Governmetnt Will Be Tracking B.M.I. by 2014

[Teller]

IF ( and that's a big if) they offer me a $500 credit to drop 20 lbs and I can do so by changing some habits and minimizing chips and Fritos and Breyers mint chocolate chip..:drool:

Hell yeah, I just might. Wouldn't you?

~Bang

Sure. Like you (though I'm WAY behind you) I'm already working on it.

And sorry if I don't buy the tax credit bit. I was supposed to get half of the tax credit for paying my child support too, but that was one of the first campaign promises Obama nixed.

[Bang]

Sure. Like you (though I'm WAY behind you) I'm already working on it.

And sorry if I don't buy the tax credit bit. I was supposed to get half of the tax credit for paying my child support too, but that was one of the first campaign promises Obama nixed.

Well, sure, I'm not saying they will do a credit,, I just made that up myself.

I just think if they do anything tax based that will be the way they (promise) to go. I don't think they'd directly tax or force people to lose weight.

As has been presented by numerous people, there's too many facets and pandora's box is WAY too big to open by trying to regulate this stuff on a fed level.

~Bang

[Chicken Fried]

Good they should. People in this country are becoming fat asses.

So you want the feds to unnecessarily interfere in our daily lives even more than they already do? I don't understand why. If people want to eat themselves to death, that's their problem. The government cannot tell you to lose weight. The more we approve of these small, seemingly unimportant concessions, the more the feds keep chipping away at individual freedom. It's ironic that just the other day I posted that I don't care if you eat pesticide-treated crops or organic as long as the government doesn't tell us what to do. There you have it.

[Ryman of the North]

It's not about going after anyone, it's about trying to get a hold of a health issue.

And besides, no one is targeting anyone for anything. they've added something to yours and my and everyone's medical chart. If you had high blood pressure, do you think they can force you to stop eating salt?

Besides, most of us are overweight, and most of us can do something about it. I know I can. I play a lot of tennis, but i still can't get down to where I'd really like to be because I like beer, I like ice cream, and salty snacks know my name and whisper to me. I'm not within my BMI by a longshot. (and frankly, haven't been since I was 16.. even in the best shape of my life in the military I was up to 25 lbs heavier than the BMI, with very low body fat.)

Like I said earlier on, the most likely thing they may do with any sort of tax would be to offer incentives like a tax credit to persuade people to try to lose some weight. But they won't force you, and they won't tax you directly. Incentive based on reward rather than punishment is what they'd do, IF they do anything at all.

By the sound of the article, it's just an advisement to the med community to make the BMI standard on your medical records. Considering the potential health risks that come with it, it could be valuable information in an emergency. I'm pretty sure it makes a big difference in anesthesia, and you may not be conscious to tell them anything when they need to know.

IF ( and that's a big if) they offer me a $500 credit to drop 20 lbs and I can do so by changing some habits and minimizing chips and Fritos and Breyers mint chocolate chip..:drool:

Hell yeah, I just might. Wouldn't you?

~Bang

MY dad and I were arguing about this a few days ago, he thinks that because I play football my healthcare premiums should be higher, I countered that he smoked and somehow he didnt feel that his smoking was as high risk as my playing ball to stay somewhat in shape. It doesnt matter, there will always be high risk groups. I dont think that because you play tennis you should be penalised for sprained ankles lol but then really really fat people should not be included in with people trying to stay healthy lol.

[PeterMP]

And what about diseases that are far more prevalent in certain ethnic groups? Don't we need a list of those people too?

Out comes, like disease, will be part of the system as well as race.

Other things like salt and sugar are expensive to track in a good way, except for self-reporting, which is likely to be non-robust (i.e. contain lot's of errors).

BMI is a cheap (in terms of equipment and man power), robust (even more robust than thinks like hip to wait ratios, which tend to have more variation based on who took them), extremely safe indicator to determine of several health out comes.

[PeterMP]

Thanks.

Is it a secret that obesity is bad? Or that there are specific health risks linked to it? Again, I may well be proven wrong. In fact, I hope I am. But this doesn't pass the smell test, IMHO.

EXCEPT obesity isn't always bad.

