All things Collective Bargaining Agreement related (Merged)

[dfbovey]

But in this instance you may as well keep your own dead wood. Picking up younger FA's' date=' who may well be restricted and off the market, would help this team more, imo.[/quote']

I think the whole point would be getting rid of overpriced players who aren't earning their contract... and then sign players as stop gaps with similar ability for a lot less.

There's going to be a flood of teams dumping players that don't fit, get paid too much or are past their prime. A few of those players will still be able to contribute. But will probably have to sign for a lot less.

For example... you could dump Portis and sign Larry Johnson next year for a lot less and get the same production.

[Oldskool]

I think the whole point would be getting rid of overpriced players who aren't earning their contract... and then sign players as stop gaps with similar ability for a lot less.

There's going to be a flood of teams dumping players that don't fit, get paid too much or are past their prime. A few of those players will still be able to contribute. But will probably have to sign for a lot less.

For example... you could dump Portis and sign Larry Johnson next year for a lot less and get the same production.

You're missing the point about young OL and tenders.

Sure there is going to be maybe one or two big name OL cut who are currently under contract simply due to the size of their contracts. However, the majority of players that are RFA's simply will have a tender attached to them like a worm on a hook waiting for a team to bite.

• $927,000 for the prior club to retain the right of first refusal (ROFR) without any draft choice compensation;

• $927,000 for ROFR or the club receives draft choice compensation equal to the draft round at which the player originally entered the league if they chose not to match an offer;

• $1,417,000 for ROFR or the club receives one second-round draft pick if the offer is not matched;

• $2,017,000 for ROFR or the club receives one first-round pick; or

• $2,562,000 for ROFR or the club receives one first round and one third-round pick

[dfbovey]

I'm not missing the point on Restricted Free Agents. I know how it works. I read up on it alot when the Redskins signed the Jets players years ago. I realize the good young players will be signed to tenders. Not all the players who will be available this offseason, will be restricted. I think more players will be cut than people anticipate.

And why would you assume that I didn't understand how restricted free agency works from what I posted anyway?

I also never made a point singling out offensive line positions being filled through free agency. You seem fixated on that like it's the only problem this team has to address. Only example I gave was running back.

[Sebowski]

I have a simple question about this thing that no one is answering.

When is the deadline to reach a new agreement? What hr of what day can we officialy say that the cap is gone for next year and all these rules will apply? Free agency starts on March 5th. I imagine the ruling has to come some time before that.

[Oldskool]

I have a simple question about this thing that no one is answering.

When is the deadline to reach a new agreement? What hr of what day can we officialy say that the cap is gone for next year and all these rules will apply? Free agency starts on March 5th. I imagine the ruling has to come some time before that.

I'm going to say my best guess is, the moment that the 2009-2010 year officially ends, be that the end of the Superbowl or the Pro Bowl.

[Est.1974]

But then we have a cap to contend with.

GO UNCAPPED so we can unload the dead weight and bring in others that the new staff may want.

I think the number of player contracts the team needs to offload is nowhere near the level what some think. The team carried $18m in 2009 dead cap against a cap of ~$127m. Thats not great by any means, but any new cap will clearly exceed the 2009 level, so I think the new FO could live with an element of dead cap in year one of their tenure. Thats would just be part of the change process.

I also think that the FO will benefit from a wider UFA pool under a new agreement. I would much rather have a younger crop of FA signings instead of what you are faced with in an uncapped year. Most guys will be fast heading toward 30 & have 6 years under their belts already. I'd rather have that option as the exception, not the rule.

You only have to listen to Bruce Allen's comments to see that, in an uncapped year, the team will have to move forward with much of what they already have 'in the locker room'.

That being siad, in either scenario, you have to deal with what is in front of you. At present, I'm swaying towards a new CBA providing greater options for the FO to improve the roster.

[capefear caveman]

Thanks to the OP for the info. I have an additional question: What is the deadline for a new CBA before the 2010 Season becomes officially "uncapped"?

I have a simple question about this thing that no one is answering.

