The argument for drafting QB at the #4 pick

[dreamboater]

This argument will continue until draft day. I still think Bradford has a higher ceiling but also higher risk due to the unknown. Can he escape pressure, read a defense, throw the deep out in the NFL. I think Bradford is our guy.

[dreamboater]

Sometimes I laugh at the whole weak arm argument. Every NFL QB can throw a 60 yard pass. Now Russell and Cutler may throw a rope when others can not however timing and intelligence are so important here. Brady had a weak arm coming out of college but has incredible timing. His deep balls to Moss look pretty good to me

[hieverybody]

Sometimes I laugh at the whole weak arm argument. Every NFL QB can throw a 60 yard pass. Now Russell and Cutler may throw a rope when others can not however timing and intelligence are so important here. Brady had a weak arm coming out of college but has incredible timing. His deep balls to Moss look pretty good to me

Matt Hasslebeck has always had a weak arm, but made up for it with smarts. But now, with age, his arm is even worse and he can't complete a throw. There's definitely a minimum requirement for arm strength.

[redskin301]

:doh:

Read my edit and get back to me.

How the hell is JC not a bust? He hasn't done anything to prove he is not!!!

This whole thread is abouth getting a new QB so how is jcam not a bust:silly:

[RBClintonPortis]

lou4gehrig that was an awesome analysis. Just awesome and I know folks can quibble on the edges on who is a bust vs. a solid etc.... still the over all the concepts and stats are really, really good.

I disagree here though

What other path do we have to get a chance at Superbowl QB than rolling than the dice on somebody new?

I don't think you can force it and I would submit, really your analysis shows that - the NFL can now by and large with some accuracy "tell" who can play QB at the next level.

So, in the Redskins situation, If the guy is there you take him, you have to. If he's not though, we don't "roll the dice" . We have to go with Campbell or Carr, Grossman, Pennington, Culpepper until we get a top 10 pick when the superbowl level QB is there.

[zCommander]

This whole thread is about getting a new QB so how is jcam not a bust:silly:

Good point. And here is the irony: He tells me in one post, "I think most of this just goes over you head anyway":hysterical:

[wysknz1]

I didn't feel like reading it all. We are not going to do it all in one year. O-Line needs to be a priority. I don't like any of the QB's this year, but I could be wrong, I'm no coach. But get a line and let them gel a year before Qb is a priority.

[mithong1]

I want a QB who can overcome a few injuries on offense. I want a QB that can win games in the 4th quarter. I want a QB who we don't need to make excuses for.

[Gregpeck99]

Here's a summary of QB's drafted in the last 10 years: ...

What other path do we have to get a chance at Superbowl QB than rolling than the dice on somebody new?

Excellent post ... clearly corroborates the obvious conclusion that Skins have no choice but to use # 4 on one of the top 2 guys.

[wildbill1952]

Not to get into another JC bashing thread, but I fail to follow the logic. If JC is not a bust, then why are we drafting another QB?

Sorry, I do not follow. If JC is not a bust, or the jury is still out, then draft supporting players (e.g. OLine). If JC's a bust, that's a prime reason to get a QB. If JC is a bust, then draft a franchise QB. (Which seems missing from this draft, but that's another thread.)

I apologize if someone else already pointed this out. Too many posts to read.

[Ricky_Ervins32]

Gehrig that is indeed a great post. If anything it demonstrates that drafting in the 1st round is dangerous. For example there are only three teams with two quarterbacks in the first round on that list.

Baltimore, Washington and Detroit.

[HRNY4ZRNY]

Pretty simple to me.

If Shanny sees a QB there that he thinks has Brady, Manning, Brees even Mcnabb potential. Than take the damn QB.

If he can wait one year get some OL and give JC a legit shot that would be my pick. Get a QB next year.

[VaBeachRedskin]

Excellent post ... clearly corroborates the obvious conclusion that Skins have no choice but to use # 4 on one of the top 2 guys.

That is how teams end up back in the top 5 in a couple years. Picking a position just to pick it when neither of the players is worth a top 20 selection. We definitely have a choice and it shouldn't be QB.

[36HAMMER]

i just don't see this because we have done this before and where did it get us?yes Schuler sucked but if there was any chance for him the lack of a line ruined it.no more putting the horse before the carriage.get the oline fixed and then get your qb.campbell will do better with a better oline i promise you.the only two guys that i would have trouble not getting because of need is Suh and Terry.theres a spot next to Albert open and we have no real safety back there.we have two mini lb's back there.we need an intimidator and a ballhawk in one to help cb's.all cb's need help and ours have none.Landry has a long way to go to be what he is capable of being.other wise either the tackle fromOklhoma st or the one from iowa.and from what i read the one from iowa maybe more to our likeing.if we take terry or drop sone slots pick up another pick and get Terry then we can work out a trade up for the tackle from Iowa and have both.it will take some keen alignments for the Skins to get all the holes filled they way they want this year.i doubt it but anything is possible.

[texasthunder]

All of that is true, but it ignores the fact that we can draft a franchise QB next year. We don't have to try to fix the whole team at once, and unfortunately we are going to need 4 new starters on the O-Line next year unless we re-sign Rabach or want to go with Thomas and Heyer again.

I completely agree that if you are going to draft a QB, you want to be the first one to choose a QB, but I'd be happier drafting one next year since I'm not convinced that this crop is very good.

