The Official Washington Basketball Thread: Wizards, Mystics etc

[Destino]

As far as drafting goes I think size is the biggest trap in the draft because teams are willing to take a guy that has no offensive game and lacks an NBA strength thinking that those things will materialize in the future.

[Gator Bait]

As far as drafting goes I think size is the biggest trap in the draft because teams are willing to take a guy that has no offensive game and lacks an NBA strength thinking that those things will materialize in the future.

that's how I feel about Anthony Davis. yeah, he is a very good shot blocker in college and gets some put backs and alley oops, but he has shown me nothing as far as NBA ready offense.

[Samuels]

that's how I feel about Anthony Davis. yeah, he is a very good shot blocker in college and gets some put backs and alley oops, but he has shown me nothing as far as NBA ready offense.

He is 18 years old. Davis has absurd upside at PF. The guy is'nt asked to shoot jumpers regulary at Kentucky. If you watch his HS videos you will see him beating guys off the dribble,Hitting long jumpers etc. The guy is a freak athletically with a brain and understanding of the game. I can't count how many times he has blocked a shot or stole a pass and went coast to coast.

[RonArtest15]

The crazy thing about Davis is, he played guard until he was a sophomore in HS. He CAN shoot...but his shot needs a little work. Offensively, I think he could put up KG #'s in due time.

[Going Commando]

that's how I feel about Anthony Davis. yeah, he is a very good shot blocker in college and gets some put backs and alley oops, but he has shown me nothing as far as NBA ready offense.

He's more than just a shot blocker and finisher. He or Robinson have got to be the favorites to win POTY. That'd be real special if he won the award as a freshman because Durant is the only other player to do that. He's averaging 14.4 PPG on 66% shooting. That's really good for a freshman big. DeMarcus Cousins had ready made NBA post up offensive skills and was a solid shooter and he only averaged 15 PPG on 60% shooting.

Davis can shoot too. He shoots FTs well and he started taking threes recent and hit a couple. I think his offensive upside is a lot higher than people originally thought. Scoring from freshman bigs isn't always the most important indicator for future NBA potential. Look at Michael Beasley, he could fill it up and had a ton of offensive moves and variety of ways to score. But he was never able to translate that complete dominance to the next level for whatever reason.

About the Oden/leg thing, I read that had never been officially confirmed. If true, and Portland knew about that information beforehand, you have to figure their team doctors cleared him. Plus he was (supposedly) young and still growing, it's an issue he probably could have either grown out of, or worn special shoes to even out his stature. Plus I think the leg issue was more of a potential problem for his hips than his knees, and it's a knee injury that has been his downfall.

[Samuels]

He's more than just a shot blocker and finisher. He or Robinson have got to be the favorites to win POTY. That'd be real special if he won the award as a freshman because Durant is the only other player to do that. He's averaging 14.4 PPG on 66% shooting. That's really good for a freshman big. DeMarcus Cousins had ready made NBA post up offensive skills and was a solid shooter and he only averaged 15 PPG on 60% shooting.

Davis can shoot too. He shoots FTs well and he started taking threes recent and hit a couple. I think his offensive upside is a lot higher than people originally thought. Scoring from freshman bigs isn't always the most important indicator for future NBA potential. Look at Michael Beasley, he could fill it up and had a ton of offensive moves and variety of ways to score. But he was never able to translate that complete dominance to the next level for whatever reason.

About the Oden/leg thing, I read that had never been officially confirmed. If true, and Portland knew about that information beforehand, you have to figure their team doctors cleared him. Plus he was (supposedly) young and still growing, it's an issue he probably could have either grown out of, or worn special shoes to even out his stature. Plus I think the leg issue was more of a potential problem for his hips than his knees, and it's a knee injury that has been his downfall.

Watching Beasley in college he was such a monster on the glass. Don't know what happened to him there I figured he would rebound like crazy. I hope Robinson has legit size i've read reports that he was 6-8 in shoes so probably 6-6.5 without.

