Season Ticket Renewals

[Coach Janky Spanky]

This question might belong in the Upgrade thread, but it is probably relevant here as well.

I've had STs in same seats for several years now -- upper level, right at the 50, Redskins sideline. I'm not interested in an upgrade to the lower level because I don't want to be in the corner or endzone, and I like the people around me.

Here's my question -- is it possible to request an upgrade within the section, essentially at the same seats but in a lower row? The two guys who were to my right are now a couple rows lower and a couple more seats away from the 50. And there are two guys who have been in my section for as long as I have, but they move up a row every 2 to 3 years. I'd be interested in this, but I didn't know that upgrades could be made so specifically.

Thanks for any input.

[Mark The Homer]

If you are on the upgrade list, they will upgrade you by moving you down. You just have to check the appropriate box when you send your payment in. That would be the box that says "Yes I want to upgrade but don't want a price increase" or words to that effect.

[Crazy Levi]

You can't have it both ways. If you don't want the other team's fans in the our stadium, then you need to buy the tickets. If you don't want to pay full price, then don't get all ****y about us selling them to people who will.

You aren't telling us anything we don't know. Mark knows this.

He's just scolding the Skins fanbase for prefering to sit at home in the luxury of their living room, watching their gorgeous HDTV's as fresh food comes out of the kitchen in between bathroom breaks in their clean, unused by unfamiliar fat drunks facilities.

It's just the way it is. Redskins fans KNOW what going to Fed Ex and most don't like it. Traffic, long lines for everything from peeing to eating, expensive and crappy food even in the Club etc. Road fans don't, and they don't care.

I don't blame you. It's YOUR money. Sell it to whomever pays. Naturally, I blame a) Snyder for creating such an oppressive atmosphere and negative perception that will take a long time to change, and HDTV. It's gonna be hard to put that genie back in the bottle.

I LOVE going to games. There are thousands of people like me. But not everyone is like that, clearly, and I understand why.

[RFKFedEx]

Couldn't have said it better Crazy Levi.

The bottom line... The NFL is better today than ever before, even if attending Redskins games is not for all people.

Personally, I've been content for several years now, though it took me a full decade to get over losing my family's prime STs in section 507 in RFK. We have so many more choices these days, I just love it.

Stubhub, HDTV, Sunday Ticket at home, Sunday Ticket Mobil, Fantasy FB, Extremeskins... none it was around in the glory days of the Redskins game day experience.

Did I mention the Redzone channel?

Edited September 20, 2011 by RFKFedEx

[Mark The Homer]

The league is sponsoring perfume now? :silly:

[DC9]

I'd like to expand on this topic, because I've been beating this drum for years.

Typically after a big game (against the steelers, cowboys, etc) you see these threads popping up that involve the topic of season ticket holders selling to opposing team's fans...

The redskins fan base sucks to sell tickets to. I say this as season ticket holder for the last 4 years, and as a person who watched my parents and grand parents do the same thing for as long as I can remember.

When you try to sell tickets, redskins fans approach you with the following mentality:

- You can't sell them for face value, I know you can't sell them for face value, so I'm going to offer you 30% of the value and you're going to give them to me.

Other team's fans don't do that... they're happy to get face value, and are happy to not have to pay a 30% mark up for the tickets. So i sell to them. Do i go looking for them? no... but those are the people who give me face value for the tickets. Redskins fans (generally) refuse to pay face value. Then they get all high and mighty on the season ticket holders for not selling only to redskins fans.

You can't have it both ways. If you don't want the other team's fans in the our stadium, then you need to buy the tickets. If you don't want to pay full price, then don't get all ****y about us selling them to people who will.

That's what stinks about having such a big stadium bro. I think it would be cool if the Redskins did this, but that's putting a lot of trust in your fanbase to keep you from getting blacked out. That will cover us up to the 17% blackout rule if I am not mistaken. (Not sure of the actual percentage #, but for some reason I think it's 17)

[RFKFedEx]

Big stadium, small stadium, sell outs, or thousands of empty seats, Snyder will never exercise the blackout option IMO. It would have happened long ago if it was an actual threat.

