S D SkinsFan]

Our offense is very bad. We just need to suck it up and draft a QB and more OLineman next year. Our OLine really worries me, just as much as our poor QB play.

[CapnRedskins]

Psst!

That's how you beat ANY team.

Kind of like saying that the secret is out that you just need to score more points than the other team to win.

I'm pretty sure if you take away the Packers running game or the Patriots running game they'll find a way to beat you..smartass.

[IrepDC]

We desperately need some play makers on offense. If our scheme doesn't make a play, our team doesn't make a play. If the play design doesn't get the receivers open, our QB can't throw it up and expect the WRs to make the play. If our run play isn't blocked well, our RBs aren't going to break too many tackles or make an amazing cutback. All we can really hope for Kyle to out coach the opposition coordinator, and that isn't working out well.

You saw the things McCoy could do when things broke down, Jackson making plays all over, Maclin out running the coverage even though it was a good defensive call. You see Nicks making plays for the Giants, Cruz making catches in double coverage weekly, Bradshaw making all kinds of amazing runs. Dallas has Austin making plays after the catch, Bryant jumping out the building, Jones fast as lightning. These guys are explosive and can make plays when there's nothing there. I have been all about drafting defense the past few years, but this year we need to find some talent for our O.

[tex]

the nfl is a passing league now. simple fact you got no passer you got no game. gots to have a passer and line to give him time. love how the patriots have a real qb and a line that gives him all day to pass, many times dropping back and then just standing there surveying the field taking his time picking defenses apart.

[SkinsTillIDie]

gaffney had a **** game too, there were a few passes he should have hauled in. stallworth dropped that bomb didnt help either.

but the QB situation is our anchor at the bottom of the NFL sea.

Yah, once Moss was easily neutralized, Fred Davis was our only threat. Gaffney is exactly what he is, a decent role player, but not someone you can depend on to bring you back from 2 scores, or consistently make plays, or come down with contested balls.

But with John Beck, I don't think we're at the bottom -- I've always thought we'd be better off with him, even if he's more of a "game manager" who isn't turnover prone. Though he looked better than that label today in limited opportunity, and continued to make plays with his legs.

I think Beck can play within the Jason Campbell/2011 Josh Freeman tier of NFL QBs. Better than the Mark Sanchez/Andy Dalton/Chad Henne/Tavaris Jackson/Matt Cassell/Kyle Orton tier. And with our defense and a running game that should hopefully benefit by simply not having awful QB play, that might be enough to get us into the playoffs this season. And, at the least, be competitive in every game.

I feel confident in saying that if Beck had started today, we beat the Eagles.

[wildbill1952]

Responding to the OP, no it's not the play-calling when your QB throws 4 interceptions. Grossman just doesn't have the arm strength, even ignoring the bone headed throws into double and triple coverage.

Is the play calling bad? When the box is stacked with 7 men play action seems appropriate, not a run up the gut, But Kyle is under orders too and the game plan comes form the Head Coach. Should they have changed the game plan when they saw how the Iggles were playing? Yes. But they should have pulled Grossman earlier too. I thought after the first half but definitely after the 3rd interception. But that call, like the game plan,only comes at the direction of the head coach.

Beck gave the team a spark, even with the dropped passes. But the lack of depth on the OL will kill this team's chances, just like it did with Zorn's 6-2 start. I didn't hear if both injuries were season-ending, but if they both were, then the only good thing coming out of the rest of this season is a chance to see what Beck can do without a running game and with mediocre pass protection.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

We desperately need some play makers on offense. If our scheme doesn't make a play, our team doesn't make a play. If the play design doesn't get the receivers open, our QB can't throw it up and expect the WRs to make the play. If our run play isn't blocked well, our RBs aren't going to break too many tackles or make an amazing cutback. All we can really hope for Kyle to out coach the opposition coordinator, and that isn't working out well.