Edited March 7, 2012 by Samuels

[Gator Bait]

He is 18 years old. Davis has absurd upside at PF. The guy is'nt asked to shoot jumpers regulary at Kentucky. If you watch his HS videos you will see him beating guys off the dribble,Hitting long jumpers etc. The guy is a freak athletically with a brain and understanding of the game. I can't count how many times he has blocked a shot or stole a pass and went coast to coast.

in sports, "upside" = not that good (yet)...sometimes yet turns into a good player, sometimes it doesn't.

as far as citing his high school play....go look at Perry Jone's high school highlights. He was a "lock" to be #1 overall and he was going to be the "next KG".....so what happened?

75% of division IA basketball players have amazing high school highlight tapes.....means absolutely nothing.

This guy has now played a full season of college basketball and shown very little potential to have an NBA offensive game.

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

I was actually watching Dwight Howard high school vids today at work. Guess what he was doing in them? Going coast to coast with the ball, actually blowing by people and then slamming it home.

These kids these days play hundreds of high school and AAU games--many of them taped. A 3 min video of someone knocking down a few jumpers doesn't do much for me.

Just sayin'

[Gator Bait]

He's more than just a shot blocker and finisher. He or Robinson have got to be the favorites to win POTY.

he has undoubtedly put together a very impressive defensive resume in college basketball. Doesn't mean his game will translate to the pros.

BTW....past Naismith College player of the year recipients:

Jimmer Fredette - jury is still out, but he will likely never be more than a role player in the nba

Evan Turner - still not starting in his second nba season

Blake Griffin - Stud

Tyler Hansbrough - career role player

Kevin Durant - Stud

JJ Redick- career role player (gonna throw Adam Morrison's name in here too since he was in the running...major bust)

Andrew Bogut - slightly above average nba starting center

TJ Ford - bust

Jameer Nelson - not very good

Shane Battier - career role player

so out of the last 10 player of the year award winners....only two went on to be stars.

That'd be real special if he won the award as a freshman because Durant is the only other player to do that. He's averaging 14.4 PPG on 66% dunking

I fixed it for ya. Anthony Davis is an athletic 7 footer playing against a bunch of guys that will likely never sniff the league. When he gets to the NBA everyone is going to be big and athletic and most of them skilled. Just look at Reggie Bush...he made everyone in college football look silly with his speed and quickness....then he got to the NFL and everyone was fast...he suddenly wasn't so great anymore.

Anthony Davis is very underwhelming considering his "skill set", size, and athleticism. He doesn't dominate like Blake or KD did.

That's really good for a freshman big. DeMarcus Cousins had ready made NBA post up offensive skills and was a solid shooter and he only averaged 15 PPG on 60% shooting.

have you watched DeMarcus Cousins play????? He is Andray Blache.....terrible shot selection, shot jacker, terrible shooting percentage in the NBA. He is the perfect example of addition by subtraction. If he wasn't on the Kings, they'd be a better team.

Davis can shoot too. He shoots FTs well and he started taking threes recent and hit a couple. I think his offensive upside is a lot higher than people originally thought. Scoring from freshman bigs isn't always the most important indicator for future NBA potential. Look at Michael Beasley, he could fill it up and had a ton of offensive moves and variety of ways to score. But he was never able to translate that complete dominance to the next level for whatever reason.

the reason Beasley hasn't been successful is because A) he is crazy, and he doesn't have an NBA position...he is caught in 3/4 no man's land...manly the first reason though.

and you are right...Davis has hit a couple 3's.....out of 12, so he is a 16% 3pt shooter. I will give you the FT argument....it is impressive for a college big to shoot 70% from the line.

About the Oden/leg thing, I read that had never been officially confirmed. If true, and Portland knew about that information beforehand, you have to figure their team doctors cleared him. Plus he was (supposedly) young and still growing, it's an issue he probably could have either grown out of, or worn special shoes to even out his stature. Plus I think the leg issue was more of a potential problem for his hips than his knees, and it's a knee injury that has been his downfall.

where there is smoke there is fire....no one would make up that he had one leg longer than the other. You don't have to believe it, but the rest of the basketball community does. Not to mention, Oden had no nba offensive game as well. KD was an absolute stud...averaging over 35 ppg, 11 reb, 47% from the field, 40% from 3....athletic and was a 6'10 2 guard....who wouldn't want that.

[Destino]

A few things. Davis' ft% (.713) is used to show he can shoot. Joakim Noah has a ft% of .748, anyone want to tell me he's a shooter? Also shooting in high school doesn't mean a damn thing because the issue is creating a shot not simply hitting one. I don't see much creation from AD in college and the pros are stronger better defenders.

