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A Closer Look at 2011 QB Prospect:Andy Dalton


darrelgreenie

What should the Redskins do in the first round?  

200 members have voted

  1. 1. What should the Redskins do in the first round?

    • Draft OLB/DE Robert Quinn
      30
    • Draft WR Julio Jones
      33
    • Draft OL Tyron Smith
      7
    • Trade down to acquire more picks
      130


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The 2011 Redskins might be in the market to acquire a QB in the upcoming draft and there are several good prospects.

The aim of this series of threads is to conduct a layman's evaluation and discussion of the QBs by look past the stats and the often parroted rhetoric available through media and draft sites.

The goal is to look in depth and discuss the top prospects in action.

The springboard for the discussion will be the commonly available game cut-ups (not highlights) on youtube and may extend to torrents (if there's interest).

All are welcome with the expectation that specific plays will be discussed whenever possible.

5284491422_d1094fbff3_t.jpg

The prospect for this thread is Andy Dalton and will be looking at this game:

TCU vs San Diego State

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fj-4131UbFg

(1) 2&12 Shotgun 3 Wide 2 RBs-Motion to singleback- 5 man pressure-PA locked onto frontside progression on the ® and the missed TE on (L) near hash & RB checkdown- Sack

(2) 3&23 Gun 1RB Trips ® 10 yd square in OT+TR+

(3) 2&15 Empty-Trips ® Locks on near TE running an out CB tips it Safety misses it almost picked off

(4) 3&15 1RB Trips ®-Locks onto Iso (L) on a go route well covered by CB double covered by FS

almost picked by CB

(5) 1&10 1RB Zone Read QB-RB miscommunication FUMBLE recovered

(6) 2&12 1RB Trips (L)- PA 10 yd out to Iso WR ® OT+TR+ Pass Interference

(7) 1&10 2 RB Twins (L)- PA bubble screen slot (L)

(8) 2&5 1 RB Twins (L); TE motion PA bubble screen slot (L)

(9) 1&15 1 RB Even-Slot (L) 4 yd out OT+TR+IS+

(10) 1&10 1 RB Even-Turns down open slot (L) misses/overthrows WR (L) in between Cover 2 CB-FS (@ 2:16)

(11) 2&10 1 RB Even-Zone read keeps up the middle 8 yds and gets down before taking a hit

(12) 3&2 Empty Trips ®- Near slot 5 yd out OT+TR+ IS- FL dove and made a nice catch (2:40)

(13) 2&8 1 RB Even-(L) Slot 5 yd hitch OT+ TR+ IS+

(14) 4&4 Empty Trips ®-Hits middle slot ® 8 yd out OT+ TR+ IS+ good ball placement lead to YAC + a good block downfield TD!....good stones to convert on 4th after a rocky start (3:10)

(15) 2 RB Twin (L)- WR Iso ® 12 yd out/comeback OT+ TR+ IS+ NFL throw (3:26)

(16) 1 RB Even- WR (L) 10 yd curl OT+ TR+ IS-n/a dropped; rips a strong NFL throw from far hash (L) almost to ® sideline good velocity you can hear it hit of dudes pads (3:37)

(17) 3&10 Trips(L)- WR(L) 12 yd Square In OT+ TR- high IS+ Pass interference

(18) 1RB Bunch Stack ® Dbl TE (L) Hits TE(L) 20 yd Corner-fade OT+ TR+ IS+ TD! (4:09)

(19) 1RB Even-WR(L) 10 yd Out from (L) hash to ® sideline strong throw OT+ TR+ IS- good velocity

(20) 1RB Trips® checks down to RB TO+ TR+ IS+

(21) 3&6 2RB motion to 1RB designed* veer option snap to AD forward pitch to RB dropped (4:53)

*Dalton said its a designed forward snap on Gruden's QB camp

(22) Pistol Dbl TE® Twins(L) WR(L) 5 yd out OT+ TR+ IS+

(23) Pistol"-PA WR(L) 25 yd Post fired on a line OT+ TR+ IS broken up by DB strong throw good velocity (5:10)

(24) Pistol flipped-Slot ® 5 yd out OT+ TR+ IS

(25) Pistol- Slot(L) 5 yd out OT+ TR+ IS+ TD he's surgical throwing outs (5:35)