You saw the things McCoy could do when things broke down, Jackson making plays all over, Maclin out running the coverage even though it was a good defensive call. You see Nicks making plays for the Giants, Cruz making catches in double coverage weekly, Bradshaw making all kinds of amazing runs. Dallas has Austin making plays after the catch, Bryant jumping out the building, Jones fast as lightning. These guys are explosive and can make plays when there's nothing there. I have been all about drafting defense the past few years, but this year we need to find some talent for our O.

we definitely need some legit talent on offense. moss is coming to the end of the road, gafney is a mediocre WR, stallworth is a vet backup, paul seems to be a good blocker but is hardly explosive.

Davis and Austin are probably the only two building blocks, and maybe armstrong when he gets back. Hankerson was supposed to be that guy, looks like we botched that one.

[Rexx1240]

We averaged less than three yards per carry. Eagles stacking the box worked to perfection. You can't "outplay" that. When the line's not getting any push, you don't just keep running it.

Exactly.

[tiger187126]

it really is the qb though.

without someone who can threaten at all you can just line everyone up at the LOS and play the run. that's what the eagles did. no respect for grossman.

i don't think beck is some savior, but having a guy who isn't 1 dimensional (and is not good at that one dimension) will help the play calling, run game, and offensive line.

with rex you need a perfect situation just to complete a 15 yard pass.

oh and throwing 4 ints in one game with a final score of 20-13 is a pretty big deal.

[DeadExField]

Exactly.

but is that the answer to the numerous issues I pointed out? I barely even mentioned the run game if at all.

[SkinsTillIDie]

we definitely need some legit talent on offense. moss is coming to the end of the road, gafney is a mediocre WR, stallworth is a vet backup, paul seems to be a good blocker but is hardly explosive.

Davis and Austin are probably the only two building blocks, and maybe armstrong when he gets back. Hankerson was supposed to be that guy, looks like we botched that one.

Don't think we botched Hankerson at all. I've said this before, but I really think we're developing him in the exact same way as Shanahan did with Brandon Marshall, another mid-round big receiver. Who was only active for the second half of his rookie year, and made a meager contribution week to week.

Also completely disagree that Niles Paul isn't explosive. Not sure Austin is a building block per say, but hopefully he'll be able to positively contribute on a week to week basis from here on out.

Hopefully Beck has garnered some chemistry with our young receivers Austin, Paul, etc. by practicing with them day in and day out.

[IrepDC]

When's the last time you heard an announcer, speaking about the Redskins offense, say, "The coverage was there, but he just made an amazing play pulling the ball away from the defenders" or "It looked like the defense had him bottled up, but he managed to turn it into a big gain"?

We hear it every week, but it's always talking about the opposition teams players.

[MrJL]

We couldnt establish a ground game so what was Kyle supposed to do?? If he had kept running, gaining 1-2 yards a pop & we're down 20 points, he gets slammed. He puts the ball in the hands of his QB but his QB lets him down yet we still trash him?? Kyle seems to be in a lose-lose no matter what..

Listen, it's not the play-calling, it's the players, period. Not saying I agree with every single call today or the previous 4 games but to blame the offensive struggles solely on Kyle is insane.

we were down two scores with about twenty five minutes left in the game.

[camyj15]

Why does this team never take advantage of the other team's weakness. 147, 131, 105,165,124 - this is the running yardage the Eagles gave up in their first 5 games. The Skins had 2 weeks to figure out how to take advantage of this. How many rushing yards did the Skins get? 42. Grossman should have been sat at the end of the half. This is not a great team but it could definitely be better.

...and the biggest run was by the freakin' quarterback

[Rexx1240]

but is that the answer to the numerous issues I pointed out? I barely even mentioned the run game if at all.

I just don't see why so much of the blame is on Kyle for this one. Would would you have done differently that would have been more effective than what Kyle did (or tried to do) ??

