JPCreativelab Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 i was cool with and happy about the Albert trade, until i remembered he was the dude that stomped on Andre's face. even tho he was a Cowboy, thats just not right, and i was against it after i remembered the fact that... albert = douche Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hail2skins Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I think the move right before Spurrier was hired--getting rid of Marty--left a good number of Skins fans scratching their heads. But Marty was seen as pretty conservative on the O side of the ball and bringing in the OBC, then seen as an offensive wizard, alleviated the misgivings about firing Marty at the time. Firing Schottenheimer and the cluster of a coaching search after Gibbs 2.0 ended are the big football-related stains on Snyder's regime so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smooters Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Don't write anything too offensive in this thread, because he may get offended take over this board and censor this just like he censored the posters that people brought to fedex 2 years ago It IS an official message board. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thinking Skins Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Panel is exactly right. Every major move made by Snyder, except for the hiring of Jim Zorn, was overwhelmingly popular when it went down. The Jason Taylor move is instructive on this point. A poll done in this forum showed that 89% of our members favored the trade. That 89% majority must not be posting here anymore because it seems like all the posters since the move failed knew it was another stupid move by Dan Snyder when it happened. I'll easily point out that I was in the 11 percent when that went down. I remember praying that it was another unsubstantiated rumor of JLC and hearing the Redskins deny it. Anyway, one of the main problems with this team is that they don't stick to anything except trying new things out. We trade for Taylor and then cut him. We hire Zorn then remove his abilities. We sign Haynesworth then won't use him, then bench him. We trade for McNabb then bench him. We draft Thomas and Kelly then bench them. We draft Ramsey then bench him. We appoint Williams as the successor to Gibbs then fire him. We trade for Lloyd then bench him. The list goes on and on. He fires Norv after FINALLY taking this team to the playoffs (and within a missed FG of a championship game). He benches Brad Johnson after the best year by a QB since 1991. Thats one major difference between Snyder's Redskins vs the late 90's Cooke Redskins. Back then, we were praying for Norv or Casserly (or both) to be fired. We were praying for some change in defensive philosophy - tired of the bend but don't break every year. And we were tired of the fools gold every year, 7-1 and no playoffs, 6-2 and no playoffs, Trent Green comes in and looks like a franchise QB and doesn't want to resign here. As fans, we realized that many of these problems were due to JKC's health and that Norv/Casserly was getting extra time because whoever was head man (Cooke's son?) wasn't pulling the trigger and back then we did want an owner. But now we've got an owner who's just as irrational but to the other extreme. He doesn't have the patience to let things develop. He wants instantaneous success. And when the guys work out in their first seasons, they wind up becoming fan favorites (CP, Fletcher, Springs, etc). But the problem becomes that we can never build a nucleus of players because there's always so much turnover. So even the moves that people like begin to lose favor with the fans because is shows that he himself has a lack of faith in them. Before Brandon Lloyd, there was Walt Harris, the former Skins nickel corner who was cut and went to SF and became a pro bowler. We love to talk about Pierce and Clark, but you can also look at Justin Tyron (who many fans hated and thought he was useless, even laughing at DG for the claims he made about Tyron) - he's now a starting CB in Indy. Then there's Anthony Bryant who went to Philly, Stephen Davis who had a great career in Carolina, etc. I can go on and on. This builds the frustration. I'm not behind most of his free agent/trade moves, but I'll easily admit that some have worked. But I think one problem that fans have with him is that he operates in a binary world when this is the REAL world. I don't think there should be a phrase "he doesn't fit our system". If we've got talented guys on the bench who are more talented than the guy playing, then our system needs to be flexible enough to get the talented guys on the field. I think thats the part of the moves that frustrates the fans more than the moves themselves. Like once we got Haynesworth, I was cool with it. But when we weren't using him to rush the passer in 2009, I questioned our coaches scheme. Blatche was supposed to be the guy who "simplified the scheme" and "played to guys strenghts", but he did just the opposite with Haynesworth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky21 