His upside is huge but to reach it...

- he has to develop a strong core and base. Ask McGee if that's easy for lanky guys. KG and Bosh we're strong noodles coming into the league, both were natural scorers as well.

- he has to create his own shots and hit them at over 50%. Considering he has no post game right now that's going to take time.

I'm not saying he's not going to be good but the obstacles he needs to overcome to be great are substantial.

Edited March 7, 2012 by Destino

[SuperBash]

Kobe and the Lakers having a rough night losing in Detroit. Could mean bad bad news for the Wizards. Maybe I should go to this game. Only game I've been to this year was the OKC game.

[Going Commando]

So Davis is dunking the ball seven times a game?

He has essentially been the Durant of defense this season. I don't understand how people can watch him and not be blown away by his talent level.

The guy is just so springy, coordinated, long, and fast. He's not going to be some stiff in the NBA like Oden because he runs the floor like a guard. He's got an excellent mind for the game, and his defensive ability is amazing for such a young player. He's the best shot blocker in a generation and has some of the best hands you'll ever see on a big. He's got fantastic touch around the basket evidenced by his ridiculous shooting % and he can pull up off the dribble and shoot over guys.

Here:

Look at the total package of tools he's flashing in this freakish game. Tremendous shooting touch around the rim, a hugely efficient scorer with great feet that suggests he can develop a really nice low post scoring game + has rare finishing ability, especially in transition. Good shooting form too suggesting he can develop some range on a pull up. He's playing lockdown defense in a 20 point blow out. Unbelievable motor and awareness and hand-eye coordination.

Also, how much shot creation should a 19 year old PF/C be expected to demonstrate? How much would he have to do right away in the NBA? It's not like we have an elite passing PG or anything.

So far, MKG and Davis have been even better than Wall and Cousins were at Kentucky. The potential for these two guys is amazing.

[Gator Bait]

A few things. Davis' ft% (.713) is used to show he can shoot. Joakim Noah has a ft% of .748, anyone want to tell me he's a shooter? Also shooting in high school doesn't mean a damn thing because the issue is creating a shot not simply hitting one. I don't see much creation from AD in college and the pros are stronger better defenders.

His upside is huge but to reach it...

- he has to develop a strong core and base. Ask McGee if that's easy for lanky guys. KG and Bosh we're strong noodles coming into the league, both were natural scorers as well.

- he has to create his own shots and hit them at over 50%. Considering he has no post game right now that's going to take time.

I'm not saying he's not going to be good but the obstacles he needs to overcome to be great are substantial.

this is how I feel. People probably think that I'm saying this guy is going to be a bum in the NBA...that isn't the case. But he definitely isn't going to produce right away, isn't worth #1 overall, and is a bad fit for the Izzards

---------- Post added March-6th-2012 at 10:38 PM ----------

Steve...I'm not going to quote your last post because it is way too long. I've watched enough Kentucky games this year to know that the majority of his scoring comes form put backs and alley oops on pick and rolls that are mainly the result of poor defense and lack of players (on the other team) with the physical tools to defend him

I noticed the video you picked out is Arkansas......he isn't going to be playing Arkansas at the next level.

The SEC is a weak basketball conference and Anthony Davis hasn't even dominated that. Go look at the final years of college for dominant NBA bigs like Shaq, Malone, Duncan, Robinson etc......they all DOMINATE in all aspects of the game.

Anthony Davis is a good shot blocker......great! but that's the only aspect of the game he dominates. He has no offensive game and he is an average rebounder for his size.

Javale McGee and DeAndre Jordan are also elite shot blockers who have no offensive game.....would you spend a #1 overall on one of them?

Edited March 7, 2012 by Gator Bait

[Going Commando]

Davis is arguably the best player in NCAABB this season. He's clearly the best player in the class, by a long margin.

I'm not sure I get the thrust of the criticism about Davis. Is the argument that we shouldn't draft him if we get the first pick?

[SuperBash]

Davis has unbelievable touch on his inside offensive game.

[Gator Bait]

Davis is arguably the best player in NCAABB this season. He's clearly the best player in the class, by a long margin.

