The Official Washington Basketball Thread: Wizards, Mystics etc

[Going Commando]

Daryl Morrey is almost as bad of a GM as Erme.

He's not as bad as Ernie.

He did get caught with his pants down on Asik and Lin. Lin was a decision that was made for non-basketball reasons. He got caught with his pants down on Asik because he didn't expect to actually sign both Asik and Lin. After he made the offer to Lin, he wanted to back out of the offer to Asik. He could have, but it would have destroyed his reputation with agents and his bargaining power in future negotiations so it was better to take his medicine there.

But honestly, Asik has been the much better player than Lin and that deal is going to look better than Lin's just based on basketball reasons.

But the whole reason Morrey had to take those gambles on young RFA talent is because his team got stuck in basketball purgatory. They couldn't improve through the draft, weren't a FA draw, had put all of their eggs in a pie in the sky Dwight trade, and had to take wild swings in FA and hope they were signing top notch talent waiting for an opportunity to emerge. Now Houston is capped out at mediocre and going nowhere for at least the next two years.

But honestly, taking a shot on a player like Asik isn't the worst thing in the world. Not as bad as some of the doozies EG has pulled. These late blooming foreign players like him and Marcin Gortat and Goran Dragic are actually pretty good.

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

He's not as bad as Ernie.

He did get caught with his pants down on Asik and Lin. Lin was a decision that was made for non-basketball reasons. He got caught with his pants down on Asik because he didn't expect to actually sign both Asik and Lin. After he made the offer to Lin, he wanted to back out of the offer to Asik. He could have, but it would have destroyed his reputation with agents and his bargaining power in future negotiations so it was better to take his medicine there.

But honestly, Asik has been the much better player than Lin and that deal is going to look better than Lin's just based on basketball reasons.

But the whole reason Morrey had to take those gambles on young RFA talent is because his team got stuck in basketball purgatory. They couldn't improve through the draft, weren't a FA draw, had put all of their eggs in a pie in the sky Dwight trade, and had to take wild swings in FA and hope they were signing top notch talent waiting for an opportunity to emerge. Now Houston is capped out at mediocre and going nowhere for at least the next two years.

But honestly, taking a shot on a player like Asik isn't the worst thing in the world. Not as bad as some of the doozies EG has pulled. These late blooming foreign players like him and Marcin Gortat and Goran Dragic are actually pretty good.

They gave up Dragic and Lowry for Lin. End of story.

And it isnt even this summer's bad signings, he has years of clear mess ups. The media loves him tho because he is open and he tries to build teams through advanced stats. He is a bottom rung GM to me. Not near Ernie, but still bottom rung.

He is the reason they are in basketball purgatory also. Shoulda blown the team up after Yao got Javale'd.

and this, lol

Edited December 13, 2012 by AsiaticSkinsFan

[SuperBash]

[Going Commando]

Wall and Harden could have been the best back court in the NBA.

Houston's big problem is the lack of a second scorer and a point guard who shouldnt be starting for them but has a big FA contract so he has to start.

Best back court in the NBA doesn't mean that'd make a big impact. What other good back courts are there?

They wouldn't even be close to the best tandem of stars in the NBA. Harden is a second line All Star, Wall isn't close to that level.

Harden is never going to be a franchise player with his level of athleticism. Nene is what he is and he's not an All Star big man. So the only X factor is Wall. The only way we could get over the hump and be an actual contender with that construction is if Wall made a mega leap and became a Superstar franchise player. I no longer think that's going to happen with Wall.

And make no mistake, we would absolutely have to sign Wall to a big deal and hit luxury tax on those three players because we would no longer have the flexibility or draft picks to get anyone better than him. That would be our construction we'd take our shot with.

I think all trading for Harden would have accomplished is we'd look better in a bunch of losses and get to juts under .500 while Nene and Wall spend a lot of time watching him play from the sidelines. Maybe in the rare healthy season we'd get close to 50 wins and maybe a mid to late seed and eke out a fun first or second round loss.

I believe that would be perfectly fine for a lot of our fans.

[StillUnknown]

ref blocking free throw gif

seems like something that would happen in a Wizards game

Edited December 13, 2012 by StillUnknown

[G.A.C.O.L.B.]

You all see Amir Johnson getting tossed a couple nights ago? What a ****ing headcase. Did he explain what that was all about?

