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What Does Depth Mean to You?


KDawg

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For years, one of the Redskins biggest issues was a lack of depth. We literally had none and it showed any time a starter came out for a few plays, or was injured for any significant amount of time. It was a major bane and a problem that was extremely difficult to overcome for this team. That led us to some fairly awful seasons. The lack of depth was primarily due to a lack of monetary resources, as our cap money was tied up in overpriced "megastars". But regardless of why, depth was a major issue for quite some time.

Now we have some depth. At tight end we have Chris Cooley, Fred Davis and Logan Paulsen. Yet for some reason, everyone thinks trading Cooley is the best answer there. I disagree wholeheartedly. Sure, Davis and Paulsen could probably do well... But what's better than two tight ends that get the job done? The answer is three. Cooley is still playing injured, and if Davis keeps playing the way he has, he's going to draw the defenses attention sooner rather than later. That leaves room to open up Cooley to make some plays and get some yards and receptions. This isn't fantasy football. Our tight ends don't need ridiculous stat lines to be helpful to the team.

Now there's a thread (which the poll is lopsided hilarity, but the point stands) that people want to cut Ryan Torain. For what reason on earth would you cut a starting caliber (yet injury prone) running back? Tim Hightower and Roy Helu have looked very good, absolutely. But what happens if one of them gets nicked up after we release Torain? We go from a running back trio that has three guys who could carry the ball significantly for us, to one guy who can carry the load and we force Royster into service. I like Royster, but he still needs time to develop a bit.

If Grossman plays well for another few weeks, I half expect some folks here to ask for John Beck's release. After all, what's the point in having a second string quarterback if our starter is playing well?

It's mind numbing to see that kind of thing posted here. Depth was our nemesis for years, and now that we have it, we as fans don't want it. Come on, folks. It's time to be better than that. Trading valuable assets in season is a mistake, especially assets that aren't whining like a bunch of wusses and will without a doubt step up and produce.

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What depth means to me is when you don't have a drastic drop off in perfomance due to an injury.

Yes, not only do we not want to trade away our depth but we need to continue to build on it, especially on the OL.

Edit: Green Bay showed that last year with their SB run and the Giants showed it week 1 with their DL.

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What depth means to me is when you don't have a drastic drop off in perfomance due to an injury.

Yes, not only do we not want to trade away our depth but we need to continue to build on it, especially on the OL.

Edit: Green Bay showed that last year with their SB run and the Giants showed it week 1 with their DL.

This is exactly it. We need to build depth at more positions. As guys step up, and show they're better than what we have currently, you can start moving pieces. If a contract is going to get in the way, you either have to part with the guy who is going to demand money on the open market, or part with someone else. It all depends what you're doing. But as long as you can keep depth, you keep it. Period.

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I really hope that we spend another pick in the first 3 rounds in this upcoming draft on a DL (in addition to an ILB, but that's another topic). This, to me, is the best place on the team to have depth. The front 7.

We need to reinforce our OL of course, but a deep and nasty front 7 is what's going to make, and keep, this team competitive, because our offense will always be adequate enough to keep us in games with the Shanahan's here.

That's specifically addressing an area where I'd like to have more depth, but it's semi-related to the topic. :)

In general, I agree with you on depth and its importance. I DO think you can afford to trade depth at certain positions. They just happen to be the only positions where we have depth. So I can see the issue. I can go either way on it, when it comes to TE and RB. Not now maybe, when we're finally looking competitive and depth can finally serve a real purpose. But in the future, after another draft and FA period, there are certain positions where depth can be sacrificed. But there's no NEED to do it unless the value brought back is very high.

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Depth is key, everyone knows that. But I think you are missing the point. We have Davis, Cooley, Paulsen, and Sellers. Right now Paulsen is outplaying cooley and I would argue that Sellers would do the exact same. So then your argument turns into a hypothetical "if/when cooley is healthy". Okay I can see your argument looking at past stats and how well he has done so I can see where you are coming from. But here is my argument.

Why are we holding onto someone that even though he has little trade value due to injury, still has trade value b/c of his name. We can still run the 2 te sets with davis and paulsen and when we need a blocking te sellers will destroy lbs. And what would we get for cooley? Probably a future draft pick that magically will lead to youthful depth. Thats what good franchises do. They trade away players who have value and acrue draft picks. We finally saw it first hand and look how it turned out.

Hey if we keep him great he is cooley we love him. If we trade him this skins fan will not be pissed off 1 bit.

Thats my take on depth

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I really hope that we spend another pick in the first 3 rounds in this upcoming draft on a DL (in addition to an ILB, but that's another topic). This, to me, is the best place on the team to have depth. The front 7.