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Hindsight can be fun sometimes. Here are the wise 11.55% who can feel free to continue to mock Snyder at will. 21Knock_U_Out addicted AMONK81 aqq artmonkforHOF BillyKilmer Birdlives Bryan81 CaptChaos86 chariq Cowboy8467 DaEvent DCMONEY Dirk Diggler endzone_dave EvoSkins francom65 Gator Bait Geoff_K Gibbs=TheBestEver hawgboy Higgs44 ILoveTheRedskins Itoolu jferraro Koolblue13 KrnZippo LaRonDontLikeUgly mr2you NeckBone Norvitis Nublar7 pcumberl pointyfootball quicksilver RalphZero RedskinDan0557 Redskins:Victory_or_Death Riggo-toni Roger.Staubach S4L SKINchiefer Skins PR Skins110 skinsfannyc76 Skinsfor4 SkinsWarrior81 sloppypanda Smoooooot Stophovr6 Taylor Made The Big Dog TheREALJBird Thinking Skins W1N_SKINS Yusuf06 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Even though I'm an optimistic fan and I defend Snyder a lot, I don't think it helps his case when people point out that fans approved of specific moves. There are some smart fans, but as a whole, a fan base is ignorant and not really who I'd be going to for football advice. So, even though I agree with the OP, I don't agree with others in this thread that it matters if Snyder's previous football-related moves are popular. The game day experience stuff...sure, it's all for the fans. But not the on-the-field things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Don't expect any more responses from brettstr for a week. Gracias, Jumbo. Anyways, I have to agree that when these are the things you're thanking your owner for, that's a sign of a struggling organization. But we know that, and hopefully, its over a year into righting itself, under the supervision of Bruce Allen, through the personnel moves of Shanahan, the contracts of the aforementioned Allen, and the complete non-involvement of Dan Snyder. That's one thing he did right, that I won't stop thanking him for unless he goes back to his old ways. Its nice to have a positive thread, even if it is based on the small things. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Even though I'm an optimistic fan and I defend Snyder a lot, I don't think it helps his case when people point out that fans approved of specific moves. There are some smart fans, but as a whole, a fan base is ignorant and not really who I'd be going to for football advice. So, even though I agree with the OP, I don't agree with others in this thread that it matters if Snyder's previous football-related moves are popular. The game day experience stuff...sure, it's all for the fans. But not the on-the-field things. Hate to break it to you, but fans are smarter now then they've ever been. They were just talking about it on a sports talk show yesterday. We have more access to more venues then ever before and that's why we are more informative then in years past. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjfootballer Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Its nice to have a positive thread, even if it is based on the small things. And that's pretty much what Mark was trying to do until the haters came in and crapped on the thread. He was just trying to find a light at the end of the dark tunnel. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MassSkinsFan Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 He's done what we all asked and gotten rid of Vinny, put football minds in charge, and stepped back. I really think we all need to step back from the ledge with all this Snyder stuff. It's gotten crazy. It's true. I think many of us are so used to ****ing about Dan that it comes naturally, and since we're coming off a frustrating 6-10 season it's even easier. Having patience can be difficult (especially after 10 years of trying it), but I think we need it right now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jumbo Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Panel is exactly right. Every major move made by Snyder, except for the hiring of Jim Zorn, was overwhelmingly popular when it went down. The Jason Taylor move is instructive on this point. A poll done in this forum showed that 89% of our members favored the trade. That 89% majority must not be posting here anymore because it seems like all the posters since the move failed knew it was another stupid move by Dan Snyder when it happened. At some point it's worth being mindful of a fact most of us acknowledge regularly (except when we have an axe to grind and it works against our desire for maximum support) in conversation----- about 80% of internet "opinionators" are often pretty clueless about their topic and are often of questionable developmental stability. :pfft: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grantarchy Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Panel is exactly right. Every major move made by Snyder, except for the hiring of Jim Zorn, was overwhelmingly popular when it went down. The Jason Taylor move is instructive on this point. A poll done in this forum showed that 89% of our members favored the trade. That 89% majority must not be posting here anymore because it seems like all the posters since the move failed knew it was another stupid move by Dan Snyder when it happened. I'm not sure I agree that "every major move" was "overwhelmingly popular". The running joke a few years into Snyder's ownership was that the Redskins win the offseason every year, and I think a lot of fans began to realize that the free agent signings were not making us better. If given a choice I think a lot of people would much rather have built through the draft. But if you put a poll up and say "Are you happy with such and such signing" you aren't going to get a lot of people saying they're unappy to get these guys. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