(26) Empty Trips(L)-Sprint (L) WR(L) 15 yd Fade Sit vs Cover 2 (same pass he missed high on early) this time OT+ TR+ IS+ (6:20)

(27) Empty Trips®-10 yd out to middle slot® OT+ TR+ IS- dropped strong throw from (L) hast to ® sideline (6:24)

(28) 1RB Even Slot® 5yd hitch OT+ TR+ IS+

(29) 3&4 1RB Even-Inside slot® 15 yd Seam-Post into Cover "hole" behind the LBs in front of the FS OT+ TR+ IS+ (6:51)

(30) 1RB Trips(L)- PA slot(L) bubble screen

(31) Pistol- RB fakes handoff; Slot® Corner-out OT+ TR+ IS+ TD! (7:16)

(32) 2RB Motion® bubble screen to motion man

(33) (What? Wow!) Under Center-I Form Dbl TE®-Iso WR(L) 3 step slant (L) WR is falls then gets jammed picks up a 2 yd gain (8:01)

(34) 1RB Even motion ® to (L) Zone read keeps 2 yds

(35) 1RB Even-Slot® Seam TO TR- IS- overthrown/throwaway (being greedy) but he at least put it only his receiver had a shot at it (8:21)

(36) 1RB Even Zone read keeps

(37) Pistol-WR(L) Turned down the slot out that he was shredding them with then underthrows a -fade broken up by on a good play by CB -OT+ TR- IS- (I actually understand the aggressive/killer instinct but the out was working all game) (8:47)

(38) 3&4 Quad stack (L) Iso® Slant® OT+ TR+ IS+ broken up by nice play by CB

(39) 3&7 1RB Even-WR(L) Go route (L) sideline dropped/broken up (hard to see) but slot(L) was open on a 10 yd seam-post (getting greedy) (9:24)

(40) 1RB Even Slot® hitch OT+ TR+ IS

(41) 1RB Under center Trips®-PA bootleg (L) throw away no pressure

(42) Empty Quad bunch® Iso(L)-Fade to Iso(L) out of bounds against good coverage- OT+ TR- IS- looked like he had a dig route open from the middle WR® in the stack (greedy/impatient)

(43) Pistol-WR(L) pressure in the face -late on screen to WR(L) OT- TR- IS- INT!! -WR could have helped out by coming back to the ball but bad decision (10:15)

Unfinished summary to follow

Thoughts?

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here's my play by play:

1.) 2nd and 12 own 24. Shotgun 3 wr set w/ 2 backs. Doesn't show a great feel inside the pocket and takes a sack, though his line really did breakdown on him on the play.

2.) 3rd and 23 own 13. Shotgun 4 wr (trips) w/1 back. Completes a pass to his wr running an in/curl route for a gain of 13. Great velocity/accuracy on his pass.

3.) 2nd and 15 own 15. Shotgun 5 wide. Attempts to hit the corner route but defense breaks it up, ball almost intercepted twice. Right read, poor throw.

4.) 3rd and 15 own 15. Shotgun 4 wr (trips) and 1 rb. Looks for his wr running the post, but puts too much air under the ball, wr is double teamed by the time ball arrives. I would have liked to possibly see a pump fake on this play.

5.) 1st and 10 own 8. Shotgun 3 wr, 1 rb, 1 te. Botched hand-off on an option read.

6.) 2nd and 12 own 6. Shotgun 3 wr, 1 rb, 1 te. Play-action, dalton stands tall in the pocket and throws a strike (though incomplete due to pi), to his wr.

7.) 1st and 10 own 20. Shotgun 3 wr, 2 rb. Bubble screen to wr for 6 yds, accurate pass that didn't have too much heat on it.

8.) 2nd and 5 own 25. Pa bubble screen to same side for 5 yards, another extremely accurate pass.

9.) 1st and 15 own 26. Shotgun 4 wr (spread) 1 rb. Ugly drop-back, accurate pass to wr in the flat who gains some yac for a gain of 13. Didn't like dalton's footwork in general on this play.

10.) 1st and 10 own 45. 4 wr(spread) 1 rb. Again footwork looks less than natural, which isn't usually the case for dalton in my opinion, and he makes descent read on the post route but doesn't connect w/ his wr. Can't tell if the ball is overthrown or what, poor angle on the play.