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

Best back court in the NBA doesn't mean that'd make a big impact. What other good back courts are there?

are you serious?

this is a guard's league. If you have a good back court you will win more than not. 2 guys that can create for themselves and others and get to the free throw line? That is a 50 win team for the first time since 78 for this franchise.

They wouldn't even be close to the best tandem of stars in the NBA. Harden is a second line All Star, Wall isn't close to that level.

Harden is never going to be a franchise player with his level of athleticism. Nene is what he is and he's not an All Star big man. So the only X factor is Wall. The only way we could get over the hump and be an actual contender with that construction is if Wall made a mega leap and became a Superstar franchise player. I no longer think that's going to happen with Wall.

And make no mistake, we would absolutely have to sign Wall to a big deal and hit luxury tax on those three players because we would no longer have the flexibility or draft picks to get anyone better than him. That would be our construction we'd take our shot with.

I think all trading for Harden would have accomplished is we'd look better in a bunch of losses and get to juts under .500 while Nene and Wall spend a lot of time watching him play from the sidelines. Maybe in the rare healthy season we'd get close to 50 wins and maybe a mid to late seed and eke out a fun first or second round loss.

I believe that would be perfectly fine for a lot of our fans.

so you dont think Wall is going to be a franchise player?

[Going Commando]

They gave up Dragic and Lowry for Lin. End of story.

And it isnt even this summer's bad signings, he has years of clear mess ups. The media loves him tho because he is open and he tries to build teams through advanced stats. He is a bottom rung GM to me. Not near Ernie, but still bottom rung.

He is the reason they are in basketball purgatory also. Shoulda blown the team up after Yao got Javale'd.

and this, lol

Yeah Morrey is no great shakes. He put that team in purgatory. The decision to go with Lin over Lowery and Dragic was totally indefensible even at the time--for basketball reasons. But Houston made a choice to go with Lin based on the truck loads of money he could make their franchise. Being as that was the goal, it's probably going to work.

[SuperBash]

Someone on another site summed up Jan perfectly,

"He's a byproduct of a organization trying to build around John Wall's strengths. He's can run and jump as well as any other 7-footer and is exciting in transition. But he can't do much else. Waste of a pick."

Simple, yet says it all

Edited December 13, 2012 by SuperBash

[Going Commando]

are you serious?

this is a guard's league. If you have a good back court you will win more than not. 2 guys that can create for themselves and others and get to the free throw line? That is a 50 win team for the first time since 78 for this franchise.

What other team has been built around a PG and a SG?

Brooklyn is all I can think of, and they aren't that good.

so you dont think Wall is going to be a franchise player?

Not any more. I think he would have shown some definite signs by now.

[Skin'emAlive]

Im confused. If what we are doing right now is not working. And we are pretty much capped out now. And this will last for atleast 2 years. How could Harden not have helped more than what we have? If anything, a Wall, Harden, and Crawford backcourt would have been a GREAT starting point for this organization. Players would come to this team to play with that upside.

And for the record. I am still pissed about us trading Mcgee for Nene. I called it as a bad trade a long time ago, and i still call it now. Seraphin might be able to score in the post. But he cant rebound, cant dribble, and has terrible outlet passing. I would have much rather had a Seraphin Mcgee combo than a Nene Seraphin combo.

Edited December 13, 2012 by Skin'emAlive

[Destino]

Trading for Harden would have served as decreasing our risk with Wall. If he isn't a star he's trade bait in a league hungry for point guards. If he's a star you can keep both or move one for a lot of good pieces or a star that doesn't fit somewhere else. Stars run the NBA and Harden us better than any wizard since a healthy Arenas. Not getting him was a franchise crushing disaster. It will cost Ted any and all patience that fans had for him.

Harden is not the athlete Wade is but Wade can't shoot for ****. He's had a lot of help in Miami, Harden has.... J Lin.

This all boils down to Okariza. Ted didnt want to pay the luxury tax which was only an issue because of the insanely stupid Okafor and Ariza trade. The wizards could be winning and have a bright future but instead they are the worst ****ing team in the NBA in a year where the draft is a steaming like of **** because we decided to take the Pelicans trash off their hands and got nothing in return.

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

What other team has been built around a PG and a SG?