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

Don't think we botched Hankerson at all. I've said this before, but I really think we're developing him in the exact same way as Shanahan did with Brandon Marshall, another mid-round big receiver. Who was only active for the second half of his rookie year, and made a meager contribution week to week.

Also completely disagree that Niles Paul isn't explosive. Not sure Austin is a building block per say, but hopefully he'll be able to positively contribute on a week to week basis from here on out.

Hopefully Beck has garnered some chemistry with our young receivers Austin, Paul, etc. by practicing with them day in and day out.

i usually stand on the side of the if a guy is gonna be sick, he'll show you right away ala Kerrigan, Orakpo, Banks on returns. Im tired of hearing the "he needs time to play WR" due to our devin thomas and malcolm kelly debacles. i hope youre right but im not gonna hold my breath anymore for offensive talent unless i see it right away.

[MrJL]

kyle is a good playcaller, some of you are nuts. just because theres a deep route on each play doesnt mean rex has to throw it there. a lot of those are probably designed clear outs to get guys open underneath, except rex decided he was gonna throw passes into double coverage all day.

the Shanny's are total control freak micromanagers. And Beck also thew mostly deep passes. I think Grossman was just doing what the coaches wanted.

[Hitman21ST]

I tend to disagree with you with the evidence on 3rd downs and redzone scoring. Between the 20s we're not terrible, but when it matters the playcalling leaves me head scratching

On third and short and in the red zone, the defense is even more compact. With as awful as our running game was this week, you can't really blame Kyle for wanting to pass it.

[IrepDC]

we definitely need some legit talent on offense. moss is coming to the end of the road, gafney is a mediocre WR, stallworth is a vet backup, paul seems to be a good blocker but is hardly explosive.

Davis and Austin are probably the only two building blocks, and maybe armstrong when he gets back. Hankerson was supposed to be that guy, looks like we botched that one.

Hopefully Helu can develop into an explosive threat out of the backfield. I'm going to be borderline depressed if Hankerson goes the route of Thomas and Kelly.

[Brandon Lloyd Christmas]

Hopefully Helu can develop into an explosive threat out of the backfield. I'm going to be borderline depressed if Hankerson goes the route of Thomas and Kelly.

thats exactly what im thinking. but i know this fanbase will hold out hope way past that guys deadline because thats what skins fans do.

we'll know right away when we get a stud in here. Helu has flashed which im glad about, as has Austin.

[SkinsTillIDie]

i usually stand on the side of the if a guy is gonna be sick, he'll show you right away ala Kerrigan, Orakpo, Banks on returns. Im tired of hearing the "he needs time to play WR" due to our devin thomas and malcolm kelly debacles. i hope youre right but im not gonna hold my breath anymore for offensive talent unless i see it right away.

Right, we've been burned so often in the past.

This is how the Green Bay Packers built their receiving corps:

2005 -- 2nd round -- Terrence Murphy

2006 -- 2nd round -- Greg Jennings

2007 -- 3rd round -- James Jones

2008 -- 2nd round -- Jordy Nelson

2011 -- 2nd round -- Randall Cobb

and invested a 3rd rounder in 2008 in a pass-catching tight end in Jermichael Finley. And even though they busted with a 2nd round WR, they kept drafting that position high. And kept drafting, even when they had star Donald Driver, and kept on drafting even in this past draft with Jennings, Nelson, Jones, etc. We have to keep investing high picks in the position. Regardless of whether or not Hankerson/Paul/Austin pan out.

[tiger187126]

the Shanny's are total control freak micromanagers. And Beck also thew mostly deep passes. I think Grossman was just doing what the coaches wanted.

i'm pretty sure throw late, behind, short of, no velocity, into double coverage, etc. were not what they were looking for.

[Hitman21ST]

the Shanny's are total control freak micromanagers. And Beck also thew mostly deep passes. I think Grossman was just doing what the coaches wanted.

Grossman has never been gun-shy. He goes for the big play 90% of the time. I doubt the Shanahans are saying "you have to throw it deep, damn the coverage."