11.) 2nd and 10 own 45. 4 wr 1 rb. Dalton makes the right read on an option play and carries the ball for 8. Even though it's not a passing play i like seeing the qb making the right read.

12.) 3rd and 2 opp 47. 5 wr. Quick out to his slot man for a gain of 3. Great play, keeps the drive alive when he's teams already down 14, he puts the ball absolutely on the money, great mechanics on his throw

13.) 2nd and 8 opp 42. 4 wr spread 1rb. Hits his wr on the quick hitch, gets to the read late, ball could have been their a half second sooner. All in all though solid play, gain of 7.

14.) 4th and 4 opp 38. 5 wr. Perfect ball again on the money, hits his wr on the out route who is able to take it to the house without any significant moves to pass defenders. Great read/throw/mechanics on huge down.

15.) 2nd and 10 opp 40. 3 wr 2 rb. Correct read/nice footwork/solid mechanics, ball doesn't have great velocity, but is in the air before his wr even breaks for his comeback route, gain of 12.

16.) 2nd and 10 opp 28. 4 wr (spread) 1 rb. Solid mechanics on the play, makes the correct read throwing to the curl route, hits his wr on the money only to have the ball dropped. Very nice velocity on the pass.

17.) 3rd and 10 opp 28. 4 wr (trips) 1 rb. Pocket collapses pretty quickly, dalton makes the correct read but a poor throw which appears to be altered by his lack of space. Pi is called on the play, either way.

18.) 1st and 10 opp 15. 3 wr bunch 1 te 1 rb. Shows great touch on his corner route to the te, pass complete for a td. Showing his full repertoire in this one.

19.) 1st and 5 opp 43. 4 wr (spread) 1 rb. Solid mechanics/footwork shows some arm-strength getting the ball all the way across the field to the comeback route. Again ball is out before wr breaks.

20.) 2nd and 10 opp 33. Shotgun 4 wr (trips) 1 rb. Solid footwork/mechanics, goes through is progressions checks-down to his rb for a gain of 4.

21.) 3rd and 6 opp 29. Shotgun 3 wr 2 rb. Another botched option, this time it was a poor-snap dalton never really has a handle of it, and he makes a horrible decision to try to pitch out to his rb causing a fumble.

22.) 2nd and 5 opp 37. Pistol 3 wr 1 rb 1 te. Great accuracy on the quick out, db was playing off man, wr able to pick up solid yac for a gain of 18.

23.) 1st and 10 opp 30. Pistol 3 wr 1 rb 1 te. Play-action, dalton throws a pass with high-velocity to his wr on the skinny post. Can't tell if the ball hit the receivers hands or was overthrown but it goes incomplete. Correct read on the play, could have/should have been a td.

24.) 1st and 10 opp 16. Pistol 2 wr 2 te 1 rb. Quick-out for 7 yards, solid mechanics/footwork/good read.

25.) 3rd and 3 opp 0. Pistol 2 wr 2 te 1 rb. Quick out for the td. Accurate pass that allowed wr to pick up yac, great mechanics.

At this point andy dalton and his wr's look like they're playing pitch and catch on these quick outs.

26.) 1st and 10 own 40. 5 wr. Designed roll out to the left, connects with his receiver for a gain of 14 on what i believe to be a fade/go route, but the ball is severely under-thrown (to account for the safety) and it almost appears like the wr runs a comeback, either way good awareness by dalton to put the ball in a position where only his wr could get to it.

27.) 1st and 10 opp 46. 5 wr. I really like his footwork on this play, in my opinion it's very fluid. However he does miss his wr on the deep out. Catchable ball, but far from ideal ball placement.

28.) 2nd and 10 opp 46. 4 wr (spread) 1 rb. Quick hitch for a gain of 6. Makes 3rd down now manageable. Gets rid of the ball quickly/solid mechanics/footwork.

29.) 3rd and 4 opp 40. 4 wr (spread) 1 rb. Hits his wr on the skinny post (throws into the teeth of the zone), for a 29 yard gain. Another big play on 3rd down to keep a drive going. I give a lot of credit to the play calling in this instance though, the sdsu's lb's were getting killed underneath, so on 3rd and 4 when they're just waiting for another quick-out/hitch you hit em with the skinny post. I like it.

30.) 1st and 10 opp 11. 4 wr (bunch) 1 rb. Bubble screen to the bunch side for a gain of 7.