Edited September 21, 2011 by RFKFedEx

[tshile]

That's what stinks about having such a big stadium bro. I think it would be cool if the Redskins did this, but that's putting a lot of trust in your fanbase to keep you from getting blacked out. That will cover us up to the 17% blackout rule if I am not mistaken. (Not sure of the actual percentage #, but for some reason I think it's 17)

oh i'm aware of why it happens. i know that every year when i sign up.

it can be hard to sell your tickets for what you (truly) paid for them, if not impossible.

what irritates me is when people jump on their high horse (often people who a) don't have season tickets, and/or never go to games) about how the season ticket holders are the ones screwing it up.

as if it's our fault redskins fans wont buy the tickets for what other fans will

or as if we're suppose to eat 20-30$ a ticket because the guy buying them is cheering for the other team.

i'll gladly sell them cheaply to a redskins fan if the people who make those threads want to start contributing towards the lost money. i'm sure others would gladly do that as well.

[DC9]

oh i'm aware of why it happens. i know that every year when i sign up.

it can be hard to sell your tickets for what you (truly) paid for them, if not impossible.

what irritates me is when people jump on their high horse (often people who a) don't have season tickets, and/or never go to games) about how the season ticket holders are the ones screwing it up.

as if it's our fault redskins fans wont buy the tickets for what other fans will

or as if we're suppose to eat 20-30$ a ticket because the guy buying them is cheering for the other team.

i'll gladly sell them cheaply to a redskins fan if the people who make those threads want to start contributing towards the lost money. i'm sure others would gladly do that as well.

Yeah, I agree. If I can't make it to the games, I try to sell them to friends I know are skins fans, but at the end of the day, I try to take less than a 50% loss, but more often than not I can't.

I do have a feeling that a year or two down the road, we are going to be happy we kept our tickets through these rougher years....especially with the downsizing in the stadium. I would look at it as a premium investment.

I like your perspective, bro.

[tds]

I'm a first year sth. The sth's sitting around me are all very cool. I think I'd feel a little bad selling my seats to two eagles fans... I'd be pissed if they did and I had to sit next to that trash.

[hail2skins]

One of the things I'm curious about: for the people who are STHs, how many of the games do you go to per season and actually sit in your seats, and how many games per season do you wind up selling?

I can see things/events coming up and work obligations that on rare occasion keep people from attending games, but for those people who wind up selling, say, half their games, I wonder: why have season tickets if you're not going to go?

[Morpheus'skins]

One of the things I'm curious about: for the people who are STHs, how many of the games do you go to per season and actually sit in your seats, and how many games per season do you wind up selling?

I can see things/events coming up and work obligations that on rare occasion keep people from attending games, but for those people who wind up selling, say, half their games, I wonder: why have season tickets if you're not going to go?

Well I am a STH living in Michigan. I try to make as many games as possible -- typically 6 games. Given that in order to make the games I need to take at least 1-2 days off I just can't swing all of them. When I can't make the games, I refuse to sell my tickets unless I know to whom they are going. I just can't stand the thought of an opposing fan soiling my seats... If I don't sell my tix I will donate them to the Redskins Replay charity, hoping that they will go to 'skins fan in need.

[SwampEm]

I think it would help quite a bit if they got rid of the OV seats. They cause quite a bit of confusion on the secondary market and they cheapen the price of the gameday experience. They should reduce the cost of the UL corners and endzone to offset some of this. The result would be no OV seats, and people that want a more affordable gameday experience can obtain it. It would also help to uncrowd the LL, and fill up the UL.

I stumbled across this WaPo article from Michael Wilbon in 1997. One of the things he mentions is that no seat has a OV.

JKC Stadium: Sites, Seats to Behold

By Michael Wilbon

Washington Post Columnist

Wednesday, August 20, 1997; Page D01

Related Items

Return to Stadium Section

Let's start with the good news from yesterday's tour of the new Jack Kent Cooke Stadium: The inside is fabulous. It's hard to imagine that even the pickiest person on Earth could walk in and see fit to change much of anything.

The bad news: The first person to be tossed into one of the temporary jail cells in the bowels of the new stadium if he assaults anybody else will be Michael Westbrook. His punchout of Stephen Davis is the first real downer of what otherwise has been a productive and optimistic preseason. This is supposed to be one of the cornerstones of your franchise? A guy who attacks a teammate in an open practice, infuriating virtually everybody in the organization? The club's patience with Westbrook is running very short, and it should be.

