James Davis is NOT the answer

[bowhunter]

Brett Favre outrushed our entire team for Goodness sakes. At least let Monty play center for 5 snaps, so we can see what Davis can do

[nebster21]

I am gladd we did not jump to this conclusion on Torain or Banks. Oh wait, alot of people did.

[scruffylookin]

I am gladd we did not jump to this conclusion on Torain or Banks. Oh wait, alot of people did.

The conclusion drawn on Torain is that he had a history of not staying healthy.

Seems that it was spot on.

[cyfar]

I am gladd we did not jump to this conclusion on Torain or Banks. Oh wait, alot of people did.

Thank you. I noticed a back that ran into the line and that showed very little patience once he got to the line but I'm willing to give the guy the benefit of the doubt. Now if he doesn't learn from this week's game and shows little to no improvement by the end of the season, then I'll say, "He's a bum." All of our fakemeout GMs and coaches love to jump the gun.

[GSF]

Guy showed ZERO vision, balance or burst.

Maybe it was all the time off, but he looked terrible out there. Keiland looked faster and thats terrible.

Both those guys are scabs. Back ups at best on a legit team.

[Rodriggo]

Granted he showed nothing but one game?!?!

Give him a chance. Nobody else is lighting it up in the run game.

[ThomasRoane]

Guy showed ZERO vision, balance or burst.

Maybe it was all the time off, but he looked terrible out there. Keiland looked faster and thats terrible.

How do you know? I've been working with the ZBS (same version ran by Va Tech) for about 6 years now. It takes an RB a while to get used to that style. Where with other types of blocking you pretty much have your RB slam into the hole. Not so with the ZBS. A runner has 3 options (I have a drill for this too).

1. Hammer the hole; if it's open get in their quick!

2. Cut back (your biggest runs always, always, always come from the defense over playing and getting out of position on the backside; usually cause they're tired of seeing you methodically move the chains at 3 - 4 yards a carry -- when it's working properly that is)

3. Spill it to the outside

Take Va Tech as an example. When Darren Evans had his first great year. Then he gets hurt and in comes Ryan Williams. At first, Williams wasn't patient enough. Your instinct as a back is get the hell thru the line before someone takes your head off! But running behind the ZBS requires great patience and then great vision; in that order. At first people were blaming the line and sometimes Williams. Then mid season he gets it. And just goes nuts! Now you got everyone foaming at the mouth to draft the kid.

As for Davis? It's way too early to judge him. He's got the physical tools to be good in that system. Showed some decent vision but both his inexperience and the fact that the Vikes have one of the top 3 D-lines in the NFL kept him from showing what he really brings to the table.

Having said that, I was baffled that Kieland wasn't in there. He may not have break away speed but he does have a better feel for what Shanny wants from him. Either he was dinged up and MS didn't want people to know about it or we were saving him for the Giants game. If we are to have any hope at all of the playoffs we will have to own tie breakers in the division. Like Gibbs, MS understands how much more important Division games are than the others.

[TGI Jef]

despite how anyone feels about Davis or Williams or Torain or Potential First Round Pick X, we have to realize that the Redskins are now through with the days of attachment to any RB.

if you think we should keep Keiland then fine, but dont get too used to him getting a lot of carries. if you think we should hold out and wait for Torain or Portis next year then fine, but realize that we now have a coach who is unwilling to "wait" on a RB.

Shanahan has his faults, but he also has a running system that has proven to be effective, and that running system doesnt care if a guy is a star or a first round pick or a guy off the street.

instead of figuring out who our RB will be in 2011, the Shanahans and Bruce Allen are going to continue to fix the OL and then find guys who can run in the system. if a guys is effective, then he will be a member of the 2011 Redskins RB committee. if he falters along the way, he will be cast aside.

time to fall in love with the running game, and not the running back.

[SWFLSkins]

First round - Running back

and that is not a compliment. Mike Shannahan won't draft a RB in the first round, have you followed him much?

[SWFLSkins]

How do you know? I've been working with the ZBS (same version ran by Va Tech) for about 6 years now. It takes an RB a while to get used to that style. Where with other types of blocking you pretty much have your RB slam into the hole. Not so with the ZBS. A runner has 3 options (I have a drill for this too).

1. Hammer the hole; if it's open get in their quick!

2. Cut back (your biggest runs always, always, always come from the defense over playing and getting out of position on the backside; usually cause they're tired of seeing you methodically move the chains at 3 - 4 yards a carry -- when it's working properly that is)

3. Spill it to the outside

Take Va Tech as an example. When Darren Evans had his first great year. Then he gets hurt and in comes Ryan Williams. At first, Williams wasn't patient enough. Your instinct as a back is get the hell thru the line before someone takes your head off! But running behind the ZBS requires great patience and then great vision; in that order. At first people were blaming the line and sometimes Williams. Then mid season he gets it. And just goes nuts! Now you got everyone foaming at the mouth to draft the kid.

