Son breaks arm, hospital plays waiting game

[Bang]

So yesterday my son broke his arm. He was in the front yard screwing around with one of his friends and a football, and he fell on it and gave himself a nice clean break across his left wrist at around 3:30.

By 4PM we were in the ER.

By 4:15 I was finished filling out the various paperwork and giving up the insurance information.

At first that was nice, seemed like they were going to treat it like an emergency and actually do something.

Silly me.

At 6:45PM we got to go see a nurse. At 7:30PM, the doctor finally came in to look at it. By 8:30 we were having an X-ray done, and by 9:00, five hours after we arrived, they finally diagnosed a broken arm. By 10:00 we found out that the on-call orthopedist had taken a look at the X ray on his computer, and suggested that we not set the bone, and to put it in a soft cast.

At 11:00 they wrapped it in a soft velcro cast.

At 12:15 we were discharged with a prescription for Tylenol 3.

Over 8 hours.

I sure am glad we don't have that universal health care system crap, because from what I understand we might have been kept waiting for a long time. I cannot express in words how happy I am to have such an efficient and caring system as the one we have in place. The most attention anyone paid to us and our problem was when we first arrived, in other words while they were ascertaining how I would pay for my son's care. I actually had two people typing away at their computers making sure they would collect their cash. After that, well, I didn't feel like it was much of a priority to anyone other than me.

Gripe over. Months of wrangling with insurance and interminably long waits to see specialists to come.

Hooray.

~Bang

[twa]

Sorry to hear about the accident,but what will change?

[aREDSKIN]

The "care" and indifference experience by many from the medical community is just astounding. All they really "care" about is the insurance card.

[twa]

The "care" and indifference experience by many from the medical community is just astounding. All they really "care" about is the insurance card.

That is untrue for the vast majority of them,but feel free to work for free for awhile...most hospitals welcome volunteers.

[Birdlives]

That's hospital emergency rooms in a nutshell.

A couple of years ago I broke my foot. I brought a book. Took less time, likely because they had fewer walk-ins. I think I was out the door on crutches in only five hours.

If it's not a life threatening issue, you wait. If any other more pressing issues come in after you, you get pushed to the back of the line.

[gimpy007]

Holly crap! Sorry to hear that brother. Your story reminds me of when my dad was in the military. Military hospitals are horrible.

Your situation sounds like a policy issue with the hospital and it sounds like a BAD policy. There is no reason why they couldn't get your son admitted, see a Dr, get x-rays, etc... while you fill out the paperwork. Paperwork should never be the priority in an ER. You need to call you local news station and get your story out.

My wife is a nurse for Swedish Medical in Seattle and she always stresses that patient care is the priority and the ins is secondary. In fact, that is how the hospital is ran.

I wish your son a speedy recovery.

[Bang]

I know the ER is triage and he gets seeded based on the severity of his problem, but 8 hours to basically get a splint and some tylenol?

The fact that they didn't set the bone troubles me. Maybe I'm nuts, but 3 day weekend, come see me on Tuesday is what it feels like.

Generally I'm a patient person who understands how things must work. But the fact is as plain as day that the way we "work" our "system" is ****ed up.

~Bang

[GoSkins561]

Bang, sorry to hear about the broken arm.

As far as the wait,

as TWA said what will change?

and to be fair without seeming like a dick, it was only a broken arm. I have been to the ER many times, from teeth knocked out, to dislocated shoulders, sprained ankles, shattered elbow to bruised ribs/kidneys.

Based on my experience, I have experienced waits of

teeth knocked out, a few hours

6 to 8 hours for sprained ankles.

shattered elbow immediate attention, went to the hospital via ambulance.

bruised ribs almost immediate attention because I was having abdominal pain on my left side, possiblel ruptured spleen, ended up being a bruised kidney.

What I am trying to say is,

1. you were there on a Friday night with a minor injury.