DL, ILB, QB and interior OL would be the areas to concentrate on in the next draft and FA signing period, imo...If we can hit on those areas next offseason the Skins are gonna be scary.

---------- Post added September-21st-2011 at 09:42 AM ----------

Right now Paulsen is outplaying cooley...

How is Paulsen outplaying Cooley? lol...

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DL, ILB, QB and interior OL would be the areas to concentrate on in the next draft and FA signing period, imo...If we can hit on those areas next offseason the Skins are gonna be scary.

I couldn't agree more with this. A scary front 7 on defense is going to make our secondary look better than it ever has. And the guys we've got in the secondary are pretty young, outside of Atogwe (assuming we re-sign Landry).

Then on offense, improving the OL and taking that elusive QB of the future if he's there would put us in a GREAT spot.

Especially since, think about it:

4 years from now, where will our division rivals be? Vick, Romo sits to pee, and Manning will all be winding down or done. And we'll be rising up as the new power in the division with the only young franchise QB (I assume we get one in the next 4 years :ols:).

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Depth is key, everyone knows that. But I think you are missing the point. We have Davis, Cooley, Paulsen, and Sellers.

Sellers is a FB, not a TE. Check the depth chart. He's an emergency TE and quite honestly, I'm not impressed with him in either position.

Right now Paulsen is outplaying cooley and I would argue that Sellers would do the exact same.

By what definition is he outplaying Cooley?

Why are we holding onto someone that even though he has little trade value due to injury, still has trade value b/c of his name. We can still run the 2 te sets with davis and paulsen and when we need a blocking te sellers will destroy lbs.

And if Davis/Paulsen go down, who's our depth? Sellers isn't very good. And he hasn't been for a few years now. He has your big hit from time to time.

And what would we get for cooley? Probably a future draft pick that magically will lead to youthful depth.

Or a draft pick that fails to make the roster.

Thats my take on depth

You didn't say much about depth. :)

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I really hope that we spend another pick in the first 3 rounds in this upcoming draft on a DL (in addition to an ILB, but that's another topic). This, to me, is the best place on the team to have depth. The front 7.

We need to reinforce our OL of course, but a deep and nasty front 7 is what's going to make, and keep, this team competitive, because our offense will always be adequate enough to keep us in games with the Shanahan's here.

I disagree in that we need ILB, QB, and OL that can start. Those need to be the priorities in 2012.

That said, I could live with a top tier NT if there is one that falls to us in the first 3 rounds. That would be the only exception, though, and depth would otherwise be best acquired in the later rounds (ie, Chris Neild).

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The Cooley stuff is silly. We've missed the ship on trading him and it would've probably been a lateral move at best.

Right now, I can't see getting very much for him at all. Like a conditional 5th or 6th at best. The benefit of keeping him far outweighs any draft picks we could get. And who in the heck came up with the idea to cut Torain? Seriously, come on people. Let's try to be logical. This place really gets silly sometimes.

(Note : Not talking to the OP since it seems we agree, just speaking of this place in general.)

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Depth is key, everyone knows that. But I think you are missing the point. We have Davis, Cooley, Paulsen, and Sellers. Right now Paulsen is outplaying cooley and I would argue that Sellers would do the exact same. So then your argument turns into a hypothetical "if/when cooley is healthy". Okay I can see your argument looking at past stats and how well he has done so I can see where you are coming from. But here is my argument.

Why are we holding onto someone that even though he has little trade value due to injury, still has trade value b/c of his name. We can still run the 2 te sets with davis and paulsen and when we need a blocking te sellers will destroy lbs. And what would we get for cooley? Probably a future draft pick that magically will lead to youthful depth. Thats what good franchises do. They trade away players who have value and acrue draft picks. We finally saw it first hand and look how it turned out.

Hey if we keep him great he is cooley we love him. If we trade him this skins fan will not be pissed off 1 bit.

Thats my take on depth

So if Fred Davis (no jinx) tears an ACL how will our 2 tight end set look with Paulson and 37 year old Sellers?:silly:

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I also consider depth as bringing up our younger players. A great example is the wideouts. We have Niles Paul, Terrance Austin, etc. Eventually, these guys have the talent to step up and be starters. I love that we are growing our own talent now through the draft. I feel confident that it will continue to be that way.

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Good post KDawg.

There's been a myth floating around that New England and Philly and Pittsburgh became successful by trading away all of their best players. What really happened is they became successful, and after several years of that, were able to trade some good players away. We are not there yet, and letting go of proven players is not going to get us there any faster.