31.) 2nd and 3 opp 4. Pistol 2 wr 2 te 1 rb. Shows incredible touch again on a corner/fade route, pass complete to his wr for a td.

32.) 2nd and 3 opp 45. Shotgun 3 wr 2 rb. Bubble screen to wr for a gain of 10

33.) 1st and 10 opp 35. I form, 2 rb, 2 te, 1 wr. Looks for the fade/go route but his wr gets jammed, and then his pocket starts collapsing on him so he scrambles for a few yards. I know i'm really nit-picking here, but i'd like to see him keep his eyes downfield, his wr gets past the jam and his wide open with space to run, but dalton doesn't see it.

34.) 2nd and 10 opp 21. Shotgun 2 wr 2 te 1 rb. Option read, dalton keeps the ball and runs for a gain of a couple. Not so sure he should have kept it on this one.

35.) 3rd and 8 opp 19. Shotgun 4 wr (spread) 1 rb. Dalton misses his wr entirely on the go route. Don't like the read at all, field is to short to find the gap in between db's on what looks to be a cover-3 defense.

36.) 2nd and 3 opp 44. Shotgun 4 wr (spread) 1 rb. Another poor option read by dalton i think he should have given to the rb, scrambles for a gain of 2.

37.) 1st and 10 opp 13. Pistol 2 wr 2 te 1 rb. Looks for his wr on the fade/corner route but ball is slightly under-thrown db breaks it up.

38.) 3rd and 4 opp 7. Shotgun 5 wr (4 bunch). Can't connect with wr on slant, not a lot of separation good play by db.

39.) 3rd and 7 own 38. Shotgun 4 wr (spread) 1 rb. Descent pass to his wr on the go route, slightly under-thrown, but it does hit wr right in the mits only to be dropped.

40.) 2nd and 12. Shotgun 4 wr (spread) 1 rb.

This is until 9:45 i only have a few plays left.

Overall what i see from dalton.

Positives:

Decision making (gets rid of the ball very quickly)

mechanics

accuracy (short to intermediate)

steps his game up for big plays.

Negatives:

Will need a lot more reps from underneath center.

Deep ball accuracy could improve, but i wouldn't count it against him really either. Not really a negative i guess, but not a positive either.

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The more I watch Dalton the more I believe he would be a perfect fit for our offense.

Specifically because, in my opinion he possesses the accuracy on short/intermediate throws to be the QB in an offense that will use the passing game for ball control. In addition to that he's athletic enough to run the bootleg.

Funny that we both note right after the 25th play, Dalton is abusing them.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Fj-4131UbFg&feature=player_embedded



Passing Chart breakdown:

Missed pass incomplete: (3),(4),10,(16),(23),(27), (35) ,37,38, (39) ,41, 42, 43
Caught passes that were off target (keep in mind these are caught passes):12

Drops/(receiver misplay/effort):16,27,39

Broken up: 3,4,23, 35, 37, 38,39, 43 INT

Throw away: 10, (35), (41)


Eval For AD in the TCU vs San Diego State game Scale (1-5):

Instincts+Intuition-2 graded down because (1 fumbles 1 INT)

Competitiveness-4 (battle back after slow start)

Arm Strength-3

Complete Inventory of passes-5

Quick delivery-5

Touch-4

Read defense-2 (the system has a lot of easy half field reads and was very sharp on 1st read plays, but also made some poor decisions)

Mobility+Avoidance-3 was well protected and didn't have to make any plays w/ his feet outside of the zone-read

Function while injured- N/A

Not easily rattled-3 (battled back after a slow/poor and made a key 4th down conversion and converted some key 3rd downs but didn't respond well to pressure the 2 times he faced)

Spontaneous decision/play making-N/A didn't have to



Summary:

Better arm then he gets credit for having. Plays # 6,15,16,19, 23*, 27

Very clean stroke. Quick/efficient release.