2. Hospitals prioritize severe injuries over minor non life threatening injuries.

You should be thankful it works this way, and trust me you would probably still be sitting there if you lived in Cuba.

[GibbsFactor]

I didn't think they would set the bone, you'll have to go to a specialist for that.

When I was 8 I broke my wrist clean in two places. The doctor sat me on the bed, two nurses grabbed me by my shoulders and the doc pulled my arm back into place. WORST.PAIN.EVER!

[twa]

Holly crap! Sorry to hear that brother. Your story reminds me of when my dad was in the military. Military hospitals are horrible.

.

But aren't those run under govt supervision?:halo:

[Burgold]

Hope he feels better soon.

And you are very right about how this points to one of the big flaws in today's health care scheme. What you went through is ridiculous. More, what he went through is nuts.

What's being proposed isn't good enough, but what we have today is terrible on almost all levels. To answer some, it is possible with a universal health care scenario that there would be many more clinics set up to treat patients or doctors serving patients who now utilize the ER. Thus, the ER would be cleared for more efficient and timely delivery of service... or there would be other vehicles available for treatment.

[Bang]

Bang, sorry to hear about the broken arm.

As far as the wait,

as TWA said what will change?

and to be fair without seeming like a dick, it was only a broken arm. I have been to the ER many times, from teeth knocked out, to dislocated shoulders, sprained ankles, shattered elbow to bruised ribs/kidneys.

Based on my experience, I have experienced waits of

teeth knocked out, a few hours

6 to 8 hours for sprained ankles.

shattered elbow immediate attention, went to the hospital via ambulance.

bruised ribs almost immediate attention because I was having abdominal pain on my left side, possiblel ruptured spleen, ended up being a bruised kidney.

What I am trying to say is,

1. you were there on a Friday night with a minor injury.

2. Hospitals prioritize severe injuries over minor non life threatening injuries.

You should be thankful it works this way, and trust me you would probably still be sitting there if you lived in Cuba.

I get all that, and I really do understand that more serious cases need to go first. I'm not trying to come off as one of those blustery types just demanding without care for the big picture. But part of you doesn't think it's just a bit F'd up that it takes 8 hours to be treated? Not only that, but it takes nearly 3 hours after arriving at the ER to even be seen?

I'm not some expert with an answer for the problem. But it doesn't take a genius to see that that a problem exists.

The irony is that the people who tell me that the status quo is just fine are the ones who also tell me that state run health results in long waits.

I'd probably be a lot happier if the nurses and doctors who were bustling around the ER spent most of that time seemingly working on patients. I'm not going to say that I'm so smart as to know everything they are doing with their time. But when I watch the nurses sipping coffee and chatting and laughing about something for ten or fifteen minutes like I saw them doing on many occasions in my 8 hour stay, it tends to make me wonder if they even care there's anyone in the ER at all.

The room wasn't full of injured people. it really didn't start filling up with people until we had already been there for 3 hours.

I'm sure it did take 6 hours (!) from our opening the front door to the time the orthopedist finished his dinner and took a look at the X-rays that were e-mailed to him (or so I was told) at 8:30. (It took 4 and a half hours for them to actually take the X ray. And that was only 1 hour after they initially looked at him. Which was nearly 3 hours after we walked in the door.)

Maybe I'm delusional, but I don't think that expecting some sort of expediency is out of line.

I would suggest that if you experienced such a low level of customer service compared to the money you pay in any other industry, you'd be plenty pissed off about it. But, I can't really shop a broken arm around, can I?

~Bang

[twa]

That's a interesting theory Bur,and I do support more 24 hr urgent care/clinics for relieving backlogs at ER's of trifling problems.

But again I do not see where universal health care is gonna bring that.

Changing some of the regs and liability issues could though.

[Midnight Judges]

There is no doubt in my mind that after healthcare reform is passed, Republicans will blame 100% of their wait times on the reforms as if they didn't exist before.