When is the deadline to reach a new agreement? What hr of what day can we officialy say that the cap is gone for next year and all these rules will apply? Free agency starts on March 5th. I imagine the ruling has to come some time before that.

Ok, so I searched and only really found the ambiguous "in the time ahead."

I found Mark Miller on Yahoo! saying that sometime in March would be the deadline: http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/rumors/post/NFL-s-CBA-talks-going-poorly?urn=nfl,210947

And this video: http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-network-total-access/09000d5d815626e6/Impact-of-uncapped-year-in-2010 seems to imply that there is no firm deadline yet, just "in the weeks and months ahead..." and "there's several weeks left to figure this out..."

Anyone have any more information on this?

[GibbsFactor]

Per the NFL CBA found here, the CBA will enter the final league year on March 1st 2010. So it looks like the first of March is the day and I'd assume it would be March 1st 2010 at midnight.

To see the language, the preamble and then page 237 discusses the dates and the "final league year".

[DexterSackMachine]

One possibility for unforeseen free agents is the cheap teams (see: Bengals) cutting loose some players this offseason, simply because they have no minimum to live up to and they can save some money.

Could spell opportunity for the Redskins in rebuilding.

[capefear caveman]

Per the NFL CBA found here, the CBA will enter the final league year on March 1st 2010. So it looks like the first of March is the day and I'd assume it would be March 1st 2010 at midnight.

To see the language, the preamble and then page 237 discusses the dates and the "final league year".

Thanks

[Oldskool]

I think its time to bump this one again. Too many people simply don't get what not having a CBA means to free agency and the impact it has as to how teams need to draft.

[Looking For Number Four]

http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/2564413/what_no_cba_means_to_nfl_free_agency.html?cat=14

Basically:

Players typically are free to become unrestricted free agents with an expired contract and four years of service. Without CBA the service becomes six years. Restricted free agents that are offered 110% of what they made last season and take a contract elsewhere results in the team in which the player departs from receiving draft pick compensation.

For those reading at home that don't know the difference an unrestricted free agent is a player that can sign wherever they wish at their own free will. But when a player is a restricted free agent his original club offers him a contract and has the right to either match any deal he receives from another team in free agency or receive a draft pick from that organization in return as compensation.

Rule of 8 mean the first 4 out of playoffs can sign one player, last four cannot sign anyone. If they lose someone they can replace them, sign on player per player lost, but that is it.

Restricted Free Agent:

http://www.askthecommish.com/freeagency/

The player's original team maintains the Right of First Refusal and Draft Selection at the Player’s Original Draft Round (from the team with which he signs) if the team tenders an offer of one year at the same amount(s) listed above OR at least 110% of the player’s prior year’s salary -- whichever is greater.

The player's original team maintains the Right of First Refusal and Second Round Draft Selection (from the team with which he signs) if the team tenders an offer of one year at $$1.545 million OR at least 110% of the player’s prior year’s salary -- whichever is greater.

The player's original team maintains the Right of First Refusal and First Round Draft Selection (from the team with which he signs) if the team tenders an offer of one year at $2.198 million OR at least 110% of the player’s prior year’s salary -- whichever is greater.

The player's original team maintains the Right of First Refusal and First Round Draft Selection and Third Round Draft Selection (both from the team with which he signs) if the team tenders an offer of one year at $2.792 million OR at least 110% of the player's prior year’s salary -- whichever is greater.

Teams are given a second franchise tag:

Any Club that designates a Franchise Player as "Exclusive" shall be the only Club with which that Franchise Player may negotiate or sign a contract. In order to designate an UFA or RFA as an Exclusive Franchise Player, the team must tender the player a one year contract that is the minimum of the average of the five largest salaries (as calculated at the end of the free agency signing period) for players at the position at which he played the most games during the prior year, or 120% of his prior year salary, whichever is greater.

Peppers would garner over $20M this season if Panthers tag him, again.