While its a good thought process to draft a QB next year, after the line gets some experience, but there are some counter arguments also.

1) We may not have a draft pick as high as #4 next year, if we go 8-8, which is my best guess, we will draft around the middle of the pack. With no guarantee that a Locker, Mallett type qb will be available.

2) Then there is the possability that the qb we would target suffers an injury in his season year.

3) The offense will be learning a new scheme under the Shanahans, wouldnt there be an easier learning curve if this years drafted qb learns with this years offensive line?

Pesonally I am not in favor of drafting a QB with the #4 pick, but if Allen/Shanahan think thats the way to go, then I am all in.

[Jeff in D.C.]

For the Steelers, do you think it was just a coincidence that they went 6-10, drafted Big Ben in 04, then went 15-1 in 04, won Super Bowl 05, and won Super Bowl 08?

Actually yes it was a coincidence in 2004 & 2005, 2008 I'll give you as Ben had matured tremendously at QB and carried them with some huge throws. Some stats to keep in mind about the Steelers in 2004:

They had the #1 defense in the NFL in both yards & points, and they were the #2 rushing team in the league. They were 28th in passing that year and then keep in mind Ben played like crap in his first Super Bowl.

Now don't get me wrong, I've been on the bandwagon of needing a QB, but the OL is priority #1 and it doesn't matter who is behind center if the line is garbage. If Bruce & Shanny decide that Bradford is the pick, so be it. If they decide to pick Okung, so be it. Whatever they feel is best for the direction of the team, that's what they should do.

I completely agree that a QB is needed, but there are several ways how you can get your hands on one. It doesn't have to be with the 4th pick in the draft.

[Gregpeck99]

That is how teams end up back in the top 5 in a couple years. Picking a position just to pick it when neither of the players is worth a top 20 selection. We definitely have a choice and it shouldn't be QB.

Yea ... maybe you would be happier paying $ 40 million bucks to another "Andre Johnson" (and I don't mean the Texan).

[Jeff in D.C.]

Originally Posted by VaBeachRedskin

That is how teams end up back in the top 5 in a couple years. Picking a position just to pick it when neither of the players is worth a top 20 selection. We definitely have a choice and it shouldn't be QB.

Yea ... maybe you would be happier paying $ 40 million bucks to another "Andre Johnson" (and I don't mean the Texan).

Or Heath Shuler. The argument can go on all day as to who we should pick, but bottom line is that Bruce & Shanny have to re-vamp and re-tool the scouting department so that they can make the best, most informed decision about who to pick. Whichever player they decide on we'll know that they've done they're homework and aren't playing fantasy football like Danny & Vinny did.

[VaBeachRedskin]

Yea ... maybe you would be happier paying $ 40 million bucks to another "Andre Johnson" (and I don't mean the Texan).

I personally would have chosen Heath Shuler since he was drafted 3rd and not 30th?

My whole point is that when you have many needs you should draft the best available player that also fills a need. It makes no sense for us to pass over guys that are much better prospects than the QBs or OTs in this draft. We need to find a trading partner because we are not in the best place for our future development.

[cphil006]

I cant believe your getting all worked up about that list, let alone calling a Superbowl QB a bust. The only way were going to come to an agreement is to define a QB bust. What's yours?

spending a first round pick on a QB then trying to find a replacement within 5 years...

[hitmandm]

Picking Bradford at 4 may not be an option. If he has a good combine, we might have to trade up to 1 overall to get him. SF wants a QB, and now Carroll is in Seattle and they have 2 number 1 picks. Everyone will be going for a qb if they are any good.

[Dick Edds]

Picking Bradford at 4 may not be an option. If he has a good combine, we might have to trade up to 1 overall to get him. SF wants a QB, and now Carroll is in Seattle and they have 2 number 1 picks. Everyone will be going for a qb if they are any good.

if that is the case, then either Okung, Suh or Berry are still at there. I have been liking Bradford the more I research him. But nothing is a sure bet, at any position. If Bradford is there and we do take him than I trust Shanny sees that in him.

But i think all of these guys are top 5 picks, we could use an LT, DT or S. Take the BPA (secretly hoping its Bradford). i was not too big on him, but am more impressed by what I see and read everyday.

Feels good at least to know that we have experienced football professionals making the decision. Its gonna take time regardless of how we draft. HAIL.

[Rufus T Firefly]

Picking Bradford at 4 may not be an option. If he has a good combine, we might have to trade up to 1 overall to get him. SF wants a QB, and now Carroll is in Seattle and they have 2 number 1 picks. Everyone will be going for a qb if they are any good.

Yeah, that's a real possibility that no one is talking about.

[myzhi]

Rams are going to pick a QB #1 overall this year. They have been trying to hang with Bulger for last few years and select on other needs, but look how it turned out for them. Even if Bulger doesn't retire, they won't gamble another season. Thus, if Rams take Clausen, we get Bradford and vice versa. let's just hope they make mistake of selecting the wrong guy.

[hieverybody]

Pretty simple to me.

If Shanny sees a QB there that he thinks has Brady, Manning, Brees even Mcnabb potential. Than take the damn QB.

If he can wait one year get some OL and give JC a legit shot that would be my pick. Get a QB next year.

That's exactly what it comes down to. The only thing that gives me pause with Shanahan is his age. Would he be willing to be patient and wait for a QB next year or does he think he can turn anyone into a superstar?