[Sticksboi05]

That's gotta be annoying but believe me, that's the normal in places like Canada, as my PT tells me.

[Bang]

That's a interesting theory Bur,and I do support more 24 hr urgent care/clinics for relieving backlogs at ER's of trifling problems.

But again I do not see where universal health care is gonna bring that.

Changing some of the regs and liability issues could though.

Well, my point about the universal health care is that so many people who are against it try to give me horror stories of interminably long waits to see doctors.

I recognize that we might not have the best reform ideas on the table yet, but that one particular roadblock needs to be ignored.

I sat there for 8 hours mulling that over last night.

~Bang

[Sticksboi05]

Well, my point about the universal health care is that so many people who are against it try to give me horror stories of interminably long waits to see doctors.

I recognize that we might not have the best reform ideas on the table yet, but that one particular roadblock needs to be ignored.

I sat there for 8 hours mulling that over last night.

~Bang

That's cause you live in Maryland. If you lived in VA, maybe it would've been quicker.

[Burgold]

That's a interesting theory Bur,and I do support more 24 hr urgent care/clinics for relieving backlogs at ER's of trifling problems.

But again I do not see where universal health care is gonna bring that.

Changing some of the regs and liability issues could though.

I think it would. Here's the reason. The free or urgent care clinics would get paid. Fewer would go out of business. Right now, it's a tough business to be in and too often clinics are undersupplied and strained. However, if everyone was entitled to care, and the clinics were be compensated for doing business than more clinics would pop up because there would be a greater chance of making money. Businesses follow money. It's like how there was a huge surge in the number of nursing homes a few years back. Do you think that was because people suddenly developed a tender spot of the sick and elderly? No, it's because someone figured out that there was a way that they could make a bunch of bucks out of it.

Universal health care would create more health care centers and not for any noble reason, but because it would create additional revenue streams for a health care provider to tap into.

[twa]

Maybe I'm delusional, but I don't think that expecting some sort of expediency is out of line.

I would suggest that if you experienced such a low level of customer service compared to the money you pay in any other industry, you'd be plenty pissed off about it. But, I can't really shop a broken arm around, can I?

~Bang

No, you are not delusional and having a injured child in pain and being helpless is one of the worst feelings ever.:grouphug:

There are many reasons you can't shop around in that situation that Universal ins is not gonna change,and imo probably will make worse..

[Bang]

My wife makes a good point. She sat and listened to the people around us in the ER. Many of them had a flu or a severe cold and were there because they didn't have time to go to their regular Dr. (Translate: couldn't afford to take off from work?)

Anyway, she says that if people would not use the ER for things that aren't necessarily emergencies, it would be quicker.

So, that's a valid point, I think. Abuse causes problems.

I'm all over the road here,, appreciate y'all letting me vent a bit! Been a stressful week. My boy also spent 3 days home sick this week, and I'm so far behind on my work it's not even funny.

~Bang

[twa]

I think it would. Here's the reason. The free or urgent care clinics would get paid. Fewer would go out of business. Right now, it's a tough business to be in and too often clinics are undersupplied and strained. However, if everyone was entitled to care, and the clinics were be compensated for doing business than more clinics would pop up because there would be a greater chance of making money. Businesses follow money. It's like how there was a huge surge in the number of nursing homes a few years back. Do you think that was because people suddenly developed a tender spot of the sick and elderly? No, it's because someone figured out that there was a way that they could make a bunch of bucks out of it.

Universal health care would create more health care centers and not for any noble reason, but because it would create additional revenue streams for a health care provider to tap into.

Urgent care centers get paid now since they are not required to treat uninsured or those that cannot pay

Hazleton's urgent care center suffers from the same adversity as all facets of the health-care system, according to Dr. Tayoun. These include Medicare cutbacks, expensive malpractice insurance, rising costs and decreasing reimbursements.

The new plan is gonna reduce medicare payments even more and help?

[AsburySkinsFan]

I hope your son is ok, and that he heals well.