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Without going into too much detail, depth to me is having players come in for relief, injured or ineffective players without a significant dropoff. Of course you will have some dropoff, but not to the extent we've been accustomed to. I do believe however that the position we do lack depth in is the OL, but even that is debatable because we haven't seen them play. I hope we don't get a chance to see them play anytime soon.:D

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Good post KDawg.

There's been a myth floating around that New England and Philly and Pittsburgh became successful by trading away all of their best players. What really happened is they became successful, and after several years of that, were able to trade some good players away. We are not there yet, and letting go of proven players is not going to get us there any faster.

That whole "This is the way the Patriots do things" twaddle is a HUGE myth lol :yes:...

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Sellers is a FB, not a TE. Check the depth chart. He's an emergency TE and quite honestly, I'm not impressed with him in either position.

By what definition is he outplaying Cooley?

And if Davis/Paulsen go down, who's our depth? Sellers isn't very good. And he hasn't been for a few years now. He has your big hit from time to time.

Or a draft pick that fails to make the roster.

You didn't say much about depth. :)

By what definition is Cooley outplaying anyone? Guys you can remember all the good ole days where cooley was our star but he is done. Plain and simple. Go google all the 2009 stats you want. You are all basing everything on hypotheticals in an arguement. What if he tears his acl ha he isnt playing on the gmen so no acl tear there. I get sellers is a fb, but man has hands, blocks, and hurdles ppl like he was brian leonard in college. Or if we would trade him teams are dropping te's like crazy. Rosario from MIA was just dropped, he wouldnt be a viable number 3 te?

And btw, our 7th round pick which you say "what if our late round pick fails to make the roster" is Neild....Guess he was an ok late round pick

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We certainly have more depth then in recent years and trading it away make almost no sense. There is one case where I would trade away 1 or 2 quality players. I would only make trades if we were going to receive a very high draft pick in next years draft. I am still hoping that we will have enough ammunition to trade up in the draft and pick Luck. Although I don't see anyway that Indy won't keep him if they have the chance to draft him and Indy is not going to win many games this year.

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By what definition is Cooley outplaying anyone?

Wrong answer. YOU said "Paulsen right now is outplaying Cooley"...so when asked you need to show how Paulsen is outplaying Cooley.

What lead you to believe he was? Simple question.

Guys you can remember all the good ole days where cooley was our star but he is done.

Then the "good ole days" was last season :ols:...

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Depth is key, everyone knows that. But I think you are missing the point. We have Davis, Cooley, Paulsen, and Sellers. Right now Paulsen is outplaying cooley and I would argue that Sellers would do the exact same. So then your argument turns into a hypothetical "if/when cooley is healthy". Okay I can see your argument looking at past stats and how well he has done so I can see where you are coming from. But here is my argument.

Why are we holding onto someone that even though he has little trade value due to injury, still has trade value b/c of his name. We can still run the 2 te sets with davis and paulsen and when we need a blocking te sellers will destroy lbs. And what would we get for cooley? Probably a future draft pick that magically will lead to youthful depth. Thats what good franchises do. They trade away players who have value and acrue draft picks. We finally saw it first hand and look how it turned out.

Hey if we keep him great he is cooley we love him. If we trade him this skins fan will not be pissed off 1 bit.

Thats my take on depth

Paulsen comes in to spell the other 2 or in 3 TE sets. He's hardly outplaying Cooley (an injured Cooley at that). And to comment about the "good teams know when to trade a player for draft picks." When we become a good team, we can do it. We haven't been a good team and we still aren't a good team despite the 2-0 start. You're putting the cart before the horse. Stop trying to compare us to the Patriots and Eagles. They can afford to replace guys. We need to keep what good players we have until we build up the roster. We don't have that luxury yet. Patience grasshopper. It's going to take another offseason to complete this team. We're not done yet.

---------- Post added September-21st-2011 at 01:12 PM ----------

By what definition is Cooley outplaying anyone? Guys you can remember all the good ole days where cooley was our star but he is done. Plain and simple. Go google all the 2009 stats you want. You are all basing everything on hypotheticals in an arguement. What if he tears his acl ha he isnt playing on the gmen so no acl tear there. I get sellers is a fb, but man has hands, blocks, and hurdles ppl like he was brian leonard in college. Or if we would trade him teams are dropping te's like crazy. Rosario from MIA was just dropped, he wouldnt be a viable number 3 te?

And btw, our 7th round pick which you say "what if our late round pick fails to make the roster" is Neild....Guess he was an ok late round pick

And you are dealing in hypotheticals that Paulsen could step up and play as well as Cooley. He doesn't have the reps yet.

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