Good ball placement for YAC in the short to intermediate passing game, he was virtually automatic
in the 5-12 yds. Can make all the of throws and displays good touch. Plays # 9,14,18, 25, *26*, *29*, 31

Most of the missed throws/incompletions came from spotty decision making: 3,4,10, 35, 37, 39, 42, 43
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Really not impressed with Dalton. Looks very much like an over matched prospect a little like a Patrick Ramsey an d average QB on a decent team . A lot of overthrows, a lot of passes dropped by the defense and no real deap throws, constantly high which is too dangerous in the NFL . The ball also seems low on the release so could get a lot of batted balls in the NFL - Also I have issues with his field general leadership, there were far too many miscues like the option play which should never be an issue . When he is forced to improvise he seems totally unsure of himself and stutter runs, meanders out of the pocket and the lack of awarness on that early play that lead to the 12 yard loss was alarming . The other thing I note from the film is he spends no time under center and few balls go further than 10 yards in the air .

There is another thread in which the Skins are hoping to trade down and target Dalton at the end of the 1st . I think there are so many other players we should be targeting with a late 1st - in fact I would rather us take a cheerleader over Dalton or a tea lady - We need a QB but not this one - not in the 1st no no no

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OK- this is the only film I have seen on Dalton, but from this game alone I would give him no better than 4th Round Grade.

Credit the offensive scheme and play-calling here for making Dalton look way better (at times) than he actually is. There is no improvising on Dalton's part, no check-downs, no snaps from under center, and very few deeps balls or passes over the middle. The coaches are fully aware that Dalton's strength is on those out-routes and bubble screens.... He is staring down his receivers and knows exactly where he is going to throw it before the ball is snapped.

NFL secondaries are going to rape this man, enjoy doing it, and afterwards say "that was my first redhead."

Next.

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Reminds me a lot of Matt Ryan. I'm not someone who particularly cares for Matt Ryan either. Good QB, borderline very good, don't ever see him being great.

It's hard to tell how much the offense they run controls what Dalton does in this video. There was many quick reads where he threw the ball short to intermediate for a nice completion but he rushed the play and while he had time, he didnt let the play develop when it looks like guys down field would have broken free. Seeing as how I don't know their offensive philosophy it is hard to judge how well he executes it. They may like a quick tempo, keep the chains moving type offense where if you see a guy making a cut that will be open you make the throw instead of waiting for the play to develop.

I'm going to say this is the only footage of Dalton I have seen so I'm not going to preach one bit about something I don't know but the play calling, plays, routes, all seemed to be very well executed which is an advantage in it's own and then consider the unranked team they were playing I just didn't see anything that impressed me.

Honestly Colt Brennan's highlights in the spread at Hawaii were far more spectacular, I just don't see anything special here. And to the guy who said Dalton is the perfect qb for this offense I have absolutely no idea how you can up with that considering his deep ball accuracy is meh and he played in a spread offense.

I just don't see anything that shows me he would eventually be better then rex grossman. Beck has some great highlights too. I just wouldn't be willing to bet a low 1st or second rounder on this guy though I admit such a small sample size it is ridiculous to make the judgement.

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Reminds me a lot of Matt Ryan. I'm not someone who particularly cares for Matt Ryan either. Good QB, borderline very good, don't ever see him being great.

It's hard to tell how much the offense they run controls what Dalton does in this video. There was many quick reads where he threw the ball short to intermediate for a nice completion but he rushed the play and while he had time, he didnt let the play develop when it looks like guys down field would have broken free. Seeing as how I don't know their offensive philosophy it is hard to judge how well he executes it. They may like a quick tempo, keep the chains moving type offense where if you see a guy making a cut that will be open you make the throw instead of waiting for the play to develop.

I'm going to say this is the only footage of Dalton I have seen so I'm not going to preach one bit about something I don't know but the play calling, plays, routes, all seemed to be very well executed which is an advantage in it's own and then consider the unranked team they were playing I just didn't see anything that impressed me.

Honestly Colt Brennan's highlights in the spread at Hawaii were far more spectacular, I just don't see anything special here. And to the guy who said Dalton is the perfect qb for this offense I have absolutely no idea how you can up with that considering his deep ball accuracy is meh and he played in a spread offense.

I just don't see anything that shows me he would eventually be better then rex grossman. Beck has some great highlights too. I just wouldn't be willing to bet a low 1st or second rounder on this guy though I admit such a small sample size it is ridiculous to make the judgement.

Also I have to say he probably has the lowest ceiling of any QB in this years draft .