'Skins_&_'Stons Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I opened my morning paper this morning and, lo and behold, another negative article on Dan Snyder. Are you kidding me??? I think it's time we outlined some of the recent good things Snyder has done - because this interminable bashing, by the media and even by fellow ES members, is getting out of hand. Of course, this thread will scroll off the front page in a few hours because, after all, it's no fun talking about good stuff. But that's okay. And I'm not going to spend half a day researching this, so this will be a short list. Right off the top of my head, here goes: The HD Tron: This thing is amazing. You can sit at the 50 yard line, and watch the screen as the players run out of the tunnel - and the clarity is amazing. You can actually see the mesh of the jerseys - even their individual facial hairs - as they run out of the tunnel. If I was standing at the opening of the tunnel myself, the view wouldn't be as good. The replays are instant and are shown after almost every play. Thank-you Dan Snyder. It is perfect. Out-of-town scores: Constantly scrolling out-of-town scores. Pinch me, I'm dreaming. I've been wanting this for a decade, and now we have it. It is constant, it is real-time, and you can get a complete update on what's going on around the league in just a few seconds. Thank-you Dan Snyder. It is perfect. Extended Tailgating: Three - yes, three of the eight games last year featured extended tailgating for the fans. Instead of the usual four-hour-before-kickoff lot openings, we were allowed two eight-hour tailgates, and one six hour tailgate. This is a major benefit for tailgating fans. If you host a large tailgate, as many of us regulars do, you know you will spend at least a half hour setting up, and at least a half hour tearing down. Add the time to enter the stadium, and you're really only left with about two-and-a-half hours of pure tailgating during a normal lot opening. But change four hours to eight hours, and the tailgating experience is three-times improved. It's a MAJOR upgrade to the game-day experience. It gives us the opportunity to do things we've never been able to do: cook a pig, barbecue a turkey, smoke a brisket, etc. All in a relaxed, unhurried, festive, Redskins environment. Thank-you Dan Snyder. It is perfect. I couldn't agree more, Mark. Great fan-friendly moves that we all appreciate. He should receive nothing but positive credit for these. Uninvolved In Football Decisions: Isn't this what everybody wanted? Well, we have it. Every decision regarding Redskins football is now made by professionals who have spent their entire lives in football. Thank-you Dan Snyder. It is perfect. I'm sorry, but I never believed this for a second. The McNabb trade REEKED of Snyder's "win now" mentality that has plagued our beloved team since he purchased it. Last year's 2nd round pick & this year's 4th round pick subsequently went right down the drain for absolutely nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gibbsfan2018 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 It is easier to point out the bad things when the team is losing. If we were winning, everyone would love Dan Snyder. If it rained cash we all would be rich. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I'm sorry' date=' but I never believed this for a second. The McNabb trade REEKED of Snyder's "win now" mentality that has plagued our beloved team since he purchased it. Last year's 2nd round pick & this year's 4th round pick subsequently went right down the drain for absolutely nothing.[/quote']I just think its ridiculous to think that Shanahan would allow Dan's interference on anything. The guy still had two years of being paid the big bucks by the Broncos...you really think he HAD to come here and put himself in this situation? Of course not. He could have taken nearly any coaching job he wanted in the next 2 years. If Shanahan has one well-known flaw, its his ego. And in this situation, that's a good thing. Because it allows those with common sense to realize that he'd never enter into a coaching situation where he didn't have COMPLETE control. And he wouldn't stand for it if that was compromised. It doesn't fit. With Shanahan here, you can't blame any personnel moves on Snyder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach Janky Spanky Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 And that's pretty much what Mark was trying to do until the haters came in