Fortunately for the team, the first half of the day was spent reveling in a media tour of the new stadium, the good feeling from which obviously will be around a lot longer than the bad taste left by Westbrook's assault.

And the high over the stadium's impending completion is understandable, even if getting it ready on time is going to be a 24-hour-a-day job between now and Sept. 14.

The sightlines, from the seats close to the field, to the Bob Uecker seats up top, to the seats deep in the corners of the end zones, are probably the best you'll find in the NFL. The end zone seats are just as close to the field as they were in cozy RFK Stadium and the sideline seats are so right on top of the benches, you'll probably feel like you can reach right down and lift the headset off Norv Turner's ears. More than 95 percent of the seats are in open air (meaning, bring a cap for sun and rain) but there's no such thing as an obstructed view. It's more intimate than Giants Stadium, closer than Arrowhead, and just short of peerless Ericsson Stadium in Charlotte.

The seats themselves are plenty large, big enough that I could flop my 6-foot-3, 230-pound (okay, 240-pound) frame down and sit comfortably without my knees hitting the seats in front of me or my thighs hitting the seat next to me. Anybody shorter than 6 feet and under 200 pounds should feel like he or she is sitting in a love seat, relative to other stadium seats across America.

The audio system, even with only a few speakers functioning yesterday, put forth sound so full and clear it was like listening to a really high-end home system. There's a mammoth video screen not at one end, but both ends of the stadium, and not way up on the roof like at Giants Stadium and Veterans Stadium, but right on the first concourse. And the concourses themselves are wider than the ones in Miami's Joe Robbie Stadium (now Pro Player Park), with tons of room in the corners of the stadium that may be utilized as public areas at a later date. There seems to be a bathroom about 10 steps from every seat on every level and for a change, women should never have to wait in line.

The people who purchased seats on the club level are in stadium heaven. Not all of the chairs are five inches wider than the rest of the chairs in the main seating areas, as advertised, but folks in those 15,000 premium seats get their own parking just steps from the front door, their own brew pub, three of their own restaurants, their own lounge areas and TV monitors equipped with DirecTV's NFL Sunday Ticket, and arguably the best sightlines in all of pro football, if you like to be just high enough to see the entire field and formations.

The only thing that warrants criticism is the metal window frames that are a total nuisance in the sky suites and (ahhhem, the press box). It's a sensitive situation because Jack Kent Cooke dearly loved luxury boxes with windows that opened so suite holders could soak in the atmosphere and contribute to it. And while you can hear the roar of the crowd if you're sitting in the middle of a $150,000 suite, you can't see the 40-yard line because of some aluminum window frame. That, I think, isn't going to fly with the high rollers. Some Redskins officials already have noted John Cooke's annoyance and expect frameless, albeit unopenable, windows to be installed after this season.

I've been to every NFL stadium in the league multiple times and I can say with absolutely no reservation that the interior of JKC Stadium is right there with those of Ericsson Stadium, Texas Stadium and Giants Stadium as being as good as it's going to get for viewing pleasure and amenities.

But I can't say the same thing about the exterior.

On the outside, the stadium looks like a building that was constructed in 18 months. It's an observation more than a criticism because who can blame a man for wanting to see his dream house finished before he dies?

Still, the result -- with cleanup and unfinished landscaping figuring to enhance everything -- is a stadium that is the football equivalent of Camden Yards on the inside and the unimaginative new Comiskey Park on the outside. You stand in front of JKC Stadium and you see far too many exposed water pipes and the like. I'm no architecture student, but I expected -- perhaps unfairly -- some kind of dramatic facade like the one on Ericsson, and there is none. All you see is white railings that go on and on, and something on the front that looks like the white siding you'd use to build a tool shed.

But hey, wouldn't you live in the Taj Mahal even if it looked like Boston Garden on the outside?

The legitimate concern isn't the exterior, but the traffic flow, the parking, the access to the place. You look at the building, and it's not difficult to imagine all the critical parts to it being finished in time for the opener. But the roads? Maryland state authorities swear the road construction is "on time." My question is, "On time for what?" With only 25 days to showtime, I made three turns leading to dead ends before deciding to follow a dump truck to the stadium.