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A lot of overthrows, . The ball also seems low on the release so could get a lot of batted balls in the NFL - Also I have issues with his field general leadership, there were far too many miscues like the option play which should never be an issue . When he is forced to improvise he seems totally unsure of himself and stutter runs, meanders out of the pocket and the lack of awarness on that early play that lead to the 12 yard loss was alarming . The other thing I note from the film is he spends no time under center and few balls go further than 10 yards in the air.
Reading your post I get the feeling that you didn't watch the enitre cut-up nor do you have any real interest in discussing Dalton's play from this game.

I'm gonna assume in advance that I won't get a response but I'll tell what I disagree w/ from you post anyway.

A lot of overthrows a lot of passes dropped by the defense and no real deap throws, constantly high which is too dangerous in the NFL
Which plays do you consider overthrows or 'high/dangerous'? I count 3 plays (10,35,41) thats 3 "overthrows/high" out of 36 that' not "a lot" by any measure. (2 of the overthrows were smart overthrows with good ball placement in an area where only his receiver had a chance at it plays 35 & 41).

Dalton threw about average or fewer "high" passes and "overthrows" in this game then I've seen from the other prospects.

The lack of deep passes are a function of the type of offense and we're not judging the offense we're trying to evaluate Dalton and he did make some deep throws which are pointed out in the passing chart.

"A lot passes dropped by the defense" you must have a skewed opinion of what "a lot" means.

EVERY QB prospect (even in the pros) is gonna have at least a couple of INTs dropped by the defense every now and again.

The claims you made above in my opinion are empty.

If you want to say that Dalton made some bad decisions I would agree or if you question his deep arm strength I might agree there too.

Also I have issues with his field general leadership, there were far too many miscues like the option play which should never be an issue
This strikes me as another empty claim.

You know his W/L record right?

The fumble was a negative play for both the QB and the RB. But, again everyQB will fumble a snap it doesn'y make sense to me to knock a QB for something that happens to every QB.

Also, the other 'miscue' on the option is a designed play veer play where the center is supposed to snap the ball at an angle and he supposed to make a quick pitch.

When he is forced to improvise he seems totally unsure of himself and stutter runs, meanders out of the pocket and the lack of awarness on that early play that lead to the 12 yard loss was alarming
Well he didn't improvise much so what plays are you talking about?

If you're talking about the zone read keepers, yeah I agree that he isn't much of a running threat.

I don't think it was lack of awareness on the sack he missed a read.

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Reminds me a lot of Matt Ryan. I'm not someone who particularly cares for Matt Ryan either. Good QB, borderline very good, don't ever see him being great.

If I could get a Matt Ryan QB in the end of the 1st early 2nd, I'd do it 10 times out of 10.

It's hard to tell how much the offense they run controls what Dalton does in this video. There was many quick reads where he threw the ball short to intermediate for a nice completion but he rushed the play and while he had time, he didnt let the play develop when it looks like guys down field would have broken free. Seeing as how I don't know their offensive philosophy it is hard to judge how well he executes it. They may like a quick tempo, keep the chains moving type offense where if you see a guy making a cut that will be open you make the throw instead of waiting for the play to develop.

When the defense is playing off-man or zone you take what's underneath its a pre-snap read, that SDSU kept allowing, you can't blame Dalton for taking what the defense is giving him. It's what good QB's do...

I'm going to say this is the only footage of Dalton I have seen so I'm not going to preach one bit about something I don't know but the play calling, plays, routes, all seemed to be very well executed which is an advantage in it's own and then consider the unranked team they were playing I just didn't see anything that impressed me.

Sounds like you're looking for a play-making QB, I'd prefer a consistent QB that can be relied up on to run the entire offense, ie Matt Schaub.

So on 4th and 4, in the 1st quarter after Dalton's team has dug themselves a quick hole and are down 14-0, Dalton delivers and absolute strike on the out-route setting his receiver up for enough YAC to take the ball another 20 yards to the house, it doesn't impress you? A few plays earlier same drive, he nailed a 3rd and 3 to keep the drive alive. That impresses me, I don't need to see a QB run out of the pocket and throw the ball 40 yards downfield to be impressed.

Honestly Colt Brennan's highlights in the spread at Hawaii were far more spectacular, I just don't see anything special here. And to the guy who said Dalton is the perfect qb for this offense I have absolutely no idea how you can up with that considering his deep ball accuracy is meh and he played in a spread offense.

McNabb has some of the best deep ball accuracy in the NFL, and he already played in pro- WCO, how did he do in Kyle's offense again?