As for Davis? It's way too early to judge him. He's got the physical tools to be good in that system. Showed some decent vision but both his inexperience and the fact that the Vikes have one of the top 3 D-lines in the NFL kept him from showing what he really brings to the table.

Having said that, I was baffled that Kieland wasn't in there. He may not have break away speed but he does have a better feel for what Shanny wants from him. Either he was dinged up and MS didn't want people to know about it or we were saving him for the Giants game. If we are to have any hope at all of the playoffs we will have to own tie breakers in the division. Like Gibbs, MS understands how much more important Division games are than the others.

Man that was not only enlightening it was spot on IMO. I hope KDawg and others get a chance to read this so I can see what they think. I don't know much, but I know when someone else does.

[TGI Jef]

i am more likely to be drafted to play RB than any first round prospect. just not going to happen.

[SkinsTribeVA]

He definitely didn't look like anything special, but the line gave him nothing. I'd like to see him get some action in one more game before making a final judgment.

[SkinsCrushCowboys]

i am more likely to be drafted to play RB than any first round prospect. just not going to happen.

can you block?

agree, no RB in first round

[Jofizz]

Nobody was claiming him to be the "answer"....

Obviously you do not read this forum much.

[ke27on]

lol... seeing how slow a guy hits a hole and gets tackled by arm tackles, has nothing to do with how many carries he has. Guy just doesnt have it...period, he could have had 100 carries today, wouldnt have changed how slow he is to react.

exactly, he didnt have a lot of space. but keiland williams looked better everytime he got the ball. I understand the blocking was bad and he couldnt do a whole lot. But everytime he got the ball he looked AWFUL. I mean really awful, I couldnt understand why they werent letting williams have the ball..

[jnhay]

Can anyone post his 6 carries so we can analyze one by one? I didn't see a guy who clearly didn't belong on the field, and I didn't see a future Terrell Davis. I didn't see nearly enough to draw a conclusion!

[DRSmith]

Shanny said he did not expect much from the run game yesterday I think not running stretch plays or having him get outside hurt him.

[Diesel Hog]

I'll admit I was on a big high with the J. Davis pick up. Mainly because I watched him at Clemson and saw first hand what he is capable of. I also was big on this move because the Redskins really need a play making RB, and the team potentially got one with Davis, and spend little money and gave no draft picks to get him. Should this work out, it's a HUGE pick up for the Redskins. Like many of you, I was disappointed by his play, and the team's play on Sunday. I hope Davis gets more chances to show what he can do, and will remain with the team. If he does, the Redskins just saved themselves a draft pick. If not, well, they didn't really lose anything did they? I still have hope JD can be a great RB for this team, but first thing is first...The team really, really needs to beef up the O and D Lines.

[s0crates]

If Davis is the answer, then it must have been a stupid question. Count me among the unimpressed.

[Conn]

how can you be so down on the kid? when he plants that foot and cuts he shows great burst.

That's exactly what I see, gortiz. It seems people have been watching Portis for so long that they forgot how to evaluate other running backs, even when they don't "produce" in a bad situation.

And BLC, exactly. Keiland and Torain wish they could cut like Davis can. Now if we can just see it come behind better offensive line play, against a weaker front 7.

[Conn]

And great post, thomasroane. Very interesting stuff. Hopefully it opens people's minds up to the possibility that they don't know what the hell they're talking about.

[Shawn12]

This is a horrible thread. 6 carries from a guy who had crap to work with in terms of running lanes and Oline push.....seriously! He's got next to nothing in terms of a relationship with the other players and the system in general right now. I think he needs a little more time before you throw him away. What a knee-jerk reaction post.

[darrelgreenie]

Having said that, I was baffled that Kieland wasn't in there. He may not have break away speed but he does have a better feel for what Shanny wants from him. Either he was dinged up and MS didn't want people to know about it or we were saving him for the Giants game.

GP-

I was wondering why Keiland Williams wasn't in there myself.

Its odd that they would activate Davis and give him more carries then Williams.

And if we had 2 healthy backs why would we run the ball only 9 times in a 14-17 ballgame?

Keiland ran the ball more when he was the only healthy back during the past 2 games.

I'm listening to ESPN980 right now and Tom Loverro thinks that Keiland got dinged in the 1st qtr.

*(From a scheme stand point why weren't we running the outside zone play right at Jared Allen?)

[Mr. Sinister]

In the limited time that I saw him out there, he showed great burst through the hole ( when it was there, which wasn't that often), and showed a little wiggle, which is something that we didn't have at the RB position prior to his arrival,but his vision obviously needs to get better, and he's not that physical.

It's actually kind of funny that we're already making assumptions about a guy who has been here for five minutes, when our running game, and offense in general, has sucked for the entire season, no matter who's in the backfield.

[Saqs]

LMAO at this thread.