and crapped on the thread. He was just trying to find a light at the end of the dark tunnel. I, nor others on here, are simply "haters" who "crapped" on a thread just because we are unwilling to thank the owner for things that he should have done years ago. I mean, c'mon seriously -- we're supposed to be so thrilled that he shows out-of-town scores!! You must be kidding me. (Seriously, that's one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read. I remember at the Chiefs game in 2009, probably a low point of the Zorn era, when they even showed the wrong scores on the LiteBrite screen. They couldn't even get that right!) I appreciate the OP's intentions and I for one am optimistic that the owner has turned a corner -- but do not call us haters just because we are still upset with the owner, and offering justified criticism is not crapping on a thread. I'm sorry the thread didn't go quite the way it was intended -- obviously many fans are not ready to start patting the owner on the back just yet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grantarchy Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I just think its ridiculous to think that Shanahan would allow Dan's interference on anything. The guy still had two years of being paid the big bucks by the Broncos...you really think he HAD to come here and put himself in this situation? Of course not. He could have taken nearly any coaching job he wanted in the next 2 years. If Shanahan has one well-known flaw, its his ego. And in this situation, that's a good thing. Because it allows those with common sense to realize that he'd never enter into a coaching situation where he didn't have COMPLETE control. And he wouldn't stand for it if that was compromised. It doesn't fit. With Shanahan here, you can't blame any personnel moves on Snyder. I tend to agree - Shanahan is a no-nonsense control freak (which is one of the things that got him ousted here in Denver). I just don't buy that he would have accepted a situation where he was having players shoved on him by Snyder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pimpumd Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I just think its ridiculous to think that Shanahan would allow Dan's interference on anything. The guy still had two years of being paid the big bucks by the Broncos...you really think he HAD to come here and put himself in this situation? Of course not. He could have taken nearly any coaching job he wanted in the next 2 years. If Shanahan has one well-known flaw, its his ego. And in this situation, that's a good thing. Because it allows those with common sense to realize that he'd never enter into a coaching situation where he didn't have COMPLETE control. And he wouldn't stand for it if that was compromised. It doesn't fit. With Shanahan here, you can't blame any personnel moves on Snyder. +1. Absolutely no way in hell Snyder went behind Shanny's back, or completed ignored his opinion, on the McNabb trade. Shanny thought he was getting a solid veteran QB that could run his system. He was wrong. He's admitted that. Get over it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conn Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I tend to agree - Shanahan is a no-nonsense control freak (which is one of the things that got him ousted here in Denver). I just don't buy that he would have accepted a situation where he was having players shoved on him by Snyder. +1. Absolutely no way in hell Snyder went behind Shanny's back, or completed ignored his opinion, on the McNabb trade. Shanny thought he was getting a solid veteran QB that could run his system. He was wrong. He's admitted that. Get over it. Exactly. Many people would view his ego, and its reputation, as a negative. But in THIS specific place, the FO/Coaching staff of the Washington Redskins, its a very good thing, because our entire team culture has been that of a circus the last few years. We needed a guy who would come in, demand full control and get it, and then utilize it properly: purge the team, purge the coaching staff, purge the feeling in the building that this was an amateur organization. And I believe he's well on his way to doing that, and the further roster turnover this season will continue to put his system, his guys, and his team culture in place. Might it get old a few years from now, if we're still not winning? Possibly. But all I know is that right now, it keeps Snyder from interfering with anything (and hopefully its a habit that he keeps in the future, with other coaches...Shanahan needs to succeed just for that reason, to help any future FO members/coaches), and its getting this team to fall into line. A decade and a half of his attitude and control-freak nature, with falling results, would be a problem like in Denver, yes. But right now, its just what this organization needs, even if he makes a couple of mistakes with that authority. Lets hope that McNabb was his learning curve here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WinSkins Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 I opened my morning paper this morning and, lo and behold, another