I'm not sure I get the thrust of the criticism about Davis. Is the argument that we shouldn't draft him if we get the first pick?

more so that we shouldn't draft him....but also that he is not as good as you make him out to be. This draft class (for as deep as it is) lacks any player that warrants a #1 overall pick! That's why we need to trade our pick immediately!

Offer the lottery pick and Lewis to the Pacers or Grizzlies for Granger/Gay

trade McGee for Klay Thompson OR McGee, 2013 draft pick, Crawfor for Curry

I'll take:

Wall

Curry (or Thompson)

Gay (or granger)

Anderson (FA)

Kaman/Hawes/Asik.....pick one

over

more "developing through the draft bull****"

Wall (poor ****)

Crawford (shot jacker)

Vesely (no offensive game, but I can dunk)

Booker (love him...but he better score 20ppg on this team...which he wont)

McGee ("I've got a 60 million dollar contract......and we still suck")

we need to make some damn moves....and we need to make them now!!!!! We should be players at the trade deadline.....trade this damn lottery pick and move some peaces to get some productive players in here

[Going Commando]

I wouldn't draft Jordan or McGee first overall because neither were nearly as good a player as Davis. And Davis isn't just a great shot blocker, he's one of the best the NCAA has ever seen--as a freshman.

Davis is dominating the SEC. He's the best player on the best team in the country by far, arguably one of the best teams ever based on what they did in the regular season. They were a prayer of a 3 point buzzer beater away from finishing undefeated and they blew out almost everybody. This is a team with a killer instinct and will to dominate that's truly special and Davis is the central figure and star. These guys are better than Wall, Bledsoe, Patterson, and Cousins were two years ago.

His numbers, for a freshman big, are awesome, and his talent level and potential is amazing.

There isn't anyone in this class who would come close to consideration for #1 overall over Davis. He'll be the surefire first pick in the draft.

You've said you want winners and like guys who know how to play the game, why don't you like Davis? He's brimming with these very qualities. Noah is an interesting (if somewhat a poor man's comparison) because Noah is also a born winner that's never played on bad teams. I think Davis is going to have a similar effect for whatever team ends up being lucky enough to win the lottery this year.

[Gator Bait]

you all can officially put me on the trade McGee at the deadline train. I'm not paying anyone 10 million a year on "potential" I just said it myself a few posts ago........"potential" means you aren't good.

McGee has "potential" he isn't good.

I know someone is going to chime in with his (who are you going to replace his production with) argument.

DUDE....seriously..........we ****in' suck.....we've sucked for 4 years now. Who the **** gives a **** who we replace him with.....when you replace a guy on a **** team...it doesn't matter who you replace them with. It can't get any worse, and that guy you replaced....he didn't help you win!

he's gonna get PAID next year. Not worth it. You could get a Dalembert type guy for 6/7 million a year......upgrade on defense, come close on boards, and subtract two or three stupid player per game.

there comes a point where "potential" isn't worth anything anymore. GOCOLB is dead on right........you all remember when we played the "potential" card for NY and 7 day dray? How did that turn out?

sorry guys...I just had to vent. Scotch does that to me sometimes.

[Going Commando]

Davis has unbelievable touch on his inside offensive game.

It's his hand eye coordination. It's spectacular. Among the best I've ever seen for a big.

[Gator Bait]

I wouldn't draft Jordan or McGee first overall because neither were nearly as good a player as Davis. And Davis isn't just a great shot blocker, he's one of the best the NCAA has ever seen--as a freshman.

Davis is dominating the SEC. He's the best player on the best team in the country by far, arguably one of the best teams ever based on what they did in the regular season. They were a prayer of a 3 point buzzer beater away from finishing undefeated and they blew out almost everybody. This is a team with a killer instinct and will to dominate that's truly special and Davis is the central figure and star. These guys are better than Wall, Bledsoe, Patterson, and Cousins were two years ago.

His numbers, for a freshman big, are awesome, and his talent level and potential is amazing.

There isn't anyone in this class who would come close to consideration for #1 overall over Davis. He'll be the surefire first pick in the draft.

You've said you want winners and like guys who know how to play the game, why don't you like Davis? He's brimming with these very qualities. Noah is an interesting (if somewhat a poor man's comparison) because Noah is also a born winner that's never played on bad teams. I think Davis is going to have a similar effect for whatever team ends up being lucky enough to win the lottery this year.

