Conn Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 There's gonna be mistakes (like w/ McNabb) Kyle needs the freedom to make those mistakes so they can be his education. Completely agreed. Especially if he's being groomed, in a sense, for the HC spot after Mike retires. Which was all of our dreams, when he was first hired and brought in Kyle. I think at that point, we were mostly just desperate for some guaranteed stability. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phishisthegreatstuff Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I would prob have to go with Andy Reid. Shanny has 2 super bowls but years ago. Its like Joe Gibbs 2.0 he has 3 super bowls but clearly wasn't the same coach. I still think shanny is a good coach, but i think Reid is still a top 3-4 coach in the league... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 This SI article about Jake Plummer has a few little tidbits about his experience w/ Shanny. Nothing huge. Just that he made Plummer feel he couldn't please him. I don't know if that's a good or bad thing. Just putting it into the discussion."From the start, however, Shanahan and Plummer clashed. One wanted complete control; the other thrived only if not subject to it. "Shanahan used to kill me," says Plummer. "If I was 23 of 30 with two touchdowns, he'd say, Why didn't you go 25 for 30 with three touchdowns? I was like, We're beating someone by 21 points, how much more do you need to beat them by?" I don't think this is a strike against Shanahan at all (not sure if its meant that way). Plummer sounds like he's content with himself, as a player, in this quote. If I were a HC, I'd NEVER want my players content. Especially not my QB who won't come to offseason workouts. I also think that its a little different, because Kyle is the buffer between any QB and Mike. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
darrelgreenie Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Completely agreed. Especially if he's being groomed, in a sense, for the HC spot after Mike retires. Which was all of our dreams, when he was first hired and brought in Kyle. I think at that point, we were mostly just desperate for some guaranteed stability. I meant education as an OC putting an offense together from scratch for the 1st time as opposed to Houston where he was handed the reigns. But, I see your point. I think Kyle is gonna have to earn his stripes as OC w/ this team before we/he thinks about being a HC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman21ST Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Andy Reid - 19 playoff gamesMike Shanahan - 13 playoff games Andy Reid - 0-1 in the Super Bowl Mike Shanahan - 2-0 in the Super Bowl (3-0 if you include his year as O-coordinator with the 49ers) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SWFLSkins Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Wait, Joe Banner said he did a good job? File this under consider the source. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Loyal2Washington Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Neither, one has a history of choking year after year in the playoffs and the other hasn't sniffed success since one of the games best QB's decided to retire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drowland Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Of course Banner doesn't know anyone who would trade for Shanny, ...he's in Philadelphia. Why should Shanny's name be in something like that anyway. If it's a minor low blow kind of move, it's not a wise one considering 2 SB rings > 0. You can slice that any way you want, the whole point of football is to win the Super Bowl, which Reid has not. I don't think Shanny is that 'too old', 'out of the loop'. 'disconnect with players' guy, as some say Gibbs 2 was. Think of it this way: How do you think Reid would have handled this team if he got full control of it in the horrid shape it was in when Shanny got it. I think it would have been worse. Shanny got everyone in line immediately(except you-know-who). I just don't see Andy commanding the same respect out of the same Redskins players that gave theirs to Shanny. The Eagles were just as big a mess when Reid took over in '99. He turned them around in his 2nd year. Both have their strenghts and weaknesses. To me what stands out about Reid is his work with QBs. The NFL's a QB league and no coach prepares a QB to play better then Reid does. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper 21 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Its hard for any team to recover when a hof qb leaves ask the dolphins, or bills, or 49ers, Raiders, cowboys, rams(just when they lost kurt)and cardinals) packers got their qb while they had one in place to teach him, Yeah he didnt have a good track record afterwards but he was also looking for a qb to take his place that whole time. not qb they had after elway was decent no not jake not brian griese, yeah its hard yet they still were competitive in thier divison with a great running game. not to mention they lost thier incredible runningback and tight end. he never had the defense in denver that was the problem. when he got cutler they were making moves again and were looking alive but they didnt give him a chance to see it through. Reid is a great personal guy but sometimes the things he does are idiotic shannahan is a great coach who other teams try and copy(icing). we had **** for a team last year and yet we still improved 2 games with players hwo most of us had never heard of and probably never would have. armstrong, torain, lich, all were shanny pickups. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darkstarr Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I will take Shanny, the man simply builds great Oline's. Denver always had great lines under shanny. I bet he builds the same in Washington in no more then 3 years total. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
88Comrade2000 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Neither. Reid will never win a superbowl and Shanny will only get us to being mediocre like his last 3 years in Denver and then get fired by Danny. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
twenty-eight Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Andy Reid. Even though he's the best coach Tuesday through Saturday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MusicCitySkin Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Reid has a good eye for talent, but often I've seen his teams get manhandled because they lack size and power. It's obvious he wants that modern, pass-first, speedy offense. It's the same reason he typically gets outcoached in the playoffs. He doesn't have a balanced attack. He's a perpetual regular season champion. Shanahan has the gameplan for a deep playoff run, he just needs someone taking care of his talent decisions--except when it comes to RBs and OL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bedlamVR Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I do not think you can point at Reids accomplishements (or lack there of) and then dismiss what Shanhan did in Denver . The common missonception is that Shannahan inherited a team and won with it, but he took a 8-8 run of the mill team with an aging QB and took it to back to back superbowl victories - only 6 coaches have ever repeated in the history of the NFL and consider all the great coaches (Reid) for example that never have taken a team all the way . It is also commonly undersold just how dominanting those Bronco teams were - in three years they posted a record that stands today as the most wins in a 3 season window (where they went 46-10) overall . Also people discount Shannahans role with the 49ers where he oversaw an offense which, untill J McD helped the