Jump to content
Washington Football Team Logo
Extremeskins

When will we EVER learn? Redskins fans, some of the biggest hypocrites around .....


Gibbs Hog Heaven

Recommended Posts

We're about to enter year two of the new regime. A new regime that has brought about change from top to bottom in this organization I had long lost hope of EVER happening again. No longer are we a league wide laughing stock; but a respectable, professionally run organization again; with a complete overhaul and move to youth going on with the playing staff. And within that we read we've created around $45 million worth of cap space. All in all pretty much everything everyone's claimed to of craved from the Redskins for way too long now.

Yet as soon as the news on the cap space breaks, many are suddenly giddy over the biggest name FA they can find. In no particular order, I've read in the past hour that we should go in hard for Nnamdi Asomugha, 30 when next season starts; Cullen Jenkins, 30, and who's missed the small total of 17 freeking games the last three years; Aubrayo Franklin, 31; Daryn Colledge and Jason Hatcher, both 29. And that's just 5 examples. Forget the fact we've just drafted two DE/NT's, let's go adding expensive, and in some cases broken down ageing vets. Forget the fact we drafted three young O-linemen last year, let's add ageing, expensive vets. rather than adding to them with good age talent that will be around for the long haul when we are competitive again. Letting the young guys play, take their licks and grow together when we're a zillion miles from doing anything would apparently be an asinine notion. Let's keep chasing the dream to win now.

I've nothing against adding quality, old, experienced vets. IF your in a position to challenge and one or two of those players can keep you ticking over. We aren't. FAR from. I honestly couldn't care if we stink the joint out results wise the next few years, if we continue in the youth movement vein we're in now. Long term success > short term gratification. ANY day of the week,

I wrote a whiles back on the bi-polar nature of the modern day Redskins fan. After reading some (not all, as there's some very logical views on attacking FA. But too many of the same to have you shaking your head in a "not again" moment) yet again wanting Snyder to go out and do what they've castigated him for time again it's clear that description still holds with a section of the fan base. And I used to laugh at Dallas fans for such hypocrisy. It all isn't quite as funny when it's your own.

How can we honestly, straight faced expect those in power to change the way we do things when we haven't fully as fans?

Hail.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Thank you for this thread, I was seeing the same thing in that 45mil cap space thread that you're talking about and didn't know why people were so adamant about going after older "vets" who have very little chance to be on the team after 2 or 3 years. Sure they're good, but we don't need bandaids right now, we still need deeper treatment. I'd much rather use that cap space for extensions and SMART signings, like what Shanallen have done for the majority of the time they've been here. We shouldn't be going after bigger names just because all of a sudden we have the power to, we should be going after the right names and compensating them accordingly. I don't want Nnamdi and I don't want Braylon.

Lets lock up the core Skins we have now, I mean Santana and Landry, because they deserve the contacts and I would love to see them retire as Skins. Lets sign some people who will help our scheme and not just a big name that brings excitement to the fan base. If Shanahan and Allen do sign a big name, then I'll trust that whatever they saw in him is a fit for our team and locker room.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We're about to enter year two of the new regime. How can we honestly, straight faced expect those in power to change the way we do things when we haven't fully as fans?

Hail.

Thankfully those in power don't look to the fans for directitude= attitude of direction has been forged and will continue. I don't think either one of the two guys running this team look to fans, including the owner of the team, for wisdom concerning football related decisions.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I understand what you're saying but we need a happy medium. We should use FA to add depth but utilize our young talent.

Look what we did last year with our WR corps. We gave AA a shot and Banks the reins as far as special teams.

My only issue with going with our youth is that it isnt necessarily better.

But I like the direction we're headed. We're putting the hardest working/hungriest players on the field. And to me, that's how u win football games. And that is a team that I will proudly support.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The worst thing is fans that don't understand that building a roster through nothing but the draft is just as idiotic. We should not abandon free agency all together. And that is a sentiment I see here more than "Fire up Redskins One' date=' coach."[/quote']

I think THIS year is the one year to abandon FA. Had Shanallahan done the right thing in 2010, and punted that season as opposed to bringing in McNabb and keeping Haynesworth, we'd be further along.