Saying that a QB who consistently is accurate and makes the correct decisions couldn't run our offense because a.) he doesn't have above average deep ball accuracy, and b.) because he played in a spread is extremely poor logic.

Also how exactly can you judge someone's deep ball from watching 1 game, in which he played a defense that brought little to no pressure, and instead choose to leave their safeties back to prevent the big play.

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I'm not sure what the point of the video was? Lets put up a video that shows Dalton not doing well? Show a video that has both good points and bad? I'm a Dalton fan based off of what he can do and I walked away from this video "almost" thinking he's not as good as I thought, but every QB has a bad game even if they win them like Dalton did in 2010.... all of them.

To get an more ideal oppinion of him I think you have to look at as many games of him as possible not just a game he struggled in. Just like it wouldn't be fair of me to post a game of him having an awesome day saying he's the best thing since sliced bread.

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I'm not sure what the point of the video was? Lets put up a video that shows Dalton not doing well? Show a video that has both good points and bad? I'm a Dalton fan based off of what he can do and I walked away from this video "almost" thinking he's not as good as I thought, but every QB has a bad game even if they win them like Dalton did in 2010.... all of them.

To get an more ideal oppinion of him I think you have to look at as many games of him as possible not just a game he struggled in. Just like it wouldn't be fair of me to post a game of him having an awesome day saying he's the best thing since sliced bread.

It's not like DG can post Dalton's entire season up or assume he and everyone else has enough time to go through all that. This is pretty much the only full game cut up of Dalton on youtube. I'd rather see a video of him doing decently, it's more revealing then him destroying some other team.

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It's not like DG can post Dalton's entire season up or assume he and everyone else has enough time to go through all that. This is pretty much the only full game cut up of Dalton on youtube. I'd rather see a video of him doing decently, it's more revealing then him destroying some other team.

I understand but I've been wondering why we have had the "Closer look at Locker", "Closer look at Newton", "Closer look at Gabbert", and "Closer look at Mallett" threads and there was no "Closer look at Dalton." Then today I see a "Closer look at Dalton" thread and actually got excited that there would be some good points about him, good stats, good reasons why he should be considered by the Skins and instead we get a video that shows just as much good as bad and none of the other information. All along I felt he was getting no love by leaving him out of the "Closer look at ...." and then a video that would lead many here to say .... see this is why I don't want him.

You right he can't post his whole season and if he could it would be all highlight reels, but he could have shown the Rose Bowl game which showed him stepping up agains a "Big Ten" team Wisconsin.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0rgEw2tT00Q

How the video from his Pro Day?

http://www.wfaa.com/sports/Andy-Dalton-impress-pro-scouts-117968429.html

TCU vs. Wyoming

These are just a few videos. His Pro Day video is especially informative.

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I guess you hadn't noticed the purpose of the "closer look at" series was to discuss plays of an entire cut-up not a highlight reel. It's far more informative to look at an entire game than it is to look at 6-7 completions someone threw in a game, or to watch them throw the ball in their shorts at a pro-day.

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I'm on the fence with Dalton. I have a better feel for the other QBs this year.

Some people have made some loose comparisons to Aaron Rodgers with Dalton, but I don't really see it. The quick release, a little... but Rodgers has a deep ball that is second to none. He learned to put extra air under it when needed to allow the receiver to adjust.

Anyhow, as with most QBs, I think his success will depend on the situation he walks into. The system and supporting cast can make just about any QB a bust or successful.

I'll say that after this thread I'm a little more comfortable if Dalton found his way to DC, but I'm not ready to advocate that position.

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I actually think Dalton reminds me more of Schaub than Rodgers.

Seems like schematically, Dalton is a QB in the mold we are looking for. I think it is debatable whether he is the best fit in this class for Kyle's offense, but he certainly has the great short-to-intermediate accuracy, quick decision making skills, and solid pocket presence to excell in our O.

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Reading your post I get the feeling that you didn't watch the enitre cut-up nor do you have any real interest in discussing Dalton's play from this game.

I'm gonna assume in advance that I won't get a response but I'll tell what I disagree w/ from you post anyway.

.

Tell you what - get off your high horse and actually engage in debate rather than thinking anyone who does not agree with you is a dummmasfunderbunker .