There is something called the obesity paradox as described in the link I included in my other post.

[No Excuses]

I really don't understand what the big fuss is. BMI is not a tell all stat, it is just a helpful tool that is used to quite often in the medical industry. Easy to calculate, easy to record. Can be used to give and explain certain things to patients that otherwise would be hard to.

I don't see where the government is trying to tell people what to do or what not to do. I mean if they have your height and weight, they already have your BMI. So what's the big deal?

[PeterMP]

No, we don't.

What is the health outcome, for every smoker?

What's the person DNA sequence, when did they start smoking, how long did they smoke, how much did they smoke every day, what did they smoke?

[Bang]

MY dad and I were arguing about this a few days ago, he thinks that because I play football my healthcare premiums should be higher, I countered that he smoked and somehow he didnt feel that his smoking was as high risk as my playing ball to stay somewhat in shape. It doesnt matter, there will always be high risk groups. I dont think that because you play tennis you should be penalised for sprained ankles lol but then really really fat people should not be included in with people trying to stay healthy lol.

Exactly what I was saying when i say that trying to "go after" fat folks opens up too many cans of worms. I think it's simply information on your med chart,, info that's not terribly secret to begin with.

~Bang

[Ax]

What's the person DNA sequence, when did they start smoking, how long did they smoke, how much did they smoke every day, what did they smoke?

Oh, you mean the out comes of smoking aren't the same for everyone?

Agreed.

[Bang]

Oh, you mean the out comes of smoking aren't the same for everyone?

Agreed.

The outcomes of shark attacks aren't always the same either.

~Bang

[Ax]

The outcomes of shark attacks aren't always the same either.

~Bang

Very good!

And what of removing ones head with a Samurai sword?

[Prosperity]

Very good!

And what of removing ones head with a Samurai sword?

sometimes the guy misses

[Ax]

sometimes the guy misses

No, that would be an attempted/botched removal.

[Prosperity]

No, that would be an attempted/botched removal.

so what's the effect of having one's lungs overtaken by massive tumor?

smoking is analogous to pissing off a Samurai in feudal Japan. Maybe he'd forgive you, maybe you would run away, maybe you would take out a gun and shoot him... or maybe you'd have your head chopped off

it's all risk

[PokerPacker]

BMI is terrible. I'm considered to be "small". I don't have an ounce of fat on my body, yet were I to gain 5 pounds, I'd be overweight according to BMI.

That aside, get the **** out of my personal business, Uncle Sam!

[Thiebear]

Every smoker will die mind you, that's also the health outcome for every living organism, but it's still the longterm health outcome for smokers

So were back to the:

50$ a month extra if you fall in the fatmcfatass in the BMI

50$ a month extra for 1 year if obese, but dropped if not making progress

50$ a month extra for smokers

50$ a month extra for drug takers

50$ a month extra for extreme sports

50$ a month extra for history of heart/cancer in the family

50$ a month extra for 3+ accidents

so dont be a clumsy smoking, drinking 5'0 135pd women with a heart history and like mountain climbing at Great Falls after practicing at sport rock for a week....

[Darth Tater]

Anyone who supported health care reform (ALL the plans presented before congress) should have no problem with this.

[Stew]

I think its a good thing. Its being done with health and healthcare in mind, not to be mean and punish the overweight. Im all for it.

[Stew]

so what's the effect of having one's lungs overtaken by massive tumor?

smoking is analogous to pissing off a Samurai in feudal Japan. Maybe he'd forgive you, maybe you would run away, maybe you would take out a gun and shoot him... or maybe you'd have your head chopped off

it's all risk

I lol'd:ols:

[Destino]

Anyone who supported health care reform (ALL the plans presented before congress) should have no problem with this.

What is the problem here? We want health care to tackle the challenges of tomorrow but we don't want them to have access to the information they need to make any progress.

The nation has an obesity rate estimated at 25%. That's a disaster waiting to happen. The bad eating habits are being passed on to younger generations and the problem is getting worse. Obesity in children which was around 5% has increased to nearly 20%. Are we going to get the same lame ass excuses that BMI is off because kids are just so damn muscular?