Hope this helps, all hail! :helmet:

[Looking For Number Four]

Also noteworthy:

http://www.adavidmooreorgans.com/pcinoz/Salaries_-_Detail.htm

Campbell made $3.8M, therefore, we are going to give him about $4.1M to stay, if another team wants him they give us a 1st and 3rd round pick. We can also match what they offer if we want him instead of the picks.

[cphil006]

There are probably 10 threads on this in the past 3 months... search... search...

It's been repeated... repeated...

Not to sound like a :pooh:, but I do, it crowds the front page with repetetive threads.... there is a search feature to see if topics have already been discussed, then you can post in those... these have already been discussed, but feel free to continue to discuss...

This might get merged with those other threads...

[wvtbred]

Also noteworthy:

http://www.adavidmooreorgans.com/pcinoz/Salaries_-_Detail.htm

Campbell made $3.8M, therefore, we are going to give him about $4.1M to stay, if another team wants him they give us a 1st and 3rd round pick. We can also match what they offer if we want him instead of the picks.

I thought Jason was under 3 mil this year.

[wvtbred]

I thought Jason was under 3 mil this year.

Jason is 2.8 this year. Not sure where you got your numbers but they are wrong. Also did you know that in 2008 and 2009 combined Todd Collins made more then Jason?

[Mark The Homer]

OP, we appreciate the info and the effort, but as Cphil006 mentions above, there is a thread on this already.

[Kurd Cudins]

Jason is 2.8 this year. Not sure where you got your numbers but they are wrong. Also did you know that in 2008 and 2009 combined Todd Collins made more then Jason?

His numbers reflected Campbell's cap hit, not his salary.

[Oldskool]

There still seems to be a lot of misinformation about the uncapped year, so here's more info:

Why is there going to be an uncapped year?

Back in 2006 the NFL and NFLPA agreed to a new collective bargaining agreement (CBA) which was to last through the 2012 season. Part of that agreement though was a clause that allowed the owners to opt out in 2010, and they chose to do so in 2008 due to what they felt were problems with revenue sharing and rookie salary caps, among other things. Regardless, the decision means that 2010 will be an uncapped year: i.e., no salary cap. Along with no maximum spending amount, it also means there will be no minimum spending amount either.

While it is not a certainty that 2010 will be uncapped, it is highly unlikely that it will not be. The end of the year for the NFL is the last day in February and free agency begins March 5th. Negotiations have barely started, so it is very doubtful an agreement will be reached before then.

What are the restrictions on free agents?

The most important free agent restriction in an uncapped year is the amount of accrued seasons a player needs to earn unrestricted free agency. In a normal season, a player would need three to become a restricted free agent and four to become an unrestricted free agent. In an uncapped year, players still need three to become a restricted free agent, but they now need six to become an unrestricted free agent. (An accrued season is equal to six or more weeks on a 53-man roster, injured reserve, or PUP; …NFI and other lists do not count)

Beginning March 5, all unrestricted free agents will be free to sign with any team, besides the “final eight” teams with more restrictions, which are discussed below.

Beginning in mid-February and ending March 4, teams may begin to tender restricted free agents “qualifying offers,” which come at five different compensation levels of a one-year, base salary-only contract, the final four of which all carry a right of first refusal: only right of first refusal, original draft pick compensation, second round draft pick compensation, first round draft pick compensation, and first and third round draft pick compensation. However, if any of these tenders is less than 110% of the player’s prior year base salary, the team must tender that player at 110% of their prior year base salary, plus whatever terms of prior year’s contract were in place. A team may choose not to tender a restricted free agent at any time, or may withdraw a tender before it is signed, in which case the player becomes an unrestricted free agent. Unlike a franchise tender, a restricted free agent tender is not guaranteed salary.