I'm tired of arguing...only time will tell. I think you will be sadly disappointed when this guy turns into a solid starter, but nothing special in the NBA.

BUT....I hope I'm wrong, you are right, and we draft this dude.

[Destino]

Gator McGee is good RIGHT NOW. He's never going to be great but if you look around the league you realize he's a middle of the pack center. Seraphin, Blatche, and Turiaf will never be as good as he is right now. Theyll never be middle of the pack starting centers. The reason he has to be traded is because the damage is done and he's not resigning here. He wont want to and we Ted has angry fans thathave decided hes the problem. The rumors of teams planning to target him in the offseason already exist because they know fans will go crazy if the wizards match offers merited by a middle of the pack center.

We should offer McGee and something to the TWolves for Williams. They have Love and maybe they'd be willing to part with the lesser version of him they have on the bench (though I doubt even they are that stupid). Booker and McGee for Derrick Williams. Or trade him for Wilson Chandler.

Edited March 7, 2012 by Destino

[Gator Bait]

on another note....I couldn't resist...I spent my 69th tweet (ever...I don't tweet much) telling Blatche he should change his name to Kwame Brown and told him we wouldn't booo him if he wasn't soft and lazy.

where do you all rank the following people affiliated with the wizards on your hate list:

Chris Webber, DeShawn Stevenson, Andray Blatche, Eddie Jordan, Kwame Brown, Michael Jordan, Gilbert Arenas, ( I feel like I'm missing someone)

my list:

1) MJ ( worst executive ever...thank you for drafting Kwame and trading Rip because he wouldn't pass you the ball...I hate you!)

2) Blatche (I know you were a 2nd round pick, but you are a soft, lazy, pathetic excuse for a human being)

3) Eddie Jordan (we had tons of talent, but you held them to zero accountability and didn't give a **** about defense)

4) Deshawn Stevenson ( don't taunt one of the greatest regular season basketball players ever you idiot!)

5) Webber (I'm was too young when you were getting arrested an causing trouble that caused us to ship you out....young and dumb w/ lots of money....I kind of understand)

6) Agent Zero (you gave me the best 4/5 years of basketball I ever watched....I'm not mad atcha.

---------- Post added March-6th-2012 at 11:22 PM ----------

Gator McGee is good RIGHT NOW. He's never going to be great but if you look around the league you realize he's a middle of the pack center. Seraphin, Blatche, and Turiaf will never be as good as he is right now. Theyll never be middle of the pack starting centers. The reason he has to be traded is because the damage is done and he's not resigning here. The rumors of teams planning to target him in the offseason already exist because they know fans will go crazy if the wizards match offers merited by a middle of the pack center.

We should offer McGee and something to the TWolves for Williams. They have Love and maybe they'd be willing to part with the lesser version of him they have on the bench (though I doubt even they are that stupid). Booker and McGee for Derrick Williams.

I'd run around naked and sing backstreet boys if you could pull off this trade.....but there is zero chance of it happening.

The team that would most likely try to land McGee is Golden State. And McGee is not good. He has potential, which means he sucks.

Like I said DUDE, I'M YELLING NOW, IT DOESN'T MATTER WHO WE REPLACE HIM WITH......WE ARE AN UNDER 20 WIN PER SEASON TEAM RIGHT NOW....HE ISN'T HELPING US!

[Destino]

Potential to be what? McGee is what he is. Maybe he adds half a rebound and gets to 12 ppg. He's not going to go from a somewhat awkward thin big man to Bynam. He's a middle of the pack big that gives you some offense and some defense but will never be great at either, just average to slightly bode average.

I heard on the radio the reason we don't have Derrick Williams is that they wanted wanted McGee and the pick and EG said no. Maybe they still want him?

[Gator Bait]

bode average.

I heard on the radio the reason we don't have Derrick Williams is that they wanted wanted McGee and the pick and EG said no. Maybe they still want him?

that makes me sick to my stomach....so you are telling me we could have had Derick Williams to run the pick and roll/pop w/ Wall for the next 10 years and wouldn't pull the trigger because they wanted us to include McGee and Vesely.....WTF!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Warhead36]

The only guy I really hate on that list Gator is Blatche.