Frankly I don't believe that people just got fat all of the sudden. Something in the US diet is causing an abnormality and it's time to look closer at it. I don't think people realize how fast this **** is growing.

Percent of Obese (BMI > 30) in U.S. Adults

Even if you think the BMI chart is absurd the trends are clear (as shown above). There is no reason to think the growth of this problem is going to just stop. Look at the above and tell me what you think 2018 will look like. The time to take this problem seriously as a nation was 10 years ago. Taking action now isn't just reasonable, it's absolutely necessary.

The question I have is why isn't the rest of the world growing at the same rate. I find it extremely hard to believe that only the US has gotten lazy and eat too much. What else has changed in our diet? Is there any additive or anything odd that happened around the time these rates spiked that are contributing and somewhat unique to the US?

[Teller]

This is just my opinion, Des, but I find it to be more expensive to eat healthy. Looking at your maps, it appears as though the states with the highest obesity rates are also some of the poorest.

Since I've recommitted myself to losing weight, I've noticed that I'm spending more money to eat healthy. Heck, if I had my way, I'd be eating tons of seafood, but I can't afford to. Seafood, generally, is high in protein, and low in fat and calories (if you avoid heavy butter, etc.)

Meanwhile, you can go to Mickey D's and get a meal that you don't have to prepare for about three bucks. (McDouble, small fries, small coke.) It's also about 900 calories, give or take. Not to mention the fat and "empty" calories in the soda.

When you're eating healthy, you have to spend more money, whether it be for lean chicken, fish, ingredients for a good salad, etc. Or you can buy Lean Cuisine or Smart Ones meals, which tend to be pretty darn expensive themselves.

It seems contrary to logic, but I think poverty contributes to obesity here. It's cheaper to eat garbage than it is to eat healthy, unfortunately.

[Destino]

This is just my opinion, Des, but I find it to be more expensive to eat healthy. Looking at your maps, it appears as though the states with the highest obesity rates are also some of the poorest.

Since I've recommitted myself to losing weight, I've noticed that I'm spending more money to eat healthy. Heck, if I had my way, I'd be eating tons of seafood, but I can't afford to. Seafood, generally, is high in protein, and low in fat and calories (if you avoid heavy butter, etc.)

Meanwhile, you can go to Mickey D's and get a meal that you don't have to prepare for about three bucks. (McDouble, small fries, small coke.) It's also about 900 calories, give or take. Not to mention the fat and "empty" calories in the soda.

When you're eating healthy, you have to spend more money, whether it be for lean chicken, fish, ingredients for a good salad, etc. Or you can buy Lean Cuisine or Smart Ones meals, which tend to be pretty darn expensive themselves.

It seems contrary to logic, but I think poverty contributes to obesity here. It's cheaper to eat garbage than it is to eat healthy, unfortunately.

You're right man. Eating right is more expensive, requires more thought, and far more time. In order to keep the costs down and succeed you have to plan everything in advance and go to the store more often than anyone wants to.

- Lean proteins are more expensive than the cheap stuff in most instance.

- Vegetables don't stay fresh as long and depending on your taste aren't as cheap.

- fruit doesn't stay fresh as long. depending on your taste may not be cheap at all.

- Hello spice rack... with no cheese mayo and ketchup to save the day your spice rack will explode with flavor (and cost). I've started buying the bulk sizes now because those little bottles at giant last about a week and a half.

- no cheap carbs to keep the costs down.

- Want to eat healthy? Bring your own lunch... if you eat healthy out you're going to pay a hell of a lot more than you do at mcdonalds and odds are good it won't be nearly as healthy as you think it is. lol

I could go on and on.

[PokerPacker]

I wonder how much of this could be related to TV dinners and other prepared meals versus home-cooking with fresh ingredients.

[Teller]

I wonder how much of this could be related to TV dinners and other prepared meals versus home-cooking with fresh ingredients.

Yeah, I'm sure the hectic pace of our lives, and our kids lives is a factor. Not to mention the fact that in most families, both parents have to work to pay the bills. So both get home, both are tired, and neither wants to make a nice dinner for the family.

Again, it's swing by Mickey D's, or the pre-packaged meals you mentioned.