Teller Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Yeah, fathers are ****ed in the legal system in this country. Mom can abort at will, dad can sit there and wait and see what mom does. And then, some of the women in this country use the child/children as negotiating ploys to get what they want or divorce. What legal resort do men have This. Desperate times and all that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burgold Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 IF he broke into the doctors office and stole her records to learn of it, I'd agree, but I don't think that's the case.Let's remove the abortion part from it. If somebody tells you they had a nose job and then you put up a billboard about it (w/o actually naming the person appearantly), would that be illegal? Should the rules change for an abortion vs. a nose job? Why? Or let's it make it even more mild. What about strep throat? I've seen individuals sued for disclosing plastic surgery. Where it gets squiggly for me is what if you find out that X has an STD and as a public service you hire out a billboard or facebook this info to everyone around. Now, he purpose of doing this is to stop X from spreading his STD which is a noble cause,but it is also making him a pariah or injuring X. Is putting out this abortion info about this woman injuring her? In some communities I believe that it would be. People would see her differently, treat her differently, and her life would be alterred. She certainly could face societal consequences from this man revealing her medical procedure. Now, I don't know if I'm right, but you could make a case that publishing this info is causing her harm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Madison Redskin Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 This is beyond legal resposibiliies this is dictate what a person does with their body for the next 9 months, in that time to be fair a woman should be allowed to tell a man what he will do with his body for the the same nine month period I believe that women should be permitted to have abortions in the first trimester of their pregnancies, with or without consent of the would-be father. However, I do not believe that a woman's right to have an abortion encompasses the right to gag the would-be father. He's not subject to any oath of confidentiality. So why should he have to keep his mouth closed? Because it's spiteful and distasteful? That's not a good enough reason to suppress the man's freedom of speech. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeterMP Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 I've seen individuals sued for disclosing plastic surgery. Where it gets squiggly for me is what if you find out that X has an STD and as a public service you hire out a billboard or facebook this info to everyone around. Now, he purpose of doing this is to stop X from spreading his STD which is a noble cause,but it is also making him a pariah or injuring X. Is putting out this abortion info about this woman injuring her? In some communities I believe that it would be. People would see her differently, treat her differently, and her life would be alterred. She certainly could face societal consequences from this man revealing her medical procedure.Now, I don't know if I'm right, but you could make a case that publishing this info is causing her harm. But you can make that argument about all sorts of things. Was Nixon harmed because of the WashPo stories on watergate? Harm being done can't be the measure of invasion of privacy. Nothing negative about anybody would ever be published. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teller Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 I still think allowing "male abortions" would solve much of the unwanted-pregnancy problem. Simply allow fathers the choice to be a parent, or sign over all parental rights and all responsibilties to the mother if he doesn't want the child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rictus58 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 I still think allowing "male abortions" would solve much of the unwanted-pregnancy problem. Simply allow fathers the choice to be a parent, or sign over all parental rights and all responsibilties to the mother if he doesn't want the child. Then he should have wrapped it up. Your "solution" couldn't be any more horrible.You'r simply trading one problem for a much worse one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teller Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Then "he" should have wrapped it up. Your "solution" couldn't be any more horrible. She should ensure that it is too. Abortion problem solved. Or is he the only one we're going to replace responsibility upon? If so, then he should be the one with the rights. Period. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rictus58 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 She should ensure that it is too. Abortion problem solved. Or is he the only one we're going to replace responsibility upon? If so, then he should be the one with the rights. Period. Seriously, HH, what world do you live on where the man is the only one with the responsibility thrust upon him? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forehead Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 For those who haven't seen it, I know I was curious. Also, the Photoshoppers are already out in force. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
December90 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Then he should have wrapped it up. Your "solution" couldn't be any more horrible.You'r simply trading one problem for a much worse one. I think you don't understand where HH is coming from. If a man gets a woman pregnant then he is completely powerless and she can do whatever she wants without his consent up to and including hiring someone to kill his baby before it is born. If he wants to hire the person to kill his baby before it is born and she doesn't want that then he cannot force it to happen. Even though he wanted an out by killing his baby, if she has the baby instead then he is on the hook for child support for the next 18 years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popeman38 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 She should ensure that it is too. Abortion problem solved. Or is he the only one we're going to replace responsibility upon? If so, then he should be the one with the rights. Period. H_H, you know the response to this. Abortion is her acting responsibly. Most of the pro-choice members on this board say that abortion is not used as birth control. We all know that, with all the advertising and knowledge and resources available to anyone wanting them, in fact it is. But admitting that invalidates the argument they have been using for 30 years. They want women to have the right to do what they want with their bodies, and not plan for anything. And then react if something they didn't want to happen but took no steps to prevent, happens. Its always the other persons fault. Dude shoulda wrapped up!!! What about the 1,345 forms of female contraception? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teller Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Seriously, HH, what world do you live on where the man is the only one with the responsibility thrust upon him? One where a woman can kill a man's child whenever she wants to shirk her own responsibility, but he's on the hook for 18 years (minimum) if she carries to term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rictus58 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 One where a woman can kill a man's child whenever she wants to shirk her own responsibility, but he's on the hook for 18 years (minimum) if she carries to term. Considering the fact that the man isn't the one carrying the baby to term, the man shouldn't have a say. His choice comes prior to engaging in sex. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 I still think allowing "male abortions" would solve much of the unwanted-pregnancy problem. Simply allow fathers the choice to be a parent, or sign over all parental rights and all responsibilties to the mother if he doesn't want the child. In short, permit all males to father all the children they want, and completely deny any responsibility whatsoever, by filling out a "I told her to kill it" form, after the fact? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rictus58 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 In short, permit all males to father all the children they want, and completely deny any responsibility whatsoever, by filling out a "I told her to kill it" form, after the fact? You mean that's not a reasonable solution? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Teller Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Considering the fact that the man isn't the one carrying the baby to term, the man shouldn't have a say. His choice comes prior to engaging in sex. So SHOULD hers. But hell, equal treatment under the law is just a respectful suggestion. It's not even close to being fact. ---------- Post added June-7th-2011 at 10:05 AM ---------- In short, permit all males to father all the children they want, and completely deny any responsibility whatsoever, by filling out a "I told her to kill it" form, after the fact? How else would you ensure equal treatment? Or are you fine without it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Most of the pro-choice members on this board say that abortion is not used as birth control. We all know that, with all the advertising and knowledge and resources available to anyone wanting them, in fact it is. But admitting that invalidates the argument they have been using for 30 years. They want women to have the right to do what they want with their bodies, and not plan for anything. And then react if something they didn't want to happen but took no steps to prevent, happens. Its always the other persons fault. Dude shoulda wrapped up!!! What about the 1,345 forms of female contraception? I bet you'll have no problem at all finding a post where somebody says that, right? Since "Most of the pro-choice members of this board" say it? That is, unless you just pulled it out of your Philly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
December90 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 In short, permit all males to father all the children they want, and completely deny any responsibility whatsoever, by filling out a "I told her to kill it" form, after the fact? How about a compromise that says your not allowed to kill the baby unless both parents agree to killing the baby? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 So SHOULD hers. But hell, equal treatment under the law is just a respectful suggestion. It's not even close to being fact.---------- Post added June-7th-2011 at 10:05 AM ---------- How else would you ensure equal treatment? Or are you fine without it? Unfortunately for your political crusade, reality isn't equal, in this case. It may come as a shock to you, but women get pregnant, and men don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rictus58 Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 HH, I know you feel you've been screwed by Family courts in the past. But if a man isn't willing to support a child he helped create, he needs to keep it locked up or double wrapped. If he wants to father a child, he needs to find a woman who shares the same thoughts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 How about a compromise that says your not allowed to kill the baby unless both parents agree to killing the baby? Ah, the "compromise" that says "It should require two votes, both votes shall count equally (even though the results of the vote only apply to one of the voters), and any ties must be decided the way my opinion thinks it should be decided"? Funny, I sort of think that the tie breaking vote should go to the person who's being asked to donate their body for the next nine months. I kind of think that that fact counts for something. ---------- Long as we're making up compromises, how about "the woman's vote is the one that counts, unless the Man is willing and able to have the fetus implanted into his body, and to assume all responsibility for the fetus from that point forward"? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redskins Diehard Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Health records are confidential. Abortion is a medical procedure. Revealing her medical history is a violation of privacy.I'm not sure where I stand on this freedom of speech vs invasion of privacy, but it sure is an icky thing to do. I may not look at it the same way if he put a picture of her and said "She killed my baby". But it looks like he didn't name her at all right? The icky thing to do...are you talking about the sign? Or aborting his baby against his wishes? Freedom to choose, freedom to live discussion aside...I think it would be a pretty icky thing to have my baby aborted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pwyl Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Ah, the "compromise" that says "It should require two votes, both votes shall count equally (even though the results of the vote only apply to one of the voters), and any ties must be decided the way my opinion thinks it should be decided"? Funny, I sort of think that the tie breaking vote should go to the person who's being asked to donate their body for the next nine months. I kind of think that that fact counts for something. ---------- Long as we're making up compromises, how about "the woman's vote is the one that counts, unless the Man is willing and able to have the fetus implanted into his body, and to assume all responsibility for the fetus from that point forward"? Bolded part not true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Destino Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 H_H, you know the response to this. Abortion is her acting responsibly. Most of the pro-choice members on this board say that abortion is not used as birth control. We all know that, with all the advertising and knowledge and resources available to anyone wanting them, in fact it is. But admitting that invalidates the argument they have been using for 30 years. They want women to have the right to do what they want with their bodies, and not plan for anything. And then react if something they didn't want to happen but took no steps to prevent, happens. Its always the other persons fault. Dude shoulda wrapped up!!! What about the 1,345 forms of female contraception? If we ignore the history of female reproductive rights your post seems almost reasonable. Abortion is absolutely used as birth control and I doubt many posters would argue otherwise. It was always intended to be used as birth control in fact, so long as the women chose to use it as such. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Larry Posted June 7, 2011 Share Posted June 7, 2011 Bolded part not true. Bolded part absolutely true. Again, I know it's tough to grasp, but only one person is expected to donate their body for nine months. Once he's born, then both of them can, and should, be equally responsible. Raising a child is an obligation upon both parents. (And, hopefully, lots of others, too.) But the burdens of pregnancy fall solely upon one person. (Unless you consider late night munchie runs to be half of the burden.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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