If we were in the position of the Detroit Lions, I say spend.

Right now this thing still needs to get ripped down for another year

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is not about age...it is about talent and ability. The problem the Skins have had in the past is signing free agents who could produce to the level of their contract. The youngest any free agent is likely to be is about 26. Why? because most talented college players sign a 4 or 5 year contract. So when you say that a 28 year old is "too old", you are left with looking at a very small pool of players.

A 30 year old can easily have 4-5 years left; and often it is 4-5 years of their prime playing years. People need to stop looking at age alone. That is only one criteria that goes into selecting a player. If you replace a 38 year old Philip Daniels with a 30 year old high performing DE like Cullen Jenkins, you just made your team 8 years younger and added a quality pass rushing player.

Stop with the tunnel vision. If you want to live off of undrafted free agents, your team is going to such badly if that is your GM strategy. A quality football team has a nice mixture of high quality veterans and youth.

The key is having the football IQ to select quality players in the draft and free agency. This team sorely lacked that kind of player personnel evaluator for ten years.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The worst thing is fans that don't understand that building a roster through nothing but the draft is just as idiotic. We should not abandon free agency all together. And that is a sentiment I see here more than "Fire up Redskins One' date=' coach."[/quote']

Thankfully in the thread that had me exasperated yet again with many there were many more putting forward some quality, mid- latish (26/27) 20 year olds that fit into the new direction were taking to try be competitive now, but building this thing the right way for the long haul.

As has been mentioned in a reply above, it's about getting the happy medium between the draft and what you can pick-up in FA to aid that.

Hail.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It is not about age...it is about talent and ability. The problem the Skins have had in the past is signing free agents who could produce to the level of their contract. The youngest any free agent is likely to be is about 26. Why? because most talented college players sign a 4 or 5 year contract. So when you say that a 28 year old is "too old", you are left with looking at a very small pool of players.

A 30 year old can easily have 4-5 years left; and often it is 4-5 years of their prime playing years. People need to stop looking at age alone. That is only one criteria that goes into selecting a player. If you replace a 38 year old Philip Daniels with a 30 year old high performing DE like Cullen Jenkins, you just made your team 8 years younger and added a quality pass rushing player.

Stop with the tunnel vision. If you want to live off of undrafted free agents, your team is going to such badly if that is your GM strategy. A quality football team has a nice mixture of high quality veterans and youth.

The key is having the football IQ to select quality players in the draft and free agency. This team sorely lacked that kind of player personnel evaluator for ten years.

We have spoken about this in other threads but I'll repeat the point.

If you keep bringing in 27-30 year old guys, you reduce the amount of room for younger guys on rookie contracts. The Chris Wilson's, the Kevin Barnes, the Kareem Moore's of the world never get enough time to play and develop.

What you end up with is the 2004-2006 Redskins

1 year where the team adjusts to a new scheme (2004) and struggles

The next year where they put together a nice year, but max out at 10 wins (2005)

And then by year 3, these guys are on the back side of their career and the bottom falls out (2006)

We need to a) lose to collect high talented young guys and then B) play those young guys for a season and let them get experience. At that point we can see what FA moves are needed and bring in the appropriate veterans to fill in holes

We just always jump to the final step

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not only that SHF, but let's say we add the named vets. And we become competitive to the extent of muddling through to an around .500 season. In a 2012 draft full of top quality QB talent, we've just set ourselves back even further for the sake of short term gratification.

Hail.

If we go 8-8 next year I'll go crazy.

2011 needs to generate a top 5 draft pick for us. Andrew Luck would be perfect, but I'll settle for Jones or Barkley.