Patriorts explode in 2007, scored the most points in a season 636 - back in 1994. People want to point at the negative assumptions about Shanahans personell choices but he always managed to pluck 1000 yard running backs out of nowhere, drafted dominant players like Dumbervile and Claddy, Schaffer, Cutler and Marshell - the list of Shanahan first round busts is much much shorter than Reids - who plumped for greats such as Todd Pinkerson, Freddy Mitchell, Broderick Bunkley and Jerome McDougle . Then you have with Reid the entire Kevin Kolb issue . Drafting him in the second would be fine if you really thought he was your guy of the future - He risked and actually did alienate McNabb with the move but then kept McNabb as the starter for 2 years . Then he finally bit the bullett and named Kolb the starter for about five minutes then instyantly replaced him with Vick and Kolb if he can get away from the Eagles will do rather than rotting behind a dog kil... i meen Micheal Vick The finnal head scratcher is just how good is he without a Jim Johnson at D co-ordinator - That D has lost its bite and now as an ex offensive line coach as their co-ordinator .... an interesting move to say the least . So all things considered who would you take .. . . The guy with the superbowl history, the guy who co-ordia nted one of the most prolific offences in NFL history. . . one of the few coaches to take a team to the superbowl in less than 4 years of taking charge . . . . .or a fat guy who isn't a Redskin coach or player . . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hitman21ST Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I will take Shanny, the man simply builds great Oline's. Denver always had great lines under shanny. I bet he builds the same in Washington in no more then 3 years total. O-lines and running backs... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJ Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Shanny needs 3 years to prove his worth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clarkskin Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I'd have to go with Reid. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stew Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Reid cannot even successfully run his family, let alone get over the hump in the playoffs. It has now been proven that even without McNibble, Reid cannot succeed in the post season. he has had more then ample chance in the playoffs in his career, and has never won it all. If the excuse is that he had subpar talent at any position, I blame that on the coach. Shanny, while he may have had some talent on the teams he coached, he still had to guide his teams to wins, and has been there and won. he knows more abuot success then Reid, and as many others have stated, he has a nack for creating superb O-lines, and he knows how to get the most out of a RB. Im not nearly as down on Shanny as some are on here. He is navigating the ship through some choppy waters, and all in all we havent taken on much water. I like Shanny as our coach, and I think there are some good times in store for us with him as our coach. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJ Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 WHEN the new CBA is resolved our team will start to take shape. Several key FAs with Shanny and Haslett getting the player(s) they need on OF and DF then the draft this year and next this team will be ready to compete in 2011. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AllBusiness Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Cowher........ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Reaper 21 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 i think reid compares well to mike d'antoni... some regard him as a great nba coach, (suns old coach now knicks) ... i wouldnt they win games all year long with thier explosive offense but as anybody who watchest the nba at all defense isnt played till the playoffs.(well not real defense) then in the playoffs they are lucky to get out of the first round if they do its because they were playing bottom feeders or just had great matchup problems. but when it came down to the big heads of the league lakers, spurs, mavs, they would get smacked like little children for not playing d.. notice the comparison to andy reid now great regular season with an unstoppable high powered offense blowing every team in its path. until teams buckle down and play for real Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigricky3469 Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 The question should read do you think Reid can win in DC? This organization is so f**k*d*p that not even Bill could win here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
addicted Posted February 17, 2011 Author Share Posted February 17, 2011 Great discussion here everyone. I agree with this: Of course Banner doesn't know anyone who would trade for Shanny, ...he's in Philadelphia. Why should Shanny's name be in something like that anyway. If it's a minor low blow kind of move, it's not a wise one considering 2 SB rings > 0. You can slice that any way you want, the whole point of football is to win the Super Bowl, which Reid has not. I don't think Shanny is that 'too old', 'out of the loop'. 'disconnect with players' guy, as some say Gibbs 2 was. Kinda shocked me to read that. I mean who asked the Eagles President about Shanahan anyway? I like both coaches, both have awesome pasts and excel at different things. To me it can't just come down to Superbowl history. Yes it's very important to win the big one but there is much more to it then just winning the big game. Guys like George Allen who was mentioned here didn't win the big game but that doesn't take away from his accomplishments. To me when your someone like Reid without that to me it's like a masterpiece painting without a signature. You love the artwork but aren't sure what you got. My own opinion about the men leading us is this. If I were Snyder and had to choose one of the men to coach this team over the course of the next 4 years I'm going with Shanahan. He's demonstrated a leadership and iron fist rule that this organization needs. I believe that change in mentality is as important for our team going forward and on par with how this teams made up. Shanahan's shown an ability to take players throughout his career and turn them into relevant NFL performers that other coaches just can't do. Last year he did that again with Banks, Williams, Torain, Armstrong....who before the season thought those guys were going to be as important as they turned out to be? He's done that forever so in my opinion building a team is one of his strengths. But so is dealing with the million dollar babies he inherited. And I think he's done a great job with that. Reid not so much. Seems he has issues with his players all the time like Owens and Jackson this year and he doesn't seem to command the same level of respect and fear from his guys that Mike has. Andy's a great coach but I think for us the answer would be Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 Cowher........ I'll never understand why so many people love a coach that took 15 years to win it all with one of the best FO structures in the league, and won it because of his DC and GM, at that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Enter Apotheosis Posted February 17, 2011 Share Posted February 17, 2011 I'll never understand why so many people love a coach that took 15 years to win it all with one of the best FO structures in the league, and won it because of his DC and GM, at that. It's all about the jawline. Men want it and women want to be with it. At least... that's my best guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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