Driving and parking on game days is going to be trouble, at least for the immediate future. RFK, along with Soldier Field, The Vet, the Metrodome and Arrowhead, have been among the easiest stadiums in the league to access. JKC may well join Texas Stadium, Rich Stadium in Buffalo and Foxboro Stadium in New England as the toughest. Go early. Very early. And be prepared to shuttle from somewhere.

But even if you get stuck in traffic and have to walk too far from the parking lot, your anxiety should be calmed for the rest of Sunday afternoon by a well-designed, well-executed ballfield that appears to be as comfortable and as inviting as any in the NFL.

© Copyright 1997 The Washington Post Company

[dgreen]

DC9 and tshile, I see you live in Fredericksburg and Warrenton. I'm in western Fairfax County.

We tend to have friends who live near us. I do. I assume you do. I know several Redskins fans in my general area. We talk Redskins. They have t-shirts. They watch the games. But, living where we do, it's very difficult to get any of them to pay me $ to make the long trek to Landover. And it's not even necessarily a traffic thing. Sure, the traffic can suck. But, it's just about the distance. It's an all day event even without tailgating.

My wife and son attended this last game. They left our house around 10:30 and sat down just after kickoff. They stayed the whole game and didn't get home until about 7. Now, there were a couple extra factors there. Apparently Metro had some single-track action Sunday because of track maintenance and my wife doesn't always take the quickest routes; she takes the easiest routes. But, those times are significantly different than the norm. I usually try to leave by 10:30 to make it by kickoff and I usually get home around 6.

All that to say that those of us whose circle of friends are away from the city can have a hard time selling to friends. As mentioned by others, some fans like attending games and others just don't care as much. If I lived much closer to the stadium and my circle of friends was much closer to the stadium, I think they'd be easier to sell.

[tshile]

One of the things I'm curious about: for the people who are STHs, how many of the games do you go to per season and actually sit in your seats, and how many games per season do you wind up selling?

I can see things/events coming up and work obligations that on rare occasion keep people from attending games, but for those people who wind up selling, say, half their games, I wonder: why have season tickets if you're not going to go?

I typically attend 5-6 games. There are a range of factors. I'm finishing up my degree, so sometimes school gets in the way. Other times work, or just a lack of desire - it's hard to justify the trip, time/money spent on tailgating, and spending the entire day to watch them play the rams (for example) at the end of the season when both teams have 4 wins and aren't making the playoffs.

This year I'll be attending all 8; hell I even went to one of the preseason games for a total of 9 games. I never go to preseason games and typically give the tickets away to whoever will take them. The lack of prime time games (for home games) makes it easier to attend all 8 scheduling wise. In the past I wind up missing one of the prime time games just because it means taking half a day off work.

DC9 and tshile, I see you live in Fredericksburg and Warrenton. I'm in western Fairfax County.

We tend to have friends who live near us. I do. I assume you do. I know several Redskins fans in my general area. We talk Redskins. They have t-shirts. They watch the games. But, living where we do, it's very difficult to get any of them to pay me $ to make the long trek to Landover. And it's not even necessarily a traffic thing. Sure, the traffic can suck. But, it's just about the distance. It's an all day event even without tailgating.

My wife and son attended this last game. They left our house around 10:30 and sat down just after kickoff. They stayed the whole game and didn't get home until about 7. Now, there were a couple extra factors there. Apparently Metro had some single-track action Sunday because of track maintenance and my wife doesn't always take the quickest routes; she takes the easiest routes. But, those times are significantly different than the norm. I usually try to leave by 10:30 to make it by kickoff and I usually get home around 6.

All that to say that those of us whose circle of friends are away from the city can have a hard time selling to friends. As mentioned by others, some fans like attending games and others just don't care as much. If I lived much closer to the stadium and my circle of friends was much closer to the stadium, I think they'd be easier to sell.

Thats the thing... you have to commit to it being an all day event. It drives my wife crazy because of that - but it's only 8 games a year. If you go into the entire thing knowing it's an all day event, and plan accordingly, you might find yourself enjoying it a bit more.

Yes, I live in warrenton. For a 1pm game, here's my rough schedule:

- leave the house by 9, no later than 9:30 am. Get to the stadium between 10 and 10:30am. It's about an hour drive at this time in the morning (i go around 495 and park in the D lot, so i take 202 at exit 17), as long as there isn't an accident. The line to get into the parking lots is non existent, and there are plenty of spaces available.