negative article on Dan Snyder. Are you kidding me??? I think it's time we outlined some of the recent good things Snyder has done - because this interminable bashing, by the media and even by fellow ES members, is getting out of hand. Of course, this thread will scroll off the front page in a few hours because, after all, it's no fun talking about good stuff. But that's okay. And I'm not going to spend half a day researching this, so this will be a short list. Thank-you Dan Snyder. It is perfect. Thanks MTH...nice to have some balance injected into this discussion. WP lost me the other day when the Haynesworth arrest and lawsuit trumped the Chris Hanbuger Hall of Fame election on the sports page. Sick of the media and other fans trying to tell me how to think, spend my money and act on game day. I make up my own mind, based on current facts and am not afraid to change my opinions as things change. My children refer to it as acting like a grown up instead of a child. Wouldn't mind seeing some more grown up posts like yours instead of the same nonsense being spewed over and over again. Thanks again for adding some sanity to the discussion. :applause: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TD_washingtonredskins Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Hate to break it to you, but fans are smarter now then they've ever been. They were just talking about it on a sports talk show yesterday. We have more access to more venues then ever before and that's why we are more informative then in years past. That might be true...but fans are still fans while GMs and scouts are paid to do what they do for a reason. Overall, a GM or a scout for any NFL team is going to know SO much more about a player than we are. Even small things like how they fit within the intricacies of the schemes we're going to employ could make a huge difference. So, just because we consider ourselves knowledgeable, doesn't mean that a group of fans being excited about a move validates that move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KingGibbs Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 And that's pretty much what Mark was trying to do until the haters came in and crapped on the thread. He was just trying to find a light at the end of the dark tunnel. Ha ha. The "haters" label again, huh? Okay Larry Michael clonie. In case you didn't realize this is a public forum that is opened to discussion as long as you stay within the guidelines. Besides, how boring would it be if we all agreed.on everything? Light at the end of the tunnel? LOL! If you think installing the Tron, extending tailgates, showing out of town scores constitutes "light at the end of the tunnel" in regards to the direction this franchise is going? Then I've seen it all now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark The Homer Posted February 10, 2011 Author Share Posted February 10, 2011 Thanks MTH...nice to have some balance injected into this discussion. WP lost me the other day when the Haynesworth arrest and lawsuit trumped the Chris Hanbuger Hall of Fame election on the sports page. ...Well, I am happy to report that the Wash Post didn't have a single anti-Snyder article in it this morning - first time in over a week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elkabong82 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 Besides, how boring would it be if we all agreed.on everything?Light at the end of the tunnel? LOL! If you think installing the Tron, extending tailgates, showing out of town scores constitutes "light at the end of the tunnel" in regards to the direction this franchise is going? Then I've seen it all now. You all didn't seem to mind continually agreeing on everything in the negative Snyder threads. Seeing as the fans have wanted a GM, Snyder to be hands-off, a new jumbotron, extending tailgates, etc., then doing all of that is a step in the right direction, or, light at end of the tunnel. Just as others complain about things Snyder does unrelated to football and claim that it seeps over to football, or is part of a larger picture, the positive things are equally included under that frame of thought. If you are going to claim a lawsuit againt a paper, Six Flags failing, over-priced concessions, and other negative off the field stuff effects the Redskins and keeps them on the wrong path, then you have to accept the postive off field stuff as effecting the Skins as well and a part of the right path. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocky21 Posted February 10, 2011 Share Posted February 10, 2011 If you are going to claim a lawsuit againt a paper, Six Flags failing, over-priced concessions, and other negative off the field stuff effects the Redskins and keeps them on the wrong path, then you have to accept the postive off field stuff as effecting the Skins as well and a part of the right path.I agree. I am willing to give Snyder credit for the good things as long as he gets the blame for the bad things. And the bad far outweighs the good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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