pjfootballer Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 "Anything is possible" doesn't equate to the refs stealing a W from Rutgers. As I've mentioned several times, the refs took away one last opportunity for Rutgers to throw up a prayer...I'll concede that. That's my point. BS was saying it didn't matter if they got the call right that Rutgers didn't have chance. I was agreeing that they should have made the correct call and Rutgers should have had the ball with 1.7 seconds left. I used to the Duke/Kentucky game as a point that it's never over until it's over. Rutgers could have hit the tying or winning shot. ---------- Post added March-10th-2011 at 03:31 PM ---------- Semantics...my point isn't that Rutgers had NO chance to win. If you want to call it a 20% chance, that's fine. My point is that this is being painted by some (not just in this thread but on the radio, etc.) as though Rutgers had the game won and the refs gave it to St. Johns. That, obviously, is no where near the case. And if the correct call was made (stepped out of bounds, threw the ball in the stands for a delay of game) then Rutgers has a chance at 2 free throws on the technical foul and the ball with 1.7 seconds left at half court. I'm not saying Rutgers had the game won or St. Johns was handed the win, I'm just saying you never know if the correct calls were made. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan T. Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 And if the correct call was made (stepped out of bounds, threw the ball in the stands for a delay of game) then Rutgers has a chance at 2 free throws on the technical foul and the ball with 1.7 seconds left at half court. I'm not saying Rutgers had the game won or St. Johns was handed the win, I'm just saying you never know if the correct calls were made. Well you could argue too that if the traveling call was made, the guy doesn't throw the ball into the stands. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 And if the correct call was made (stepped out of bounds, threw the ball in the stands for a delay of game) then Rutgers has a chance at 2 free throws on the technical foul and the ball with 1.7 seconds left at half court. I'm not saying Rutgers had the game won or St. Johns was handed the win, I'm just saying you never know if the correct calls were made. So, when a player throws the ball up in the air to let the last couple seconds run down...that's a technical foul? I know they got the cheerleader for it a while back, but I didn't realize you couldn't run out the clock that way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Well you could argue too that if the traveling call was made, the guy doesn't throw the ball into the stands. True, which still gives them a shot with more than 1.7 seconds on the clock and a 65-63 score. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Well you could argue too that if the traveling call was made, the guy doesn't throw the ball into the stands. Yes...I think that's a very good point. The player most likely doesn't toss the ball if the whistle blows which brings us back to Rutgers being down 2 and inbounding the ball from the spot where he stepped out (or thereabouts) right around mid-court. Sure, they have a shot, but more than likely the game ends 65-63. I'm not saying that the refs did the right thing or did fine...I'm just saying that the outrage seems disproportionate to the offense. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 So, when a player throws the ball up in the air to let the last couple seconds run down...that's a technical foul? I know they got the cheerleader for it a while back, but I didn't realize you couldn't run out the clock that way. I'm not sure the correct rule, but throwing the ball in the stands with time on the clock would constitute a delay of game. Throwing it straight up in the air I guess would "technically" be still in play, unless it hits the clock. I never saw the replay of the cheerleader. I don't know if he/she threw it up or into the crowd or if they came onto the court. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 I'm not sure the correct rule, but throwing the ball in the stands with time on the clock would constitute a delay of game. Throwing it straight up in the air I guess would "technically" be still in play, unless it hits the clock. I never saw the replay of the cheerleader. I don't know if he/she threw it up or into the crowd or if they came onto the court. OK, thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adam@section118 Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 Adams said there wouldn't have been a technical foul called for Brownlee throwing the ball in the stands. "There is no penalty for exuberance if the kid thought it was the end of the game," Adams said. "It's his ball and he's not delaying anything. Also the coaches are walking toward each other. There was a presumption that the game was over but unfortunately it doesn't sound like it was." http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6198753 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmySmith Posted March 10, 2011 Share Posted March 10, 2011 http://sports.espn.go.com/ncb/news/story?id=6198753Once again, the St. Johns coach is clearly out of the box and interfering with the play with the clock is moving. The thought that they are "walking toward each other" is flat out false. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman21ST Posted March 10, 2011 Author Share Posted March 10, 2011 So, when a player throws the ball up in the air to let the last couple seconds run down...that's a technical foul? I know they got the cheerleader for it a while back, but I didn't realize you couldn't run out the clock that way. There's a difference between not calling it when the player A) throws the ball in the air with a two or three possession lead and 1 second left on the clock and throws the ball into the stands with a one possession lead and almost 2 seconds left on the clock case in point (sort of): In the Miami-Virginia game, Miami was leading by 7 and Virginia had the ball and was throwing up desperation shots because they had possession. Virginia shoots it with 1 second left, it bounces off the rim, and another UVA players grabs the rebound, turns around, and shoots it again before time expired. A Miami player jumps to block the shot, but fouls the shooter. It doesn't get called. Why? Because, even if the shooter had made the shot and the free throw, the outcome wouldn't have changed. In the Rutgers-St. John's game, a two shot technical, or at least possession, could very well have changed the outcome of the game. Maybe not, but it's possible. The refs in essence gave the win to St. John's by not calling anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubble Screen Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Please promise me that you will never EVER become a basketball official. Dude, you're talking to a guy that played basketball all his life. And was very good at it, I might add. Sorry, I just don't see the outcry that alot of other people do. Yeah, it was bad officiating, but I've seen WAY worse than that. And it was a meaningless game, for all tenses and purposes. I mean, Rutgers wasn't going anywhere, even had they pulled that game out. They got screwed out of having a "chance" to tie up a game. So what. It happens. Those guys calling that game last night have called a combined 27 Final Fours. So obviously they are great officials. Everyone has off nights. ---------- Post added March-11th-2011 at 01:43 AM ---------- rutgers should have gotten two free throws and the ball at half court throwing the ball in the stands is a technical foul. i coach community college basketball in the vccs, and if that happened to me i would have been ready to kill the refs. to say that the game wasnt affected cuz they couldnt get a shot in 1.7 secs is an idiotic statement and irrelevent. derrick fisher hit a three pointer with .4 seconds left in the playoffs vs the spurs. i wonder if that was less than 1% chance he hit that. but he did, and the lakers went on to win a championship. get out of here saying it wouldnt affected the game. Dude, it was RUTGERS. Yeah, let's compare the 17 (or is it 18 now?) time World Champion Lakers winning on a late shot to a stinking college basketball team. Like the other poster stated, nothing those refs did would have likely changed the outcome. Who cares. They weren't going to get in the NCAA tourney, anyway. Btw, you don't call a technical for the kid throwing the ball in the stands there. That's stupid. The game was over. Even had they reviewed it and determined he threw it in the stands with time still on the clock, they wouldn't have called a tech. ---------- Post added March-11th-2011 at 01:47 AM ---------- I agree with all of this in response to Bubblescreen's post. And anyone remembre Christian Laettner against Kentucky? Anything is possible. Yeah, that game actually mattered. Rutgers sucks. Who cares. And like the guy said, 99 times out of 100 they probably still lose. And as I've mentioned several times, in the big scheme of things, this loss doesn't affect anything. Not like it cost them a possible NCAA berth or anything. Some people just like to ***** about anything. ---------- Post added March-11th-2011 at 01:48 AM ---------- "Anything is possible" doesn't equate to the refs stealing a W from Rutgers. As I've mentioned several times, the refs took away one last opportunity for Rutgers to throw up a prayer...I'll concede that. Glad I'm not the only one that sees this for what it is. ---------- Post added March-11th-2011 at 01:51 AM ---------- So, when a player throws the ball up in the air to let the last couple seconds run down...that's a technical foul? I know they got the cheerleader for it a while back, but I didn't realize you couldn't run out the clock that way. You're spot on again, man. Can't believe these guys don't realize that they clock STILL RUNS when you toss the ball in the air like that. Its no different than when the guys roll the ball up the court before another guy touches it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TimmySmith Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 You're spot on again, man. Can't believe these guys don't realize that they clock STILL RUNS when you toss the ball in the air like that. Its no different than when the guys roll the ball up the court before another guy touches it.You are completely missing everyone's (correct) point. The right call was a steal, followed by a player in possession of the ball clearly stepping out of bounds (or traveling, take your pick), which makes the