No top flight franchise QB=no Superbowl down the line. All we end up with is 6-10 to 10-6, just like the last decade (with a 4-12 and 5-11 thrown in there for kicks)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Absolutely agree. I'm excited to be under the cap, but not so we can sign every FA that looks shiny on TV. I'm actually looking forward to us signing sensible FAs, OL and DL, then maybe a 2nd tier corner, and some other bit players.

The only signing I'm really hoping we do, and since most of the media is ignoring him, and NT isn't a "sexy" position, is Aubrayo Franklin to play as part of our rotation. I don't expect us to sign any 7 year contracts, like Vinny loved to do. The longest I could see us doing is a 5 year for a younger OL, that's about it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We have spoken about this in other threads but I'll repeat the point.

If you keep bringing in 27-30 year old guys, you reduce the amount of room for younger guys on rookie contracts. The Chris Wilson's, the Kevin Barnes, the Kareem Moore's of the world never get enough time to play and develop.

The odds are much greater that the Chris Wilsons, Kevin Barneses and Kareem Moores of the world don't get more playing time due to their level of talent, practice habits, inconsistent production, their skillsets, and lack of ability to translate to the field what they learn in meetings and the classroom, than anything having to do with the number of 27-30 year olds on the roster.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

If we go 8-8 next year I'll go crazy.

2011 needs to generate a top 5 draft pick for us. Andrew Luck would be perfect, but I'll settle for Jones or Barkley.

No top flight franchise QB=no Superbowl down the line. All we end up with is 6-10 to 10-6, just like the last decade (with a 4-12 and 5-11 thrown in there for kicks)

Hey, this is for another thread and many will flame me for this but I'm so sick of mediocrity under center I don't care: If you could guarantee me an 0-16/ 1-15 season right now, with the young guys playing, taking their licks and learning and growing together, but just coming up short results wise, I'd snap your hand off right now and ask where do I sign?

And that's not intentionally tanking the season, before some wise ass takes the homer standpoint. That's from all standpoints one of the best things that could possibly happen to this team going forward. And I'm sure if the owner could see the long term benefits there'd be no fear of the HC's job either in a scenario like that.

Hail.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The odds are much greater that the Chris Wilsons, Kevin Barneses and Kareem Moores of the world don't get more playing time due to their level of talent, practice habits, inconsistent production, their skillsets, and lack of ability to translate to the field what they learn in meetings and the classroom, than anything having to do with the number of 27-30 year olds on the roster.

Its apparent we gave up Moore pretty quick, despite him having an injury last year. I would like to have seen him another year starting and see if he improved

Wilson: We bury him behind Andre Carter and don't get him realistic playing time. And if we bring in another CB what do we do with Barnes?

I'd like to see a trial by fire year this year, in particular if the season is shortened. Mike Shanahan has the advantage with his contract situation to do this

---------- Post added July-10th-2011 at 07:54 PM ----------

Hey, this is for another thread and many will flame me for this but I'm so sick of mediocrity under center I don't care: If you could guarantee me an 0-16/ 1-15 season right now, with the young guys playing, taking their licks and learning and growing together, but just coming up short results wise, I'd snap your hand off right now and ask were do I sign?

And that's not intentionally tanking the season, before some wise ass takes the homer standpoint. That's from all standpoints one of the best things that could possibly happen to this team going forward. And I'm sure if the owner could see the long term benefits there'd be no fear of the HC's job either in a scenario like that.

Hail.

I hope to God this is the thinking in Ashburn this summer.

You potentially have one of the best QB's to come out in years at the top of this draft, and 2 others who aren't exactly chopped liver. Get in position to get them while improving this team for the next decade.

Being a team whose best seasons the last 20 years is 10 wins and a playoff win is simply unacceptable.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

People don't understand that most free agents aren't going to be 25 years old, if some of you guys had your way this team would be full of 20 year old UDFA who have "high character". A team can build through the draft AND get top quality free agents. London Fletcher was 30 when we signed him. How has he worked out for us?

He was 32, actually lol...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

People don't understand that most free agents aren't going to be 25 years old, if some of you guys had your way this team would be full of 20 year old UDFA who have "high character". A team can build through the draft AND get top quality free agents. London Fletcher was 30 when we signed him. How has he worked out for us?