Right of First Refusal Only: $1,100,000 (4th/5th year: $1,176,000)

Original Draft Pick Compensation: $1,100,000 (4th/5th year: $1,176,000)

Second Round Draft Pick Compensation: $1,684,000 (4th/5th year: $1,759,000)

First Round Draft Pick Compensation: $2,396,000 (4th/5th year: $2,521,000)

First and Third Round Draft Pick Compensation: $3,043,000 (4th/5th year: $3,168,000)

Once the restricted free agent has been tendered a qualifying offer, he is free to solicit free agent offers from all teams, including the “final eight” without restriction, beginning on March 5. Those teams can then submit an “offer sheet” to the prior team outlining the terms of the contract they are offering the player. The prior team then has seven days to choose whether or not to match that offer sheet (exercise their right of first refusal), in which case they would re-sign their player, or to allow the new team to sign that player to an offer sheet. Keep in mind that “poison pills” can come into play here; the new team can make an offer sheet that says the contract is voided if the player is on the roster of the old team at any time, or something like that, in which case the team couldn’t realistically match the offer. However, poison pill or not, if the team doesn’t choose to match the new team’s offer sheet, they receive the designated draft pick compensation in return. It is always for the current year’s draft. Other teams have until eight days before the draft to extend an offer sheet, and teams thus have until the day before the draft to match those last-minute offer sheets.

If the player doesn’t sign his qualifying tender by June 1, the team can either choose to continue to offer their tender, or withdraw it. If they continue to extend their tender, the player cannot sign with any other team past June 1.

In an uncapped year, teams have one franchise tag and one transition tag to use, or two transition tags to use.

What is this “Final Eight?” rule?

For the final four teams alive in the 2009-10 NFL playoffs, the following restrictions are in place for 2010 free agency:

->Teams may sign any player who was released by their former team

->These teams may re-sign any player who was under contract with that team at the end of the season

->These teams may ONLY sign one unrestricted free agent (from another team) for every one of their own unrestricted free agents who signs with another team. Further, that new player cannot have a first-year salary (excluding signing bonus proration) of any more than what the old player signed with his new team. Further, to prevent back-loading that new deal, the salary of the new player (including roster bonus, option bonus, LTBEs, and excluding signing bonus proration) cannot have an annual increase of more than 30%. Further, the newly signed player cannot renegotiate an increase until 12 months after he is signed. This is different from the normal rule, which allows a first renegotiation within 12 months, but not a second for another 12 months.

->Teams may not trade for any player who they would not otherwise be able to sign as an unrestricted free agent

For the four teams who lose in the divisional round of the 2009-10 NFL playoffs, ALL of the above restrictions are in place, except for the following:

->They may sign one unrestricted free agent with a first-year salary of at least $4,925,000 (that is a 2006 number, the 2010 number is adjusted by the % increase in total revenue, 2006-2010)

->They may sign as many unrestricted free agents with a first-year salary of $3,275,000 (again, not adjusted…does not include signing bonus proration) or lower, but also with an annual increase of less than 30% of that number. This is also not re-negotiable for a year.

Can’t a team just front-load a contract to take advantage of the uncapped year?

No, this would be difficult to do. That is because, according to the CBA, any salary decrease of greater than 50% from one year to the next becomes signing bonus and thus is spread out over the life of the deal. For example, if the Bucs signed Antonio Bryant to a deal with a $20M salary in 2010 (uncapped) and a $4M salary in 2011 (capped), then that is a decrease of more than 50% ($10M), that $16M difference would become signing bonus and pro-rated over the life of the deal; if it was a four-year deal, then it would count as $4M/year, so the 2010 cap charge would reduce to $8M ($20M - $16M + $4M), and the 2011-2013 charges would increase by $4M.

Couldn’t a team have back-loaded a contract a few years ago to take advantage of the uncapped year?

No, there are two rules that have prevented this (and when uncapped years loomed years ago). The first is the “30% rule,” which says that any contract beginning in a capped year and extending into uncapped year(s) may not increase by more than 30% in salary (excluding signing bonus proration) annually in those uncapped years.

However, there are ways to get around that. Since that 30% increase does not include signing bonus or other prorated amounts, you can have a contract that is heavy in signing bonus, and then is back-loaded with higher base salaries in uncapped years. The Deion Rule applies to contracts that begins in a capped season and extends into an uncapped season. If the prorated amounts (from the heavy signing bonus) are greater than the non-prorated amounts (base salary) in the first three years of the deal (capped or uncapped), then that amount (or 50% of the combined pro-rations in the uncapped year(s), if that is less) is subtracted equally from the uncapped years and applied equally to the capped years. This prevents teams from back-loading contracts into uncapped years.