Brooklyn is all I can think of, and they aren't that good.

Brooklyn also have a good big man in Lopez.

Their problem is Joe Johnson isnt that good anymore. Different to Harden.

Not any more. I think he would have shown some definite signs by now.

this is based on the terrible games he played this season?

[Hersh]

this is based on the terrible games he played this season?

I don't think he will be a superstar because I don't trust guys in the NBA coming back from serious knee injuries. Particularly when your biggest asset is your athleticism.

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

I don't think he will be a superstar because I don't trust guys in the NBA coming back from serious knee injuries. Particularly when your biggest asset is your athleticism.

he has a stress fracture, no? Its one thing if he has ligament damage, but Wall basically has a broken bone.

If it were something else I would be concerned, but not a stress fracture.

Edited December 13, 2012 by AsiaticSkinsFan

[StillUnknown]

Trading for Harden would have served as decreasing our risk with Wall. If he isn't a star he's trade bait in a league hungry for point guards. If he's a star you can keep both or move one for a lot of good pieces or a star that doesn't fit somewhere else. Stars run the NBA and Harden us better than any wizard since a healthy Arenas. Not getting him was a franchise crushing disaster. It will cost Ted any and all patience that fans had for him.

Harden is not the athlete Wade is but Wade can't shoot for ****. He's had a lot of help in Miami, Harden has.... J Lin.

This all boils down to Okariza. Ted didnt want to pay the luxury tax which was only an issue because of the insanely stupid Okafor and Ariza trade. The wizards could be winning and have a bright future but instead they are the worst ****ing team in the NBA in a year where the draft is a steaming like of **** because we decided to take the Pelicans trash off their hands and got nothing in return.

Okafor/Ariza is going to replace Foye/Miller in Wizards lure. Remarkable that the guy who executed the first was still around to see the second.

[Destino]

he has a stress fracture, no? Its one thing if he has ligament damage, but Wall basically has a broken bone.

If it were something else I would be concerned, but not a stress fracture.

In a day and he where athletes heal faster and from serious injuries.... Wall is behind schedule from something that was described as not terribly serious. That's alarming.

---------- Post added December-12th-2012 at 11:38 PM ----------

Okafor/Ariza is going to replace Foye/Miller in Wizards lure. Remarkable that the guy who executed the first was still around to see the second.

It already has. I'd trade them both for an expiring contract... Oh wait.

[Going Commando]

Brooklyn also have a good big man in Lopez.

Their problem is Joe Johnson isnt that good anymore. Different to Harden.

Yeah Johnson isn't that good any more. Brook Lopez is also a very flawed player to be getting the contract he got. I think going for a PG-SG construction is a flawed approach though. You need a really good front court player. They locked up all their flexibility in their starting guards.

Players 4-8 on that team are actually pretty good though all things considered. They should be better than they have been so far.

this is based on the terrible games he played this season? http://www.the-coli.com/images/smilies/A1Bny.png

Based on the fact we'll probably still be wondering about him going into his fourth season. That shouldn't be the case for a true franchise PG. He's gotten big minutes since day one.

Wall's winning percentage his two years was .291

By contrast, Rose's was .500, CP3's was .470, and DWill's was .561.

Winning matters IMO.

You can make excuses for Wall based on a lockout year, injuries, organizational support, etc. They are all good reasons contributing to a player failing.

The fact of the matter is Wall has failed thus far. He's not getting it done. If he was a franchise player, the franchise would be heading in the right direction and showing some sort of progress. We've actually gotten worse each year since we drafted him. If he was going to be a franchise PG like these other PGs, we should have seen some significant uptick in our wins just from adding him alone.

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

In a day and he where athletes heal faster and from serious injuries.... Wall is behind schedule from something that was described as not terribly serious. That's alarming

its a broken bone. Idk what the deal is, but its a broken bone. Not any ligament, tendon, or joint damage. Once it heals, he will still have the same explosion.

IMO, I think the Wizards staff misdiagnosed the injury.

Yeah Johnson isn't that good any more. Brook Lopez is also a very flawed player to be getting the contract he got. I think going for a PG-SG construction is a flawed approach though. You need a really good front court player. They locked up all their flexibility in their starting guards.