- go into the stadium at 12:15. getting through security is easier, you get to see all the pregames stuff, including warm ups, and you get to relax instead of running to your seats to see kickoff

- leaving the seats is the tricky part. you don't want to leave too early and miss things, but you want to avoid traffic as much as possible. it changes every game. i didn't leave the seats last sunday until the clock hit 0 - it as just too close of a game.

- one you get to the car you have to make a decision... can i get out now, or should i sit back and eat some food for 20-30 minutes? depends on when you leave your seats...

- going home you need a route that doesn't involve getting on 495. I go 202 west to martin luther king jr highway to sheriff's road west to 295 south. I then get off at exit 3b (nationals stadium, hang a right and go up through DC to 395. I take exit 8b off 395 (101) north to 66. It takes me an hour to get home, roughly 30 minutes to get out of the lot once i get in the car. Cash parking is much better for getting home earlier. Last year we parked cash at the corner of 202, and we were home 1 hour and 10 minutes afte rwalking out of the stadium (hadn't even walked to the car yet).

It just depends on your planning. The people who go more often have a system down that works for them. The people who rarely go don't have a good idea time wise of how long things take. With the right planning fedex field can be a fun experience; but it is NOT easy for a novice to get through the day without a lot of frustration

Edited September 21, 2011 by tshile

[dgreen]

It just depends on your planning. The people who go more often have a system down that works for them. The people who rarely go don't have a good idea time wise of how long things take. With the right planning fedex field can be a fun experience; but it is NOT easy for a novice to get through the day without a lot of frustration

Agreed. I've had a few different systems over the years. I loved the buses to Landover Metro Station. They were close to the stadium and I could use a similar route as you to get back to VA. We Metro now. The main problem with that is that our kids are younger (8, 6, 4). As they get older, that walk won't seem as bad. The 8 and 6 year old do it pretty well now, but the 4 year old takes his time or kills my shoulders as I carry him for large chunks of the slightly uphill walk. It wears me out. I need to get in better shape. I park at Addison Rd so I only ride Metro one stop. I prefer to get in my car as quickly as possible because I know the area well enough to take different routes and make good time back home. It's also good to get back in the car with kids so they sleep more comfortably if they want and I can get them dinner quickly if they are hungry (I refuse to buy a lot of concessions at the stadium).

If I'm attending a low-demand game (for example against Tampa late in the season in the rain), I hit craigslist for a cheap parking pass. But, at typical prices, I just can't see myself paying $40 for parking for just two people.

[psu2008]

One of the things I'm curious about: for the people who are STHs, how many of the games do you go to per season and actually sit in your seats, and how many games per season do you wind up selling?

I can see things/events coming up and work obligations that on rare occasion keep people from attending games, but for those people who wind up selling, say, half their games, I wonder: why have season tickets if you're not going to go?

I go to every game. Could I spend my money on more practical things? Yes. But without the Redskins, there would be a void in my life.

[SwampEm]

I have had tickets since 2001. I have been to all but two regular season games. In the same time frame I have attended one preseason game.

[hail2skins]

If I'm attending a low-demand game (for example against Tampa late in the season in the rain), I hit craigslist for a cheap parking pass. But, at typical prices, I just can't see myself paying $40 for parking for just two people.

I think the logistics or finances involved in just entering the stadium is a major thing that is off-putting to folks. The traffic isn't necessarily horrendous if you get there reasonable early, but you're either looking at a mile walk from the Metro (kudos to dgreen for doing it with three young kids) or being stuck for $35 to park your car. I know some on here think that $35 is a bargain but not everyone who goes to the games tailgates. I know we're not the only stadium that charges that much, but it makes me wince when someone posts their invoice from the late 1990s and it has a cost of only $10/game for parking passes. This is an area where Snyder has been much too greedy.

[RFKFedEx]

I have had tickets since 2001. I have been to all but two regular season games. In the same time frame I have attended one preseason game.

That is hard core for the era we're living in. Mad props to you.

[Popeman38]

I have had tickets since 2001. I have been to all but two regular season games. In the same time frame I have attended one preseason game.