Can't the uncapped year be used to dump salary without penalty?

No. The CBA rules regarding bonus acceleration into the current year when a player is released do not apply in uncapped years. Normally, in a capped year, releasing a player before June 1 would mean whatever guaranteed money allocations from future years would accelerate into the current year’s cap, which in some cases would put the team over the salary cap (like having $10million of bonus allocations accelerate into 2009 from releasing a player during 2009). However, the 2006 CBA allowed teams to designate two pre-June 1 cuts as post-June 1 cuts. If a player is released after June 1, that acceleration is divided equally into the current year and the next year, as long as that next year wasn’t uncapped (which, again, means the team would have $10M accelerate into 2009 by releasing that player before or after June 1, 2009 in this example). Trades, no matter before or after June 1, would always trigger acceleration. In an uncapped year, there is no acceleration at all; neither into the current year nor into the current year and the next year. When a player is released or traded during an uncapped year, his bonus amortizations in future years remain intact.. For example, if Player X is released in 2010 (uncapped) and has $4M bonus amortizations in 2010, 2011, and 2012, those $4M cap hits would stay in each of those four years and not accelerate.

[Rufus T Firefly]

Can't the uncapped year be used to dump salary without penalty?

No. The CBA rules regarding bonus acceleration into the current year when a player is released do not apply in uncapped years. Normally, in a capped year, releasing a player before June 1 would mean whatever guaranteed money allocations from future years would accelerate into the current year’s cap, which in some cases would put the team over the salary cap (like having $10million of bonus allocations accelerate into 2009 from releasing a player during 2009). However, the 2006 CBA allowed teams to designate two pre-June 1 cuts as post-June 1 cuts. If a player is released after June 1, that acceleration is divided equally into the current year and the next year, as long as that next year wasn’t uncapped (which, again, means the team would have $10M accelerate into 2009 by releasing that player before or after June 1, 2009 in this example). Trades, no matter before or after June 1, would always trigger acceleration. In an uncapped year, there is no acceleration at all; neither into the current year nor into the current year and the next year. When a player is released or traded during an uncapped year, his bonus amortizations in future years remain intact.. For example, if Player X is released in 2010 (uncapped) and has $4M bonus amortizations in 2010, 2011, and 2012, those $4M cap hits would stay in each of those four years and not accelerate.

Wow. Didn't know that one at all. Never heard it.

I knew the uncapped year was bad for players, but the more info that comes out about it, the worse it gets.

[texasthunder]

Always good information Oldskool, your hard work is appreciated.

One question tho-

If the CBA is to expire on March 1st, how does that effect the free agency period which starts Feb 27th. I realize there are only a couple of days difference, but couldnt that circumvent some negotiations?????

[Oldskool]

Wow. Didn't know that one at all. Never heard it.

I knew the uncapped year was bad for players, but the more info that comes out about it, the worse it gets.

This one got me as well. Something I didn't know.

[Oldskool]

Always good information Oldskool, your hard work is appreciated.

One question tho-

If the CBA is to expire on March 1st, how does that effect the free agency period which starts Feb 27th. I realize there are only a couple of days difference, but couldnt that circumvent some negotiations?????

The NFL goes into a situation with no salary cap at the end of the league year, which I assume (since I cannot find any info to back this up) will be the day after the Superbowl, which is February 8th.

[Rufus T Firefly]

This one got me as well. Something I didn't know.

It throws everything we've been talking about here for a year into doubt. Where di you get this?

[Rufus T Firefly]

The NFL goes into a situation with no salary cap at the end of the league year, which I assume (since I cannot find any info to back this up) will be the day after the Superbowl, which is February 8th.

I believe the league year, as the above poster said, goes into effect Feb 28th/March 1. Free Agency, however I believe starts March 5, not Feb 27.