Players 4-8 on that team are actually pretty good though all things considered. They should be better than they have been so far.

im not defending Johnson, but thats a big reason for their troubles. And Harden is a much better player than Johnson and his contract is nowhere near as bad. Its just not an apt comparison.

Based on the fact we'll probably still be wondering about him going into his fourth season. That shouldn't be the case for a true franchise PG. He's gotten big minutes since day one.

Wall's winning percentage his two years was .291

By contrast, Rose's was .500, CP3's was .470, and DWill's was .561.

Winning matters IMO.

You can make excuses for Wall based on a lockout year, injuries, organizational support, etc. They are all good reasons contributing to a player failing.

The fact of the matter is Wall has failed thus far. He's not getting it done. If he was a franchise player, the franchise would be heading in the right direction and showing some sort of progress. We've actually gotten worse each year since we drafted him. If he was going to be a franchise PG like these other PGs, we should have seen some significant uptick in our wins just from adding him alone.

This is hilarious. 3 weeks ago you were saying Wall will make the jump this season and be that player and you believed it. IN those 3 weeks Wall hasnt played a game due to the injury, and you have written him off. This is ridiculous.

[Hersh]

he has a stress fracture, no? Its one thing if he has ligament damage, but Wall basically has a broken bone.

If it were something else I would be concerned, but not a stress fracture.

All they call this is a "stress injury" which means, according to the initial reports, that it's an injury that could lead to a fractured patella from training too much. It's not even a fracture at this point. The fact that this has happened already, at age 22, and it's not healing so he can't jump let alone practice at all. This screams reoccurring injury to me.

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

All they call this is a "stress injury" which means, according to the initial reports, that it's an injury that could lead to a fractured patella from training too much. It's not even a fracture at this point. The fact that this has happened already, at age 22, and it's not healing so he can't jump let alone practice at all. This screams reoccurring injury to me.

idk, I wouldnt be too concerned over it messing with his athleticism.

[Destino]

its a broken bone. Idk what the deal is, but its a broken bone. Not any ligament, tendon, or joint damage. Once it heals, he will still have the same explosion.

IMO, I think the Wizards staff misdiagnosed the injury.

How many broken bones have you heard of that inexplicably took a month longer to heal than expected... When top doctors and tech is consulted? I'm just saying that it seems strange.

[AsiaticSkinsFan]

How many broken bones have you heard of that inexplicably took a month longer to heal than expected... When top doctors and tech is consulted? I'm just saying that it seems strange.

dont stress fractures take 3 months to heal tho?

and with this franchise, nothing is strange to me

[nfl guru]

I hate Ernie Grunfeld so, so much...

Watching commercials of Ricky Rubio and seeing Harden do what he does and knowing the Wiz should have both of these players on there team is mind blowing. What an idiot.

The NBA rewards bad teams. The wizards had the 5th pick in 09, 1st pick in 2010, 6th in 2011, 3rd recently. Watching them waste assets like these makes me salty, we shouldve have already completed the rebuild by now yet we have nothing to show for it

---------- Post added December-13th-2012 at 01:01 AM ----------

The fact of the matter is Wall has failed thus far. He's not getting it done. If he was a franchise player, the franchise would be heading in the right direction and showing some sort of progress. We've actually gotten worse each year since we drafted him. If he was going to be a franchise PG like these other PGs, we should have seen some significant uptick in our wins just from adding him alone.

This post is laughable. Wall needs shooters and guys who finish,around him yet the front office has switched out every position for as long as hes been here with no sense of consistency

[Going Commando]

This is hilarious. 3 weeks ago you were saying Wall will make the jump this season and be that player and you believed it. IN those 3 weeks Wall hasnt played a game due to the injury, and you have written him off. This is ridiculous.

Was I? I don't think I was. I don't really know what defense I could have mounted that he is a franchise player.

Wall's not a bust. I defended him against the claim he was. He's a transcendent athlete with a great raw skill set that set an Oscar/Magic pace the first weeks of his career. He's just nowhere close to being a franchise player.

Why do you think he'll become one?

---------- Post added December-13th-2012 at 07:08 AM ----------

This post is laughable. Wall needs shooters and guys who finish,around him yet the front office has switched out every position for as long as hes been here with no sense of consistency

Wall needs to improve himself, make the guys around him better, and elevate his team like the other great PGs do. Those are things a franchise player just does.