I have had tickets since 2002, and have missed 0 reguar season games. The sick part is, in that time I have missed only 2 preseason games - the 2010 preseason awaiting the birth of my daughter. Yup, I am that crazy a-hole who left his wife at home alone with a 3 week old (through 4 month old) to keep my reg season streak alive! And God love her, she was cool with it!

[SwampEm]

I have had tickets since 2002, and have missed 0 reguar season games. The sick part is, in that time I have missed only 2 preseason games - the 2010 preseason awaiting the birth of my daughter. Yup, I am that crazy a-hole who left his wife at home alone with a 3 week old (through 4 month old) to keep my reg season streak alive! And God love her, she was cool with it!

Nice work!

[MarkB452]

One of the things I'm curious about: for the people who are STHs, how many of the games do you go to per season and actually sit in your seats, and how many games per season do you wind up selling?

I can see things/events coming up and work obligations that on rare occasion keep people from attending games, but for those people who wind up selling, say, half their games, I wonder: why have season tickets if you're not going to go?

I probably go to 1/2 to 2/3 of the games per season. I usually break even on the seats I sell and if I can sell to my family/friends/other Skins fans, then so much the better. I have tickets because I like my seats (50 yardline in section 401) and I really like the ES tailgate. However, if Snyder EVER introduces a PSL, I will be gone.

[RFKFedEx]

Yup, I am that crazy a-hole who left his wife at home alone with a 3 week old (through 4 month old) to keep my reg season streak alive! And God love her, she was cool with it!

You should love her even more for allowing Zone A club STs in the annual budget!

[RFKFedEx]

Here’s some evidence on why PSLs aren’t worth it.

My pricing data is based on current Stubhub listings and the season ticket info page on DallasCowboys.com.

I’ve been checking Stubhub for months, observing the rates for the Cowboys home opener against the Redskins. This match up should be one of the most highly anticipated regular season games of the year for Dallas. It’s the home opener against a division rival in primetime, and both teams are still in contention.

Here’s what a Cowboys ticket costs to purchase from the team; per DallasCowboys.com… midfield, section 235, Founders Club seating retailing at $15,911.00 per seat, per season. That equates to $1,591 per seat, per game for 10 games; or $1988.00 per seat, per game, for 8 regular season games.

Today on Stubhub I went right for the best seats in the house, and what I found will hopefully want to make Cowboys PSL holders want to rip their hair out.

A plentiful supply of seats in the founders club can be had for Monday Night. Good deals in the $500-600 dollar range per seat; after taxes and Stubhub fees. The public can now buy the best seats for the biggest games at less than a 1/3 of the cost of what STHs are paying for every game, including preseason.

http://www.stubhub.com/dallas-cowboys-tickets/cowboys-vs-redskins-cowboys-stadium-1068474/?ticket_id=312923167

The lopsided market is not limited to the prime club level seats. Let’s have a look at the nose bleeds on the upper level sidelines. As the least expensive PSL option the Cowboys offer, the upper level sideline seating will cost the STH apx. $927.00 per seat, per season, which includes the annual PSL fee. That breaks down to about $93 per seat, per game for 10 games; or $115 per seat, per game for 8 games. Here’s a listing on Stubhub for near midfield uppers in the same PSL zone for $33 per seat. That’s about $40 per seat after taxes and fees. Remember, this is for the NFCE home opener, not preseason.

http://www.stubhub.com/dallas-cowboys-tickets/cowboys-vs-redskins-cowboys-stadium-1068474/?ticket_id=292997004

Although not as lopsided as the Founder’s Club pricing, Stubhub offers the upper deck for a prime game at about half of what the upper deck PSL holder is paying for every game including preseason. Most of the seats on Stubhub today are lower than what people were paying on Stubhub for comparably located seats in Texas Stadium in 2008. Season ticket prices however, have sky rocketed.

The same study produced similar results for the Giants and Jets home openers at Metlife Stadium in 2011. The secondary market in 2011 affords better deals today than in 2009 at old Giants Stadium.

Good luck to any franchise still hoping to fund stadium construction on projected PSL revenue. SF, Minn, and LA are up the creek if they think they’re going to get near the same numbers as the Cowboys and Giants for PSLs. I think the ticket market has forever collapsed in wake of competition from digital game viewing technology and the preventive high gameday costs.

Edited September 26, 2011 by RFKFedEx