play dead and stops the clock. He THEN throws the ball, which is a technical foul. And please don't let the fact that these refs have been fired for the rest of the tourney get in the way of your opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ixcuincle Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Dude, you're talking to a guy that played basketball all his life. And was very good at it, I might add. Sorry, I just don't see the outcry that alot of other people do. Yeah, it was bad officiating, but I've seen WAY worse than that. And it was a meaningless game, for all tenses and purposes. I mean, Rutgers wasn't going anywhere, even had they pulled that game out. They got screwed out of having a "chance" to tie up a game. So what. It happens. Those guys calling that game last night have called a combined 27 Final Fours. So obviously they are great officials. Everyone has off nights.---------- Post added March-11th-2011 at 01:43 AM ---------- Dude, it was RUTGERS. Yeah, let's compare the 17 (or is it 18 now?) time World Champion Lakers winning on a late shot to a stinking college basketball team. Like the other poster stated, nothing those refs did would have likely changed the outcome. Who cares. They weren't going to get in the NCAA tourney, anyway. Btw, you don't call a technical for the kid throwing the ball in the stands there. That's stupid. The game was over. Even had they reviewed it and determined he threw it in the stands with time still on the clock, they wouldn't have called a tech. ---------- Post added March-11th-2011 at 01:47 AM ---------- Yeah, that game actually mattered. Rutgers sucks. Who cares. And like the guy said, 99 times out of 100 they probably still lose. And as I've mentioned several times, in the big scheme of things, this loss doesn't affect anything. Not like it cost them a possible NCAA berth or anything. Some people just like to ***** about anything. ---------- Post added March-11th-2011 at 01:48 AM ---------- Glad I'm not the only one that sees this for what it is. ---------- Post added March-11th-2011 at 01:51 AM ---------- You're spot on again, man. Can't believe these guys don't realize that they clock STILL RUNS when you toss the ball in the air like that. Its no different than when the guys roll the ball up the court before another guy touches it. This guy is crazy sometimes but this time he speaks truth Again, what happened was a travesty but it's being blown out of proportion and is largely forgotten due to yesterday's tournament events. Yeah, Rutgers should have gotten a last shot, even if Francessa conceded that Rutgers wouldn't be able to do much with it since there was 1.7 left on the clock. You might get an Evan Turner-like halfcourt miracle, or you might not. ****, Rutgers hit a three and got fouled against Villanova to win it. Anything can happen. That being said, it's all in the past. It sucks, move on and follow the rest of the BE tournament. There is no need for any more anger or outrage on the situation since it's already old news, sit back and enjoy the semifinals tonight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dan T. Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Dude, you're talking to a guy that played basketball all his life. And was very good at it, I might add. Sorry, I just don't see the outcry that alot of other people do. Yeah, it was bad officiating, but I've seen WAY worse than that. And it was a meaningless game, for all tenses and purposes. I mean, Rutgers wasn't going anywhere, even had they pulled that game out. They got screwed out of having a "chance" to tie up a game. So what. It happens. Those guys calling that game last night have called a combined 27 Final Fours. So obviously they are great officials. Everyone has off nights. Dude, it was RUTGERS. Yeah, let's compare the 17 (or is it 18 now?) time World Champion Lakers winning on a late shot to a stinking college basketball team. Like the other poster stated, nothing those refs did would have likely changed the outcome. Who cares. They weren't going to get in the NCAA tourney, anyway. My point stands. Anybody with an attitude displayed in your posts ("who cares?" "Rutgers sucks anyway" "It was a meaningless game") would be a disaster as a basketball official. Dude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ixcuincle Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 7-ZZqnKiyvI VGwWu-Bj4SQ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 You are completely missing everyone's (correct) point. The right call was a steal, followed by a player in possession of the ball clearly stepping out of bounds (or traveling, take your pick), which makes the play dead and stops the clock. He THEN throws the ball, which is a technical foul. And please don't let the fact that these refs have been fired for the rest of the tourney get in the way of your opinion. And you're missing the biggest point... We're dealing with all hypotheticals at this point. So, if the ref had blown the whistle to call the St. Johns player out of bounds (or traveling) do you believe he still would have chucked the ball into the stands? No, I can almost certainly say he wouldn't have. He did that to celebrate what he believed was the end of the game. So, if a whistle blows there, he probably hands the ball to ref and Rutgers inbounds the ball with 1.7 seconds