9-7, 8-8, 4-12, 6-10 :whoknows:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Since when does the fan base make the front office decisions around here? Why should we care what a member of this board thinks about a potental FA pickup, big picture. People seem to take this place a little too seriously.

Now im not saying people should stop chatting it up here. Thats what makes this place fun; Its whats fun about being a fan. But the only thats worse than an uninformed opinion is someone who takes their informed opinion, about a game, too seriously.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And if we bring in another CB what do we do with Barnes?.....

.....You potentially have one of the best QB's to come out in years at the top of this draft, and 2 others who aren't exactly chopped liver. Get in position to get them while improving this team for the next decade....

First, no team in the league is going to tank the season, if that's what you're proposing. Second, the last 3 years people have been saying the same thing about the next year's QB class, so what's to say next season we won't be saying, "we should wait to draft a QB until the 2013 draft"? I'm hoping we pick someone next year, but I'm not assuming we tank the season. I don't think we'll have to TRY and lose to be in position for a QB, even if we DO sign a couple younger OL. I don't think this team is good enough to worry about tanking a season.

Second, I'm not sure bringing in competition for the CB position is a horrible thing. I'm not saying sign Asomugha, he's not a zone cover guy, but bringing in someone might be a necessity, since we currently don't have a decent nickel corner.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

People don't understand that most free agents aren't going to be 25 years old, if some of you guys had your way this team would be full of 20 year old UDFA who have "high character". A team can build through the draft AND get top quality free agents. London Fletcher was 30 when we signed him. How has he worked out for us?

Why is Fletch the only example that gets thrown up when talk of ageing vets comes up? Oh, he's about the only real recent success we've had ..... and that success certainly hasn't transitioned into making the team any better results wise, as great an individual player and influence on all Fletch is.

He's a unique one off, and not the way you want to be going for the long haul.

Hail.

*Edit* As exemplified by the season on season results posted above through his time.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

First, no team in the league is going to tank the season, if that's what you're proposing. Second, the last 3 years people have been saying the same thing about the next year's QB class, so what's to say next season we won't be saying, "we should wait to draft a QB until the 2013 draft"? I'm hoping we pick someone next year, but I'm not assuming we tank the season. I don't think we'll have to TRY and lose to be in position for a QB, even if we DO sign a couple younger OL. I don't think this team is good enough to worry about tanking a season.

I agree.

The roster on this team is a bottom 3 roster. We don't have to "tank" the talent is that bad.

However, we don't need to go out and sign a bunch of guys either. Let this roster play out this year and lets end up in the top 5.

And plenty of people were very skeptical about the QB class this past season. I for one was not a fan of it once Luck elected to stay in school

Link to comment
Share on other sites

9-7, 8-8, 4-12, 6-10 :whoknows:

So you're saying that because we signed London Fletcher our record has been bad? I'd say our record has been bad in SPITE of us signing Fletcher. He's been about the ONLY right thing we've done on defense this side of switching Landry to play closer to the line.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Its apparent we gave up Moore pretty quick, despite him having an injury last year. I would like to have seen him another year starting and see if he improved

Moore is a 6th round draft pick who showed flashes of being a capable back up, nothing more. We could survive with him starting 2-3 games, yes. But what exactly has led ANYONE to believe he showed he could be a long-term starter for this team? Not to mention he'll be 27 years old and in his 4th year...raise your hands if you think Kareem Moore hitting the open market would generate tons of calls from teams looking for a starting-caliber safety.

Wilson: We bury him behind Andre Carter and don't get him realistic playing time.

Has Chris Wilson ever started any games for the Redskins, regardless of who was coach?

And if we bring in another CB what do we do with Barnes?

Um, let him continue to develop, maybe? Can a realistic case be made that he's shown enough to warrant keeping the team from bringing in someone else as starting CB?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    • No registered users viewing this page.
×
×
  • Create New...