I have watched the highlight real again and again and there are some real flashes of a decent QB but lets not fool ourselves here we are talking about one of a handful of QBs who might make the NFL out the hundreds who play the game every friday -

Okay go back to the cut up . The first 4 plays of the film there is the sack - That play alone gave me chills of memories of Patrick Ramsey - set in the shotgun 10 yards from the LOS and he sees (that was a lack of awareness - the pressure was not bam in his face but you could see pre snap where the pressure was coming from with the 3 man front) pressure coming up from the edge and insted of moving into the pocket he runs back towards his own endzone . In that situation the QB either has to make a smart play and step into the pocket or eat the ball trying - He doesn't make a break for his own enzone .

The next play in the cut up - he finds No.88 in space and insted of leading him so he could make a few more yards the throw is high and while 88 makes the catch he is stopped dead - but that was a short play on a 3rd and 23 . The QB had options deaper but went for the dump off - where have we seen that before ....

. The next throw is broken up but looked on the high side the next longer pass was off target and long - the DB was as close as the WR the next play was the fumble - misscomunication and then the refs chip in with a dubious PI call because that ball looked as if it never going to be caught - well infront of the target but then that could have been because the DB was feeling lonley and getting it on .

The first score is a dink and dunk schooling short short short short short run - bad slide the 4-4 play was impressive the WR was hit perfectly in stride and Dalton gave him every opportunity to make the play .

I could go on and on but putting the film aside for one second as you brought up the W/L ratio - outside this film you have to look at other factors such as is Dalton is listed a 6-2 but is that is generous - You point out his questionable footwork and then you have his slightly odd release (not unlike Phil Rivers but then Rivers is 6-5 - not 6-2) . You point to his WL record and his stats but all those stats are in a spread offense . How many plays in the film are in anything resembling an NFL offense - You say he makes smart reads but many of his good plays are 1-2-3-throw designed simplified plays in a simple offense . You say he has all the NFL throws and I admit I see some real nice throws but I don't see consistency in his arm - longer throws seem to sail on him, i don't see the throws up the middle into traffic though I do see more than I want to see throws into multiple coverage .

I know people want to show him as a Drew Brees.... All I see is a ginger Chase Daniel.

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The next play in the cut up - he finds No.88 in space and insted of leading him so he could make a few more yards the throw is high and while 88 makes the catch he is stopped dead - but that was a short play on a 3rd and 23 . The QB had options deaper but went for the dump off - where have we seen that before ....

3rd and 23, teams is already down 7-0 and you want the QB to go for the gusto? I disagree. In addition there weren't option(s) deeper, there was a single option deeper and it was by about 2 yards deeper, still short of the 1st down.

The next throw is broken up but looked on the high side the next longer pass was off target and long - the DB was as close as the WR the next play was the fumble - misscomunication and then the refs chip in with a dubious PI call because that ball looked as if it never going to be caught - well infront of the target but then that could have been because the DB was feeling lonley and getting it on .

First two plays you mention are ugly, but I was impressed by the way Dalton was able to get back in gear after a poor series or two at the start.

As far as the PI called is concerned the ball is only uncatchable because the DB is holding onto the WR, acting like this playing is anything but blatant PI makes me question your objectivity on the matter.

The first score is a dink and dunk schooling short short short short short run - bad slide the 4-4 play was impressive the WR was hit perfectly in stride and Dalton gave him every opportunity to make the play .

What is wrong with dink and dunk if that's what the defense is giving you? If it leads to a TD it sounds like the right decision to me.

The out route was a thing of beauty, particularly because of the situation of the game at the time. Already down 14, 4th and 4, on the first drive that's actually shown some life.

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Dalton just scares me, that SDSU clip has some pretty ugly moments in it. I guess that the Shanahans know what they're doing though so if they go for him then I trust them.

I completely agree, but for the most part they came in the beginning of the game and I liked that he showed the ability to bounce back after a few rough series.

A few that I can think of:

TE® on the corner route, I think it was the right read, the play just needed to be further developed and as DG points out he locks on to his TE pretty badly. He does hit this corner route to his TE for a TD later in the game against man coverage, really showing nice touch on the pass.

WR(l) on the post route, it's a daring read but it's there, looks to me like he's trying to find the soft spot in between the DB releasing the WR, and the FS picking him up in a tampa 2 zone, ball sails a bit too much allowing both players to collapse on the wr.

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