left and a small (though admittedly possible) chance to tie or win the game. Bottom line...the refs cost Rutgers another long-shot, though not impossible, opportunity to tie or win the game. Period. ---------- Post added March-11th-2011 at 11:00 AM ---------- Glad I'm not the only one that sees this for what it is. You're spot on again, man. Can't believe these guys don't realize that they clock STILL RUNS when you toss the ball in the air like that. Its no different than when the guys roll the ball up the court before another guy touches it. I read through your posts this morning and was happy to see I'm not alone as well. It's probably not a coincidence that we both played ball our entire lives. Bad calls happen, but when a team was losing and, at best, had just one more chance to shoot a contested long-range shot to win the game, I hardly think the refs took anything from them. Good posting! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubble Screen Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 You are completely missing everyone's (correct) point. The right call was a steal, followed by a player in possession of the ball clearly stepping out of bounds (or traveling, take your pick), which makes the play dead and stops the clock. He THEN throws the ball, which is a technical foul. And please don't let the fact that these refs have been fired for the rest of the tourney get in the way of your opinion. Dude, no travel or stepping out of bounds was called. Therefore the whole thing about him throwing the ball in the stands is a moot point. Besides, they said that a technical wouldn't have been called there, anyway. Which is precisely what I had already said. For the record, I never said they weren't bad calls. I said they were great refs and that even great refs have off nights. ---------- Post added March-11th-2011 at 12:41 PM ---------- My point stands. Anybody with an attitude displayed in your posts ("who cares?" "Rutgers sucks anyway" "It was a meaningless game") would be a disaster as a basketball official. Dude. Yeah, I made those points, and I stand by them. But I also made "great" points in my responses. Of course you overlook those. There were bad calls made. There are bad calls made EVERY game. Move on. Again, in the big scheme of things, it didn't affect anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 Dude, it was RUTGERS. Yeah, let's compare the 17 (or is it 18 now?) time World Champion Lakers winning on a late shot to a stinking college basketball team. Like the other poster stated, nothing those refs did would have likely changed the outcome. Who cares. They weren't going to get in the NCAA tourney, anyway. It doesn't matter whether or not Rutgers is "going anywhere." They are entitled to the full 40 minutes alotted for the game and the officials were wrong in not making at least a travelling call. How would you feel if the Redskins were playing the Cowboys and the Cowboys guy ran out of bounds with 2 seconds left on 4th down on their own 35 and the officials just said "oh well. The Redskins probably only have a 1 in 100 chance on the hail mary, so let's just head to the lockeroom?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted March 11, 2011 Share Posted March 11, 2011 It doesn't matter whether or not Rutgers is "going anywhere." They are entitled to the full 40 minutes alotted for the game and the officials were wrong in not making at least a travelling call. How would you feel if the Redskins were playing the Cowboys and the Cowboys guy ran out of bounds with 2 seconds left on 4th down on their own 35 and the officials just said "oh well. The Redskins probably only have a 1 in 100 chance on the hail mary, so let's just head to the lockeroom?" Good analogy. Let's play it all the way through. After you got over the anger that you would have if that single, bad call was made...wouldn't it be fair to say that the refs, despite missing a call, probably didn't cost the Redskins anything? No one (so far) has claimed that the refs didn't make a mistake, just that that reaction and outrage seems disproportionate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bubble Screen Posted March 12, 2011 Share Posted March 12, 2011 It doesn't matter whether or not Rutgers is "going anywhere." They are entitled to the full 40 minutes alotted for the game and the officials were wrong in not making at least a travelling call. How would you feel if the Redskins were playing the Cowboys and the Cowboys guy ran out of bounds with 2 seconds left on 4th down on their own 35 and the officials just said "oh well. The Redskins probably only have a 1 in 100 chance on the hail mary, so let's just head to the lockeroom?" Dude, people are making it seem like this is a travesty, that those refs "cost" them the game. They didn't. They merely cost them a chance to heave, probably, a 35 foot desperation shot. And that's IF they are able to even get off a shot. And, yes, it was just Rutgers, a team that is going nowhere. What's not to understand? In the big scheme of things, it doesn't matter what happened. Again, those refs have worked a combined 27 Final Fours. They obviously are great officials. Even great officials have off nights. It happens. So what. Move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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