With that said, 8 hours is insane, I'd have been on the phone ripping someone a new hole. We ran into a similar issue when we took my daughter to the ER, she's 4 and she was complaining of shortness of breath and sharp pinching in her chest which was causing her to cry. Took her to the ER, filled out the form and the form was taken to the triage nurse in another room who never saw my daughter and we were told to wait. After 30 minutes without even having her blood pressure checked I was starting to steam so I went to the counter and asked the nurse there what was going on he told me that the nurse looked at the form and said, "Because she's young it's probably nothing." I with my classic ExtremeSkins style asked him, "Well how did she make that evaluation? Off the color of the paper?!"

We left that ER and went down the road to another ER within 5 minutes she was having her blood pressure and blood O2 checked. After a full round of tests including EKG, ECG, and blood tests, we were recommended to a heart specialist who put her on a heart monitor.

The difference between the two hospitals was like night and day, we left the one steaming and the other giving thanks. Needless to say several phone calls were made the following Monday.

[GoSkins561]

I get all that, and I really do understand that more serious cases need to go first. I'm not trying to come off as one of those blustery types just demanding without care for the big picture. But part of you doesn't think it's just a bit F'd up that it takes 8 hours to be treated? Not only that, but it takes nearly 3 hours after arriving at the ER to even be seen?

I'm not some expert with an answer for the problem. But it doesn't take a genius to see that that a problem exists.

The irony is that the people who tell me that the status quo is just fine are the ones who also tell me that state run health results in long waits.

I'd probably be a lot happier if the nurses and doctors who were bustling around the ER spent most of that time seemingly working on patients. I'm not going to say that I'm so smart as to know everything they are doing with their time. But when I watch the nurses sipping coffee and chatting and laughing about something for ten or fifteen minutes like I saw them doing on many occasions in my 8 hour stay, it tends to make me wonder if they even care there's anyone in the ER at all.

The room wasn't full of injured people. it really didn't start filling up with people until we had already been there for 3 hours.

I'm sure it did take 6 hours (!) from our opening the front door to the time the orthopedist finished his dinner and took a look at the X-rays that were e-mailed to him (or so I was told) at 8:30. (It took 4 and a half hours for them to actually take the X ray. And that was only 1 hour after they initially looked at him. Which was nearly 3 hours after we walked in the door.)

Maybe I'm delusional, but I don't think that expecting some sort of expediency is out of line.

I would suggest that if you experienced such a low level of customer service compared to the money you pay in any other industry, you'd be plenty pissed off about it. But, I can't really shop a broken arm around, can I?

~Bang

I see where you are coming from, ER's suck. period.

Think about this, the government is about ready to get involved in our health care system, you don't think they are going to install additional checks and balances?

Another factor, docs are looking at pay cuts under universal care, if there was a shortage last night I don't think they will be lining up to work in the ER. Essentially you end up with more PA's which is fine for minor injuries and illnesses.

[Corcaigh]

I always felt with triage, it should be possible to say ... "based on what we saw, you'll get seen in about four or five hours. You can sit there, or go home and come back."

OR, "for another $200 (all major cards accepted) you'll get seen in the next 15 minutes".

[Burgold]

Urgent care centers get paid now since they are not required to treat uninsured or those that cannot pay

Hazleton's urgent care center suffers from the same adversity as all facets of the health-care system, according to Dr. Tayoun. These include Medicare cutbacks, expensive malpractice insurance, rising costs and decreasing reimbursements.

The new plan is gonna reduce medicare payments even more and help?

You don't think a universal health care system will put more money into play or put dollar signs in some people's eyes? If all those people who can't pay or whose insurance refuse to pay for suddenly become eligible for treatment and reimbursement that's a whole lot of change.

Again, remember I'm not arguing for the fiscal side of Universal Health Care. Fiscally, I think it's going to be very expensive and probably problematic. I just believe in it from a purely moral perspective.